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In a 12 second after-the-credits scene on Lower Decks, Daniels from enterprise beams in, sabotages Discovery's Time Core so it goes to an alternate timeline instead of the future, smirks at the camera and beams out.
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Mar 6, 2023 00:13
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For all the important things that happen in "The Collaborator" it sure is a bland episode. Maybe I don't care much for Bajoran internal politics. I was thinking of watching it and "All Good Things..." together but I was falling asleep by the end of the DS9 episode and didn't want the finale experience to be ruined by what felt like a two-hour episode.
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Mar 6, 2023 01:27
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DoubleCakes posted:For all the important things that happen in "The Collaborator" it sure is a bland episode. Maybe I don't care much for Bajoran internal politics. I was thinking of watching it and "All Good Things..." together but I was falling asleep by the end of the DS9 episode and didn't want the finale experience to be ruined by what felt like a two-hour episode. I think part of the problem isn't necessarily the Bajoran politics (which can be a bit of a slog, admittedly), but more that Philip Anglim, who plays Bareil, has all the charisma of a Totino's Party Pizza that was baked and then left in the fridge for two weeks. We're supposed to buy that Kira's head over heels for him, but he's just dull as dishwater.
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Mar 6, 2023 01:32
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Der Kyhe posted:And the future they jumped into was a generic "Starfleet and Federation has fallen"-future the writers have been wanking over for a decade as a reboot series. It wasn't generic, it was the dumbest possible version of that sort of future, which is at least sort of backwards inventive.
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Mar 6, 2023 01:37
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Timby posted:I think part of the problem isn't necessarily the Bajoran politics (which can be a bit of a slog, admittedly), but more that Philip Anglim, who plays Bareil, has all the charisma of a Totino's Party Pizza that was baked and then left in the fridge for two weeks. We're supposed to buy that Kira's head over heels for him, but he's just dull as dishwater. Bareil's complete lack of presence is the reason why I love the episode where they slowly replace pieces of his brain with computers to keep him alive after an accident to the point where his personality isn't there anymore and it's like Lmao that's how they ended the character
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Mar 6, 2023 01:41
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Timby posted:I think part of the problem isn't necessarily the Bajoran politics (which can be a bit of a slog, admittedly), but more that Philip Anglim, who plays Bareil, has all the charisma of a Totino's Party Pizza that was baked and then left in the fridge for two weeks. We're supposed to buy that Kira's head over heels for him, but he's just dull as dishwater. it's this, the bajoran political stuff can be pretty interesting (anything with kai winn is maddening, and that's intentional), but yeah: bareil is just loving boring
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Mar 6, 2023 01:42
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Discovery should have been about a Star Trek vessel with the slipstream drive from Voyager fully developed and just traveling around the galaxy without any back up.
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Mar 6, 2023 02:08
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i mean, if you want us to accept that they have a spore drive, fine. if they can theoretically travel anywhere, why keep it confined to this galaxy? going to andromeda and dealing with the kelvans or something would even fit in with the time period the show was originally set in. make the spore drive break down and they get stuck there as an explanation for why nobody knows anything about the ship. you could even re-tread voyager since people evidently love that crap by making them attempt to get home and fail, which would be the more interesting choice, and it would allow the writers to do their grimdark poo poo occasionally god this isn't hard paramount 
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Mar 6, 2023 02:35
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Everybody wants to go to the Andromeda galaxy but no one ever wants to go to the Triangulum galaxy even though they're about the same distance away
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Mar 6, 2023 03:07
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Not to mention everyone always wants to rush all the way over to Andromeda and just skip all the galaxies that surround the Milky Way? There's like 60 galaxies nearby. At least poke around the LMC some.
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Mar 6, 2023 03:17
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That’s easy. Andromeda sounds cool, Triangulum sounds like a geometry function.
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Mar 6, 2023 03:17
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At least Stargate: Atlantis went to the Pegasus galaxy instead of Andromeda. But yeah, give me a Trek show's Voyager by way of Stargate: Atlantis. A show about a ship or expedition going somewhere really far far away and making do with whatever they find on the otherside, but intentionally instead of accidentally.
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Mar 6, 2023 03:20
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Big Mean Jerk posted:That’s easy. Andromeda sounds cool, Triangulum sounds like a geometry function. Want to do a whole bunch of acid and go to the geometry function galaxy. Fucker would be full of all the same sort of fractals as would be seeing in my brain. Sounds sweet.
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Mar 6, 2023 03:21
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nine-gear crow posted:At least Stargate: Atlantis went to the Pegasus galaxy instead of Andromeda. If there was a way to do it justice and not do...whatever Picard and Disco have been doing....I'd like a spin-off series where the Enterprise-D never returned from Triangulum M33 in Where No One Has Gone Before. I think they were further out into deep, uncharted space than any other ship in Star Trek and the possibilities could be really interesting (if done well). It might not necessarily be in character, but I'm imagining a plot where Picard accepts their fate being lost for the rest of their lives in another galaxy. Kosinski becomes a member of the crew and is slowly humbled as the enormity of his mistake dawns on him (we actually do get some character growth in the actual character where the experience seems to humble him a bit). F_Shit_Fitzgerald fucked around with this message at 03:27 on Mar 6, 2023 |
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Mar 6, 2023 03:25
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Tiberius Christ posted:Everybody wants to go to the Andromeda galaxy but no one ever wants to go to the Triangulum galaxy even though they're about the same distance away why not both? they can go anywhere
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Mar 6, 2023 03:30
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Tiberius Christ posted:Everybody wants to go to the Andromeda galaxy but no one ever wants to go to the Triangulum galaxy even though they're about the same distance away
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Mar 6, 2023 03:38
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I may have to watch Voyager for a 2nd time to be sure but I think I like Enterprise more at this point. Just watched episode where the Xindi insectoid egg shits on Archer's face and the neurotoxin in it makes him obsessed with the hatchery on their ship. Cool filler episode with the rare valid mutiny.
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Mar 6, 2023 04:40
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MikeJF posted:Not to mention everyone always wants to rush all the way over to Andromeda and just skip all the galaxies that surround the Milky Way? There's like 60 galaxies nearby. At least poke around the LMC some. This has been my pet idea for years. Some mumbo jumbo (periodic wormhole?) reliably allows travel between the regular Federation territory and the LMC, but only for like a year at time every five years or something. The Federation makes contact with a minor, non-aggressive power in the LMC and has intermittent relations during the year where they can interact. After five or six cycles, relations have reached the point where the LMC Power authorizes the Federation to build a starbase in their region and base a task force (no more than ten ships) there. The show starts with the closing of the mumbo jumbo and the USS Maincharacter departing from Starbase Magalhães on a mission of exploration. You get to explore new ground like Voyager, but with a modest amount of support that means they're not completely alone and raising questions about where they're getting more torpedoes.
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Mar 6, 2023 04:50
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Disco sucks because its writing is a mess and no one knows what to do with it, not because they're wasting the concept of the spore drive or whatever. Who cares if they were exploring another galaxy? It doesn't matter, because it would've had the same garbage writing. Voyager literally did the "oh look here's an entirely new area to explore" thing and it didn't magically make that show good. A good writing team should be able to adhere to the spirit and feel of Star Trek even if the main crew only explores a single planet per season. Finding new areas to explore doesn't do poo poo because Star Trek doesn't have a well-defined universe that's currently limiting writers in any way. TNG was still exploring new places right up into its seventh season because there's nothing stopping writers from creating those stories in any Star Trek time period or setting. Paradoxish fucked around with this message at 05:26 on Mar 6, 2023 |
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Mar 6, 2023 05:07
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Sash! posted:This has been my pet idea for years. Some mumbo jumbo (periodic wormhole?) reliably allows travel between the regular Federation territory and the LMC, but only for like a year at time every five years or something. The Federation makes contact with a minor, non-aggressive power in the LMC and has intermittent relations during the year where they can interact. After five or six cycles, relations have reached the point where the LMC Power authorizes the Federation to build a starbase in their region and base a task force (no more than ten ships) there. The show starts with the closing of the mumbo jumbo and the USS Maincharacter departing from Starbase Magalhães on a mission of exploration. You get to explore new ground like Voyager, but with a modest amount of support that means they're not completely alone and raising questions about where they're getting more torpedoes. My similar idea, throw out the wormhole: Canis Major dwarf galaxy is about 26k light years out. Say with advancements in drive tech, you can make the crossing in five years or so. So a bunch of volunteers crew a small fleet of ships, including one that unfolds into a starbase/support base, crossing the void (and leaving a trail of subspace relays back to the milky way) and throwing themselves out there to explore on a 20 year mission or so before looping back home. The show opens as they arrive.
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Mar 6, 2023 05:16
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Still laughing that they went with Discovery being a prequel about Spock's secret sister. Like... they started with that.
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Mar 6, 2023 05:19
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jeeves posted:Still laughing that they went with Discovery being a prequel about Spock's secret sister. And that was Bryan Fuller's grand idea. That Spock had another secret sibling. Disco sucks, but we dodged a bullet by him getting fired a year before they shot a single frame of footage.
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Mar 6, 2023 05:23
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i still think a rotating anthology series set in different eras with a different crew featured in each season could've been interesting. of course now we know that the execution would have been terrible but it's a decent idea
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Mar 6, 2023 05:34
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Timby posted:And that was Bryan Fuller's grand idea. That Spock had another secret sibling. Fuller's Disco may well have sucked anyway, but at least his would've been a show driven by a singular vision from someone with actual creative bona fides.
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Mar 6, 2023 05:37
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From what it sounded like, it was supposed to have been 60s spy thriller influenced - which sounds cool as poo poo. But Burnham and the redesigned Klingons were also a part of that vision. Mixed bag.
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Mar 6, 2023 05:41
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I mean if we're throwing our ideas for shows we wish had, my ideal new Star Trek would involve the Enterprise-F, after Voyager it's equipped with a quantum slipstream drive and it's main mission is to test another new piece of technology, a reverse engineered transwarp coil. It'd be the STO Odyssey class because I'm a fan of it's design, and it'd help explain why it's so big, it was made to be a self sustaining vessel with the transwarp gate's target being somewhere in the Alpha quadrant 10 years at max warp away, with the slipstream being the ship's option if it needs to go home. Since it's intentional they can actually try and do diplomacy and make new friends of the Federation but it's far away enough that the only aliens from older shows we should see are like maybe the Breen, and I think the Breen are cool enough antagonists if you wanted to lean on older races. Anyway my other ask would be a Romulan in Starfleet and on the bridge, just because the Romulans are my favorite race and somehow Picard keeps doing them dirty.
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Mar 6, 2023 06:12
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Eimi posted:I mean if we're throwing our ideas for shows we wish had, my ideal new Star Trek would involve the Enterprise-F, after Voyager it's equipped with a quantum slipstream drive and it's main mission is to test another new piece of technology, a reverse engineered transwarp coil. It'd be the STO Odyssey class because I'm a fan of it's design, and it'd help explain why it's so big, it was made to be a self sustaining vessel with the transwarp gate's target being somewhere in the Alpha quadrant 10 years at max warp away, with the slipstream being the ship's option if it needs to go home. It's gonna rule so hard when the Enterprise-F shows up for 20 seconds and then is blown to smithereens in a couple weeks on Picard.
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Mar 6, 2023 07:23
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Eimi posted:I mean if we're throwing our ideas for shows we wish had, my ideal new Star Trek would involve the Enterprise-F, after Voyager it's equipped with a quantum slipstream drive and it's main mission is to test another new piece of technology, a reverse engineered transwarp coil. It'd be the STO Odyssey class because I'm a fan of it's design, and it'd help explain why it's so big, it was made to be a self sustaining vessel with the transwarp gate's target being somewhere in the Alpha quadrant 10 years at max warp away, with the slipstream being the ship's option if it needs to go home.
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Mar 6, 2023 07:52
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McSpanky posted:Fuller's Disco may well have sucked anyway, but at least his would've been a show driven by a singular vision from someone with actual creative bona fides. Except Fuller ditches everything he's involved with the minute he gets a note from the studio informing him that no, his script is not, in fact, the greatest thing since sliced bread. Fuller got fired from Discovery because he had produced one single script in 12 months. (Nearly 20 months, really.) Even Amazon wanted to continue Hannibal, because there had been some deals done for the Silence of the Lambs rights, but insisted that Fuller get scripts done before shooting; he told them to go to hell. Timby fucked around with this message at 08:00 on Mar 6, 2023 |
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Mar 6, 2023 07:58
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Fuller has never completed anything he's started.
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Mar 6, 2023 08:03
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Wasn't Bryan Fuller also involved or implicated in some No-No Sex poo poo too on top of all of that, or am I just conflating him with Confirmed Sex Creep Bryan Singer?
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Mar 6, 2023 08:14
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Timby posted:Except Fuller ditches everything he's involved with the minute he gets a note from the studio informing him that no, his script is not, in fact, the greatest thing since sliced bread. Oh I know he's a nightmare to actually work with, I was just speaking hypothetically from the standpoint of its quality/consistency. It's too bad he's such a prima donna behind the camera, when he actually gets a production going it can really be something else (as in the aforementioned Hannibal).
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Mar 6, 2023 08:48
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Unfortunately i love my Star Trek political dramas so my dream Discovery would have been set just a couple of years after the Dominion War and the utter fallout of that literally quadrant changing conflict. Watch as a Federation dispatches a ship that like the Titan is made up of as many races in the Federation, with exchange officers from the Klingon Defense Forces and the Bajoran militia as they travel around, resolving disputes, visiting recently liberated worlds while the various governments figure out what to do afterward.
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Mar 6, 2023 10:21
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Ignoring Discovery, I really just hope that next time they jump a half century or more, the Klingons are part of the Federation. (Or even just half the Klingons. Have the progressive houses join and the dumb houses just form a failing rump state) (And Bajor should be in too. Ira Stephen Behr said they shouldn't but his concepts for DS9 season 8 prove he can be dumb about these things, the whole point of the Federation is that it's not the US and there's space in it to retain your own cultural identity and you don't really have to participate much at all if you don't want to.) MikeJF fucked around with this message at 11:25 on Mar 6, 2023 |
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Mar 6, 2023 11:23
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nine-gear crow posted:Wasn't Bryan Fuller also involved or implicated in some No-No Sex poo poo too on top of all of that, or am I just conflating him with Confirmed Sex Creep Bryan Singer? Like Singer, Fuller is very much gay, but he's not a sex monster like Singer. Fuller's issue is that he gets bored with things very quickly and then quits or gets fired from projects. (Or, as in the case of Voyager, claims he was one of the guys running the show for a while when he was really only a staff writer for a little while.) When he got tossed out the airlock on Discovery, he'd only written the first episode and an outline for the second ... and that was after more than two years of CBS waiting for him to actually get poo poo done. When he asked for another delay, that's when he was fired.
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Mar 6, 2023 13:39
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MikeJF posted:Ignoring Discovery, I really just hope that next time they jump a half century or more, the Klingons are part of the Federation. (Or even just half the Klingons. Have the progressive houses join and the dumb houses just form a failing rump state) Less pleasantly, joining the Federation also means Starfleet will come run off Ferengi and Orion privateers and will discourage other people from eyeballing you as part of their ancient and traditional sphere of influence.
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Mar 6, 2023 16:39
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Started a DS9 rewatch, probably haven't seen it all the way through in 15 years and I'm struck by how confident and mature the show is from the jump. Easily the best pilot out of any of the series (though I do notice that every ST pilot seems to have the hero ship crew encountering a non-corporeal superbeing that interacts with the captain in a budget friendly construct of previously existing sets) and its deep into the politics of the region right away. Quark is more sinister in the pilot and also his nose is different. Rom just had his first speaking role and he's just another nasally talking angry Ferengi instead of the lovable dope he becomes. Julian is still wet-behind-the-ears, I don't really like his characterization as an overeager and naive tourist. I just got to Move Along Home but the first seven episodes of s1 of DS9 are so much better than the first seven episodes of TNG or VOY. Also it is insane to me that they didn't take 15 minutes to debark all the civilian spouses and children before they sent 100 year old Reliant class ships to fight the Borg at Wolf 359
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Mar 6, 2023 16:43
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zoux posted:Rom just had his first speaking role and he's just another nasally talking angry Ferengi instead of the lovable dope he becomes. My personal headcanon on that one is that Rom had been reading self-help books (or self-help holoprograms, perhaps) promising to make him into a better Ferengi, and so he was trying out a persona that was more confident and aggressive. It obviously didn't stick and he was soon back to normal. I've seen exactly the same thing happen in real life when people read some book about how to be more successful at the business factory -- their entire vibe changes and they try to present themselves an energetic go-getter, and then after a couple weeks or so the act wears off when it doesn't bring them the miraculous rewards they expected.
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Mar 6, 2023 16:59
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quark's nose in the first couple of episodes actually becomes rom's nose but yeah rom is very different, iirc he's just "PIT BOSS", not even rom. it's actually fun to watch his character arc: rom isn't a typical ferengi, even if he starts out as one. he realizes this and strives to be different, and eventually succeeds to the point he becomes grand nagus it's an excellent character eventually
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Mar 6, 2023 16:59
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Also Avery Brooks was only two years younger than Patrick Stewart was in Encounter at Farpoint, but he looks about 15 years younger.
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Mar 6, 2023 17:05
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