(Thread IKs:
weg, Toxic Mental)
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Coverage from Leopard 2 school in Poland, nothing particularly revelatory. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtawNwACOv8
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Mar 8, 2023 08:57
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| # ? May 29, 2024 15:27 |
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https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1633367949061791744 It appears even Solovyov and friends don't appear too optimistic about Russian chances when Ukraine gathers its strength to strike back.
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Mar 8, 2023 09:04
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Tarquinn posted:Okay, Russians are Romans now. Finally this war is justified! 
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Mar 8, 2023 10:10
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Oh, I remember that one. I hope it’s still there. 
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Mar 8, 2023 10:11
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Half joking here, but I thought the Romanians were the proper Romans?
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Mar 8, 2023 10:12
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Dumb Sex-Parrot posted:Half joking here, but I thought the Romanians were the proper Romans? Half of me is laughing at your joke, the other half of me is laughing even harder
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Mar 8, 2023 10:13
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zone posted:https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1633367949061791744 Couldn't the Russians also be down-playing their successes / over-exaggerating their setbacks to lure the Ukrainian into over-extending their forces? Why take Russian propaganda at face value, when they are known to be habitual liars?
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Mar 8, 2023 10:19
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fizzy posted:Couldn't the Russians also be down-playing their successes / over-exaggerating their setbacks to lure the Ukrainian into over-extending their forces? Based on how much land they control versus earlier on in the war? No. You'd have to be working backwards from the position that Russia is inherently more reliable to think otherwise. Or incredibly ignorant, or both. I don't know your life. Punkinhead fucked around with this message at 10:26 on Mar 8, 2023 |
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Mar 8, 2023 10:22
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fizzy posted:Couldn't the Russians also be down-playing their successes / over-exaggerating their setbacks to lure the Ukrainian into over-extending their forces? Why take Russian propaganda at face value, when they are known to be habitual liars? Because their crude attempts at maskirovka, which they boasted as being the best in the world, have so far failed to yield any results. Ukrainian leadership, and intelligence officers, along with the help of Western intelligence data, have proven already under field conditions that they can out-think and outmaneuver the Russians. The reason they're even saying what they're saying in this clip, for example, is that they were allowed to say it by the higher authorities. Nothing is said on that channel that isn't permitted to be said, and that sometimes includes a few truths as well. Of course I do agree that none of this should be taken *exactly* at face value, but usually the tone of the propagandists and the topics they speak about are usually enough to get a general idea of the accepted narrative, while comparing it to what independent analysts have to say to weed out the more bald faced lies or propaganda points.
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Mar 8, 2023 10:28
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"How can we be sure Russia hasn't destroyed more HIMARS than have been reported delivered? Ukraine must be near or completely out of HIMARS if Russia is to be trusted at all, surely?????? Thus Russia must be advancing evenly and with constant supporting artillery! Wait, they're not? This is a real brain teaser and I'm gonna need some SA posters to help me figure it out..."
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Mar 8, 2023 10:31
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fizzy posted:Couldn't the Russians also be down-playing their successes / over-exaggerating their setbacks to lure the Ukrainian into over-extending their forces? Why take Russian propaganda at face value, when they are known to be habitual liars? They might be but literally everything on that channel is for internal consumption. It's who they're lying to that matters in this context and it's not for Ukraine. I also think they'd have a hard time bullshitting Ukraine about the actual situation since they know exactly how many vehicles they've destroyed, how many shells have been fired at them, roughly how many soldiers they've killed, and that's fairly easily checkable against known Russian capabilities. The Russians can hide a little bit but not enough for anyone to drastically underestimate what they've got. With all the eyes they have on them at the moment if they're somehow concealing a significant force somewhere then it's been one of the most brilliantly executed military operations ever. It's up there with the inflatable tanks and disinformation campaign before D-day. Earlier in the war I'd see these and ask "How does them saying than help keep Putin in power?" and usually the answer would be pretty obvious. These days I have no idea, but I don't bother watching them much. I think maybe they're trying to reinforce the sense of helplessness and nihilism in Russia?
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Mar 8, 2023 10:31
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fizzy posted:Couldn't the Russians also be down-playing their successes / over-exaggerating their setbacks to lure the Ukrainian into over-extending their forces? Why take Russian propaganda at face value, when they are known to be habitual liars? Putin desperately needs successes to boost morale and stop looking like the war is going very badly. The failures are not 5D chess, it's genuinely going badly, it's harder and harder to hide Somaen fucked around with this message at 10:38 on Mar 8, 2023 |
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Mar 8, 2023 10:32
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HonorableTB posted:Your point is valid for sure. The location and such didn't change. What changed in this case was Ukraine realizing the Russian military was willing to pay an utterly insane butcher's bill to take the city and the Ukrainian army seems to be more than happy to let them do that since it's also taking all of their strategic initiative out of the picture for this offensive. I also still believe that Bakhmut's value was artificially inflated to distract from a Ukrainian counteroffensive in Zaporizhzhia. Blowing up Bakhmut's value into something it isn't is a great way to get a whole bunch of Russian troops moving over there to try and take it, meaning they aren't in the south. Even if we believe the claim about much higher Russian casualties. Five Russians for every Ukrainian isn't a good deal, if it's a seasoned Ukrainian soldier versus five Wagner prisoner mobiks. Most media are talking about heavy Ukrainian losses that are potentially endangering future counter offensives. So it remains to be seen who will come out of the Battle of Bakhmut in a better position. Hopefully it'll play out something like Severodonetsk.
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Mar 8, 2023 10:35
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CSM posted:There's no conclusive evidence however that the losses Ukraine is incurring are less severe than Russia's though. This is the real question. Even though Ukraine has held this town for over half a year that doesn't necessarily mean things are moving towards a Ukrainian victory. Tactical successes do not 1:1 translate to strategic successes.
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Mar 8, 2023 10:37
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Somaen posted:Putin desperately need successes to boost morale and stop looking like the war is going very badly. The failures are not 5D chess, it's genuinely going badly This is basically why Putin ordered the Russian army and Wagner to capture at least the Donbass by March 31 so he could have something he could sell to the masses at home as a kind of 'victory'. Capturing Soledar by itself, despite being a pyrrhic victory at best, and the current precarious but still relatively stable situation near Bakhmut are basically all they have to show for it at present. And at the current pace of gains, it's evident that they'll be unable to meet these stated goals, while keeping a one track mind on the objectives they were ordered to fulfill, which will lead to either a premature culmination at Bakhmut, the depletion of offensive and defensive resources on other parts of the front line, or both. This one track, stupid, single minded attempt to fulfill these orders has the seeds of a second disastrous collapse of Russian defenses sown all over it.
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Mar 8, 2023 10:39
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Tarquinn posted:Okay, Russians are Romans now. Finally this war is justified! Russani eunt domnes!
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Mar 8, 2023 10:42
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CSM posted:There's no conclusive evidence however that the losses Ukraine is incurring are less severe than Russia's though. The units that are currently fighting on the front are primarily those that have already been fighting after being rotated in and out of combat to replenish losses or TDF who are only expected to hold the territory as long as possible despite the losses. Pro-Russian bloggers have already said that Ukraine's reserve troops for the new offensives are primarily going to be their new mechanized brigades which are being formed with the donated Western equipment and staffed with those soldiers trained abroad as their core. The brigades which are already doing the fighting are likely not going to be direct participants in whatever upcoming offensives Ukraine has planned, except themselves as support/holding/reserves role.
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Mar 8, 2023 10:43
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CSM posted:There's no conclusive evidence however that the losses Ukraine is incurring are less severe than Russia's though. This is precisely what has been bugging me as well. I hope the destruction of kit is what is going to matter, because Russia will have a much harder time replacing that.
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Mar 8, 2023 10:45
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Funky See Funky Do posted:They might be but literally everything on that channel is for internal consumption. It's who they're lying to that matters in this context and it's not for Ukraine. I also think they'd have a hard time bullshitting Ukraine about the actual situation since they know exactly how many vehicles they've destroyed, how many shells have been fired at them, roughly how many soldiers they've killed, and that's fairly easily checkable against known Russian capabilities. The Russians can hide a little bit but not enough for anyone to drastically underestimate what they've got. With all the eyes they have on them at the moment if they're somehow concealing a significant force somewhere then it's been one of the most brilliantly executed military operations ever. It's up there with the inflatable tanks and disinformation campaign before D-day. I think RUSI were on to the answer here: from the tactical level upwards the Russian system punishes any admission of failure, so everyone reports massive success. Because this remains true at every step in the chain upwards there's every incentive to repeat the story of massive success while failures are mysterious and unavoidable surprises that are Nobody's Fault. The result is a system where everyone knows that the stats they have are nonsense and they can't possibly have destroyed 50 HIMARS last week, but there's no person in the system who can call that out so the number keeps getting repeated as 'true' all the way to the point where its published.
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Mar 8, 2023 10:47
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The same system also encourages some truly bogus claims to be made, like Bradleys being destroyed in September and the Abrams destroyed near "Bakhmut" which was an old loss from the Iraq war. They didn't even bother that there was a palm tree in the image they used for that claim. Just posted it as is so that their useful idiots and unthinking masses can rejoice in another Mighty Russian victory.
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Mar 8, 2023 10:54
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Where does the word "mobik" come from btw?
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Mar 8, 2023 10:58
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Tree Bucket posted:Where does the word "mobik" come from btw? Borrowed from Russian мо́бик (móbik), from моб(илизо́ванный) (mob(ilizóvannyj), “mobilized”) + -ик (-ik, diminutive suffix). https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/mobik
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Mar 8, 2023 11:02
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HonorableTB posted:do we have any poles in here? I stopped by the beer store and wanted to try some new beer so I got a couple pint bottles of Okocim based solely on their slogan "O.K. Beer", it's p good IMO. Kurwa! I'm no beer connoisseur but Okocim is pretty poo poo, like most beers by big brewers.
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Mar 8, 2023 11:04
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Pablo Bluth posted:Coverage from Leopard 2 school in Poland, nothing particularly revelatory. Why are there turrets pointing backwards alot?
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Mar 8, 2023 11:16
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https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1633410034951438339 Latest Strelkov screed. All it amounts to are sarcastic congratulations aimed at Prigozhin and Shoigu for capturing half a small city, a note on how there have been more defense lines prepared while it was held, and that apart from inflicting losses on Ukraine in the process, their big winter offensive became a big flop.
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Mar 8, 2023 11:16
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Alchenar posted:I think RUSI were on to the answer here: from the tactical level upwards the Russian system punishes any admission of failure, so everyone reports massive success. Because this remains true at every step in the chain upwards there's every incentive to repeat the story of massive success while failures are mysterious and unavoidable surprises that are Nobody's Fault. That's obvious but sometimes you have segments like the one in the clip where the actors seem despondent and melancholy about the way things are going. I don't speak Russian so I can't (and don't want to) watch that show in full to see the context it's in. It might be that they're being set up as the gutless sad sack for every other person on the show to argue against. Or it might be that their purpose is to get through to the people that know that things are going terribly for Russia and instil a sense of nihilism in them so they don't try to change things. I don't have a point. It's just one the things about Russian society that I don't get.
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Mar 8, 2023 11:17
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Tree Bucket posted:Where does the word "mobik" come from btw? It's an contracted agent noun composed of the word мобилизовать and the suffix -ник.
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Mar 8, 2023 11:18
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I would blow Dane Cook posted:Why are there turrets pointing backwards alot?
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Mar 8, 2023 11:22
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https://twitter.com/PaulJawin/status/1633357286226767872?t=ZZ1R46tma-DkuwAYLgk7vg&s=19 Lol
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Mar 8, 2023 11:24
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fatherboxx posted:https://twitter.com/PaulJawin/status/1633357286226767872?t=ZZ1R46tma-DkuwAYLgk7vg&s=19 Ah yes; the Soviet Military Train Sergei Shoigu insisted on restoring to it's proper glory circa 1970 with no modernized weaponry, logistics, or detection equipment. It will be no match for... *checks notes* Drone strikes. Or Tanks. Or HIMARS. Or opportunistic sappers damaging the tracks along its route in advance followed by ambushing the train itself with the above options.
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Mar 8, 2023 11:31
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I would blow Dane Cook posted:Why are there turrets pointing backwards alot? Makes the tank shorter. The axis of rotation of the turret is offset to the front. Having a shorter tank is good if you are trying to park it somewhere.
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Mar 8, 2023 11:38
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Ceterum censeo Imperium Romanum esse delendam.
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Mar 8, 2023 11:44
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fatherboxx posted:https://twitter.com/PaulJawin/status/1633357286226767872?t=ZZ1R46tma-DkuwAYLgk7vg&s=19
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Mar 8, 2023 11:58
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Dumb Sex-Parrot posted:Half joking here, but I thought the Romani were the proper Romans?
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Mar 8, 2023 12:00
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Peace is good, war is bad (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 8, 2023 12:07
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We all want peace, but it's always just out of reach. So, what's the best to get peace?
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Mar 8, 2023 12:11
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HonorableTB posted:do we have any poles in here? I stopped by the beer store and wanted to try some new beer so I got a couple pint bottles of Okocim based solely on their slogan "O.K. Beer", it's p good IMO. Kurwa! Okocim is decent as far as mass-produced swill goes. If you go back for more, here's some brands to avoid: Lech, Harnaś, Tyskie, Tatra, Ciechan. Brands to get: Perła, Łomża, Brackie, Specjal.
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Mar 8, 2023 12:20
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some plague rats posted:Cool. what is it Tymofiy Shadura. You could have looked that up if you needed to know but I guess a snarky post is more your style.
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Mar 8, 2023 12:29
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CSM posted:There's no conclusive evidence however that the losses Ukraine is incurring are less severe than Russia's though.
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Mar 8, 2023 12:29
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| # ? May 29, 2024 15:27 |
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KirbyKhan posted:Peace is good, war is bad It would be helpful or at least interesting if you could go beyond repeatedly stating the obvious, and maybe share a thought on how in your opinion peace could most effectively be achieved, based on the current situation, and what an acceptable resulting situation would be.
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Mar 8, 2023 12:54
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