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fwiw elemental proc is also outrageously strong in wo long, but you don’t have many ways to take advantage of it that early
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Mar 9, 2023 01:48
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VanillaGorilla posted:I really don’t like how weapon damage is basically inconsequential - bosses are almost entire lot about baiting out critical attacks and parrying until you can break them. deflecting crit attacks is only a small part of how you beat most bosses; your core strategy for almost every boss should be building up high spirit, using spirit attack or occasionally a martial art to limit their max spirit, and then eventually chipping them down into spirit disruption range. not using spirit attacks to limit their low spirit gauge and relying solely on crit deflects means that a boss can hit you a few times after and eventually return to neutral spirit unless you've massively damaged their spirit already Oxxidation posted:fwiw elemental proc is also outrageously strong in wo long, but you don’t have many ways to take advantage of it that early all the virtues should get access to their elemental imbue after about 10-12 points, and they're 100% worth investing a spell point in as soon as possible. proccing a debuff causes an interrupt on the target, and they all have great effects that can make bosses considerably easier. i personally think lightning is the best general-purpose one, since shock is just a straight up spirit DoT that allows you to spend some time dodging and recovering if things go south without worrying about a boss recovering too much spirit in that time
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Mar 9, 2023 01:53
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they supposedly patched the mouse control and some of the graphical bugs today. microsoft store/xbox patches might not be out yet. which i saw while i was looking for this: does anyone know if this part about improved drops at low morale from the game's website is true?  i repeated a side mission from chapter 1 a few times at 0 morale near the beginning of the game and eventually got some 4* dual swords with an ice enchant gem, and now that i've finished my first playthrough I can say with confidence that element enchant gems are PRETTY rare, but i'm not sure whether it was due to morale.
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Mar 9, 2023 01:57
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VanillaGorilla posted:Yeah I dunno. I’ve been stuck on Aoye or whatever her name is for 2 days, and I think I’m done with this. Ya I agree I think base dmg is no totally inconsequential but just like Sekiro it's about breaking their spirit/posture. IF you do more dmg you do more dmg to their spirit gauge so it does help, status effects like others said do help a lot. The problem I noticed with some of the magical buff spells they barely last unless you leveled the right attributes, I think there is one attribute that increases duration of buffs. That being said I am still enjoying it a lot. I loved Sekiro so, I think they could have just given you one weapon and it would be almost the same experience. I think they need to make the martial art more different. This is what Team Ninja did a good job with in SoP, the skills and class completely changed your playstyle especially on higher difficulty. Definitely feels like a game they could improve a lot with DLC and sequel but imo it's already great. Ulio fucked around with this message at 02:06 on Mar 9, 2023 |
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Mar 9, 2023 02:03
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Einwand posted:So what do people think about the weapons so far? I've tried most of them and other than the staff/sword/sabre they've pretty much all felt pretty terrible to me? Some combination of way too slow or terrible spirit generation/damage. it's cool that there are so many different types but it doesn't super matter because outside of the one or two martials arts you get on them and some combo timing, they're all the same. you could fold every martial art from every 1h sword in this game into a single weapon and it still wouldn't feel like it had as much variety as the single katana from nioh. I do like the big slow weapons like the axe and polearm podao though, and visually, the moveset for the slicing spear and a lot of its martial arts is beautiful.
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Mar 9, 2023 02:19
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isk posted:Someone mentioned similarity to Nioh missions earlier and, yep, I feel the same. There's the burning city, there's the rickety docks and small boats in stormy water, and so on. Having now beaten NG, I can confirm the existence of the canal with dams and drains, the flooded city with dramatic drain, and the big city with serpentine walkways and vertigo-inducing pits. To be clear, I don't mind the recurrence; each is different enough from previous games to be their own thing. It's more of a familiar and reassuring foundation with its own iterations and vibes. Also, I was not a fan of the penultimate boss. Mechanically I think they're fine; what (almost) killed me was the camera's inability to keep up with their movement. First time it consistently happened for me in a Wo Long boss fight. It sucks when a tool I depend on suddenly breaks in a critical moment. I know it's not new in videogames, and I don't think it was necessarily intentional here (like it is in so many others); it just feels like a trap. Cheap. Anyway, now that that's done and dusted, I'm enjoying NG+ a bit. Still getting better and better at the mechanics, discovering the new item sets and synergies with 5* gear, and occasionally finding nooks I missed the first time. Considering I explored each level at a measured pace, it's nice how there's even more stuff to discover. Overall, while I broadly broke the Niohs over my knee, I feel more empowered in Wo Long without feeling overpowered. I run around missions with more confidence, and I do dramatic I like this game.
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Mar 9, 2023 02:24
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If you're having a rough time I reckon lots of wood and lightning weapon will help you out. Even in light armour I can still take a hit. I also don't think your base damage is inconsequential. Obviously a crit is worth heaps, but your combos with an element and martial arts can pour it on. Most bosses I feel like crits and general output are about 50/50. I haven't felt too much opposition from bosses so far, I got Zhang Rang second go because killing the mimics refills your HP with that wood regen on hit spell. Now I pursue Lu Bu so I'll see how that goes. Octopus cow took me four tries and on the last one it felt like the fight went for thirty seconds due to relentless aggression and a couple of good counters on its red attacks.
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Mar 9, 2023 02:24
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VanillaGorilla posted:Yeah I dunno. I’ve been stuck on Aoye or whatever her name is for 2 days, and I think I’m done with this. You are completely ignoring the magic system which is very easy to because you don’t really have enough points to go around until the end of NG. The rock paper scissors game with elements really matters.
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Mar 9, 2023 02:38
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even if you ignore the actual rock-paper-scissors mechanics of the five phases, there's only a couple enemies that are actually full-on immune to specific status effects, and, as previously mentioned, those status effects help a lot against both bosses and regular enemies in my entire playtime, i think i counted two that were 100% immune to shock: the penultimate boss, and the large pig dudes that start showing up in the later acts. even the very clearly wood-coded enemies in the game aren't immune to it, at least in NG, so it's well worth grabbing an imbue and going to town JBP posted:If you're having a rough time I reckon lots of wood and lightning weapon will help you out. Even in light armour I can still take a hit. full wood is what i would recommend for first time players who don't have a specific character theme in mind, or who aren't looking for a major first playthrough challenge. inner breath, absorb vitality, and lightning weapon are all easily picked up within the first few hours of play, and those three spells + qinglong will carry you through the entire game without much hassle
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Mar 9, 2023 02:47
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VanillaGorilla posted:Yeah I dunno. I’ve been stuck on Aoye or whatever her name is for 2 days, and I think I’m done with this. There's only 1 boss that I think fits into that category and you aren't there yet. Like Vermain said, you should be building spirit and using your spirit attacks. Using R1 + up/down to buff your npc companions drastically improves their damage output. Use heavier armor. As long as you are in green weight, you will still have a decent deflect/roll. Armor mitigates a lot of incoming damage. Worst case you can just hop into co-op and get some help from people online. Just make sure you have found all the flags in the level. Lots of people just beeline to the boss and wonder why they are getting crushed when their starting morale isn't at 20.
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Mar 9, 2023 04:20
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I feel like I suck at this game because even though I'm making it through the levels with no more than 1 or 2 deaths, I almost never get the enemy stagger bar to do a critical blow besides to kill them. I guess I miss up enough deflects that I end up whittling their health down first instead.
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Mar 9, 2023 04:32
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WarpedLichen posted:I feel like I suck at this game because even though I'm making it through the levels with no more than 1 or 2 deaths, I almost never get the enemy stagger bar to do a critical blow besides to kill them. a win's a win, IMO - if what's satisfying to you is just progressing through the game then keep doing that with no shame, but if you get enjoyment out of the mastery of something, then it's totally okay to sit down with a boss and and try to learn their moveset, or practice fighting a specific enemy you always struggle with until you've got their number i died probably somewhere in the range of, like, 40-50 times to the tutorial tiger when the demo was out because i was determined to learn how to beat him, and when i came back through on NG+ i nohit the bastard, which is an immensely satisfying feeling
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Mar 9, 2023 04:35
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Lu Bu took me forever, felt like I was tickling him until I learned to parry almost everything. Qinglong is my favorite summon, helps me learn since you're near immortal as long as you stand in the circle.
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Mar 9, 2023 05:27
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isk posted:Having now beaten NG, I can confirm the existence of the canal with dams and drains, the flooded city with dramatic drain, and the big city with serpentine walkways and vertigo-inducing pits. To be clear, I don't mind the recurrence; each is different enough from previous games to be their own thing. It's more of a familiar and reassuring foundation with its own iterations and vibes. If you like being a walking god you need to check out SoP, imo that's the version where Team Ninja just said f balance. All the regular enemies can one shot you in ng+ literally the weakest dredge level enemy but once you get a optimized build you can literally torch the whole level in speedrun fashion.
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Mar 9, 2023 05:41
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Think I'm just gonna avoid that 1v3 fight until I find something broken to cheese it with. I think the fundamental problem with it is that it doesn't have the same kind of safeguards that From Software games have to make fights with multiple people less arduous or unfair. For instance, when you fight those Shadows before you get to Byrgenwerth in Bloodborne, you can summon allies to ease the burden, but even when you go in solo, their attacks tend to not overlap as much as these guys' attacks do, they stagger fairly easily, and they're not as meaty as they would be if it were just one guy as the boss. Here, it's about as close as you can get to one of those situations in Elden Ring where you invade and get your rear end kicked by the host and his two friends.
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Mar 9, 2023 05:44
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Maybe I got lucky but I beat that 1v3 in the first try. I had unlocked the full guan yu , and the halberd that came with it had a cheesy instant repeat jump attack. Special move. I was able to melt the first guy using that, making sure only one of them could reach me at any given moment. They conveniently body blocked each other for me and the back ones would slow themselves down by doing range attacks or spells.
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Mar 9, 2023 06:13
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fighting multiple dudes is actually really fun in this game imo because you don’t need to be facing a move to deflect it.
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Mar 9, 2023 06:27
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Moonshine Rhyme posted:Maybe I got lucky but I beat that 1v3 in the first try. I had unlocked the full guan yu , and the halberd that came with it had a cheesy instant repeat jump attack. Special move. I was able to melt the first guy using that, making sure only one of them could reach me at any given moment. They conveniently body blocked each other for me and the back ones would slow themselves down by doing range attacks or spells. it's a fight about positioning and aggression, really: i rushed down the furthest-away guy at the start to push him into spirit disruption, then kited around the big rock with the mud pit deflecting attacks and getting hits in until i separated two of them out, then beelined for whoever the furthest guy was and repeated it i do think it's easy to get overwhelmed if you aren't good at deflecting multiple targets at once, but it's a fight where you can honestly just sprint/dodge around a lot to separate them out and still do okay with a bit of patience
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Mar 9, 2023 07:10
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I beat the 3 jerks by running away and when they started to catch up I'd drop 3 flame pillars and then run away again
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Mar 9, 2023 07:22
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It took me an hour but I beat the Sun gank squad -focus Huang Gai first, he has the least health, but is the fastest and can deal massive damage -avoid being in line of sight or Cheng Pu and Han Dang will pepper you with arrows and fire pots -use a divine beast that has good AOE -kill Cheng Pu 2nd, his fire pots are annoying -Han Dang was the bane of my existence most of this fight. His bow shots are split second, he has Earth phase tank poo poo, and he's slow but has great range and does INSANE damage. -use the terrain, never engage with all 3 of them at once unless you are a deflect God, and don't let them corner you
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Mar 9, 2023 07:43
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Liu Bei is actual horseshit, I’ve never been mad at a boss until this one. What the gently caress is this
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Mar 9, 2023 08:11
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Thumbtacks posted:Liu Bei is actual horseshit, I’ve never been mad at a boss until this one. What the gently caress is this the lightning waves are the only really dangerous part of that fight, so breaking lockon and running around to deal with them is probably the best plan instead of trying to trade with him at the same time it's ongoing. i believe you can also jump over them instead of deflecting if you're feeling spicy
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Mar 9, 2023 08:14
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Vermain posted:the lightning waves are the only really dangerous part of that fight, so breaking lockon and running around to deal with them is probably the best plan instead of trying to trade with him at the same time it's ongoing. i believe you can also jump over them instead of deflecting if you're feeling spicy “Trade” He hits me a thousand times and then does a backflip into the sky, where exactly am I supposed to trade
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Mar 9, 2023 08:17
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Thumbtacks posted:“Trade” all of his extended combos and his ground slam have a long recovery animation at the end, and the ground slam can be strafed around easily to let you conserve spirit and get off a spirit attack before he zoots away he is definitely one of the game's harder bosses, i think it took me 5 or 6 tries and all my pots at the end of it
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Mar 9, 2023 08:22
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As is tradition I beat him immediately after posting that. He builds spirit like crazy so if you can get an opening he staggers super fast. I just played like a coward until he did the things I could reflect and then got more aggressive. Aqua blink is insanely good for this right specifically.
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Mar 9, 2023 08:23
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Thumbtacks posted:fun fact about those halberds, they have nearly the highest spirit guard rating in the game and it's not even CLOSE. the second highest one is the blacksmith hammer with 32, the halberds are 67. they are broken sounds like will get patched, con't be intentional VanillaGorilla posted:Yeah I dunno. I’ve been stuck on Aoye or whatever her name is for 2 days, and I think I’m done with this. you could watch a youtube video of the fight and change the speed of the video at 0.5x. First Aoye face turns red. Then a small red blink spot appears. When that blink spot fades out, the animation start. It may help you to instead of fighting from random distances, always fight her at the same distance, like far enough to be out of reach his melee attacks, but not further. if the distance to the boss is always the same, it might help learn better to avoid the attack (always the same timing). If you are one of these people that do a lot of normal attacks, have you access to imbue your weapons with electricity?, I think that ramps up the speed the bosses can get stun. Augus posted:fighting multiple dudes is actually really fun in this game imo because you don’t need to be facing a move to deflect it. I am a huge fan of the healing spirit, because once you have it out, you can spam attacks in a large area with impunity for a large period of time, and your life will not lower. That fight where the boss multiply into many is made easy with things like this. ----- On the fight of Lu Bu, if you are missing a flag. Is probably the one that is hidden from the left of the big canyon on the castle, beyond the barricade. Check for a place to jump down after the barricade, then continue, theres a way to climb and after a tiny distance theres the last hidden flag. The boss will be less tanki with the 20 flags. Tei fucked around with this message at 09:15 on Mar 9, 2023 |
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Mar 9, 2023 09:04
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I hope I unlock respec soon because I chose to go in on Earth because I like polarm padao but I didn’t know that apparently the only earth scaling weapons are all big slow twohanders. I keep finding these cool dual sword/halberds and they all invariably scale with water or fire or metal. Ideally I’d have the padao and then a dual fast weapon as secondary but idk if that’ll work out with stats.
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Mar 9, 2023 11:53
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Wamsutta posted:I hope I unlock respec soon because I chose to go in on Earth because I like polarm padao but I didn’t know that apparently the only earth scaling weapons are all big slow twohanders. I keep finding these cool dual sword/halberds and they all invariably scale with water or fire or metal. Ideally I’d have the padao and then a dual fast weapon as secondary but idk if that’ll work out with stats. This isn't quite true but it might take a while to get Earth scaling fast weapons. You unlock respec after the fifth main mission by the way. EDIT: Spears are fairly quick and the first companion you get gives you an Earth scaling spear if you get his bond to level 10 RatHat fucked around with this message at 12:55 on Mar 9, 2023 |
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Mar 9, 2023 11:57
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Ok Lu Bu keeps killing me this is hard. E: got him. He's a baby when you make him cold and dance with him pressing square, circle, square, circle. JBP fucked around with this message at 12:34 on Mar 9, 2023 |
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Mar 9, 2023 12:26
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Wamsutta posted:I hope I unlock respec soon because I chose to go in on Earth because I like polarm padao but I didn’t know that apparently the only earth scaling weapons are all big slow twohanders. I keep finding these cool dual sword/halberds and they all invariably scale with water or fire or metal. Ideally I’d have the padao and then a dual fast weapon as secondary but idk if that’ll work out with stats. I was in the same boat as you and was considering respeccing, but there actually are fast weapons that scale with Earth. I'm running dual sword/glaive and both scale A or B with Earth
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Mar 9, 2023 12:49
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None of the stat-weapon scaling matters in any meaningful way until after halfway through the game (level 50+) the first time around. And even then the scaling is secondary to upgrade levels.
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Mar 9, 2023 13:17
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Bunny hop stealthing is hilarious, though I do hope they do something about it eventually because it is incredibly silly.
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Mar 9, 2023 13:51
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WarEternal posted:Qinglong is my favorite summon, helps me learn since you're near immortal as long as you stand in the circle. It’s such a good oh poo poo button. You can use it when staggered and it interrupts boss attacks. Bonus points for rezing Allies. It doesn’t even fit my build but I kept it for all of NG.
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Mar 9, 2023 13:54
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Augus posted:fighting multiple dudes is actually really fun in this game imo because you don’t need to be facing a move to deflect it. Ya I said this earlier, this is one of the best improvements on the Sekiro formula apart from how spirit gauge works.
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Mar 9, 2023 14:32
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I really, really wish that I could add a small bit more time to the deflect window. I just fought the boss right before you unlock respecs, and for the life of me I could not get the timing down. I figured I'd farm up to 20 morale to make it easier, but the morale loss from taking a red hit from the boss sticks around between deaths, and my morale was whittled back down to 14 again within a few deaths (boss is at 15 morale; I couldn't find one of the small flags). It was incredibly frustrating because I'd be staring at the boss winding up, holding down block with my thumb hovering over the deflect button, and I'd just whiff the deflect over and over and over and over. I know what to do, and I'm trying to do it, but the timing window is so tight and punishing that it gets very frustrating. I did end up winning the fight eventually, but it didn't feel like an accomplishment or even a relief. Hell, there were points where I just let myself die after failing to deflect the opening critical attack because I knew I needed to learn the timing for it and that was the fastest way to encounter it again. It was just a smoldering irritation of knowing exactly what to do to win the fight, but being unable to do it. Also, the sheer amount of visual noise is very frustrating. If I summon my healing dragon, I'm virtually guaranteed to get hit by the next few boss attacks because there's a giant dragon blocking my view of the boss and particle effects everywhere. Meanwhile, if I want to see if my buffs are running out, I have to look away from the boss to the edges of the screen instead of there being some clear indicator around my character to let me know. The game overall is quite fun, and I enjoy going through the levels, but the deflect window being not only absolutely critical to winning boss fights, but also incredibly punishing to whiff (and you don't realistically have a choice to not engage - getting hit even when blocking will destroy your morale permanently until you grind it back out) is starting to put me off of it.
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Mar 9, 2023 15:16
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Dirk the Average posted:Bunny hop stealthing is hilarious, though I do hope they do something about it eventually because it is incredibly silly. Yeah you can literally collide with the enemies and push them before you land and death blow them. It's extremely fun but absolutely not intended. I can picture the speed runs now just every playing on this patch bunny hop sheathing through the map.
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Mar 9, 2023 15:52
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Alacrity haste doesn’t make enemies hear you from any farther away, so with enough water/stealth to give you a tiny bit of leeway, the easiest way I’ve found to get backstabs is to blitz up to things at 70mph before they can turn around
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Mar 9, 2023 15:57
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Wamsutta posted:I hope I unlock respec soon because I chose to go in on Earth because I like polarm padao but I didn’t know that apparently the only earth scaling weapons are all big slow twohanders. I keep finding these cool dual sword/halberds and they all invariably scale with water or fire or metal. Ideally I’d have the padao and then a dual fast weapon as secondary but idk if that’ll work out with stats. Staff scales with Earth and is fast.
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Mar 9, 2023 16:06
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Staff rules, I matched online with two other dudes also using staff and hearing that BONK BONK BONK every time we clowned on an enemy was delightful
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Mar 9, 2023 16:33
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The only thing I don’t like about the staff moveset is that dash attack is a bit slow
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Mar 9, 2023 16:35
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