Ukraine War: Berth El Buk

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(Thread IKs: weg, Toxic Mental)

zone: Dec 6, 2016

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1633809519556820993
Half a billion dollars of missiles wasted on terror bombing again.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 14:06

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# ? May 29, 2024 21:58

Karate Bastard: Jul 31, 2007; Soiled Meat

"A very sophisticated attack, using technniques only available to highly specialized actors" isn't that the public line fed by incompetent assholes after they get wrecked by some teenagers finding the keys to the vault under the doormat? Like, by every crypro dipshit to get wrecked ever?

Like Deviant Ollam says in many of his lectures, we literally got in using some trash we found in the garbage can next to the door, and grabbed some stacks of cash that we found laying on the counter.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 14:08

Power Khan: Aug 20, 2011; by Fritz the Horse

zone posted:

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1633809519556820993
Half a billion dollars of missiles wasted on terror bombing again.

How many % of that even got through?

# ? Mar 9, 2023 14:08

zone: Dec 6, 2016

Power Khan posted:

How many % of that even got through?

Unfortunately this time? close to half, as many of the missiles used were ballistic. However the damage is still repairable in most cases.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 14:11

Pablo Bluth: Sep 7, 2007; I've made a huge mistake.

zone posted:

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1633809519556820993
Half a billion dollars of missiles wasted on terror bombing again.

150m on missiles, 430m on graft?

# ? Mar 9, 2023 14:25

waydownLo: Oct 1, 2016

Pablo Bluth posted:

150m on missiles, 430m on graft?

That kind of ratio is the only way it was possible for the *civilian* PD-14 jet engine to cost the Russian Federation the equivalent of $1.1 billion in development and production costs.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 14:40

Dwesa: Jul 19, 2016; Maybe I'll go where I can see stars

Public support for Ukraine in most EU countries increased in February compared to the last Eurobarometer survey in November

https://twitter.com/Kofronjan/status/1633498867541983232

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:03

Zippy the Bummer: Dec 14, 2008; Silent Majority
The Don
LORD COMMANDER OF THE UKRAINIAN ARMED FORCES

Mr Teatime posted:

The talk of Russian tank brigades advancing in columns and getting bogged down over and over dredged up a memory of this article I read many years ago.

https://20thcenturywargaming.wordpress.com/2013/06/16/why-cold-war-warsaw-pact-tactics-work-in-wargaming/

It�s an interesting dive into older soviet doctrine and the logic behind it and why perhaps certain behaviours you keep seeing from the Russians are occurring. Old theory meeting modern reality.

I missed this post from a few pages back thanks that is very interesting

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:07

zone: Dec 6, 2016

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1633810221054279680

Shoigu, see how effective my terror attacks were on the Ukrainians, I remain a master strategist, ook.

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:09

Dumb Sex-Parrot: Dec 25, 2020; Absurd Pox Term
Rad Buxom Strep

Retard Ox Bumps
Borax Dumpster

Dares Box Trump

Dwesa posted:

Public support for Ukraine in most EU countries increased in February compared to the last Eurobarometer survey in November

https://twitter.com/Kofronjan/status/1633498867541983232

Thanks this is very interesting. Do you, or anyone itt, know why some of the old east block countries (Slovenia, Slovakia, Czechia for instance) are so low?

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:32

Tai: Mar 8, 2006

Probably a lot of pro USSR boomers

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:37

Set: Oct 30, 2005

A couple of articles up on Yle today about the ramping military activity by the Finnish/Russian border and generally in the arctic. This one is specifically about the NATO Joint Viking exercise and the situation in the arctic today. All the obscuring has been left to the side, and everyone is really open that the enemy that everyone is training to defend from is Russia. As someone living in the Nordics, this feels really scary that everyone now feels so free to just say it out loud after it generally being just alluded to since the 2nd World War. Feel free to click the link if you want to see soldiers running around in -30 C weather and a lot of snow, and there are links within the text for further sources.

Author: Hanna Visala
Release date: 09.03.23
Link to untranslated article: https://yle.fi/a/74-20021609

quote:

Russia opened almost all of its Soviet-era military bases near Finland in the Arctic region - this is how the commander of the Norwegian Navy commented on the matter

NATO increases its activity in the Arctic region. For example, Britain opened a military base in northern Norway. Yle followed the big Joint Viking exercise.

BARDUFOSS A huge submarine silently rises to the surface from the sea. A helicopter hovers above it and lands in a controlled manner on a nearby landing craft.

The large Joint Viking exercise of the military alliance NATO is underway in Northern Norway.

NATO and its allies have increased training in the Arctic region. This has happened for a good reason.

- Russia has quietly accelerated its activities in the region, says Rune Andersen, Commander of the Norwegian Navy.

Admiral Andersen watches the exercise from the command deck of the British amphibious assault ship HMS Albion and notes that everything is going as it should. Despite the rush, he manages to give an interview to Yle.

- In recent years, Russia has greatly increased its military power in the region. It has also reopened old bases, Andersen states.

According to Andersen, the Arctic region is strategically very important for both Russia and NATO. It is the home port of the Russian Navy and the nuclear deterrent placed on Russian submarines is located there.

There are also oil and gas fields in the area, and Norway is now Europe's largest supplier of gas.

According to data collected by the British think tank International Institute for Strategic Studies and the news agency Reuters, Russia currently has about a third more bases in the Arctic region compared to NATO.

Russia has naturally kept the information about the exact locations of its nuclear weapons a secret, but it regularly tests its nuclear weapons deterrence precisely in the Arctic region.

- NATO and its allies must listen to the signals carefully, understand this development and aggression, says Andersen.

- We have to maintain the balance of the Arctic region, be present and provide a counter-deterrent.

And attendance has increased. In March, Britain opened a NATO military base in northern Norway. The place, known as Camp Viking, serves as a base for the strike force of the British Navy consisting of about a thousand soldiers.

Since Norway does not allow permanent bases of foreign military forces in its territory, Camp Viking would be in operation for about ten years.

Exercises have also been added. During March, NATO and its allies are training in the Joint Viking and Joint Warrior war exercises in northern Norway.

The cooperation must work both on land, at sea and in the air and in cold conditions. It has been almost 30 degrees below freezing at the time of the exercise, so one of its goals - working in the cold - is fulfilled.

Joint Viking and Joint Warrior involve a total of more than 20,000 soldiers from ten different countries. The largest number of foreign troops are from Great Britain, Canada, Norway and the United States. This time, Finland is in the role of an observer.

Russian submarines are ready to strike

In previous years, NATO exercises have not named the enemy so directly. Now it was not unclear what and who we were training against.

Although both NATO and Russia have their eyes on Ukraine at the moment, in the war of aggression started by Russia, according to Andersen, there will come a time when we have to prepare for other things as well.

- We cannot be lulled into the fact that the Russian ground forces have big problems in Ukraine. However, they have specifically prioritized naval and air forces, and they are largely located in the Arctic region.

According to Andersen, Russia has especially developed its submarine fleet.

In July, the Russian Navy received a new submarine Belgorod. It can carry giant Poseidon torpedoes that can be equipped with nuclear warheads.

The submarine is designed to sneak past coastal defenses by traveling along the seabed.

China is also interested in the Arctic region. Russian warships trained with China last September in Siberia and the Sea of Japan. Norway, on the other hand, raised its preparedness level in October.

NATO countries also practice submarine warfare in the Arctic Ocean.

Joint Warrior includes, among other things, a submarine of the Norwegian Navy, a landing craft of the British Navy and other military fleets.

Finland's strengths in the Arctic region

According to Admiral Andersen, the joining of Finland and Sweden to NATO would significantly strengthen the defense of the Arctic region.

- Nordic cooperation has already gone well. We have the same mentality, the ability to work in an arctic environment and the ability to understand each other easily. We can operate on land, at sea and in the air, Andersen states.

Andersen emphasizes that Finland is also a strong defender in the Baltic Sea.

If Sweden and Finland join the defense alliance, then seven of the eight Arctic countries will be NATO members. The eighth country is Russia.

There was also an interesting article about an island just 40 km south from the nearest Finnish town, and a short helicopter flight to Helsinki. To summarize: Russia has built radar stations as well as an helicopter airport there, with the implication that the base there would function as a way to basically control all airspace in the area if they install a anti-air battery there, not to speak of giving them the capability to do some really nasty helicopter based strikes if things turn ugly. And yeah, as a tiny aside it seems that all that GPS interference that we have had in southern and eastern Finland most likely originates from this facility, and is a direct attack on air safety especially in this area of Finland. If you want to see satellite imagery of the outpost, as well as some maps of the GPS jamming you can find those behind the link.

Authors: Anu Rummukainen, Juha Rissanen, Taneli Arponen
Release date: 09.03.23
Link to untranslated article: https://yle.fi/a/74-20020628

quote:

Russia has become active in Suursaari, which is right next to Finland

Suursaari is about 40 kilometers from the coast of Finland. Helsinki is a short flight away from there.

Russia has been active in Suursaari, located in the eastern part of the Gulf of Finland, since 2014, that is, since the invasion of Crimea.

Satellite images show that a radar station has been built on Suursaaren. According to the Russian media, Russia also built a new military helipad on the island a few years ago.

After the annexation of Crimea, there have been more exercises of paratroopers and special forces in the region.

Finland's largest container port in Kotka is only about 40 kilometers from Suursaari. Helsinki is also a short flight away.

According to Yle's report, Suursaari probably disrupted Finnish air traffic last March. This is clear from the data sent by the airplanes.

In Finland, the authorities do not comment on issues related to Suursaari.

This article evaluates the importance of the island for Finland's security with the help of the Foreign Policy Institute, a Danish military analyst and open databases.

Cheap preparations

Charly Salonius-Pasternak, the leading researcher at the Foreign Policy Institute, estimates that Russia considers Suursaari to be a refueling site and an emergency landing site for helicopters. Militarily, the matter is rational and normal, because the island belongs to Russia and it can do whatever it wants there.

Salonius-Pasternak does not consider Russia's increased presence a threat to Finland's physical security.

- It is precisely in matters like this, such as harassment and intelligence, that geography must be taken into account in defense. In itself, the location of Suursaari does not pose a threat to us.

Salonius-Pasternak sees Russia preparing for everything. He emphasizes that if things never progress beyond preparation, that's okay.

- This is the same thing as with the land purchases. Their price has been low. If it turns out you don't need them, that's ok. Sometimes preparations can be useful because they don't cost much and at the same time you can practice or send a message to other countries.

Estonian Navy Commander J�ri Saska describes the importance of Suursaari in a similar way to Salonius-Pasternak. According to Saska, Suursaari is "one stone in the sea", whose importance for intelligence is greater than the island's military importance.

Saska compares Suursaari to Ukraine's Snake Island.

- It's a good place to own, but difficult to stay in control of.

Peacetime defense

Researcher Charly Salonius-Pasternak, director of the Foreign Policy Institute, estimates that it would be good for Finland to think more deeply about the importance of infrastructure near Finland's borders, considering possible times of crisis.

- In what situation should this kind of infrastructure be destroyed? The world of thought is foreign to Finnish politicians and, I claim, partly also to the defense forces.

Salonius-Pasternak means that there are regions and departments or sensors in Russia that can be used hundreds of kilometers away. In his opinion, in times of peace, we should think about what kind of situations Finland would be ready to neutralize the threat.

Suursaari is a so-called outpost where various opportunities for the Russian armed forces have been built. However, Salonius-Pasternak is not worried about the issue as a whole.

- Perhaps Finland has never been so safe during its independence, because Russia's focus is on Ukraine. Most of the forces that have been near the Finnish border are in Ukraine. In addition, some of the forces have been destroyed in Ukraine.

The leading researcher also estimates that the Finnish defense forces are perhaps more ready than ever. In addition, there is cooperation with Sweden, Norway and the United States, and Finland has received political commitments to support it.

The silence of Finland

One example of Russia's actions towards Finland is GPS jamming. According to aircraft data from Suursaari in March, aircraft GPS interference was directed in the direction of Kotka, Yle's investigation showed. It means that the machines lose their positioning signals.

In Finland, the authority responsible for air traffic is Traficom. It says it can't trace the harassment coming from Russia. In the north, the Norwegian authorities have traced the harassment coming from Russia. In addition, last year, in an international study investigating Russian GPS interference, one measurement point was in Sodankyl�. Harassment was detected there.

The Central Criminal Police investigated the GPS disturbances in March of last year, but stopped the investigation because the source of the disturbances could not be found. The Central Criminal Police says that the investigation will continue if they receive new information on the matter.

Estonian Navy Commander J�ri Saska tells Yle that Estonia has also experienced GPS interference in recent years.

Salonius-Pasternak wonders why the authorities in Finland don't speak up and say out loud that the behavior is unacceptable.

- When you look at that GPS interference map, the interference does not seem to be related to the protection of Russia's strategic targets. It is possible that the harassment is related to covering up one's own activity, but the activity is still not acceptable. Here, the airspace of another country is deliberately disturbed.

Salonius-Pasternak interprets the harassment as precisely directed to Finland.

- I don't see how this could be interpreted in any other way than hostile.

Yle requested an interview from the Russian armed forces, but to no avail.

Harassment direction Utti

Danish military analyst Jens Wenzel Kristoffersen has been following Russia's activities for decades.

Kristoffersen sees Suursaari's location as strategic.

- If you place, say, an S300 or S400 air defense system on the island, you can stop all air traffic in the Gulf of Finland if you want.

The military analyst believes that Finnish intelligence is interested in Suursaari and its upcoming activities.

Kristoffersen draws attention to the fact that in March of last year, GPS jamming was made directly towards Finland.

- Finland, not Estonia, has been chosen as the destination. The harassment may be directed towards Kotka because of Uti's Jaeger Regiment, Kristoffersen estimates.

Set fucked around with this message at 15:46 on Mar 9, 2023

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:37

Arc Light: Sep 26, 2013

Tai posted:

Why are B-52's flying around eastern Romania lol. Seems like a dumb thing to do

I must have missed where that was posted, I only saw the Global Hawk off Crimea.

If there's a B-52 in the air, it's to send a message. Any time we fly a B-52 sortie that close to Russia, the message is some variant of "If you 'accidentally' hit NATO, remember that we have mobile cruise missile planes on your border ready to go." The airframes currently flown have some ISR capabilities, but nothing near the utility of a dedicated surveillance plane.

As for the particular timing, I'd guess it was planned in advance, but I'm not in the loop for bomber ops these days. There are no US bombers on permanent assignment to Europe. Via midair refueling, B-52s can launch from their home bases (in Louisiana, North Dakota and Guam) and fly around the world and then return, but that means they need tankers ready to meet them. Alternately, for them to operate out of the same geographic region, they require a long, reinforced runway and various support facilities for fuel, munitions, etc. There are two NATO bases typically used to temporarily support those bombers in Europe - RAF Fairford and Mor�n Air Base.

Back in 2014, after Russia first invaded and occupied Crimea, I was stationed at a B-52 base. As a similar show of force, my team went out to RAF Fairford in England with a squadron of bombers, and then they spent a month flying along the border of Russian airspace. B-52s are currently flying out of Mor�n Air Base in Spain as part of a previously planned annual training exercise, so I'd think this is most likely a training sortie, or else they were diverted to assist in a real world mission due to their existing proximity.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:40

zone: Dec 6, 2016

https://twitter.com/Maks_NAFO_FELLA/status/1633825336101306372
Which crystal ball did these geniuses use to make this prediction?

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:42

Philonius: Jun 12, 2005

zone posted:

https://twitter.com/Maks_NAFO_FELLA/status/1633825336101306372
Which crystal ball did these geniuses use to make this prediction?

Or more likely, the chinese plan was treated with the derison it deserves, so now they're trying to pretend they had Ukraine's best interest at heart after all.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:48

Alan Smithee: Jan 4, 2005; A man becomes preeminent, he's expected to have enthusiasms.

Enthusiasms, enthusiasms...

zone posted:

https://twitter.com/Maks_NAFO_FELLA/status/1633825336101306372
Which crystal ball did these geniuses use to make this prediction?

China ran it in a state of the art simulation: a Genshin Impact RP mod

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:51

Victis: Mar 26, 2008

It�s super rainy across most of Ukraine today which makes it lovely for repair crews but makes any fires like at the coal plant easier to deal with

edit: also means that drones don�t fly and there�s not much chance of fighting, not that these were actually strikes in support of military actions

Victis fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Mar 9, 2023

# ? Mar 9, 2023 15:53

Oscar Wilde Bunch: Jun 12, 2012; Grimey Drawer

zone posted:

https://twitter.com/Maks_NAFO_FELLA/status/1633825336101306372
Which crystal ball did these geniuses use to make this prediction?

I had a friend in the military who did a lot of war gaming and he at one point mentioned that the Chinese rig their war games so that China always wins. It�s probably the same here. How could glorious ally to perfect China not win?

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:13

zone: Dec 6, 2016

Oscar Wilde Bunch posted:

I had a friend in the military who did a lot of war gaming and he at one point mentioned that the Chinese rig their war games so that China always wins. It�s probably the same here. How could glorious ally to perfect China not win?

That's almost too precious for words. You'd think they'd at least not make the same mistakes Russia did with their military, but now I'm not so sure they haven't gone the same route.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:18

Pablo Bluth: Sep 7, 2007; I've made a huge mistake.

Victis posted:

It�s super rainy across most of Ukraine today which makes it lovely for repair crews but makes any fires like at the coal plant easier to deal with

https://twitter.com/Seveerity/status/1633546192834396160?t=SsMOPOWYjqvUMDkbKpvoNg&s=19

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:18

Drone_Fragger: May 9, 2007

Still loling at the time the usa lost a wargame because the guy they put in charge of opfor realised the usa military wouldnt be able to deal with small suicide powerboats or mass cruise missle attacks owing to control issues and sunk like half the us navy by ramming them with suicide powerboats while the limited point defence weapons were trying to shoot down incoming cruise missles.

Anyway, they accused him of cheating and reset the wargame and forced him to run to a script that consisted of stuff like "turn the radar on full blast when you detect enemy aircraft so we can shopt it with anti radiation missles".

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:21

Telsa Cola: Aug 19, 2011; No... this is all wrong... this whole operation has just gone completely sidewaysface

Drone_Fragger posted:

Still loling at the time the usa lost a wargame because the guy they put in charge of opfor realised the usa military wouldnt be able to deal with small suicide powerboats or mass cruise missle attacks owing to control issues and sunk like half the us navy by ramming them with suicide powerboats while the limited point defence weapons were trying to shoot down incoming cruise missles.

Anyway, they accused him of cheating and reset the wargame and forced him to run to a script that consisted of stuff like "turn the radar on full blast when you detect enemy aircraft so we can shopt it with anti radiation missles".

This comes up a lot, but the dude did in fact cheat because his plan and strategy relied on physically impossible things like 1. Motorcycle couriers that are invisible and instantly go from A to B, and 2. Mounting ASM missiles on basically inflatable boats that in no way could have actually taken the weight.

When called out on this and basically called a loving idiot for wasting everyones time and money, he went to the media.

It's pretty telling that from what I can tell, he's not looked fondly on by anyone whose done any military wargaming.

Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Mar 9, 2023

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:25

Outrail: Jan 4, 2009; www.sapphicrobotica.com

Drone_Fragger posted:

Still loling at the time the usa lost a wargame because the guy they put in charge of opfor realised the usa military wouldnt be able to deal with small suicide powerboats or mass cruise missle attacks owing to control issues and sunk like half the us navy by ramming them with suicide powerboats while the limited point defence weapons were trying to shoot down incoming cruise missles.

Anyway, they accused him of cheating and reset the wargame and forced him to run to a script that consisted of stuff like "turn the radar on full blast when you detect enemy aircraft so we can shopt it with anti radiation missles".

Wasn't he kinda cheating with teleporting messengers and poo poo?

Efb

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:25

Tai: Mar 8, 2006

My lot (UK) did quite a lot of wargaming versus the US. Kitted up with those laser detection things to rifles and chest. We'd always win and they'd be super salty :smug:

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:27

Decrepus: May 21, 2008; In the end, his dominion did not touch a single poster.

That story gets more embellished every time it gets posted here :laffo:

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:27

the holy poopacy: May 16, 2009; hey! check this out; Fun Shoe

On the one hand, the whole point of wargames is to expose potential weaknesses and measure your ability to deal with unforeseen issues, so you want to model a certain amount of bullshit from your opfor; no one needs to analyze the best case scenario. There's a limited amount you can learn from outright impossible hypotheticals, though, so you still need to keep it somewhat plausible.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:31

Alchenar: Apr 9, 2008

You can read the declassified official report: https://www.esd.whs.mil/Portals/54/Documents/FOID/Reading%20Room/Joint_Staff/12-F-0344-Millennium-Challenge-2002-Experiment-Report.pdf

The point of professional wargaming is not to take tens of thousands of people so that two generals can play real life Hearts of Iron, it's to test boring things like 'if we set up a new headquarters unit here, does that make command and control of the force easier'.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:33

Infidel Castro: Jun 8, 2010; Again and again
Your face reminds me of a bleak future
Despite the absence of hope
I give you this sacrifice

Victis posted:

It’s super rainy across most of Ukraine today which makes it lovely for repair crews but makes any fires like at the coal plant easier to deal with

edit: also means that drones don’t fly and there’s not much chance of fighting, not that these were actually strikes in support of military actions

Don't know why we haven't explored more ATHF-inspired air defence systems before. It's brilliant!

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:33

Cugel the Clever: Apr 5, 2009; I LOVE AMERICA AND CAPITALISM DESPITE BEING POOR AS FUCK. I WILL NEVER RETIRE BUT HERE'S ANOTHER 200$ FOR UKRAINE, SLAVA

EasilyConfused posted:

Great post, but what the hell is going on with the floating torso?

If you click through to the link, you'll find it's one of those photosphere photos, which don't stitch together perfectly :cheeky:

But also this:

Borscht posted:

Her parents never fell in love at the enchantment under the sea dance.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:40

FUCK SNEEP: Apr 21, 2007

Drone_Fragger posted:

Still loling at the time the usa lost a wargame because the guy they put in charge of opfor realised the usa military wouldnt be able to deal with small suicide powerboats or mass cruise missle attacks owing to control issues and sunk like half the us navy by ramming them with suicide powerboats while the limited point defence weapons were trying to shoot down incoming cruise missles.

Anyway, they accused him of cheating and reset the wargame and forced him to run to a script that consisted of stuff like "turn the radar on full blast when you detect enemy aircraft so we can shopt it with anti radiation missles".

Still lol that goons post about the one warfare they ever heard about without ever looking into how they guy managed to break the laws of physics to do so

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:41

Dandywalken: Feb 11, 2014

the holy poopacy posted:

On the one hand, the whole point of wargames is to expose potential weaknesses and measure your ability to deal with unforeseen issues, so you want to model a certain amount of bullshit from your opfor; no one needs to analyze the best case scenario. There's a limited amount you can learn from outright impossible hypotheticals, though, so you still need to keep it somewhat plausible.

This. If you "win" the wargame routinely then its not a good test.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:42

Dwesa: Jul 19, 2016; Maybe I'll go where I can see stars

Dumb Sex-Parrot posted:

Thanks this is very interesting. Do you, or anyone itt, know why some of the old east block countries (Slovenia, Slovakia, Czechia for instance) are so low?

I don't know about Slovenia, so this will mostly apply to Slovakia (and perhaps to some extent to Czechia), there are various factors: idea of pan-Slavism was fairly popular since Austria-Hungary, then there were decades of Soviet propaganda and many older folks are nostalgic about those times, because they perceive those times as simpler and more economically stable (if you shut up), Russian propaganda is also sadly quite prevalent and many politicians embrace it because disinfo webs give them space.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 16:59

Tai: Mar 8, 2006

the holy poopacy posted:

On the one hand, the whole point of wargames is to expose potential weaknesses and measure your ability to deal with unforeseen issues, so you want to model a certain amount of bullshit from your opfor; no one needs to analyze the best case scenario. There's a limited amount you can learn from outright impossible hypotheticals, though, so you still need to keep it somewhat plausible.

We did try to explain it to them at the pub/bar once everything was finishied that you aren't expected to win. This is purely to make you better. Still grumbled lol

# ? Mar 9, 2023 17:03

Killer robot: Sep 6, 2010; I was having the most wonderful dream. I think you were in it!; Pillbug

Alchenar posted:

You can read the declassified official report: https://www.esd.whs.mil/Portals/54/Documents/FOID/Reading%20Room/Joint_Staff/12-F-0344-Millennium-Challenge-2002-Experiment-Report.pdf

The point of professional wargaming is not to take tens of thousands of people so that two generals can play real life Hearts of Iron, it's to test boring things like 'if we set up a new headquarters unit here, does that make command and control of the force easier'.

That's the other part of it: even if someone legitimately gets an "instant win" condition out of the scenario, you still have a lot of time and resources invested and it only makes sense to rewind and do it again as though that didn't happen. Otherwise you did the full expense of training for a fraction of the benefits.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 17:08

karoshi: Nov 4, 2008; "Can somebody mspaint eyes on the steaming packages? TIA" yeah well fuck you too buddy, this is the best you're gonna get. Is this even "work-safe"? Let's find out!

Power Khan posted:

https://twitter.com/RoubleDestroyer/status/1633785359153745920

They've been using analog video transmitters since day 1 because $9 aliexpress 5GHz combo devices are supported by ardupilot. Combo as in TX and put some text on the video. Also analog cameras are cheap af.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 17:09

Nessus: Dec 22, 2003; After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!

Killer robot posted:

That's the other part of it: even if someone legitimately gets an "instant win" condition out of the scenario, you still have a lot of time and resources invested and it only makes sense to rewind and do it again as though that didn't happen. Otherwise you did the full expense of training for a fraction of the benefits.

Yeah, you don�t want to continue the entire exercise under your new AU. Round of applause for Mr. Clever, resume play at the day 2 scenario.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 17:22

Karma Comedian: Feb 2, 2012

Jet taboo seems to be cracking.
https://twitter.com/bayraktar_1love/status/1633777296854138880?t=tw5LlJ6tIR6BMhIdObi04A&s=19

# ? Mar 9, 2023 17:36

Cthulu Carl: Apr 16, 2006

Pablo Bluth posted:

https://twitter.com/Seveerity/status/1633546192834396160?t=SsMOPOWYjqvUMDkbKpvoNg&s=19

https://youtu.be/V6l2py68WY4

# ? Mar 9, 2023 17:39

Oscar Wilde Bunch: Jun 12, 2012; Grimey Drawer

zone posted:

That's almost too precious for words. You'd think they'd at least not make the same mistakes Russia did with their military, but now I'm not so sure they haven't gone the same route.

It's all part of the same authoritarians dilemma, advancement and being non dead rely on asskissing and reinforcing to the people above you that they're very smart and handsome. Of course boss your plan is great and will result in great success. And your bosses bosses plan is great too. Aside from the PLA not being a Army in the sense of built to fight foreign adversaries (It's mostly an internal suppression force), I had another friend who did a lot of observation of large scale corps of engineers type projects, and they sound like they anecdotally suffer from the same problems the Russians do. Can't take a dump without the go-ahead from Beijing first, no effective NCO's, and the funniest was a lot of observation on how the enlisted guys would just straight gently caress off and leave if there wasn't an LT there yelling at them to do their jobs.

# ? Mar 9, 2023 17:48

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# ? May 29, 2024 21:58

fatherboxx: Mar 25, 2013

Power Khan posted:

FINALLY, it happened. They found a TOS and used a drone to blow it up

https://twitter.com/RoubleDestroyer/status/1633785359153745920

Rip to the unlucky crew, TOS usually blows up in a giant fireball

# ? Mar 9, 2023 17:51

The Something Awful Forums > Main > General Bullshit > Ukraine War: Berth El Buk

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