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This is all very interesting, but I’m also a messy bitch by default so I’m anything but impartial. What’s your gig OP? Art college professor?
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Mar 13, 2023 00:51
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All makes me happy I didn't go to undergrad for animation. Art school students are so dramatic. I was self taught and then did a year at Sheridan to get work in animation. Already most of the students had professional experience so while some were super harsh with critique or had come from overseas studios where people had died working on projects for insane clients, they at least weren't super petty.
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Mar 13, 2023 00:54
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I'm surpsied a Hazbin Hotel thread hasn't been made yet.
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Mar 13, 2023 01:23
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Xelkelvos posted:I'm surpsied a Hazbin Hotel thread hasn't been made yet. same. Ccs posted:All makes me happy I didn't go to undergrad for animation. Art school students are so dramatic. I was self taught and then did a year at Sheridan to get work in animation. Already most of the students had professional experience so while some were super harsh with critique or had come from overseas studios where people had died working on projects for insane clients, they at least weren't super petty. i have thought about going into a masters for art history but i am pretty sure i wouldnt find a good job with it.
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Mar 13, 2023 01:36
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Me and Viv went to same college but I'm not sure if we there at the same time. All I can say is I knew I wanted my work animated but animation was not nor is ever going to be my strength. That was script writing and concept art. So I never applied to those sorts of classes to begin with. Part of the process is coming to terms with what you can get done and how someone else is going to have to help you out in those particular endeavors.
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Mar 13, 2023 01:46
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All I can say is I would prefer it if nobody ever dissected what I was like in college online.
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Mar 13, 2023 01:54
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Rand Brittain posted:All I can say is I would prefer it if nobody ever dissected what I was like in college online. I was basically the same as I am now, which is to say a giant nerd.
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Mar 13, 2023 01:57
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I just like to watch the thesis films students make, it's fun to see a cool short and then years later you see their name in the credits of a show and it's like, whoa I remember them from that cool short!! i'm not super concerned with what they were like in college because you are dumb in college and become slightly less dumb later on. i was an edgy little poo poo in high school and college and I mellowed the gently caress out a couple of years later i will say that the one time I met Rebecca Sugar in person, they told me that there was some guy going around at SVA claiming to be pals with me and was my best friend. I had never heard of them, no idea who they were. i guess college is the time you just sort of do that. The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 02:41 on Mar 13, 2023 |
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Mar 13, 2023 02:34
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Warbird posted:This is all very interesting, but I’m also a messy bitch by default so I’m anything but impartial. What’s your gig OP? Art college professor? My particular skill was layout, though my drafting/analytical skills also made me a good revisionist for things like re-animating characters' hand animation when the outsourced stuff came back too crappy for example. I worked in the industry for a little bit but had to head back to my hometown after a few family tragedy things happened and I had to help handle those affairs which are basically still ongoing years later. I don't feel like rejoining it in its current shape, though, either.
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Mar 13, 2023 03:49
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Helluva Boss is always packed with blink-and-you'll-miss-it jokes and for this episode I do believe my favorite one was "the priest throws his hands up, turns around and walks away with double birds with a  expression on his face".
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Mar 14, 2023 02:23
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I do like the bits, and often it's because they're not focused on him, where Blitzo isn't quite so extra.
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Mar 14, 2023 04:26
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I'm going to ask a question here because I try to keep my distance from internet fandom drama as hard as I can. So I was scrolling for concept art of the background characters and of course it being tumblr I keep getting hit with the hate posts. But one particular point i keep seeing--I'm not sure whether it's their collective belief or is based in reality--but it's that the show is dying because it's not doing the numbers it used to. Is that them raging out or has the show been struggling with that? Also said post was foaming with rage about how the latest episode was racist against Italians so make of that what you will. Flopsy fucked around with this message at 04:57 on Mar 14, 2023 |
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Mar 14, 2023 04:29
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Flopsy posted:I'm going to ask a question here because I try to keep my distance from internet fandom drama as hard as I can. So I was scrolling for concept art of the background characters and of course it being tumblr I keep getting hit with the hate posts. But one particular point i keep seeing--I'm not sure whether it's their collective belief or is based in reality--but it's that the show is dying because it's not doing the numbers it used to. Is that them raging out or has the show been struggling with that? The latest episode got 7.4 million views within two days of being out, they're not dying.
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Mar 14, 2023 08:14
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Space Cadet Omoly posted:The latest episode got 7.4 million views within two days of being out, they're not dying. Honestly that's what I thought. It's just that when I see a point being constantly repeated I just want to know if there was some basis in reality or if it's literally pure insanity. Say what you will about Vivzie but I give her credit for trucking on when you got people getting as terrifyingly worked up as they do about her shows. I don't dabble too much in fandom spaces but what I see sometimes genuinely disturbs me.
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Mar 14, 2023 08:45
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I tend to not plumb the depths of fandoms for things i'm not into or interested in and that saves me so much more headspace for weed or flowers or literally anything else, so I can only imagine how deranged a fandom for scene-kid style characters can get.
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Mar 14, 2023 09:35
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Neeksy posted:I tend to not plumb the depths of fandoms for things i'm not into or interested in and that saves me so much more headspace for weed or flowers or literally anything else, so I can only imagine how deranged a fandom for scene-kid style characters can get. Hell, I hardly touch the fandoms of things I am interested in, that can be where the worst cringe comes from.
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Mar 14, 2023 12:03
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I don’t mean to be dour/goonish, but yeah. Part of growing up in nowhere Alabama was not having access to groups or materials I was interested in and finally seeing an anime convention in person was a shock to the system and not in a good way. Similar for computer or game focused groups/events. I’m happy people are enjoying things but a lot of folks need to chill. Neeksy posted:I tend to not plumb the depths of fandoms for things i'm not into or interested in and that saves me so much more headspace for weed or flowers or literally anything else, so I can only imagine how deranged a fandom for scene-kid style characters can get. Oh they did the math and they’re currently rated at .79 Homestucks as of last calibration.
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Mar 14, 2023 15:10
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Flopsy posted:Honestly that's what I thought. It's just that when I see a point being constantly repeated I just want to know if there was some basis in reality or if it's literally pure insanity. Say what you will about Vivzie but I give her credit for trucking on when you got people getting as terrifyingly worked up as they do about her shows. I don't dabble too much in fandom spaces but what I see sometimes genuinely disturbs me. It's a typical tactic for people who hate a thing to start yelling about how it's dying, mostly to convince themselves.
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Mar 14, 2023 18:31
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Something something ded gay forums something.
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Mar 14, 2023 18:40
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Flopsy posted:I'm going to ask a question here because I try to keep my distance from internet fandom drama as hard as I can. So I was scrolling for concept art of the background characters and of course it being tumblr I keep getting hit with the hate posts. But one particular point i keep seeing--I'm not sure whether it's their collective belief or is based in reality--but it's that the show is dying because it's not doing the numbers it used to. Is that them raging out or has the show been struggling with that? It’s popular to hate the show now. I think it has issues but lol at a lot of the weird coping and seething I keep seeing. I think what annoys me is that people can’t just not like something, they have to come up with some great moral justification about why they hate it and why it’s evil and it’s fans or creators are monsters. Tumblr and twitter ruined society more. Neeksy posted:I tend to not plumb the depths of fandoms for things i'm not into or interested in and that saves me so much more headspace for weed or flowers or literally anything else, so I can only imagine how deranged a fandom for scene-kid style characters can get. As someone who goes there. It depends. It’s chiller than Stephen universe and other kid show ones. Most of the worst stuff is shipping fights OR goon brain type “is show bad???” Type poo poo. It’s more now it has a decent sized hate watch community now I guess.
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Mar 14, 2023 19:11
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My experiences with Jhonen Vazquez fandoms going back to JTHM definitely put me off trying the HazBoss extended universe up until now given how much it targets similarly brained individuals, but just had to remember that nothing stops you from just enjoying the thing and paying attention to no one else who enjoys the thing!
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Mar 14, 2023 19:57
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"[Show] is dying" is something I've always interpreted as "I don't enjoy this as much as i used to" or "this show isn't exactly what I want it to be". I'd be more receptive to some criticism if it wasn't so couched in this sense of, "I, the fan, am being spited by the creators." Even the criticism that I agree with, stuff like wishing for more spotlight for Millie, eventually turns in to statements like, "its clear that Vivzie just doesn't care because she's lazy/misogynistic/whatever " and it's kind of exhausting.
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Mar 14, 2023 20:29
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Happy Landfill posted:"[Show] is dying" is something I've always interpreted as "I don't enjoy this as much as i used to" or "this show isn't exactly what I want it to be". I'd be more receptive to some criticism if it wasn't so couched in this sense of, "I, the fan, am being spited by the creators." Even the criticism that I agree with, stuff like wishing for more spotlight for Millie, eventually turns in to statements like, "its clear that Vivzie just doesn't care because she's lazy/misogynistic/whatever " and it's kind of exhausting. Incidentally, Viv made a whole twitter thread talking about Millie https://twitter.com/VivziePop/status/1635001106874114049 Basically more stuff is coming for Millie but it sounds like people seem to overlook the stuff Millie currently does still get because she's generally the most upbeat of the cast and doesn't have daddy/mommy issues like Blitzo, Moxxie, Stolas and Loona I personally never really felt like Millie was missing anything, because her and Moxxie are such a strong singular unit, they almost become one character. Like Moxxie's problems this past episode are still very much Millie's problems
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Mar 14, 2023 20:39
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Macaluso posted:Incidentally, Viv made a whole twitter thread talking about Millie I agree with all of this. Millie is most well adjusted out of all of them but I would appreciate some more background on her. That's it. I don't think they secretly hate her character or they have some overarching plot to put her on the back burner for eternity. Oh and for extra lols the hate watchers took this series of posts as proof Viv is now mocking and loving with them personally. They're literally wholesale making up conspiracy theories about it. They also think the simpsons gif she tweeted is an attack on Italian Americans. I can only imagine how unsettling the Steven Universe fandom got if this is considered small potatoes.
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Mar 14, 2023 21:28
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Folks get you a partner that’s willing to try and disembowel your mutual ex because he hurt you in the past.
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Mar 14, 2023 21:29
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Macaluso posted:Incidentally, Viv made a whole twitter thread talking about Millie but yeah, millie is basicaly the happy straight man of the show who is really really good at her job. Happy Landfill posted:"[Show] is dying" is something I've always interpreted as "I don't enjoy this as much as i used to" or "this show isn't exactly what I want it to be". I'd be more receptive to some criticism if it wasn't so couched in this sense of, "I, the fan, am being spited by the creators." Even the criticism that I agree with, stuff like wishing for more spotlight for Millie, eventually turns in to statements like, "its clear that Vivzie just doesn't care because she's lazy/misogynistic/whatever " and it's kind of exhausting. thats kinda my issue. i like criticism and talking about flaws in characters, but alot of the criticism comes off as extreamly hypobolic or stupidly mean/stupid. everything has to be a moral outrage, i have close friends who don't like the show or are indifferent. they arnt psychotic about it. Bussamove posted:Folks get you a partner that’s willing to try and disembowel your mutual ex because he hurt you in the past. more like, leaves his dumb rear end to die to your husbands psychotic/desperate crime lord dad and death being the best thing that happens to him that day. Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 22:39 on Mar 14, 2023 |
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Mar 14, 2023 22:32
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Flopsy posted:I agree with all of this. Millie is most well adjusted out of all of them but I would appreciate some more background on her. That's it. I don't think they secretly hate her character or they have some overarching plot to put her on the back burner for eternity. Oh and for extra lols the hate watchers took this series of posts as proof Viv is now mocking and loving with them personally. They're literally wholesale making up conspiracy theories about it. They also think the simpsons gif she tweeted is an attack on Italian Americans. I can only imagine how unsettling the Steven Universe fandom got if this is considered small potatoes. steven universe had a couple of suicides related to it i believe because some fan artist would draw someone the wrong skin tone by slightist bit or made one of the charaters "less fat" or some poo poo. also what a bunch of loving freaks. how do these dipshits think this show is reactionary? like wtf. genuin hot take but this kinda poo poo is the REAL cancel culture. weird dickheads going after smallish creators on twitter or youtube or whatever because they made a faux pa or etc and then they scream and gently caress with them about everything until they get their "win" this doesnt work on chuds or real monsters because they dont have shame. Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Mar 14, 2023 |
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Mar 14, 2023 22:49
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Dapper_Swindler posted:steven universe had a couple of suicides related to it i believe because some fan artist would draw someone the wrong skin tone by slightist bit or made one of the charaters "less fat" or some poo poo. I think you mentioned this earlier but who has the time or energy to hate watch something? Like seriously why devote yourself to something you loathe? Everything is interpreted as a personal attack and it's just baffling to me they think she gives that much of a poo poo about them. I just don't understand why they don't watch something else they actually like instead of seething how they hate sad backstories and the latest episode had too much green in it.
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Mar 14, 2023 23:10
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Flopsy posted:I think you mentioned this earlier but who has the time or energy to hate watch something? Like seriously why devote yourself to something you loathe? Everything is interpreted as a personal attack and it's just baffling to me they think she gives that much of a poo poo about them. I just don't understand why they don't watch something else they actually like instead of seething how they hate sad backstories and the latest episode had too much green in it. Let me tell you about a little subreddit called r/RantGrumps
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Mar 14, 2023 23:13
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There's nothing I can add to this conversation that hasn't already been said in SarahZ's video on this same issue https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__ctRfI7cuM * People shouldn't be shielded from criticism because they're marginalized but like, people don't treat Alex Hirsch or Pendelton Ward like this. People get -really- nitpickey when the media is queer and created by someone who isn't a man. I feel like if this show was not overtly queer and created by a dude, the fandom wouldn't be like *gestures vaguely* this. Not to say that dude creators don't also get poo poo but I feel like it takes a lot to get to that point. Honestly, I think the only woman showrunner that didn't get showered in poo poo was Lauren Faust and people only seemed to really start criticizing that show after she left There was a really good tweet that I saw just yesterday, that I can't find, that said something like, "the worst thing you can do as a queer creative is go in to children's animation" and all can say is WORD *her Bad Media Criticism video also touches on very similar points, but I think this video is a littler more relevant Happy Landfill fucked around with this message at 23:27 on Mar 14, 2023 |
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Mar 14, 2023 23:20
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Flopsy posted:I think you mentioned this earlier but who has the time or energy to hate watch something? Like seriously why devote yourself to something you loathe? Everything is interpreted as a personal attack and it's just baffling to me they think she gives that much of a poo poo about them. I just don't understand why they don't watch something else they actually like instead of seething how they hate sad backstories and the latest episode had too much green in it. i mean millie doesn't and having angsty backstory and shits fine. like not for everyone but to me Helluva boss strikes me as show from 00s but writen for 20s sensibilities and well "nuance". its weird and i like it for that. Happy Landfill posted:There's nothing I can add to this conversation that hasn't already been said in SarahZ's video on this same issue yeah faust basicaly ended up hitting lightining in a bottle with MLP fim and while some of the bronies are weird/gross, the ones i am friends with tend to be pretty normal/chill and the show is good for what it is. reminds me of bluey but for older kids and more world building. but from my reading, it never had as much "inward" drama outside a couple notible cases. I saw way more hosed up poo poo from steven universe fanbase. but yeah, criticism is cool but some people treat it like fundimentalism and its weird. Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 23:37 on Mar 14, 2023 |
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Mar 14, 2023 23:31
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I've only had a few (positive) interactions with Viv but I can say that a month in, the production and design staffs thus far have been really chill, friendly, and extremely patient with my dumbass figuring out their system. You can feel very good at supporting them! Also something interesting for anyone who was riding the Pantheon train- We're having an in-person wrap party next month for S2. I know AMC was shopping the show and we were told to "hang tight" on updates, so [speculation]I'm pretty confident it's found a new home and we'll be receiving an announcement soon.[/speculation] (And for those who don't know, Pantheon was an adult 2D sci-fi series that AMC completely flubbed the release of and weeks after S2 was 100% done, they announced they were shelving the whole thing. They proceeded to go scorched earth and removed S1 from all available platforms thereafter. Why do this when it was getting such immense critical praise? Simple! Good ol' CEO shift-fuckery!)
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Mar 14, 2023 23:33
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Das Boo posted:I've only had a few (positive) interactions with Viv but I can say that a month in, the production and design staffs thus far have been really chill, friendly, and extremely patient with my dumbass figuring out their system. You can feel very good at supporting them! I met her at too many games(for like 2 min tops), she was nice signed and drew a little stolas for me. hope they go back there again someday.
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Mar 14, 2023 23:35
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Das Boo posted:I've only had a few (positive) interactions with Viv but I can say that a month in, the production and design staffs thus far have been really chill, friendly, and extremely patient with my dumbass figuring out their system. You can feel very good at supporting them! I'd be really curious to hear about your experiences there and how it differs from your other jobs, given the more independent nature of things. Glad things are going well  Wishing Pantheon the best! I really hope you guys get picked up elsewhere. Honestly, if A24 wanted to pick up another adult animated show, that would be pretty cool
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Mar 14, 2023 23:47
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Happy Landfill posted:There's nothing I can add to this conversation that hasn't already been said in SarahZ's video on this same issue I've noticed this as well and I wonder if there's some sort of unconscious bias going on here.
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Mar 14, 2023 23:50
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I think it might just be as simple as an audience with heightened expectations because of a sheer dearth of choices otherwise; people don't have expectations of Family Guy or South Park to be culturally sensitive or even aware of the poo poo they're doing because that's how low the bar is for mainstream content, it's the assumed default – the given – that the audience is emotionally-underdeveloped straight white guys. An audience that has been otherwise left out of the pop-cultural buffet are much more keenly aware and also the most on guard, especially because there is so few other choices being offered to them. They're bound to become overly-precious and demanding if this is what they think is their only shot at getting something they would like to see get made, so the show becomes elevated to a symbol beyond being a show. From there it becomes a weird existential fight about whether the show is the right image to put forward to the public because they know it has to sell in the marketplace to get more made, etc. tl;dr it's a self-feedback look about worrying about being the -best- possible image for a given community to put forward under a popular culture apparatus entirely subsumed in capitalism
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Mar 15, 2023 00:08
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Flopsy posted:I can only imagine how unsettling the Steven Universe fandom got if this is considered small potatoes. Allow Werewolf Jones of "Megg, Mogg and Owl" to give you the crash course. (Majorly NSFW)  - A while back I was a little too quick to accept defaming claims on twitter against Vivienne Medrano (so I could write off a show I kept hearing was good but whose tumblr/furry art style repulses me. Also I watched the Hazbin Hotel pilot and it was awful.), but it turned out those accusations were bullshit so I want to be on record admitting I'm a dumb dumb. I might eventually give Helluva Boss a chance, just so I can make sense of the conversations in this thread, plus Das Boo working on it certainly helps.
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Mar 15, 2023 00:34
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Flopsy posted:I think you mentioned this earlier but who has the time or energy to hate watch something? Like seriously why devote yourself to something you loathe? Everything is interpreted as a personal attack and it's just baffling to me they think she gives that much of a poo poo about them. I just don't understand why they don't watch something else they actually like instead of seething how they hate sad backstories and the latest episode had too much green in it. Hating stuff feels good and hating stuff for self righteous reasons feels even better. And honestly for the most part I think it's fine, "this sucks, I've seen every episode" has been around forever and will continue on long after all of us are dead. I feel like it only really gets weird and inappropriate when people start taking things as personal attacks and going after creators directly, that's a massive boundary cross. Happy Landfill posted:
They did get super weird about George Lucas though. I'm not trying to disagree with what you posted or argue against it, but as someone who doesn't care about Star Wars I feel like everyone who did care about Star Wars was a little overly mean to George Lucas for like a decade there and that should be acknowledged.
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Mar 15, 2023 00:37
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Come And See posted:Allow Werewolf Jones of "Megg, Mogg and Owl" to give you the crash course. (Majorly NSFW) The show can be a bit hit or miss. The hits are really good the misses are pretty meh. Both pilots aren't super great (more so Helluva boss's) but Hazbin hasn't had a chance to show much else so I can't make a full comparison. I think if you ever liked Invader Zim and deviantart comic challenges you'll have a lot of fun. If not there's other stuff to browse from. Primal is very good for example if you want some really well animated violence and hard hitting drama.
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Mar 15, 2023 01:04
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Neeksy posted:I think it might just be as simple as an audience with heightened expectations because of a sheer dearth of choices otherwise; people don't have expectations of Family Guy or South Park to be culturally sensitive or even aware of the poo poo they're doing because that's how low the bar is for mainstream content, it's the assumed default – the given – that the audience is emotionally-underdeveloped straight white guys. An audience that has been otherwise left out of the pop-cultural buffet are much more keenly aware and also the most on guard, especially because there is so few other choices being offered to them. They're bound to become overly-precious and demanding if this is what they think is their only shot at getting something they would like to see get made, so the show becomes elevated to a symbol beyond being a show. From there it becomes a weird existential fight about whether the show is the right image to put forward to the public because they know it has to sell in the marketplace to get more made, etc. To be fair, there's a significant contingent of straight white guys who are equally worried about representation. A lot of it's wrapped up in toxic ideology, sure, but they're also concerned about representation and validation.
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Mar 15, 2023 01:10
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