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arsenicCatnip
Dec 23, 2022

:33< i KNOW, i was speaking metafurrikitty :33



MJeff posted:

I'm pretty sure ammo drops and poo poo in the vault hosed some Petra's Runs too.

This feels as good a time as any to put my Last Wish horror story in this thread:

On a whim joined an LFG for a Petra's Run, figuring if I got it done I might go knock out the rest of the Rivensbane seal. After a few bad attempts we make it to Queenswalk and it's smooth sailing, me and another guy make it down to the elevator. We get to the part where Kalli tells you "I'm glad you did not heed her words.", you know it's bad because specific details are stuck in my mind.

It could not have been a cleaner queenswalk; ballholder was counting down and all I would've had to do is hold W and take the rock to the hole. He hits 0 and gets pulled in...And brings the heart in with him. We're softlocked. We wipe. It's 3AM.

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Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


GoGoGadgetChris posted:

The upcoming overhaul to 'Power Level' will eliminate the concept of 'Sunset' gear. Season 1-10 gear will be usable in all content without an inherent penalty to damage in & damage out.
Just getting huge "my uncle works at nintendo" vibes from the way you're dancing around why you seem confident about this. I presume you have a source you can't out or something, but again, uncle at nintendo.

I mean, given they seem to want to phase out power, it seems plausible for the sake of making the system simple and saving them the trouble of carving out caveats for sunset gear.

But it also just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. To get rid of power level, all they need to do to get rid of power level is lock everyone and all gear at 1810, and hide the numbers. Behind the scenes, sunset gear is still 1600, and the grey triangle is the way you know the gun will be a handicap.

So few people have hung onto season 1-10 gear, and they've gone through the trouble of basically phasing out any sunset gear dropping that it feels like it's not really going to be some exciting news to suddenly be allowed to use that old stuff, and it's not like it's even going to be very exciting given how much of it has been power-crept anyways. If they unsunet my Blast Furnace, I'll still be waiting for them to re-issue it.

Basically, unsunsetting poo poo now would probably add nothing and just piss some people off.

A Buffer Gay Dude
Oct 25, 2020

Oxyclean posted:

Just getting huge "my uncle works at nintendo" vibes from the way you're dancing around why you seem confident about this. I presume you have a source you can't out or something, but again, uncle at nintendo.

I mean, given they seem to want to phase out power, it seems plausible for the sake of making the system simple and saving them the trouble of carving out caveats for sunset gear.

But it also just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. To get rid of power level, all they need to do to get rid of power level is lock everyone and all gear at 1810, and hide the numbers. Behind the scenes, sunset gear is still 1600, and the grey triangle is the way you know the gun will be a handicap.

So few people have hung onto season 1-10 gear, and they've gone through the trouble of basically phasing out any sunset gear dropping that it feels like it's not really going to be some exciting news to suddenly be allowed to use that old stuff, and it's not like it's even going to be very exciting given how much of it has been power-crept anyways. If they unsunet my Blast Furnace, I'll still be waiting for them to re-issue it.

Basically, unsunsetting poo poo now would probably add nothing and just piss some people off.

I’m his uncle and I work at Sony

sunday at work
Apr 6, 2011

"Man is the animal that thinks something is wrong."
Would unsunsetting gear also bring back a pre-Shadowkeep sandbox where legendary primaries are effective and satisfying to use?

Mesadoram
Nov 4, 2009

Serious Business
The spawns in this game can be funny sometimes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBCSGvxhdpg

RocketRaygun
Nov 7, 2015



Oxyclean posted:

Just getting huge "my uncle works at nintendo" vibes from the way you're dancing around why you seem confident about this. I presume you have a source you can't out or something, but again, uncle at nintendo.

I mean, given they seem to want to phase out power, it seems plausible for the sake of making the system simple and saving them the trouble of carving out caveats for sunset gear.

But it also just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. To get rid of power level, all they need to do to get rid of power level is lock everyone and all gear at 1810, and hide the numbers. Behind the scenes, sunset gear is still 1600, and the grey triangle is the way you know the gun will be a handicap.

So few people have hung onto season 1-10 gear, and they've gone through the trouble of basically phasing out any sunset gear dropping that it feels like it's not really going to be some exciting news to suddenly be allowed to use that old stuff, and it's not like it's even going to be very exciting given how much of it has been power-crept anyways. If they unsunet my Blast Furnace, I'll still be waiting for them to re-issue it.

Basically, unsunsetting poo poo now would probably add nothing and just piss some people off.

He's extrapolating information from various leaks. There is nothing confirmed how "A World Without Power" will work, but it's very confirmed that they are moving that direction from various leaks and interviews with bungie leads.

Power is extremely load bearing in bungie's RPG design. They can't just rip it out or their entire growth and reward system breaks down. World Without Power _was_ scheduled for Lightfall, but we didn't get it... instead we got the increased difficulty portion and them putting power into a weird zombie state that we have now.

RocketRaygun fucked around with this message at 00:03 on Mar 16, 2023

SmallpoxJenkins
Jul 9, 2012


sunday at work posted:

Would unsunsetting gear also bring back a pre-Shadowkeep sandbox where legendary primaries are effective and satisfying to use?

lol no

neutral milf hotel
Oct 9, 2001

by Fluffdaddy
We're folks farming this check point? Lol

https://twitter.com/bungiehelp/status/1636148275974905856

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal
Remember atheon? He’s back, in ghalran form

arsenicCatnip
Dec 23, 2022

:33< i KNOW, i was speaking metafurrikitty :33




there was a cheese where you could bounce him out of the arena and instakill him

Pirate Jet
May 2, 2010

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

It's a real thing, yes. I'm guessing by evidence you mean 'has a Bungie platform tweeted it' and the answer to that is currently no.

Black Armory reprisals would be really cool. But not in Season 21, anyway. We're getting a reprisal of 6 Reckoning/Gambit Prime guns in both their original flavors and weird Taken variants that have had their archetypes and elements modified. Expect any sunset legendaries that had Ornaments for sale to be reprised first, but people would certainly love to see the Black Armory and the Dawn weapons come back!

GGGC I like you but you gotta stop doing this thing where you tell everyone about some hot new leak but never ever post where you found it or how you know.


Something about Lightfall's release removed the boundary for Gahlran's AI to not be willing to jump off the back edge of the arena to chase whoever has his aggro, so you could start the encounter and finish it in literal seconds with a Strand grapple or an Eager Edge sword.

https://twitter.com/DestinyBulletn/status/1635792412441481217

Two things:

1) They just removed the checkpoint, you can still just complete the dungeon up to the boss and do it anyways, which makes this farm take five minutes per run instead of less than one, which is still great really.

2) Only Caiatl guarantees high-start Artifice armor, so the AMAZING ARTIFICE FARM everyone said this was was pretty exaggerated, he'd usually give you something in the high fifties-low sixties. It is nice if you're the kind of insane person who's willing to slam your head against a brick wall for a god-rolled Lingering Dread though (like me)

Jetamo
Nov 8, 2012

alright.

alright, mate.
I guarantee you if they go through with overhauling the power system, that old sunset weapons will stay unusable somehow. They'll make a specific exception, maybe make the weapons unusable entirely.

arsenicCatnip
Dec 23, 2022

:33< i KNOW, i was speaking metafurrikitty :33



idk if they would. Are any of the sunset weapons actually Op rn in base level activities? They've nerfed recluse, mountaintop and revoker while Redrix's and Wendigo were both power crept out.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

Oxyclean posted:

Just getting huge "my uncle works at nintendo" vibes from the way you're dancing around why you seem confident about this. I presume you have a source you can't out or something, but again, uncle at nintendo.

I mean, given they seem to want to phase out power, it seems plausible for the sake of making the system simple and saving them the trouble of carving out caveats for sunset gear.

But it also just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. To get rid of power level, all they need to do to get rid of power level is lock everyone and all gear at 1810, and hide the numbers. Behind the scenes, sunset gear is still 1600, and the grey triangle is the way you know the gun will be a handicap.

So few people have hung onto season 1-10 gear, and they've gone through the trouble of basically phasing out any sunset gear dropping that it feels like it's not really going to be some exciting news to suddenly be allowed to use that old stuff, and it's not like it's even going to be very exciting given how much of it has been power-crept anyways. If they unsunet my Blast Furnace, I'll still be waiting for them to re-issue it.

Basically, unsunsetting poo poo now would probably add nothing and just piss some people off.

I'm not dancing, I immediately said 'no proof from Bungie is available'. Uncle Nintendo isn't trying to trick you into... leaving your gear alone.

As for 'unsetting would piss people off', you're totally right. I think it's something that would make a lot of people kinda pissed if they feel like they deleted something just because of sunsetting. Even though almost every single sunset gun has been power crept, directly nerfed, reissued or replaced by an outright better gun, people would bitch and moan that they felt Lied to. If I were Bungie and I knew the post-power system was going to UnSet gear, I'd spend a few seasons reissuing everyone's favorite sunset guns (especially if they had Eververse Ornaments for sale in year 2 and 3) to make sure nobody cares about their old stuff.

Your idea for hidden numbers is good, but Destiny being Destiny, I feel like people will always want to watch a number go up (and Guardian Ranks ain't it...)

I could just as easily see a system with features like

- Overall player 'Level' instead of looking at the level of your gear slots. No more frustrating pinnacle drops in the wrong slot!
- Instead of clunky confusing numbers like 1750 and 1810, it could be a nice clean range of 1 to 100
- It could be account-wide instead of character-based. No pressure to play only one or more than one character!
- You could gain levels from XP (slow progress) or from Weekly/Seasonal challenges (fast, time-gated progress) which would level the playing field for the most part but allow people to really poopsock for a tiny advantage if they wanted to
- They've been doing a lot of testing with 'temporarily raising your level for this mission' so they could even make it so everyone's power level matches the highest in the fireteam or something. That would make it way easier to attract new players if they can instantly tag along with their seasoned veteran friend
- It would let them do stuff like 'Grandmaster Content is level 100 but does not grant any benefits to player levels past 75' etc which is an easy 1:1 to current systems.
- It would reset every season of course

syntaxfunction
Oct 27, 2010
Imagine if they removed power but made sunset weapons just lower. That would probably do it, don't cha know. They already have a tag for sunset, so it's not like they couldn't make sunset = 10 behind the scenes while everything else is 1000.

Honestly people need to just accept those guns are gone. I know it's controversial (for some reason) but Bungo should just take them out of the game already, stop letting people hang on to something that will never happen.

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal
And the “looming announcement” and marketing tagline?

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog
Bungie probably wants people to be Happy gamers though, so instead of Deleting gear (which makes gamers sad) they could just give new, better gear (to make gamers happy)

Some would still bitch & moan but you can't make everyone happy all the time.

syntaxfunction
Oct 27, 2010
It's pretty clear whenever I read fanfiction about where people want the game to go (mine included) whether people see this as an MMO or RPG first and foremost, or a shooter first. There's no judgement I just think it's neat.

My hot ideas for light level were seemingly minute. The slot has the number, not the items, and all the things in that slot are just whatever level the slot is. I'm boring apparently.

Kesper North
Nov 3, 2011

EMERGENCY POWER TO PARTY
The goalposts they are a-movin'

A Buffer Gay Dude
Oct 25, 2020

syntaxfunction posted:

It's pretty clear whenever I read fanfiction about where people want the game to go (mine included) whether people see this as an MMO or RPG first and foremost, or a shooter first. There's no judgement I just think it's neat.

My hot ideas for light level were seemingly minute. The slot has the number, not the items, and all the things in that slot are just whatever level the slot is. I'm boring apparently.

Putting huge numbers in my slot and feeling good

RocketRaygun
Nov 7, 2015



Pirate Jet posted:

GGGC I like you but you gotta stop doing this thing where you tell everyone about some hot new leak but never ever post where you found it or how you know.



He's just reposting stuff from the destiny 2 leaks discord. There are a few of us in there and it's not like special access or anything.

I try not to crosspost it because it's kind of poopy to spoil everything that's coming up.

Pretzel Rod Serling
Aug 6, 2008



I don’t think anyone really gives a poo poo about “there will be a new auto rifle” or “they are buffing Strand melee by 2%”-type leaks; you’re welcome to post them in spoiler tags as far as I’m concerned

just don’t post story stuff

A Buffer Gay Dude
Oct 25, 2020
[me inside spoiler tags] Gentlemen, you can’t post spoilers in here, this is the spoiler room

Sourdough Sam
May 2, 2010

:dukedog:
The final shape is Cylinder.

fast cars loose anus
Mar 2, 2007

Pillbug
I've noticed that old shaders seem to be dropping with regularity from gambit and crucible now, that's quite nice for me, a dedicated spaceman dresser

Saman
Oct 23, 2008

Next, you'll say...
"What a good post!"


Ada's selling old vaulted/unavailable shaders every day now too in place of her mod rotation too! Lot of black armory shaders the last few days

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

Pretzel Rod Stewart posted:

I don’t think anyone really gives a poo poo about “there will be a new auto rifle” or “they are buffing Strand melee by 2%”-type leaks; you’re welcome to post them in spoiler tags as far as I’m concerned

just don’t post story stuff

Yeah there's spoilers like "Legend of Acrius is getting a huge reserves and range buff" that some people might want to be surprised by, but like... People ought to know sooner than later that their sunset gear is getting unset. That's a PSA that people should be hearing NOW, not when bungie has their Beyond Power post ready to go live

Pirate Jet
May 2, 2010

Sourdough Sam posted:

The final shape is Cylinder.

Destiny 2 - The Final Shape (2024)

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


Pirate Jet posted:

Two things:

1) They just removed the checkpoint, you can still just complete the dungeon up to the boss and do it anyways, which makes this farm take five minutes per run instead of less than one, which is still great really.

2) Only Caiatl guarantees high-start Artifice armor, so the AMAZING ARTIFICE FARM everyone said this was was pretty exaggerated, he'd usually give you something in the high fifties-low sixties. It is nice if you're the kind of insane person who's willing to slam your head against a brick wall for a god-rolled Lingering Dread though (like me)

I was hearing people say Caital armor hasn't been rolling right/well either. They said in patch notes that all master dungeon armor is supposed to be rolling high stats too.

Also, I got a Lingering Dread with Chill Clip and Autoloading with Disorientating/Spike nades during a short farm the other day. Is that as hype as it gets or is there a different god roll?

Pirate Jet
May 2, 2010

Oxyclean posted:

Also, I got a Lingering Dread with Chill Clip and Autoloading with Disorientating/Spike nades during a short farm the other day. Is that as hype as it gets or is there a different god roll?

No, that’s it. You got it champ, congrats. The only way it could get any god-er is if your barrel and masterwork go max handling.

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

Yeah there's spoilers like "Legend of Acrius is getting a huge reserves and range buff" that some people might want to be surprised by, but like... People ought to know sooner than later that their sunset gear is getting unset. That's a PSA that people should be hearing NOW, not when bungie has their Beyond Power post ready to go live

Why is it your decision whether I read leaks?

RBX
Jan 2, 2011

That leak is old and looks fake as hell anyway.

Blast Furnace and Kindled Orchid hasn't been power crept. And I grinded my rear end off for them for no reason in the end so they better not just bring them back up years after the damage is done. Just delete the sunset guns from the game and fully rip the band-aid off.

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


GoGoGadgetChris posted:

I'm not dancing, I immediately said 'no proof from Bungie is available'. Uncle Nintendo isn't trying to trick you into... leaving your gear alone.
...
Your idea for hidden numbers is good, but Destiny being Destiny, I feel like people will always want to watch a number go up (and Guardian Ranks ain't it...)

I could just as easily see a system with features like

- Overall player 'Level' instead of looking at the level of your gear slots. No more frustrating pinnacle drops in the wrong slot!
- Instead of clunky confusing numbers like 1750 and 1810, it could be a nice clean range of 1 to 100
- It could be account-wide instead of character-based. No pressure to play only one or more than one character!
- You could gain levels from XP (slow progress) or from Weekly/Seasonal challenges (fast, time-gated progress) which would level the playing field for the most part but allow people to really poopsock for a tiny advantage if they wanted to
- They've been doing a lot of testing with 'temporarily raising your level for this mission' so they could even make it so everyone's power level matches the highest in the fireteam or something. That would make it way easier to attract new players if they can instantly tag along with their seasoned veteran friend
- It would let them do stuff like 'Grandmaster Content is level 100 but does not grant any benefits to player levels past 75' etc which is an easy 1:1 to current systems.
- It would reset every season of course
I mostly took issue with you just not just saying "hey i heard some poo poo from the leaks discord"

But yeah, with a hidden power system I kind of just figured artifact power would be achieving almost all the bullet points you just outlined.

Speaking of future rewards: What has my curiosity is they mentioned that the exotic mission rotator coming in 22 or whatever would have good rewards or something that seemed to imply something more/new, and obviously, something that isn't just a pinnacle engram. Perhaps it's just going to be integrating those old exotics into something akin to Rev0 and Vexcalibur.

asterioth
Jul 27, 2007

If it's worth killing it's worth overkilling.
For anyone saying contest mode RoN wasn't that easy:

https://www.bungie.net/7/en/News/article/destiny-2-world-first-winner

Total players that entered the raid:
582,428
Total hours spent in the raid:
4,550,022
Total Guardian deaths:
84,177,812
Players that cleared Cataclysm:
361,633
Players that cleared Scission:
315,036
Players that cleared Macrocosm:
249,731
Players that cleared Nezarec:
197,694
Unique players that cleared the full raid – i.e., players that got all 4 reward events:
190,459

roughly a 1/3 clear rate for it

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

haveblue posted:

Why is it your decision whether I read leaks?

What are you talking about? It's not.

Are you asking why I post Some Leaks and not All Leaks? Because some leaks are either Not True, can't be confirmed, or would be dickish to spoil (plot, content etc) so it would be sucky to post them.

I haven't posted links to Original Sources because 'Trace Rifle 4% Buff' is one tweet away from 'Witness has three balls and we have to find the 4th in his butt'. Everything is totally available to anyone who wants to read it, I just don't recommend it.

D2Leaks - crazy lady named Liz had some leaks in 2021 and has been chasing that dragon ever since. 20% of the content is true, 80% is bologna trying to get clicks. The 20% is stolen from the sources below

D2News Network - 50% true, 25% unknown, 25% bologna

Bungie Leaks - 75% true, 20% unknown, 5% bologna

Discord user Freezing Dart - 75% true, 25% unknown

Discord user Dinosaur - 100% true

Discord user XenoMarvel - 50% true, 25% unknown, 25% bologna

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

Everything is totally available to anyone who wants to read it, I just don't recommend it.

You just C&Ped a leak into the thread

Also like OxyClean said you are being really weird about admitting there even is an Original Source

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

haveblue posted:

You just C&Ped a leak into the thread

Also like OxyClean said you are being really weird about admitting there even is an Original Source

Yes. A leak that I believe is important for people to know, given the circumstances of it, and so I think that's something worth posting. I don't see any way that someone could be adversely impacted by reading that leak, which is why it got posted, and not Other Leaks.

You cropped it from the post you quoted but the original source is right there.

I don't see any issue here but I'm totally open to your perspective if I'm missing something.

syntaxfunction
Oct 27, 2010
You know I've taken guesses at what they were doing in the game and I've been like 50/50 on what I get right too? Does that mean I am a credible leak source?

You have listed one outlier and also a bunch of people who pretty much are as good as the average person at guessing stuff lol

The only time I've seen leaks be properly accurate is right before release, but to be honest as far as light level and keeping sunset weapons go it's not even important. Bungie ain't gonna suddenly bring back all the poo poo they sunset, power crept or not. Why bother when the process of reissuing with new perk pools and an origin trait has been such a success?

Even if "everything is the same light level from now on" is true (and it probably will be at some point is my *guess*) it doesn't mean what everyone seems to hope it means.

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


GoGoGadgetChris posted:

:siren: Don't delete your Sunset Gear :siren:

Just keep it

It might be usable again someday winky blinky
vs:

A theoretical GoGoGadgetChris posted:

hey y'all there's a leak going around saying they might unset poo poo so maybe hold off on deleting any sunset stuff for awhile longer

I'm probably just getting hung up on something very stupid but it's just that you gave a vibe you have some very credible knowledge rather then what sounds like a pretty loose leak.

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GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

Oxyclean posted:

vs:

I'm probably just getting hung up on something very stupid but it's just that you gave a vibe you have some very credible knowledge rather then what sounds like a pretty loose leak.

Yeah I totally get that. I would've gotten that vibe too, honestly. It definitely reads like somebody saying 'I have credible knowledge'

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