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The second amendment has come in direct conflict with our right to party
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Mar 21, 2023 19:31
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bird food bathtub posted:Climate change is gonna take care of the "underwater" part either way.  Though cutting into the major season of businesses that are going to be facing constant disasters is probably not going to be playing well.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:35
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Myrtle Beach has similar problems. "Biker week" now requires literally every available police officer in the rest of the state of SC to go down to Myrtle for the week.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:38
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At a guess, once a location develops a reputation for episodic "partying", there's a market demand for drugs in that location, which in turn draws competing drug interests.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:39
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VikingofRock posted:The second amendment has come in direct conflict with our right to party The Beastie Boys weren't lying.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:39
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CuddleCryptid posted:I'm not really clear on how that is a new issue though, people have been getting drunk and stupid for Spring Break for ages. The shootings are bad, but are they a new and unusual thing or just random chance that they happened in the same year? The article briefly mentions that Miami Beach has seen a massive increase of Spring Breakers ever since COVID and the overseas travel restrictions that came with it. With foreign party destinations off limits, people went to domestic ones instead.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:40
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Myrtle Beach has similar problems. "Biker week" now requires literally every available police officer in the rest of the state of SC to go down to Myrtle for the week. Was there a recent thing that triggered it/did it transition into a huge problem? Or was it always an issue? I don't know the full background with the Miami Beach situation, but the curfew, number of shootings, people just taking over the streets and blockading them, and the number of guns is definitely very new and serious. What exactly caused the difference between "drunk spring breakers being rowdy and throwing up in public" to "armed groups of people park their cars in the middle of the highway to blockade traffic every night for three weeks, bring hundreds of guns, and start destroying/looting every car on the street" situation? Discendo Vox posted:At a guess, once a location develops a reputation for episodic "partying", there's a market demand for drugs in that location, which in turn draws competing drug interests. This is 100% true, but Miami Beach has had a reputation as the spring break party spot for decades. It's definitely not a new thing.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:42
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A lot of people went completely insane during lockdowns, I wouldn't be surprised if antisocial behavior and deaths and violence resulting from said behavior have spiked in the last few years. The roads certainly feel way more dangerous between this and people seemingly having figured out that you can kill someone and get away with it so long as you use a car, that it would extend to party destinations and big event weeks seems to follow. Miami is also the center of a lot of crime of every collar color which is likely also a factor.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:48
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:What exactly caused the difference between "drunk spring breakers being rowdy and throwing up in public" to "armed groups of people park their cars in the middle of the highway to blockade traffic every night for three weeks, bring hundreds of guns, and start destroying/looting every car on the street" situation? Why wouldn't they? They have no future, no hope, no prospects of anything their parents and grandparents could count on, the American Dream that was sold to them was a lie, and the city they're partying in is slowly descending into the sea and literally nobody is doing anything about it because of greed.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:51
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Jaxyon posted:Why wouldn't they? They have no future, no hope, no prospects of anything their parents and grandparents could count on, the American Dream that was sold to them was a lie, and the city they're partying in is slowly descending into the sea and literally nobody is doing anything about it because of greed. It says in one of the articles that a lot of the arrests are of people over 25, so it wouldn't necessarily be college kids. I also think it is pretty unlikely that some 33-year old from Ohio decided "Miami is going to be under water in 50 years because of climate change. I better drive down there during spring break and shoot some people."
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Mar 21, 2023 19:53
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Was there a recent thing that triggered it/did it transition into a huge problem? Or was it always an issue? Good question. The impression I have is that it's been an escalating feedback curve. The more people come to Myrtle with extremely expensive bikes, the more people show up planning to steal the bikes, etc. I don't think it's gone like Full Bartertown or anything quite yet but it does seem to get worse every year.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:55
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Mean old mayor is trying to shut down spring break? Time for the boys from chug-a-lug house to get revenge and pull a truly epic prank on him at his fancy dinner with the governer.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:56
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:It says in one of the articles that a lot of the arrests are of people over 25, so it wouldn't necessarily be college kids. I'm saying there's a sense of desperation and nihilism that anyone under 40 feels, and that may be coming out in tension releases like spring break. Feel free to argue it, it's not really a thing I can support with sources.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:57
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People of all ages go to places where college aged women are, this is a known thing since around the time that Kool & the Gang released Ladies Night in 1979, if not many years before that.
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Mar 21, 2023 19:57
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Wouldn't be surprised if Florida becoming a Mecca for right-wingnuts (having guns on them because of the 2nd amendment and all that) is A factor
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Mar 21, 2023 20:03
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If DeSantis can’t control Spring Breakers, what hope does he have to control the country??? —A probable Trump argument
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Mar 21, 2023 20:05
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I won't rehash my experiences attempting to holiday in South Florida, but suffice to say: I am convinced no one with reason would go there more than once, so the bulk of visitors are likely to have incredibly poor judgement to begin with. It's expensive, inconvenient, generally unpleasant, and crowded. No one who would put up with all that has any sense, so Problems will occur.
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Mar 21, 2023 20:08
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Gerund posted:People of all ages go to places where college aged women are, this is a known thing since around the time that Kool & the Gang released Ladies Night in 1979, if not many years before that. Yeah, that's not different. The difference is why (some) slightly older people are going there during spring break and bringing guns/parking their cars to blockade traffic every night for three weeks. Previously, for decades, it was people 18-22 and the violence was generally drunken fights and the public disruption was usually lots of vomiting and peeing in public. That is very dramatic and different (and has been going on for 2 years, so it isn't a one-off thing) change from before. None of the articles or the Miami Beach Mayor seem to know exactly why this specific place at this specific time are suddenly going from a 5 to 11 on the crazy meter when it was been doing the same thing for decades where this never happened. I'm not even sure what the point of parking your car to blockade traffic for hours and bringing a gun to either shoot someone or drive off so you can come back and block the street the next night even is even supposed to be. Attention, maybe?
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Mar 21, 2023 20:10
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Epic High Five posted:A lot of people went completely insane during lockdowns, I wouldn't be surprised if antisocial behavior and deaths and violence resulting from said behavior have spiked in the last few years. The roads certainly feel way more dangerous between this and people seemingly having figured out that you can kill someone and get away with it so long as you use a car, that it would extend to party destinations and big event weeks seems to follow. Yeah I'm not surprised at the idea of a rehash of the Roaring Twenties now that folks feel like this century's pandemic is over (it's not)
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Mar 21, 2023 20:17
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Silly Burrito posted:If DeSantis can’t control Spring Breakers, what hope does he have to control the country??? This is the future Teen Party Ron wants for your precious sons and daughters: wild drinking, crazy parties, disease and death and who knows what else folks, and all the booze they can drink courtesy of Teen Party Ron and his vile groomers. You know he used to party with teenagers when he was a teacher? That's why I call him Teen Party Ron, folks. He wants to party with your teenagers, and get them drunk like dogs and do nasty, naaasty things to them. Teen Party Ron. He loves to party with teenagers, teenage boys, he loves the teenage boys. Spring Break is his whole deal folks. Don't let your kids go to Spring Break or they might wind up in bed with Teen Party Ron. It's sick folks, it's absolutely SICK. That Teen Party Ron, he loves the teenage boys. Absolutely loves him. "Yes, Mr. President, but the question I asked was 'what are your thoughts on your indictment'?"
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Mar 21, 2023 20:21
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Bellmaker posted:Yeah I'm not surprised at the idea of a rehash of the Roaring Twenties now that folks feel like this century's pandemic is over (it's not) It's as over as it's going to be in our lifetimes / the literal foreseeable future, barring an even more miraculous breakthrough than mRNA vaccines. Vaccines work, mutation pressures are broadly in a less lethal direction, and the moment covid made the jump into mice and giant forest rats (deer), it became endemic forever. We don't have the tools to wipe it out in its animal reservoirs. Killer robot posted:The big spike in car crashes (and some categories of other violence) started with pandemic-related shutdowns rather than their fading, so that's probably not it. also probably this, i'm willing to believe at least some in the "shutdowns drove people crazy" theory another contributor to the car thing though is that with the reduction of travel, people who enjoy high speeds found it much easier to feed their appetite, and their unsafe driving habits persisted after traffic levels returned to normal
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Mar 21, 2023 20:22
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Bellmaker posted:Yeah I'm not surprised at the idea of a rehash of the Roaring Twenties now that folks feel like this century's pandemic is over (it's not) The big spike in car crashes (and some categories of other violence) started with pandemic-related shutdowns rather than their fading, so that's probably not it.
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Mar 21, 2023 20:22
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Google Jeb Bush posted:It's as over as it's going to be in our lifetimes / the literal foreseeable future, barring an even more miraculous breakthrough than mRNA vaccines. Vaccines work, mutation pressures are broadly in a less lethal direction, and the moment covid made the jump into mice and giant forest rats (deer), it became endemic forever. We don't have the tools to wipe it out in its animal reservoirs. I heard "wipe out mice and deer" and that's good enough for me! 
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Mar 21, 2023 20:23
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Yeah, that's not different. Perhaps there is something that began almost exactly 3 years ago that helps explain why for the last 2 years people have been engaging in societal collapse behavior in Florida.
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Mar 21, 2023 20:51
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Google Jeb Bush posted:It's as over as it's going to be in our lifetimes / the literal foreseeable future, barring an even more miraculous breakthrough than mRNA vaccines. Vaccines work, mutation pressures are broadly in a less lethal direction, and the moment covid made the jump into mice and giant forest rats (deer), it became endemic forever. We don't have the tools to wipe it out in its animal reservoirs. Oh, we have the tools. It's just that our tools aren't precise enough to turn all the world to glass without also inconveniencing ourselves. Gerund posted:Perhaps there is something that began almost exactly 3 years ago that helps explain why for the last 2 years people have been engaging in societal collapse behavior in Florida. DeSantis isn't that bad.
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Mar 21, 2023 20:54
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Silly Burrito posted:If DeSantis can’t control Spring Breakers, what hope does he have to control the country??? This is a legit good argument for Trump to make. There's a sizeable contingent of Republican voters who may not be full-on MAGA but are really, really into Law and OrderTM. They hate the idea of young people having fun, partying, and shooting people, especially if some of those people are not super, uh, pale if you know what I mean. These are people who love Bob Knight and think kids have it too soft these days. (For the record, having fun and partying (safely) == good. Shooting people == bad)
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Mar 21, 2023 21:38
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Good question. The impression I have is that it's been an escalating feedback curve. The more people come to Myrtle with extremely expensive bikes, the more people show up planning to steal the bikes, etc. It used to be so much worse. The thing is that when the Bike Weeks were at their biggest point, even if you ignored all the extra trouble they bring with them, they were still too big for the city. Every hotel in the city was booked solid, but each two-queen room for four would have eight people in it and they'd all have a motorcycle. Traffic on Ocean Boulevard and the highway was effectively impassible for the entire weekend, and residents just kind of had to resign themselves to being stuck at home. A few people liked the bike weekends, but nearly everybody hated them, even tourism-related businesses, because everybody except the bars was perfectly capable of being at 100% capacity without them by virtue of being a beach in April. The city didn't really have any direct way to put a stop to the event, but in response to escalating complaints, it eventually nickel-and-dimed the events down to a manageable level (where "manageable", as HA mentioned above, means the same law enforcement deployment we use for natural disasters), but it looks like they've started to grow back up towards the Cool Zone in recent years.
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Mar 21, 2023 21:39
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Rand Brittain posted:It used to be so much worse. Yeah, one weekend back in the middle aughts a friend had a open weekend at his uncle's beachhouse and nobody told any of us heading down there the *reason* the house was not booked that weekend. Then I pulled into an empty lot off of Ocean Boulevard to turn around and go home, turned out the lot was truly empty, i.e., a sandpit and my tires got stuck, and no tow truck could get to us because, yeah, it was that time of year. Good times.
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Mar 21, 2023 21:45
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Silly Burrito posted:If DeSantis can’t control Spring Breakers, what hope does he have to control the country??? "A lot of people are saying Ron likes to hang out with students and a lot of people are saying Spring break kids, who are also students, are a violent rowdy bunch....."
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Mar 21, 2023 21:49
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Um, The NewsTM said that Trump was getting arrested and then locked in a pillory in the middle of Times Square today, what happened to that?!?!
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Mar 21, 2023 21:54
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Milhouse: "Trump arrested? Trump didn't get arrested. This news is completely fake." Trump: "You're right, Milhouse. It is a fake. Which makes it Fake News." Milhouse: "Fake News?! Cool!"
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Mar 21, 2023 21:58
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Was there a recent thing that triggered it/did it transition into a huge problem? Or was it always an issue? The narrative's been building for years, if not decades. If I tell Google not to give me any results before 2019, it'll still give me plenty of articles about Miami Beach crime, massive police deployments, and community pushback against major tourist events. I suspect that rather than being a real change, it's more a shift in perception (i.e., narratives) or in political makeup (i.e., some kind of demographic shift such as gentrification) leading residents to see the problem as growing regardless of whether it actually is. After all, we know people in places like NYC have cried louder and louder about crime even when crime was actually decreasing. And, of course, there's the question of race, class, and police abuses. The article that Eric Cantonese posted, for example, contains a lot of local black leaders saying the police are massively overreacting against largely-black crowds at the behest of the city's shrinking white population. An excerpt: quote:The huge crowds that gathered in the city’s famous 10-block beachside entertainment district starting in late February became unruly at times, with fights breaking out and gunshots fired into the air, causing stampedes. And thanks to the magic of Google, we can go back in time and see what the New York Times was writing about Miami Beach in 2016. Not even about Spring Break, just random day-to-day stuff. Here's a couple of excerpts, and note how similar these seem to the current complaints: quote:From rooftop bars and rope lines to gridlocked streets and sidewalks, Ocean Drive, the once-idyllic neon heartbeat of South Beach, can trample the senses on most weekends. quote:“International tourists who used to come here in droves avoid this place like the plague,” Mr. Novick said, adding that people who stay in Ocean Drive hotels complain incessantly about noise. “Noise is what fuels all of the riffraff. They need to take the party off the street.” Notice the recurring themes: a sense that party areas were overrun by crime, a couple of fairly public killings making people unsafe regardless of the actual crime rate, and the only politically-palatable response being to flood the streets with extremely visible police officers. The end of that last quote is especially interesting, because Miami Beach's population actually dropped from 1980 to 1990. Despite that, though, the demographic mix changed quite a bit - Miami Beach was 76% white in 1980 but only 48% white in 1990. That suggests an absolute shitton of white flight, with the better-off retirees all pulling up their roots and leaving for the suburbs. Hell, let's travel even further back in time to the ancient days of 2012, where the NYT was writing yet again about Miami Beach partygoers. This time, the target of their ire was Urban Beach Week, a hip-hop festival with an overwhelmingly black audience. Would it surprise you to hear yet again that city officials and commentators claimed this event was a massive nexus of rising crime and violence, due to so many tourists coming with guns and getting into drunken fights, and therefore required massive police deployments? Let's check out some more excerpts! quote:Since 2001, hundreds of thousands of young hip-hop devotees from around the country have descended on the South Beach neighborhood for Memorial Day weekend to hear some of country’s leading artists and D.J.’s. As the visitors converge, a reverse migration ensues: Rresidents, beaten down by the traffic and chaos of the event, hop in their cars en masse and head to the mainland for a few days. The idea that there's a "yearly pilgrimage" of "South Florida criminals" to a hip-hop festival, and that everyone else has to bring guns to defend themselves from those people, sounds pretty racist to me. And speaking of racist, note that brief mention of the police shooting in there. If you aren't looking closely, the NYT's mention of it above might seem like an indication of how bad the crowds were, but it's largely regarded as a case of police overreaction (or worse) instead. A dozen cops emptied their clips in the general direction of a drunk driver, not only killing him but also seriously injuring several bystanders, vaguely claiming that he'd "moved suspiciously in a downward direction" or something like that. And then they acted incredibly suspicious about it: finding (or "finding") a gun under his car seat three days later, pressuring a victim of an unsolved crime six months previous to blame it on the shooting victim, defying a judicial order to hand over materials, and more.
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Mar 21, 2023 22:00
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Epic High Five posted:A lot of people went completely insane during lockdowns, I wouldn't be surprised if antisocial behavior and deaths and violence resulting from said behavior have spiked in the last few years. The roads certainly feel way more dangerous between this and people seemingly having figured out that you can kill someone and get away with it so long as you use a car, that it would extend to party destinations and big event weeks seems to follow. People losing their minds during Lockdown and still not getting them back feels like a big issue and I suspect just about everything is going to be at least a bit crazy for a good while until a social equilibrium is found again. 2019-2022 is going to create so many research papers just from everyone studying all the semi-invisible ways it drove us insane in hindsight.
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Mar 21, 2023 22:08
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I’m still confused as to what the gently caress “lockdown” means in the US. Nothing happened and if it drove you crazy that you couldn’t go to a restaurant or theatre, you were already fuckin crazy. There was no lockdown. You had to get your Chili’s curbside instead of brandishing guns at the servers to prove a point?
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Mar 21, 2023 22:11
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:I’m still confused as to what the gently caress “lockdown” means in the US. Nothing happened and if it drove you crazy that you couldn’t go to a restaurant or theatre, you were already fuckin crazy. There was no lockdown. I need you to understand that, yes, this is a fundamental infringement on many Americans' rights to do whatever they want, whenever they want, without obligations to others.
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Mar 21, 2023 22:13
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:I’m still confused as to what the gently caress “lockdown” means in the US. Nothing happened and if it drove you crazy that you couldn’t go to a restaurant or theatre, you were already fuckin crazy. There was no lockdown. For a brief, glorious moment, some places actually did a full on Close and not be open for any kind of business. Which lasted for all of a week and then Capital decided to bargain with the virus and that's what led to the slippery slope of "Stay the gently caress home, if you absolutely NEED to leave to buy essentials, wear a mask." -> "You can do whatever you want as long as you mask up." -> "Think about maybe wearing a mask?"
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Mar 21, 2023 22:14
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:I’m still confused as to what the gently caress “lockdown” means in the US. Nothing happened and if it drove you crazy that you couldn’t go to a restaurant or theatre, you were already fuckin crazy. There was no lockdown.
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Mar 21, 2023 22:16
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Also even the weak lockdowns meant that many people couldn't see their friends or family in person for basically a year, which for most non-goons is a pretty big deal.
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Mar 21, 2023 22:21
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Mellow Seas posted:Milhouse: "Trump arrested? Trump didn't get arrested. This news is completely fake." This is fake and AI generated, but perchance to dream…(the thread has a lot of photos) https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/1637927681734987777 https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/1637930259193663488?s=20
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Mar 21, 2023 22:24
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ninjahedgehog posted:Also even the weak lockdowns meant that many people couldn't see their friends or family in person for basically a year, which for most non-goons is a pretty big deal. We work in the airline industry, my wife and me. I had daily panic attacks when her pregnancy conveniently coincided with no more masks in planes. Great circumstance for pregnant flight attendants. There was never a time when you couldn’t see your family. If you didn’t, it was a (good) moral choice. There was no lockdown. And the people upset about the lockdown aren’t the people making a moral choice, and are??? the people shooting up Florida. Edgar Allen Ho fucked around with this message at 22:27 on Mar 21, 2023 |
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Mar 21, 2023 22:25
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