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powerwalls are loving stupid. a: they're meant to skirt some building codes by being MoUnTeD oUtSiDe. b: they leverage a relatively expensive battery tech that has exactly two benefits - high capacity per pound and cubic meter. You dont loving care about that on a house! Lead-acid is the best value for storage per cubic meter and nickel-iron has low energy density but doesn't require any child-mined minerals and they can be abused and last for-loving-ever. there are nickel-iron battery banks in telco datacenters that are over fifty years old and still working at like 90% of their day 1 capacity.
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Mar 22, 2023 22:31
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I'm running 22 panels installed like 9 years ago, no batteries because I don't care about going offgrid and all they're there for is net metering. Eventually I might do some kind of lead acid storage.
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Mar 22, 2023 22:41
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VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:I'm running 22 panels installed like 9 years ago, no batteries because I don't care about going offgrid and all they're there for is net metering. i'd like a bit of storage because my area is prone to short blackouts during bad weather
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Mar 22, 2023 22:48
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Jonny 290 posted:powerwalls are loving stupid. a: they're meant to skirt some building codes by being MoUnTeD oUtSiDe. b: they leverage a relatively expensive battery tech that has exactly two benefits - high capacity per pound and cubic meter. You dont loving care about that on a house! Lead-acid is the best value for storage per cubic meter and nickel-iron has low energy density but doesn't require any child-mined minerals and they can be abused and last for-loving-ever. there are nickel-iron battery banks in telco datacenters that are over fifty years old and still working at like 90% of their day 1 capacity.
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Mar 22, 2023 22:51
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Improbable Lobster posted:i'd like a bit of storage because my area is prone to short blackouts during bad weather our lines are buried and power has been ultra reliable, I can count the number of times we've blacked out in 20 years on one hand also if power does go down, we're next to a fire station so it tends to be among the first things worked on
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Mar 22, 2023 22:51
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4lokos basilisk posted:that picture seems to hint that electricity will come to the solar panels from lightning strikes, I mean if lightning hits it technically it is, just not in quite the way you might want
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Mar 22, 2023 22:54
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Powerful Two-Hander posted:I mean if lightning hits it technically it is, just not in quite the way you might want muskman make the tesla coil
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Mar 22, 2023 22:56
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Nessus posted:not all of us have access to u-boat surplus sales nor have space for telco central office-sized battery banks
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Mar 22, 2023 22:59
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well then pay 17,000 dollars for a musk powerwall then i dont really know what to tell you there's a middle ground between "vape battery fire hanging off the back of my house" and "enough flooded battery storage to power connecticut for a week"
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Mar 22, 2023 23:13
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we wanted some remote controlled lights on our shed but regular remote control lights are garbage and don't have enough range to reach the shed so i bought some panels + controller from someone on craigslist last fall, put them up on my shed with a battery and a light hooked up through a homekit relay. total cost was less than $200 and i've got enough power coming in to charge some batts and run some garden irrigation. it's really nice.
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Mar 22, 2023 23:16
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those iron nickel batteries are fuckin sick as hell but omg so expensive
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Mar 22, 2023 23:46
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i mean idk if they're cost competitive with elons wall-o-18650s but
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Mar 22, 2023 23:47
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the powerwall in name only, for it is neither
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Mar 22, 2023 23:52
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I think it's shipping cost being a big part of it. Shopping a literal ton of batteries ain't cheap? But also having local sources would do a lot. Went searching and basically the only source seems to be China for some reason (mind you it was a quick 5 minute search). But yeah the tech sounds perfect for home use, it just would be making sure you handle it right like all battery stuff. And sounds way way safer then lithium, and if it lasts longer then lead acid without the corrosion then it's a no brainer, especially if you have the land and space.
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Mar 22, 2023 23:54
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i mean. pretty much anything is gonna have china as a major supplier just a cursory search shows you can get nickel-iron batteries from a us supplier at least (amazon has them, of course)
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Mar 23, 2023 00:00
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power wall except the batteries are nickel cadmium
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Mar 23, 2023 00:11
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On the solar thing, the powerwall is possibly the stupidest product produced by any of elons companies. At least the flamethrower actually worked as well as any of the alternatives. They combined all the separate functions into one unit so when one thing fails, it is all scrap. Supposedly this is to make it easier to install, but considering this is something that needs to be wired by an electrician anyway I don't buy that argument at all. I'd specced out an off-grid solar system in 2009 for my dad, bringing power to the corner of his place would have cost 14k due to power company schenanigans. He ended up with ~24kW of panels and ~20kWH of flooded lead acid. The batteries needed replaced in 2017 due to a faulty charge controller, so right when the powerwall was launching. To get the same performance it would have been 3x the cost, and as already pointed out there is no reason to go for lightweight batteries in a system that is stationary. Solar is great, but I'd highly advise against battery backup unless you have a good reason, it's a huge additional expense and maintenance task. For occasional power outages, you are way better off keeping a generator around (with a properly installed transfer switch so you aren't killing utility workers). I'd also think that running a generator <5 hours per year is probably better environmentally than all the mining & energy that goes into producing batteries. E: we'd looked at the nickel batteries, it's a super interesting chemistry for the application but it wasn't available from a reputable supplier at that point. Hopefully someone starts producing them.
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Mar 23, 2023 00:12
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why the hell is nickel so expensive? nickels are the shittiest coin, at least pennies are cool tier list: penny: long history, rakish female name, present in bat cave (giant) dime: a round sum for round americans, possibly magical (scrooge) quarter: insert to continue dollar coin: you're in New York, thank god; RL gold piece substitute but the nickel? a bastard coin
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Mar 23, 2023 00:15
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Nessus posted:why the hell is nickel so expensive? nickels are the shittiest coin, at least pennies are cool where’s the god drat half dollar
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Mar 23, 2023 00:16
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Nessus posted:why the hell is nickel so expensive? nickels are the shittiest coin, at least pennies are cool I think Sudbury just got tired of being a poisoned hellscape with the very bedrock changing colour from the fumes. Now it can just be a regular North Ontario hellscape.
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Mar 23, 2023 00:18
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Asymmetric POSTer posted:where’s the god drat half dollar you can get them at the bank, they still mint them
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Mar 23, 2023 00:26
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Beeftweeter posted:you can get them at the bank, they still mint them i collected them as a kid by going to the bank and withdrawing/depositing rolls in search of every date then when I got older i just spent them all lol
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Mar 23, 2023 00:32
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Asymmetric POSTer posted:i collected them as a kid by going to the bank and withdrawing/depositing rolls in search of every date i did the same thing with some $2 bills lol
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Mar 23, 2023 00:36
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ADA_Hypothetical posted:On the solar thing, the powerwall is possibly the stupidest product produced by any of elons companies. At least the flamethrower actually worked as well as any of the alternatives. They combined all the separate functions into one unit so when one thing fails, it is all scrap. Supposedly this is to make it easier to install, but considering this is something that needs to be wired by an electrician anyway I don't buy that argument at all. in california, net energy metering is being absolutely gutted in 3 weeks and anyone who installs after that will often see a better return on investment (though much larger upfront costs) if they install a battery too. because of the increased demand, hopefully some costs will start coming down and there's other battery chemistries that will start being more prevalent
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Mar 23, 2023 00:44
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Cat Face Joe posted:theyre doing the ad in the comments again and they're entirely mobile games and crypto scans with one exception: from a couple pages ago but i found it amusing as the kangaroo hints that it's an Aussie site and yet in AU a Liberal is a supporter/member of the conservative Liberal party (Labor is our centre-left party). so if anything that's just a dating site for shitheads
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Mar 23, 2023 00:46
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lol at electrochemical batteries what is this 1873? build a giant crane that raises a big chunk of concrete to store energy and then lowers it to release it, cowards
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Mar 23, 2023 00:57
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Endless Mike posted:lol at electrochemical batteries what is this 1873? build a giant crane that raises a big chunk of concrete to store energy and then lowers it to release it, cowards im a big fan of pumped water storage. upside: even if you dont need power, you got pressurized water. downside: you can inadvertently take a bath with your climate control power
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Mar 23, 2023 01:05
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is just putting a giant hot/cold water tank in the basement to store hot/cold a thing? i wonder what capacity you can get with that. just run a heat pump off the solar during the day and recirculate at night or whatever.
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Mar 23, 2023 01:23
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I’ve looked into the battery well of a submarine. it’s uh… a whole lot of batteries they don’t get much use beyond testing and drills, what with nuclear power and all
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Mar 23, 2023 01:25
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Eeyo posted:is just putting a giant hot/cold water tank in the basement to store hot/cold a thing? i wonder what capacity you can get with that. storing cold is a different story though I have heard occasional mutterings
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Mar 23, 2023 01:28
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Endless Mike posted:lol at electrochemical batteries what is this 1873? build a giant crane that raises a big chunk of concrete to store energy and then lowers it to release it, cowards it's too bad gravity batteries have such terrible energy density gravitational potential energy = mgh. if you lift a 2000kg SUV 100m, you've stored 2000*9.8*100 =~ 2MJ. sadly, this is less energy storage than the 12V lead-acid battery in that SUV (probably 3-ish MJ) only reason pumped water storage works at all is scale. you can impound an awful lot of water mass in a big reservoir, and fluids are a lot easier to work with than solid objects Fart Sandwiches posted:I’ve looked into the battery well of a submarine. it’s uh… a whole lot of batteries diesel electric subs are still a thing, have even more a whole lot of batteries, and use them quite a bit
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Mar 23, 2023 02:10
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what if you make the mass lead-acid batteries? e: or even better, gasoline?
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Mar 23, 2023 02:18
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infernal machines posted:what if you make the mass lead-acid batteries? gasoline + lead + lead batteries
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Mar 23, 2023 04:36
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i think it’s neat how water towers on top of tall buildings get filled up at night when electricity is cheap
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Mar 23, 2023 06:47
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Eeyo posted:is just putting a giant hot/cold water tank in the basement to store hot/cold a thing? i wonder what capacity you can get with that. Yes https://www.vantaanenergia.fi/en/carbon-negativity-2030/worlds-largest-cavern-thermal-energy-storage-to-be-built-in-vantaa/
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Mar 23, 2023 06:50
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raminasi posted:i think it’s neat how water towers on top of tall buildings get filled up at night when electricity is cheap cloutchasers having to figure out which day is "no shower day" with their podcaster roomies because the landlord wants to get a few bucks extra by draining the rooftop tank and using it to run a generator
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Mar 23, 2023 06:52
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Pile Of Garbage posted:from a couple pages ago but i found it amusing as the kangaroo hints that it's an Aussie site and yet in AU a Liberal is a supporter/member of the conservative Liberal party (Labor is our centre-left party). so if anything that's just a dating site for shitheads I think you can safely assume that any new dating app is targeted at shitheads. Most people will do fine on any legacy dating app, and all of the non-shithead niche groups (gay, jewish, arranged marriages, etc) are already handled by successful apps of their own. So the market is pretty saturated. All that's left is the shitheads (conservatives, rich douchebags, mensa members, people banned for sending dick pics) who can't get a date no matter what app they try, so they're always good marks for a new one.
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Mar 23, 2023 06:56
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Sagebrush posted:I think you can safely assume that any new dating app is targeted at shitheads. Most people will do fine on any legacy dating app, and all of the non-shithead niche groups (gay, jewish, arranged marriages, etc) are already handled by successful apps of their own. So the market is pretty saturated. All that's left is the shitheads (conservatives, rich douchebags, mensa members, people banned for sending dick pics) who can't get a date no matter what app they try, so they're always good marks for a new one. wait there's an app for arranged marriages?
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Mar 23, 2023 07:03
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of course. bharat matrimony, shaadi, etc i think they are all companies that existed well before they had an app, since matchmaking in india is an enormous business, but hey gotta keep up with the times
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Mar 23, 2023 07:15
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yeah i was about to say, i would be surprised if india didn't have like 12 diff hugely popular apps for all that
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Mar 23, 2023 07:19
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