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christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider
I think you can pay souls at his grave and buy from his ghost (you have to pay each time though)

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goblin week
Jan 26, 2019

Absolute clown.
Nah he’s hosed. While it’s true that you can revive NPCs as ghosts, they do not change their character state like this, i.e. Ornifex won’t move to Tseldora, and Maughlin won’t assume his capitalist outview (which is the trigger for selling boss armors)

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider
oh poo poo well sucks to suck lol

Merry Deciever
Aug 20, 2015
Pillbug
Holy CHRIST the Iron Keep gauntlet sucks. To all the goons saying Dark Souls II had great DLC, you can eat it

The Joe Man
Apr 7, 2007

Flirting With Apathetic Waitresses Since 1984

Merry Deciever posted:

Holy CHRIST the Iron Keep gauntlet sucks. To all the goons saying Dark Souls II had great DLC, you can eat it
It does. That (and 2 other areas) are meant and tuned for co-op.

Just wait until you get to the north pole.

Archenteron
Nov 3, 2006

:marc:

Merry Deciever posted:

Holy CHRIST the Iron Keep gauntlet sucks. To all the goons saying Dark Souls II had great DLC, you can eat it

Are you talking about the Iron Passage? Yeah each DLC has one hellzone like that, they're scaled for You Really Want To Summon Friends For These (and can summon people who don't have DLC access, they can lay summon signs at those graves at the dlc entrance warp that'll appear at the start of that area)

Merry Deciever
Aug 20, 2015
Pillbug

Archenteron posted:

Are you talking about the Iron Passage? Yeah each DLC has one hellzone like that, they're scaled for You Really Want To Summon Friends For These (and can summon people who don't have DLC access, they can lay summon signs at those graves at the dlc entrance warp that'll appear at the start of that area)

Oh, I've done the area and have made it past the main gauntlet, beaten the Smelter Demon boss. Now I'm just trying to the alternate route and sweep up goodies, but it's fire traps and closing gates, and 5 axe armor dudes that can two shot me if I mess up on ONE of the gates. I had to run the MAIN gauntlet enough times with summoned NPC help to actually start clearing out some of the enemies. Traps with timed elements are the worst design =_=

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider
Yeah, each DLC has some bullshit zone.There's Bizarro-Havel and his magic gank squad, the Iron Passage leading to Smelter Demon (Blue), and then there's the loving ice twins of siberia

Merry Deciever
Aug 20, 2015
Pillbug
The main gauntlet is just a bow check, and even with a big stick and no dex I can at least light crossbow the really bad sniper arrow enemies, lure the clerks out, it just takes forever and feels cheap as hell

The Moon Monster
Dec 30, 2005

The Memory of the old Iron King (the Alonne gauntlet and fight) is also one of the DLC co-op poo poo zones, but people never seem to count it with the other 3 because it has a cool boss I guess.

heard u like girls
Mar 25, 2013

The Joe Man posted:

It does. That (and 2 other areas) are meant and tuned for co-op.

Just wait until you get to the north pole.

Getting to the second bonfire in Loyce wasnt that bad imo, im sure itll get crazier i mean funnier later

christmas boots posted:

oh poo poo well sucks to suck lol

yep, but i love these games so much, im prolly gonna make a new pyromancer or something and do it correctly

Dark Souls 3 has been my fav for a long time, but im starting to feel like this one is a bit more intense/secretive/surprising and therefore enjoyable for me personally

heard u like girls
Mar 25, 2013

Merry Deciever posted:

The main gauntlet is just a bow check, and even with a big stick and no dex I can at least light crossbow the really bad sniper arrow enemies, lure the clerks out, it just takes forever and feels cheap as hell

I opted for the Seaside Bow this run, instead of the Dragonrider Bow and it's been less powerful but can shoot quite a bit further. So yeah, Iron Keep and Shrine of Amana deff felt like places the bow was sort of mandatory to not live in eternal suffering.

Kinda excited how bad it gets in Iron King DLC lol

heard u like girls fucked around with this message at 02:19 on Mar 24, 2023

goblin week
Jan 26, 2019

Absolute clown.
Iron Passage has a nice level design

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider
I missed out on Drangleic this year because I was playing DS3 for the first time and it was a bit too much for me to bounce back and forth but next year maybe

VideoGames
Aug 18, 2003
I should have joined the Drangleic event. I love Dark Souls II so much and every month that passes since I first finished makes me smile more and more.

I saw the clip of me pressing every incorrect button when attemping the Rat King boss, followed by my final attempt at the Darklurker and winning with about 2% health and both had me beaming.

Even if this is not my most favourite fromsoft game, I think it is the game where I had the very highest highs and the most fun - if that makes sense.

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔
"both beaming" is usually a bad thing in the Darklurker fight

VideoGames
Aug 18, 2003
At the risk of self promotion the beaming thing is true in both ways. I have never felt more elated at beating a boss than I sound here:

https://clips.twitch.tv/OpenPlainOwlPMSTwin-n3FLlEpHtbnkEfuI

It was one of the last human effigies I had as well. I think that was my 30th attempt and I was whittling them down and down. Goons cheering me was always the biggest help :)

FishMcCool
Apr 9, 2021

lolcats are still funny
Fallen Rib

The Moon Monster posted:

The Memory of the old Iron King (the Alonne gauntlet and fight) is also one of the DLC co-op poo poo zones, but people never seem to count it with the other 3 because it has a cool boss I guess.

I don't feel the Sir Weeabo gauntlet is that bad. It's relatively sprintable (as opposed to Iron Passage hexers that slow you down) and a lot shorter than Horsefuck Valley.

UnderFreddy
Oct 9, 2012

GEGENPOSTING

i'm playing through the game for the first time and was incredibly positively surprised by the Gank Squad run actually being run of those boss runs you can just run straight to and ignore the enemies

unlike most of the game

loving taking damage while walking through fog walls

aegof
Mar 2, 2011

VideoGames posted:

At the risk of self promotion the beaming thing is true in both ways. I have never felt more elated at beating a boss than I sound here:

https://clips.twitch.tv/OpenPlainOwlPMSTwin-n3FLlEpHtbnkEfuI

It was one of the last human effigies I had as well. I think that was my 30th attempt and I was whittling them down and down. Goons cheering me was always the biggest help :)

dang, that was close, too. Nice job!

King of Solomon
Oct 23, 2008

S S

UnderFreddy posted:

loving taking damage while walking through fog walls

I understand why they made that choice, but goddamn was it a bad one. I guess they realized it too, since they never did it again.

heard u like girls
Mar 25, 2013

UnderFreddy posted:



loving taking damage while walking through fog walls

Not only that but getting knocked out of the enter-animation, the single most dreadful thing that can happen...

also; fogwall cancel roll

UnderFreddy
Oct 9, 2012

GEGENPOSTING

King of Solomon posted:

I understand why they made that choice, but goddamn was it a bad one. I guess they realized it too, since they never did it again.

why do you think they made that choice? One of the things I've always liked about the Souls games, is that they respect if you know what you're doing, you can straight up run through enemies and areas.

For a lot of DS2, it feels like they hate the very idea of you doing this and will have enemies chase you to the ends of the earth and attempting to do anything while they chase you is just death

King of Solomon
Oct 23, 2008

S S

UnderFreddy posted:

why do you think they made that choice? One of the things I've always liked about the Souls games, is that they respect if you know what you're doing, you can straight up run through enemies and areas.

For a lot of DS2, it feels like they hate the very idea of you doing this and will have enemies chase you to the ends of the earth and attempting to do anything while they chase you is just death

Yeah, you got it in one. They didn't want players just running past all of the enemies.

Son of Thunderbeast
Sep 21, 2002
lmao goddamn, nice

Merry Deciever
Aug 20, 2015
Pillbug
More than that, I've only ever played the Scholars of the Sin version, which apparently ups the enemy count by a lot everywhere. I've beaten the main game, just grinding through the DLC now, feeling like these areas suck harder than anything in the base game, but I wonder if they are more reasonable in the original version. No matter, I've done literally everything but these DLCs, and have Beaten the Sunken King and am making my way through the Iron Passage now (actually a bit lost in the tower after activating stuff, I kinda don't know where to go.)

Say what you will about Dark Souls II, but aside from the Gutter I've never felt *lost* in it

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider
I don't think the DLCs are different between the versions, I think it's just the base game stuff.

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔

christmas boots posted:

I don't think the DLCs are different between the versions, I think it's just the base game stuff.
They are not

The Moon Monster
Dec 30, 2005

UnderFreddy posted:

why do you think they made that choice? One of the things I've always liked about the Souls games, is that they respect if you know what you're doing, you can straight up run through enemies and areas.

For a lot of DS2, it feels like they hate the very idea of you doing this and will have enemies chase you to the ends of the earth and attempting to do anything while they chase you is just death

SotFS also made some areas like Heide Tower way less run-throughable. Sucks.

Merry Deciever
Aug 20, 2015
Pillbug
So apparently the limited consumable item Smelter Wedge for the Crown of the old Iron King DLC is limited to 11 of em, and there's those 12 abyss demon things that they can kill. I've been using em as I progressed, and now there's a permenant one at the boss. That's total crap. I've enjoyed Dark Souls II a lot, but this sort of thing is why it has a bad rap.

Who designs an area to screw you over if you explore everything?

King of Solomon
Oct 23, 2008

S S

Merry Deciever posted:

So apparently the limited consumable item Smelter Wedge for the Crown of the old Iron King DLC is limited to 11 of em, and there's those 12 abyss demon things that they can kill. I've been using em as I progressed, and now there's a permenant one at the boss. That's total crap. I've enjoyed Dark Souls II a lot, but this sort of thing is why it has a bad rap.

Who designs an area to screw you over if you explore everything?

E: I'm wrong, but it's not actually a big deal. Just use your wedges smartly, if I remember correctly the right way to handle it is to leave one idol around next to the Fume Knight boss fight and just avoid that part of the room.

King of Solomon fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Mar 24, 2023

Merry Deciever
Aug 20, 2015
Pillbug

King of Solomon posted:

E: I'm wrong, but it's not actually a big deal. Just use your wedges smartly, if I remember correctly the right way to handle it is to leave one idol around next to the Fume Knight boss fight and just avoid that part of the room.

Yea, it's doable, though I'm having a hard time with the knight himself. Kinda getting sick of the walkbacks in the DLCs, but oh well. It just grinds my gears that you can get screwed in this way if you are playing without fore-warning and "fresh"

King of Solomon
Oct 23, 2008

S S

Merry Deciever posted:

Yea, it's doable, though I'm having a hard time with the knight himself. Kinda getting sick of the walkbacks in the DLCs, but oh well. It just grinds my gears that you can get screwed in this way if you are playing without fore-warning and "fresh"

I think the DLC is generally designed so that you run out of wedges when you reach the Fume Knight, it's hard to completely screw yourself over by using them on the wrong idols.

deep dish peat moss
Jul 27, 2006

heard u like girls posted:

Getting to the second bonfire in Loyce wasnt that bad imo, im sure itll get crazier i mean funnier later

yep, but i love these games so much, im prolly gonna make a new pyromancer or something and do it correctly

Dark Souls 3 has been my fav for a long time, but im starting to feel like this one is a bit more intense/secretive/surprising and therefore enjoyable for me personally

In time everyone will learn that Dark Souls 2 is the best Dark Souls. Most of what I remember about DS1 was the undead burg and making gimmick builds with the bottomless box glitch. I remember virtually nothing about DS3. Elden Ring was cool but I haven't thought about it once since I beat it, already forgot a vast majority of it, and have no desire to ever play it again. Same with Sekiro, and all I remember about Bloodborne is a couple cool boss designs. But I still remember pretty much every single area and boss in DS2.

I don't know exactly how to explain it but it feels like DS2 was written with an entire world in mind and it takes place in one part of it and shows you tiny details alluding to the rest, whereas every other Souls game feels like it was written to build up mystery and speculation around a world that doesn't actually exist through anything more than tiny breadcrumb item descriptions or whatever. It was the only one where I actually believed that these places I'm traveling through had history and were real places once.

Bring back the colorful high-fantasy world, Fromsoft :colbert:

Also lifestones are cool and are the best healing item the series has had though they probably shouldn't be able to stack like they do. Bring those back too :colbert:

deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 22:26 on Mar 24, 2023

Merry Deciever
Aug 20, 2015
Pillbug
ah, durr, there is a bonfire right before the Fume Knight. That makes things easier

The Moon Monster
Dec 30, 2005

Merry Deciever posted:

ah, durr, there is a bonfire right before the Fume Knight. That makes things easier

I missed the bonfire the first time I found him so I just thought "yeah, gently caress this" and didn't come back for a year. That's a hell of a boss run.

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.

Merry Deciever posted:

More than that, I've only ever played the Scholars of the Sin version, which apparently ups the enemy count by a lot everywhere.

Scholar's reputation is slightly overblown, in so much that it cranks up the enemy density really badly in a few specific spots that it really, really didn't need to - Iron Keep being a prime example - but in other cases "more enemies" actually means "properly finishing areas and actually placing enemies where they should've been all along" (or sometimes even culling/swapping out enemies that were poorly placed). And then there's a few cases like Shaded Woods where the raw density didn't really change, but the two version of the area have radically different enemy layouts.

Merry Deciever
Aug 20, 2015
Pillbug
Yea, the Fume Knight blows. Leaps out of the way of my big bonk stick when I use it, is too hard to hit with a regular club, so I'm switching to my +5 Butcher's Knife. Seems to work well enough, though he still basically three shots me

King of Solomon
Oct 23, 2008

S S

Merry Deciever posted:

Yea, the Fume Knight blows. Leaps out of the way of my big bonk stick when I use it, is too hard to hit with a regular club, so I'm switching to my +5 Butcher's Knife. Seems to work well enough, though he still basically three shots me

The Fume Knight rules, actually. There's so much going on there, like how you can use ~*~lore~*~ to get him to change phases early. It's a really cool fight.

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Merry Deciever
Aug 20, 2015
Pillbug
I finally just used a NPC helper and beat him the first try upon doing that~ It ain't badly designed, I did have to learn his moveset, though I'm not convinced I've seen it all. The npc was able to stunlock him a bit and take attention off me long enough to estus flask some.

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