(Thread IKs:
weg, Toxic Mental)
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RDM posted:I don't think that's true, it was absolutely possible for Ukraine to keep their nukes. They chose not to for a bunch of good reasons. They could have chosen differently. They didn't need western help to maintain or modify weapons, and iirc it was mostly western economic incentives that got them to agree to the Budapest Memorandum. They needed the money more than they needed the nukes. Their economy was pretty fragile and they couldn't have afforded to maintain them anyway.
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Mar 26, 2023 21:42
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| # ? May 29, 2024 08:00 |
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zone posted:They needed the money more than they needed the nukes. Their economy was pretty fragile and they couldn't have afforded to maintain them anyway. First you get the nukes than you get the money, much easier this way
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Mar 26, 2023 21:43
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Lord Stimperor posted:What is the general consensus regarding the Chinese-Russian relationship in this war? Any indications as to what degree China will enable Russia? I understand there was a summit recently but I am absolutely not caught up with the news for personal reasons. China changed the names of Vladivostok and other territories taken during the humiliation back to its historical ones A Sino-Russian friendship to last for
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Mar 26, 2023 21:50
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RDM posted:I mean this is entirely wrong. The Soviet troops guarding them were... no longer Soviet But they were by and large ethnic Russian or other non Ukrainian. They were not going to turn around and pledge loyalty to their new Ukrainian overlords regardless of the end of the Soviet Union.
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Mar 26, 2023 21:53
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Tiny Timbs posted:fwiw one of the people doing this was permabanned for buying themselves death threat and transphobic avatars and trying to pin it on other people russian intelligence: "We should use some plague rats" intel agent: "won't that just get our own men sick too? I mean we can do it and blame it on NATO labs sure" russian intelligence: "I meant for psyop posting on most relevant forum somethingawful dot com cyka"
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Mar 26, 2023 21:53
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Brokebrained concern trolls don't need russian intelligence to run them, they can shitpost pro-russian garbage all on their own
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Mar 26, 2023 22:01
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zone posted:They needed the money more than they needed the nukes. Their economy was pretty fragile and they couldn't have afforded to maintain them anyway. I don't think anyone will ever listen to it again.
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Mar 26, 2023 22:02
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zone posted:https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1640082838241304577  
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Mar 26, 2023 22:21
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Alan Smithee posted:China changed the names of Vladivostok and other territories taken during the humiliation back to its historical ones Also an interesting detail on the "unlimited friendship" that ronya pointed out in the D&D thread: ronya posted:five days ago:
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Mar 26, 2023 22:21
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In 20 years, the US, Europe, and the Russians have shown to every country on Earth that nuclear weapons are absolutely vital to survival and that is really sad and scary.
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Mar 26, 2023 22:25
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pro starcraft loser posted:In 20 years, the US, Europe, and the Russians have shown to every country on Earth that nuclear weapons are absolutely vital to survival and that is really sad and scary. Let's not get carried away. There's like 190 non-nuclear countries in the world, very few of them would be more likely to survive with nukes than currently.
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Mar 26, 2023 22:29
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EasilyConfused posted:Let's not get carried away. There's like 190 non-nuclear countries in the world, very few of them would be more likely to survive with nukes than currently. The US would not have gone into Iraq if they had nukes Europe would not have gone into Libya if they had nukes Russia would not have gone into Ukraine if they had nukes X would not have invaded Y if Y had nukes Why do you think the US and Europe aren't throwing everything we have at Russia right now?
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Mar 26, 2023 22:38
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pro starcraft loser posted:The US would not have gone into Iraq if they had nukes I don't disagree, just pointing out that most countries don't need nukes to avoid being invaded and none of this is somehow new.
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Mar 26, 2023 22:44
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kill me now posted:But they were by and large ethnic Russian or other non Ukrainian. They were not going to turn around and pledge loyalty to their new Ukrainian overlords regardless of the end of the Soviet Union. Many of the troops left behind weren't getting paid or supplied anymore and in many cases just left their postings, leaving things in a state where the Ukrainian military ended up guarding many of the nukes. Russia didn't exactly enter into these negotiations for the return of the weapons for no reason - while they didn't have the codes to use them the Ukrainians *did* physically control many of the weapons.
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Mar 26, 2023 22:47
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https://twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/status/1639791055934570499 No, you will not have it.
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Mar 26, 2023 22:49
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Ukraine is gonna hook up a bunch of tractors to an atom and split it. That'll show Putin!
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Mar 26, 2023 22:50
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Pot Smoke Phoenix posted:Ukraine is gonna hook up a bunch of tractors to an atom and split it. Best tractor pull ever.
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Mar 26, 2023 22:51
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Hearing reports from seasoned Kremlin watchers that Putins sharts are increasing in both size and frequency.
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Mar 26, 2023 23:09
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https://twitter.com/TheStudyofWar/status/1639995342539169792 uh-oh.
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Mar 26, 2023 23:12
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Warbadger posted:Many of the troops left behind weren't getting paid or supplied anymore and in many cases just left their postings, leaving things in a state where the Ukrainian military ended up guarding many of the nukes. Russia didn't exactly enter into these negotiations for the return of the weapons for no reason - while they didn't have the codes to use them the Ukrainians *did* physically control many of the weapons. how difficult could it possibly be at this point to bypass whatever security? Is it actually reasonable to assume that independent ukraine with lots of free time and maybe a little western help could not have controlled those nukes themselves?
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Mar 26, 2023 23:15
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I'd be surprised if they didn't have those sorts of meetings, even if they didn't expect something to happen in the immediate future. poverty goat posted:how difficult could it possibly be at this point to bypass whatever security? Is it actually reasonable to assume that independent ukraine with lots of free time and maybe a little western help could not have controlled those nukes themselves? I think they could have, given time. Ukraine had a wealth of industrial, weapons, and nuclear expertise and even if they handed over 90% of the weapons to play super nice they'd have been keeping over a hundred warheads. But they wouldn't have and didn't for other reasons. Warbadger fucked around with this message at 23:19 on Mar 26, 2023 |
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Mar 26, 2023 23:16
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biglads posted:Hearing reports from seasoned Kremlin watchers that Putins sharts are increasing in both size and frequency. this ruins the potato
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Mar 26, 2023 23:20
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Warbadger posted:I'd be surprised if they didn't have those sorts of meetings, even if they didn't expect something to happen in the immediate future. From the wikipedia article: quote:The deterrent value of the nuclear weapons in Ukraine was also questionable: Ukraine had taken "administrative control" of the weapon delivery systems and implemented measures to prevent Russia from using them, but would have had to spend 12 to 18 months to establish full operational control over its nuclear arsenal.[9] The ICBMs also had a range of 5,000–10,000 km (initially targeting the United States), which meant that they could only have been re-targeted to hit Russia's far east.[9] The Soviet air-launched cruise missiles (ALCMs) had been disabled by the Russian military during the collapse of the Soviet Union, but even if they had been reconfigured and made to work by the Ukrainians, it is unlikely that they would have had a deterrent effect.[9] Had Ukraine decided to establish full operational control of its nuclear weapons, it would have faced sanctions by the West and perhaps even a withdrawal of diplomatic recognition by the United States and other NATO allies.[9] Ukraine would also likely have faced retaliatory action by Russia.[9] Ukraine would also have struggled with replacing the nuclear weapons once their service life expired, as Ukraine did not have a nuclear weapons program.[9] In exchange for giving up its nuclear weapons, Ukraine received financial compensation, as well as the security assurances of the Budapest Memorandum.[9]
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Mar 26, 2023 23:31
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poverty goat posted:how difficult could it possibly be at this point to bypass whatever security? Is it actually reasonable to assume that independent ukraine with lots of free time and maybe a little western help could not have controlled those nukes themselves? The cost is that you have to spend money on your own dudes for security and nuclear maintenance, plus a ton of physical infrastructure to keep them working, etc etc. Not having a guy with a screwdriver bypass some cold war era lock.
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Mar 26, 2023 23:34
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Alan Smithee posted:they are just out of frame, radiating too I thought he meant mobiks. Could be both if they march through Prypjat?
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Mar 27, 2023 00:22
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https://twitter.com/TheKremlinYap/status/1639348095258353671 More big fat jokes about things that will never happen.
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Mar 27, 2023 00:51
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zone posted:https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1640082838241304577 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysbbNHccY04&t=15s
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Mar 27, 2023 01:09
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EasilyConfused posted:I doubt this. A lot of people expected that would happen when the Soviet Union broke up. Seems unlikely that it would happen after more than 30 years of independence if it didn't then. The specific reason it didn't happen is that Russia made it not happen by supporting a weirdo separatist statelet on their territory. Attepting to join Romania before dealing with that first is pretty much impossible, and since dealing with that would probably involve shooting at people who are officially Russian soldiers, it was not popular. The crucial point that needs to be made is that it's very hard to understate just how good of a deal EU was for Romania. Before the USSR broke up, Moldova was per capita richer than Romania proper. Today, Romania has twice the GDP/capita of Moldova. Everyone in Moldova knows this, and even people who kinda lean pro-Russian have started to think that maybe some sort of reunification, but with guarantees for minorities, should be done.
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Mar 27, 2023 02:03
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Power Khan posted:Lmao, is that really James Vasquez? Yep that’s him alright. What a fighter
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Mar 27, 2023 02:48
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Just Another Lurker posted:I had forgotten that post from PegLegActual, 10 months ago... hope he's doing well. His last post a year ago was on how he was going to the front lines again tomorrow… Does anyone know what happened to him or if he’s ok?
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Mar 27, 2023 03:11
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zone posted:https://twitter.com/TheKremlinYap/status/1639348095258353671 Did nobody tell this man that War is bad!?
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Mar 27, 2023 04:23
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Soggy Muffin posted:His last post a year ago was on how he was going to the front lines again tomorrow… Does anyone know what happened to him or if he’s ok? According to someone in this thread, he made soldiers happy and that's it. Deki posted:Did nobody tell this man that War is bad!? The only people who need to be told that war is bad are people who are against an invasion. Those for it are saints and know that fighting back is the worst, and therefore don't need to be told.
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Mar 27, 2023 04:25
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Soggy Muffin posted:His last post a year ago was on how he was going to the front lines again tomorrow… Does anyone know what happened to him or if he’s ok? Iirc there was a very strict "don't post about going there"/anti war tourism policy that got quickly adopted
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Mar 27, 2023 04:49
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https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1639756577338015745 Here's something interesting.
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Mar 27, 2023 05:50
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zone posted:https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1639756577338015745 Camouflaging trenches seems like a pretty good idea. 
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Mar 27, 2023 05:57
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Soggy Muffin posted:His last post a year ago was on how he was going to the front lines again tomorrow… Does anyone know what happened to him or if he’s ok? He has passed on, to Twitter
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Mar 27, 2023 06:03
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Tiny Timbs posted:fwiw one of the people doing this was permabanned for buying themselves death threat and transphobic avatars and trying to pin it on other people Alan Smithee posted:russian intelligence: "We should use some plague rats" some plague rats (the aforementioned permabanned user) was also the op of (two) holodomor mock thread(s). I've made a thread about it in SAD https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=4026206 and was told by both spr and the mods to basically 'deal with it'. Neat Hetero Dude also chimed in to say they didn't see what the big deal was. And now it turns out that the op, who posted extremely aggro anti-Ukrainian propaganda non stop, was literally an abusive psychotic person. Who could've predicted that? Some great community management on display here.
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Mar 27, 2023 06:07
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Terminally Bored posted:some plague rats (the aforementioned permabanned user) was also the op of (two) holodomor mock thread(s). I've made a thread about it in SAD Don't complain about it here, we can't do anything about it. In other news, half of Putin's army is either dead or out of action: https://www.kyivpost.com/post/14881 Lead Lines (doing the math) Russia may have just achieved a gruesome new claim to fame in its war in Ukraine. Of some 800,000 Russian troops who were part of the initial invasion army or recruited since then for the war, nearly 420,000 (over 52 percent) could now be dead or otherwise out of action due to wounds. That breaks down as follows: · 166,570 Russian troops killed. · 499,700 wounded (including 150,000 still getting medical care and 100,000 permanently disabled). The figures are based on calculations using data from Ukrainian, independent Russian, and Western sources for combat casualties and the rate at which soldiers typically return to combat after being wounded. A military unit that has lost over 50 percent of its personnel is commonly seen as needing to be withdrawn from battle because of a loss of combat effectiveness. A 1997 U.S. Army field manual says such a unit is “combat ineffective” and “requires reconstitution before [its] next mission.” Soldiers may still be able to put up a fight, but not effectively as a cohesive military force.
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Mar 27, 2023 06:13
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Was there ever any reports on the fallout(  ) from all those mobiks digging and then sleeping in trenches in the spiciest parts of Chernobyl?
grumplestiltzkin fucked around with this message at 06:55 on Mar 27, 2023 |
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Mar 27, 2023 06:20
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It was reported in both the BBC (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65075952) and Kyiv Independent (https://kyivindependent.com/zelensky-ukraine-cant-start-counteroffensive-yet/) that on 25 March 2023, Zelensky said in an interview with Yomiuri Shimbun (a Japanese newspaper) that "We can't start (the counter-offensive) yet, we can't send our brave soldiers to the front line without tanks, artillery and long-range rockets." This seems to be counter to what Oleksandr Syrskyi (the commander of Ukraine’s land forces) said on his Telegram channel on 23 March 2023, that “[Russians] are losing significant forces [in Bakhmut] and are running out of energy." and that "Very soon, we will take advantage of this opportunity, as we did in the past near Kyiv, Kharkiv, Balakliya and Kupyansk". (https://edition.cnn.com/2023/03/23/europe/bakhmut-ukraine-counter-offensive-intl/index.html) I've checked the website of Yomiuri Shimbun and I could only find Zelensky being quoted as saying "“We do not have ammunition. For us the situation in the East is not good" (https://japannews.yomiuri.co.jp/world/europe/20230325-99649/), but there were no quotes of him saying "We can't start the (counter-offensive) yet". Is anyone able to find any mentions on the Yomiuri Shimbun of Zelensky saying "We can't start the (counter-offensive) yet"? If not, where did the BBC and Kyiv Independent get that quote from? Could this be deliberate dezinformatsia being promulgated by the Ukrainian high command to confuse the Russian commanders?
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Mar 27, 2023 07:03
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