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Meadows, other top Trump aides ordered to testify in Jan. 6 probe as judge rejects claims of executive privilegequote:A federal judge has rejected former President Donald Trump's claims of executive privilege and has ordered Mark Meadows and other former top aides to testify before a federal grand jury investigating Trump's efforts to overturn the election leading up to the Jan. 6 attack on the U.S. Capitol, multiple sources familiar with the matter tell ABC News. More Executive Privilege bullshit evaporating.
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Mar 24, 2023 19:15
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Well, we'll see once it makes it to the SCOTUS. Too bad there's not just a "skip to the supreme court bit" button for this poo poo.
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Mar 24, 2023 19:38
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mutata posted:Well, we'll see once it makes it to the SCOTUS. Too bad there's not just a "skip to the supreme court bit" button for this poo poo. Delaying is the tactic; even if SCOTUS doesn't bail him out (and who knows), there's still bullshit related to what they're forced to do
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Mar 24, 2023 20:00
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Red posted:Delaying is the tactic; even if SCOTUS doesn't bail him out (and who knows), there's still bullshit related to what they're forced to do Seems like a losing tactic at this point. All of these investigations seem to be gaining steam right as the 2024 Presidential election is taking off. I'm not sure the timing could be worse.
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Mar 24, 2023 20:05
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Grip it and rip it posted:Seems like a losing tactic at this point. All of these investigations seem to be gaining steam right as the 2024 Presidential election is taking off. I'm not sure the timing could be worse. But at the same time, if he can drag it out to the primary or general election, history has shown that the DOJ suddenly gets very shy about actually going after candidates for fear of being ~political~. Honestly, I hope the cases reach the point the DOJ actually does the right thing, but history hasn't been so kind.
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Mar 24, 2023 20:15
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Grip it and rip it posted:Seems like a losing tactic at this point. All of these investigations seem to be gaining steam right as the 2024 Presidential election is taking off. I'm not sure the timing could be worse. Yeah. It wasn't like Team Tump had a Gantt chart where they were coordinating exactly how much they were trying to delay every legal proceeding so they all happened at Time X. Sure, there's a vague hope of pushing them all past January 2025 and into a hypothetical Second Age of Trump where all is forgiven, but mostly the aim is just DELAY DELAY MAKE IT GO AWAY COME AGAIN ANOTHER DAY
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Mar 24, 2023 20:17
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They aren’t stopping a trial because of elections.
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Mar 24, 2023 21:26
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Murgos posted:They aren’t stopping a trial because of elections. There is no reason to be confident in that.
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Mar 24, 2023 21:52
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Fart Amplifier posted:There is no reason to be confident in that. Federal judges can and will tell any state's AG to go pound sand up their rear end about it.
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Mar 24, 2023 22:04
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Grip it and rip it posted:Seems like a losing tactic at this point. All of these investigations seem to be gaining steam right as the 2024 Presidential election is taking off. I'm not sure the timing could be worse. Dude we're barely halfway through Biden's first term. gently caress this two year election cycle horseshit.
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Mar 24, 2023 22:14
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DA Alvin Bragg got a letter with white powder. It was postmarked in Orlando, Florida. Before this mornings warnings of death and destruction for his enemies. "The letter was addressed to Bragg and said, "“ALVIN: I AM GOING TO KILL YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!” the sources said. It contained a small amount of white powder." "including warning on his social media website early Friday of "potential death and destruction" if the DA indicts him." https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/da-bragg-investigating-trump-received-threatening-letter-white-powder-rcna76591
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Mar 24, 2023 22:18
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Xiahou Dun posted:That’s the whole point of Judge Howell’s recent ruling. Trump by virtue of what has already been shown did a crime, which means it obviates attorney-client privilege. That's not enough. Accused and indicted criminals are allowed to have lawyers and privacy; committing crimes doesn't break attorney-client privilege. But conspiring with your lawyers, or making them an accessory to your crimes, does. Murgos posted:The privilege is the clients. So if the client uses the attorney to further crime, which is what is being speculated here (unless we get information that changes that) then there is no privilege. No speculation necessary. The judge explicitly ruled prosecutors had presented prima facie evidence that Trump did just that.
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Mar 24, 2023 22:53
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DOJ indicts on Monday or Tuesday of next week: +150 No action through the end of next week: -110
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Mar 24, 2023 23:14
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mdemone posted:DOJ indicts on Monday or Tuesday of next week: +150 Are book’s actually taking action or is this just you goofing? Because DoJ isn’t indicting until at least Pence and Meadows have had their turn. I’d put July as the earliest expected DoJ indictments. April for GA and NYC could be any day now (with an obstruction kicker?).
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Mar 24, 2023 23:51
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OgNar posted:DA Alvin Bragg got a letter with white powder. I hope this ends with another thousand of Trumps most rabid fans waiting for a hearing.
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Mar 24, 2023 23:52
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mutata posted:Well, we'll see once it makes it to the SCOTUS. Too bad there's not just a "skip to the supreme court bit" button for this poo poo. Supreme Court not issuing advisory opinions is a net good to be fair. Gotta rule on the actual facts/process.
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Mar 25, 2023 00:34
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Randalor posted:But at the same time, if he can drag it out to the primary or general election, history has shown that the DOJ suddenly gets very shy about actually going after candidates for fear of being ~political~. Honestly, I hope the cases reach the point the DOJ actually does the right thing, but history hasn't been so kind. DOJ is likely to get shy but Georgia less so. I feel the attorneys running the Georgia case are trying to get their ducks in a row so they can hit full steam ahead. The Stormy Daniels case is also less likely to be gunshy about an upcoming election. Stormy herself certainly isn't.
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Mar 25, 2023 01:04
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Murgos posted:They aren’t stopping a trial because of elections. I wish I had your level of confidence about that.
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Mar 25, 2023 15:18
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Charliegrs posted:I wish I had your level of confidence about that. Name one criminal trial that’s ever stopped so that the defendant could go politic? The DoJs policy is on not starting new investigations into political figures just ahead of an election so as not to influence the result. It also has nothing to do with already on going investigations. For example cross-fire hurricane or comey and Hillary’s emails. That has nothing to do with trials what so ever which are managed by the judiciary. Why the hell are even informed people so bad at understanding this?
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Mar 25, 2023 19:13
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Murgos posted:Name one criminal trial that’s ever stopped so that the defendant could go politic? If you ask Right Wingers: "But her Emails!"
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Mar 25, 2023 20:37
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Murgos posted:Name one criminal trial that’s ever stopped so that the defendant could go politic? All the investigations into Trump's crimes are kind of unprecedented since he's a former president AND running for re-election. That's why I'm not too confident that the investigations (especially the DOJ investigations) will be treated the same.
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Mar 26, 2023 00:02
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Murgos posted:Name one criminal trial that’s ever stopped so that the defendant could go politic? Going on what, six, seven years now of Trump just doing all the crimes? Ain't poo poo happened to him yet, even when he is "punished". Sounds like a pattern for recognition to me and that's for the guy that led a violent insurrection. There's an entire society that has decades of doing precisely zero point fuckall to rich people for anything. Keep a hold on that hope if it helps you I guess. Just seems unrealistic to expect others to share it.
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Mar 26, 2023 05:35
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Took longer than I thought it would to get back here again, haha.
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Mar 26, 2023 07:08
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Alkydere posted:The Stormy Daniels case is also less likely to be gunshy about an upcoming election. Stormy herself certainly isn't. She has nothing to do with a criminal trial. The only thing the prosecutor might need her for is her testimony, but he doesn't need to even ask her for that if he doesn't want to.
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Mar 26, 2023 07:31
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bird food bathtub posted:Going on what, six, seven years now of Trump just doing all the crimes? Ain't poo poo happened to him yet, even when he is "punished". Sounds like a pattern for recognition to me and that's for the guy that led a violent insurrection. There's an entire society that has decades of doing precisely zero point fuckall to rich people for anything. What’s that got to do with how trials are conducted? And how the judicial branch of government has gently caress all to do with DoJs investigation policies? Do none of you even recognize what’s being discussed? An investigation isn’t a trial. An investigation is an executive branch function. A trial is conducted by the Judicial branch which is a complete third branch of government equal to the executive and legislative branches. There is no method, policy or precedent to stop a criminal trial once it has started for someone to go run for office. So the fear that there will be a trial that will stop because of elections is just not even reality. Murgos fucked around with this message at 13:08 on Mar 26, 2023 |
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Mar 26, 2023 13:02
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Nobody is implying the trial would go on hiatus until election season is over. The implication is that this indictment will never see the light of day, the arrest warrant will never be issued, and the trial will never begin. Because that's what happens over and over and over and over again with every one of these "wonder cases" that lands with irrefutable evidence. Once the first shoe drops and an indictment is actually made and not just talked about, it's not unbelievable that Trump could drag and delay the trial for a year and a half to execute his election campaign.
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Mar 26, 2023 13:14
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Judge Schnoopy posted:Nobody is implying the trial would go on hiatus until election season is over. The implication is that this indictment will never see the light of day, the arrest warrant will never be issued, and the trial will never begin. I understand but I keep saying trial and the op said trial but people here want to tell me I’m wrong about investigations because that lets them win an internet argument. You’re doing it. If you agree then let the comment stand and talk about investigations.
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Mar 26, 2023 13:17
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Murgos posted:What’s that got to do with how trials are conducted? And how the judicial branch of government has gently caress all to do with DoJs investigation policies? I'm well aware that you are referring to trials and not investigations and while there may be no mechanism to delay or stop a trial of a former president during an election season that doesn't mean I have any confidence that it will go forward anyway because we live in the loving hell world where the rich and powerful typically get away with their crimes and Trump always wiggles out of whatever legal trouble he's in so why would this be any different? There's not going to be any mechanism to stop a trial until they make one up for Trump it's as simple as that. But like I said before, I wish I had even 10% of the hope that you do.
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Mar 26, 2023 14:07
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Judge Schnoopy posted:Nobody is implying the trial would go on hiatus until election season is over. The implication is that this indictment will never see the light of day, the arrest warrant will never be issued, and the trial will never begin. Why would the DOJ bother doing all this investigation in the first place if they didn't plan to move forward with it? It's not like it's some big unexpected surprise that Trump is running again, nor is it shocking that it took a while to investigate - they had plenty of reason to expect that he would announce a new run before they could indict him.
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Mar 26, 2023 18:08
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Main Paineframe posted:Why would the DOJ bother doing all this investigation in the first place if they didn't plan to move forward with it? It's not like it's some big unexpected surprise that Trump is running again, nor is it shocking that it took a while to investigate - they had plenty of reason to expect that he would announce a new run before they could indict him. I think an indictment and trial is more likely than not at this point, but there are plenty of reasons, most of them being "the justice system isn't a monolith but is made of individual actors with complex motivations".
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Mar 26, 2023 18:18
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The reason they don't investigate is because it carries an implication of guilt that may influence an election and then result in no charges. Once you're at the trial stage they think the target is guilty and are trying to prove it, that consideration really doesn't apply.
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Mar 26, 2023 21:50
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Main Paineframe posted:Why would the DOJ bother doing all this investigation in the first place if they didn't plan to move forward with it? It's not like it's some big unexpected surprise that Trump is running again, nor is it shocking that it took a while to investigate - they had plenty of reason to expect that he would announce a new run before they could indict him. I'm in camp "Trump will go to jail" but goddamn if every turn of this saga hasn't ended in disappointment. Why would this stage suddenly start working on time with positive results when literally no other stage of the investigation has?
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Mar 27, 2023 00:08
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It seems like there is a little bit of movement in getting judges to stop putting up with his bullshit. The trial for his mortgage bank fraud poo poo in New York is supposed to start in October and he already tried to get it delayed and the judge promptly told him to gently caress off. His legal strategy is obviously delaying until he can be potentially president again and then you're back to the whole you can't arrest the president thing. cr0y fucked around with this message at 00:21 on Mar 27, 2023 |
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Mar 27, 2023 00:19
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Judge Schnoopy posted:I'm in camp "Trump will go to jail" but goddamn if every turn of this saga hasn't ended in disappointment. Why would this stage suddenly start working on time with positive results when literally no other stage of the investigation has? Sooner or later, the defendant runs out of time.
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Mar 27, 2023 03:42
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PainterofCrap posted:Sooner or later, the defendant runs out of time. Trump is 70 something years old and has been doing this poo poo since he could legally sign a document. How many more decades can the US as a functioning society hold together waiting for this to happen?
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Mar 27, 2023 03:54
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bird food bathtub posted:Trump is 70 something years old and has been doing this poo poo since he could legally sign a document. How many more decades can the US as a functioning society hold together waiting for this to happen? Are you assuming it's going to hold together after indictment and trial too? I think we're likely to see more violence, but I'm usually pessimistic and hope to be pleasantly surprised.
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Mar 27, 2023 05:12
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SamDabbers posted:Are you assuming it's going to hold together after indictment and trial too? I think we're likely to see more violence, but I'm usually pessimistic and hope to be pleasantly surprised. You’re going to have to suggest a better cause than “more violence” if you’re going to talk about America collapsing.
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Mar 27, 2023 23:29
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Judge Howell ruling that the DoJ evidence of Corcoran and Trumps conversations being “prima facie” evidence of criminal conduct BEFORE she actually got the contents of the conversations and the appellate court being like, “gently caress it we’re settling this before breakfast” has moved me fully into Trump will be indicted for at least obstruction in the documents matter if nothing else.
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Mar 28, 2023 03:31
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Murgos posted:Judge Howell ruling that the DoJ evidence of Corcoran and Trumps conversations being “prima facie” evidence of criminal conduct BEFORE she actually got the contents of the conversations and the appellate court being like, “gently caress it we’re settling this before breakfast” has moved me fully into Trump will be indicted for at least obstruction in the documents matter if nothing else. Yea I'm sort of in the same camp, piercing attorney client privilege is a huge deal let alone how high profile and sensitive this case is. Judges don't do that unless it's a black and white case of using your lawyer to further a crime.
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Mar 28, 2023 03:49
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cr0y posted:Yea I'm sort of in the same camp, piercing attorney client privilege is a huge deal let alone how high profile and sensitive this case is. And this is why you pay your white shoe firm lawyers folks! The bottom of the barrel is really deep.
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Mar 28, 2023 03:57
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