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I think the probes flow a little bit too heavily but if that what keeps this thread from becoming "NATO is the real badguy" and "the nukes are launching any second now" I understand. I do think the video restrictions are a bit of an overreaction and we shouldn't let a group of drama stirrers decide policy for the whole forum.
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Mar 30, 2023 13:58
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Kavros posted:https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/russia-detains-us-journalist-espionage-wall-street-journal-rcna77354 Is this going to prompt western outlets (or maybe companies in general) to pull most of their remaining people out of Russia?
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Mar 30, 2023 14:12
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cinci zoo sniper posted:You're correct in that this is not the appropriate thread to litigate a site-wide rule, and I think that it is plausible for your to see a discussion about it that you expect. While it depends on what version of the rule we get in the end, I think that the more plausible range of outcomes could affect any visual imagery where you could see a person getting severly hurt, tortured, dying, killed, or simply being dead already. Which could, depending on the precise wording, impact not only the war threads, but also TFR/GIP as subforums, all threads that post dash cams or OSHA stuff, all threads about American news, history threads discussing WW2 or whatever, sports accidents, and undoubtedly more things that I'm not immediately recalling. From what I've been told there is going to be 'nuance', so that it only bans non-GIP Ukraine war threads and videos of cops killing people, its intended victims.
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Mar 30, 2023 14:16
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Rinkles posted:Is this going to prompt western outlets (or maybe companies in general) to pull most of their remaining people out of Russia? There’s already a scant number of them remaining after the fake war news law from last March. That said, I would expect another tranche of journalists to depart the country. Companies not so much, however, since those that remain are clearly don’t give a poo poo.
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Mar 30, 2023 14:18
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Rinkles posted:Is this going to prompt western outlets (or maybe companies in general) to pull most of their remaining people out of Russia? Most likely not. Some journalists will probably leave to stay safe, but that's exactly what Russia wanted to accomplish. They don't want to ban foreign journalists, they want to create an environment that will pressure them to leave on their own accord. Companies who valued the Russian market enough to stay for the past year, will stay because the market is still there.
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Mar 30, 2023 14:20
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I am utterly perplexed by the idea that what SA needs is a sitewide rule that would be so broad that, for instance, the George Floyd recording couldn't be posted anywhere on the site. That really seems to utterly miss the mark on every level.
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Mar 30, 2023 14:27
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Herstory Begins Now posted:I am utterly perplexed by the idea that what SA needs is a sitewide rule that would be so broad that, for instance, the George Floyd recording couldn't be posted anywhere on the site. That really seems to utterly miss the mark on every level. Such a rule makes perfect sense if you support what's happening, however.
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Mar 30, 2023 14:44
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Antigravitas posted:Such a rule makes perfect sense if you support what's happening, however. Support what exactly?
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Mar 30, 2023 15:07
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Antigravitas posted:Such a rule makes perfect sense if you support what's happening, however. Vincent Van Goatse posted:Support what exactly? Don't.
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Mar 30, 2023 15:09
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Cinci I feel like a lot of the reason you have a reputation for being iron fisted in moderation here, and why people might not be posting as much, is that you often come across as unnecessarily abrasive when dealing with people. You sometimes add unnecessary threats to your warnings, you're brusque and short in responding to people, and when you disagree with someone's points it can feel like the atmosphere is crowding out any room for people to disagree with you or your points for fear of catching a sixer or more due to the first two reasons I mentioned. For example: cinci zoo sniper posted:Admin-imposed rules I'm obviously not placed to review. Hence, if you go on another meta rant to poo poo on other posters while still not providing any actionable feedback for this thread, I will send you into orbit. Like..okay. We know you have buttons. Your point wasn't unreasonable, nor was your enforcement. However, you can make your point without this kind of response that discourages people seeing it from responding because it makes you come off as a power-tripping button pusher who holds probations over peoples' heads like a posting Sword of Damocles. It is also strange that you want people to make effort posts but openly say yourself that you no longer wish to do the news summaries because people didn't read them. If people didn't read your effort posts, why would they read others? Did they read others, but not yours? Why or why not? Is it the type of effort post, or the content? The standard for posting in this thread is quite high, to the point where it appears to be too high for you yourself to meet. Saying things like this: cinci zoo sniper posted:Instead of accusing people of posting too poorly to satisfy your interests, you could be the poster who steps up and makes the post with that link. While also saying that you were wasting your time posting news roundups and the like, it seems counter productive and also counter-intuitive to your goals. I rarely post in here anymore (and this used to be my main posting thread for this topic) because I don't always want to post in an academic manner or catch a sixer every time I want to talk about something. It's exhausting. HonorableTB fucked around with this message at 15:28 on Mar 30, 2023 |
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Mar 30, 2023 15:24
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I think people are also pushing back against arbitrary admin-imposed rules that don't improve the site or foster discussion, but the opposite. "It's coming from the admins and I can't do anything about it" makes us mad because you're in a much stronger position to do something about it than the rest of us. Maybe you actually can't do anything about it, but at least understand our frustration.
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Mar 30, 2023 15:33
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HonorableTB posted:For example: Nelson Mandingo posted:an over-sensitive response to placate loud, aggressive, and unhinged posters HonorableTB posted:Cinci I feel like a lot of the reason you have a reputation for being iron fisted in moderation here, and why people might not be posting as much, is that you often come across as unnecessarily abrasive when dealing with people. You sometimes add unnecessary threats to your warnings, you're brusque and short in responding to people, and when you disagree with someone's points it can feel like the atmosphere is crowding out any room for people to disagree with you or your points for fear of catching a sixer or more due to the first two reasons I mentioned. HonorableTB posted:It is also strange that you want people to make effort posts but openly say yourself that you no longer wish to do the news summaries because people didn't read them. If people didn't read your effort posts, why would they read others? Did they read others, but not yours? Why or why not? Is it the type of effort post, or the content? The standard for posting in this thread is quite high, to the point where it appears to be too high for you yourself to meet. cinci zoo sniper fucked around with this message at 15:45 on Mar 30, 2023 |
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Mar 30, 2023 15:34
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cinci zoo sniper posted:If you have an example of a probation you don't understand, you can link it and we can discuss it while this runs. I don't want to overstate- it's only happened a couple of times that I can recall (I don't remember the specifics, sorry, I know that's not super useful).
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Mar 30, 2023 15:36
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This thread has IMO been consistently good and at this point combat footage just isn't that insightful, although I expect there will be exceptions in the future (NATO equipment supplied to Ukraine making battlefield debuts, footage proving that towns/cities are in Ukrainian hands).
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Mar 30, 2023 15:39
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HonorableTB posted:While also saying that you were wasting your time posting news roundups and the like, it seems counter productive and also counter-intuitive to your goals. Do you think it takes multiple hours of writing effort to post a single link with a 6-word question that was included in the post that quote concerns? How is this comparable to writing exhaustive summaries of multiple days of the news cycle on a strict schedule with no deviations? HonorableTB posted:I rarely post in here anymore (and this used to be my main posting thread for this topic) because I don't always want to post in an academic manner or catch a sixer every time I want to talk about something. It's exhausting. Point taken, but my interest in “academic posting” is to not see people ctrl+c ctrl+v the first lame meme they find on Twitter. As far as my moderation intent is concerned, the only guaranteed probations are for untagged  /  stuff, and for feuding with posters in this thread or elsewhere on SA.
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Mar 30, 2023 15:40
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Deteriorata posted:I think people are also pushing back against arbitrary admin-imposed rules that don't improve the site or foster discussion, but the opposite. It's perfectly fine to push back against admin rules, but D&D is not QCS, and doing that in D&D will just get the D&D thread gassed by admins. I have no interest in that happening, and I will act accordingly to prevent that. As for myself, I'm obviously not interested in, e.g., being under an obligation to ban people for posting the wrong article from the Human Rights Watch or the Financial Times. Since this is a conversation happening despite that, you may make your own conclusions about whether if I am in a meaningfully stronger position to do something about it than you are.
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Mar 30, 2023 15:54
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aphid_licker posted:I like the modding rules and the thread atmosphere they create. Worst case scenario you catch a sixer who cares DTurtle posted:This is my opinion as well. I feel like some people view getting a sixer for stuff is just short of a permaban, when it usually seems more of a slight slap on the wrist. Yeah if there's one thing I learned during my brief, lamentable term as a mod it's that there's actually a huge number of posters who view an "unjustified" (as they see it) six-hour probation as basically the worst insult imaginable. Also this, imo, Deteriorata posted:"It's coming from the admins and I can't do anything about it" makes us mad because you're in a much stronger position to do something about it than the rest of us. is an absolutely nutso opinion to have.
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Mar 30, 2023 15:54
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SixFigureSandwich posted:I think Turkey voting in favour of Finland and Sweden's accession of NATO is also a reason why he invited Putin - he really wants to keep projecting this image of neutrality (and/or continuing to keep both sides happy). Turkey is only voting on Finland. Sweden's application is still indefinitely stalled; Finland bailed on the "let's apply together" thing right after some Danish guy went and burned a Koran in front of the Turkish embassy, although the Sweden accession talks with Turkey weren't doing so hot before that either. Hungary also did not vote on Sweden.
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Mar 30, 2023 15:57
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I don't think combat footage should be blanket banned, although I honestly haven't clicked any NMS links myself since the first month of the war, and have no interest in watching soldiers blow each other up. I'm definitely for nuking "sick fites" responses, though. And I think this thread is valuable just as a non-American news aggregator. I find a lot of value in the EU/DE/etc. articles that are posted here, and I probably have more exposure to the European media perspective of the war than the American one at this point, since here we have the anodyne news networks that don't provide much useful information, and outside of them, anything beyond NYT/WaPo seems to devolve straight to THE WAR OF NATO AGGRESSION.
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Mar 30, 2023 15:57
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Moon Slayer posted:Yeah if there's one thing I learned during my brief, lamentable term as a mod it's that there's actually a huge number of posters who view an "unjustified" (as they see it) six-hour probation as basically the worst insult imaginable. Yeah, the team in-joke is that anger is inversely proportional to a probation duration. I've had like a dozen PMs long exchange over a sixer on multiple occasions, and we sometimes joke about testing like a 30-60 minute probation.
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Mar 30, 2023 15:59
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Saladman posted:Turkey is only voting on Finland. Sweden's application is still indefinitely stalled; Finland bailed on the "let's apply together" thing right after some Danish guy went and burned a Koran in front of the Turkish embassy, although the Sweden accession talks with Turkey weren't doing so hot before that either. Danish guy with known connections to Russia, funny that.
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Mar 30, 2023 16:05
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Maybe to retry from a different angle. My theory, from the outcome of the summaries experiment, is that a non-trivial number of posters does basically scroll past posts that don't have Twitter or YouTube embeds in them. I think that I am to blame for that, by endorsing and promoting that posting style through much of the posts made last year, and I would like to attempt to fix that, starting with asking everyone to write a sentence or two of their own for every link they post. Even if the theory is wrong, that would still be good posting hygiene for all of us, which is why we will be moving in that direction. The other, less clearly separated part of that conversation, is my disinterest in doing news aggregation on my own on a regular basis, as a poster. This doesn't mean that I'm disinterested in posting news (I haven't done so much recently since I'm very busy IRL until summer), or that I expect someone else to be the thread news editor now. This means that for a steady stream of interesting news and updates from Twitter, Telegram, and elsewhere in the community, an (uncoordinated) group effort will be the most likely outcome to see that happen. cinci zoo sniper fucked around with this message at 16:56 on Mar 30, 2023 |
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Mar 30, 2023 16:20
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Someone on the inside leaked a huge trove of documents from NTC Vulkan, a Russian "contractor" that does cybercrimes, Edit: Actually it was leaked to a reporter from Süddeutsche Zeitung first and then provided to Der Spiegel et all. Here's a non-paywalled Washington Post article about it. The lede: quote:Russian intelligence agencies worked with a Moscow-based defense contractor to strengthen their ability to launch cyberattacks, sow disinformation and surveil sections of the internet, according to thousands of pages of confidential corporate documents. Moon Slayer fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Mar 30, 2023 |
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Mar 30, 2023 16:21
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cinci zoo sniper posted:Maybe to retry from a different angle. don't post links without commentary has been a D&D wide rule for years and maybe my memory is poo poo but I'm pretty sure it is extremely not a regular occurrence in here? E: clicking a page at random, https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=4014579&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=262 that seems to be pretty much exactly how links should be presented according to d&d standards and rules (barring stuff that requires significant additional contextualization or w/e) Herstory Begins Now fucked around with this message at 16:48 on Mar 30, 2023 |
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Mar 30, 2023 16:44
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Herstory Begins Now posted:don't post links without commentary has been a D&D wide rule for years and maybe my memory is poo poo but I'm pretty sure it is extremely not a regular occurrence in here? It is a rule, you're right. I had it implicitly waived for this thread, which was a subject of run-ins between me and other D&D mods when they would check in with a report and enforce it. If I were to enforce the rule consistently, it would be been a top-3 probation reason filed by me at the lightest, there's been quite a bit of it historically, actually. Edit: You'd have to click back further, to like last summer/spring. What I'm trying to speak of is that I think I've established some unhelpful top-level expectations/assumptions.
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Mar 30, 2023 16:49
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Saladman posted:
There were some new about Hungary voting on Sweden a few days ago. Reuters reported on it yesterday. Officially Orban and his ilk are angry about being called out on their fash-politics by Sweden. quote:BUDAPEST, March 29 (Reuters) - Hungary is holding up Sweden's admission to NATO because of grievances over criticism by Stockholm of Prime Minister Viktor Orban's policies, the Hungarian government spokesman said on Wednesday. https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/hungary-says-grievances-hold-up-ratification-swedens-nato-accession-2023-03-29/
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Mar 30, 2023 16:49
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Nothing particularly new but the Guardian have an article looking at civilians who won't leave the front line. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/mar/30/ukrainian-parents-hiding-their-children-in-basements-in-frontline-cities
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Mar 30, 2023 16:56
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I do miss people posting relevant articles and tweets as I personally don't feel inclined to use Twitter on a regular basis, and this thread was great for getting updates and links to articles/interviews that I would otherwise miss out on. The GBS thread has a lot of white noise and gets easily distracted by low-effort trolls and forums drama which is why I prefer this thread, but lately there haven't been as many links to relevant updates and I think huge update posts are hard to discuss since they're a bit overwhelming. It's hard for me to be the change I want to see in the world since this thread was my way of getting discussion and updates without the white-noise of GBS and the general terribleness of Twitter, so my relationship to the content has been almost strictly parasitic.
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Mar 30, 2023 17:43
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This is kinda interesting --- an article on translation of Jewish religious texts into Ukrainian (focused on the Haggadah, the Passover text in particular), as one of the many cultural effects of the war. https://www.timesofisrael.com/the-first-passover-haggadah-in-ukrainian-marks-a-communitys-break-with-russia/
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Mar 30, 2023 18:09
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I'm one of those people that just scrolls past posts without Twitter embeds because it's just too much to read otherwise. I stopped reading every post and only read the relevant page +/- a few pages if the discussion pertaining to some tweet was interesting enough. I just don't have time to read every post that has a wall of text and the Twitter embeds with the pictures and such help break things up into easy to read chunks for when I'm browsing just to pass a few minutes here and there.
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Mar 30, 2023 18:13
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Boris Galerkin posted:I'm one of those people that just scrolls past posts without Twitter embeds because it's just too much to read otherwise. I stopped reading every post and only read the relevant page +/- a few pages if the discussion pertaining to some tweet was interesting enough. I just don't have time to read every post that has a wall of text and the Twitter embeds with the pictures and such help break things up into easy to read chunks for when I'm browsing just to pass a few minutes here and there. That's basically 90% of the people who read this thread, myself included.
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Mar 30, 2023 18:45
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e: never mind
buglord fucked around with this message at 19:31 on Mar 30, 2023 |
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Mar 30, 2023 19:19
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Antigravitas posted:https://www.derstandard.de/story/2000145047246/selenskyj-rede-fpoe-verlaesst-geschlossen-den-saal-zahlreiche-leere-plaetze Have you tried Deepl to translate some of this stuff? I've found it to be significantly better than any other translator.
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Mar 30, 2023 19:26
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buglord posted:e: never mind Fwiw that was a normal feedback post, not sure why you deleted it.
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Mar 30, 2023 19:41
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Have a long twitter thread on railway bridge repair https://twitter.com/507stre/status/1641488115683536905
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Mar 30, 2023 19:43
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buglord posted:e: never mind There's srsly nothing to be scared of, worst case you can't post for 6h. You can even continue to read all the posts.
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Mar 30, 2023 19:45
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cinci edit: loitering munition deployment https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1641474481276301324 I think it was noted by Perun among others that some weapons systems were uniquely quiet amongst the frontline media and the switchblade was one of them so kinda interesting to see them deployed in some fashion. (Could be training, could be psyops, you know the usual disclaimers) There is a video, as far as I saw it freeze framed before impact, I apologize if that is in error. Somebody fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Mar 30, 2023 |
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Mar 30, 2023 19:47
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cinci zoo sniper posted:Fwiw that was a normal feedback post, not sure why you deleted it. I’m a timid poster lol, but also I thought it was redundant. Unrelated, fingers crossed Finland gets in. I hope the door isn’t shut forever for Sweden, though im curious if they are at the same level of danger Finland is is despite not sharing a land border with Russia.
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Mar 30, 2023 19:48
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buglord posted:I’m a timid poster lol, but also I thought it was redundant. Unrelated, fingers crossed Finland gets in. I hope the door isn’t shut forever for Sweden, though im curious if they are at the same level of danger Finland is is despite not sharing a land border with Russia. The only real potential target in Sweden is Gotland, which would require a serious naval invasion which would probably be far beyond their current capabilities. The risk/reward isn't really there either, it'd mainly be useful for an invasion of the Baltic states. There could potentially be cyberattacks, but the ones Russia has been running since the NATO application have been really weak. poor waif fucked around with this message at 19:59 on Mar 30, 2023 |
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Mar 30, 2023 19:56
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TescoBag posted:Have you tried Deepl to translate some of this stuff? I've found it to be significantly better than any other translator. That is deepl. It does okay with German German, but Austrian German plus lots of Konjunktiv produces results that need to be touched up a lot. Translating this article only needed slight changes: https://taz.de/Kriegsverbrechen-und-Armenien/!5921600/ quote:Putin's fear of The Hague Armenia's position in this is honestly just tragic. It is nominally on Team Russia, but only because Azerbaijan is on Team Turkey, and its geographic situation is perilous. Armenia is seriously proper hosed with very little room to manoeuvre.
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Mar 30, 2023 20:03
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