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Zamujasa posted:it's incredibly trivial to craft a narrative that makes absolute sense, what are you talking about? That narrative doesn't make sense. If a hypothetical trans person were violently lashing out against legislative oppression, they'd probably target a lobbyist group, not an elementary school. As someone else said a bit earlier in the thread, there is no good and plausible reason to shoot up a class of elementary schoolers that makes any sort of sense.
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Mar 30, 2023 21:26
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Biden is still refusing to negotiate over the debt ceiling and McCarthy says that Republicans will just pass their own debt ceiling bill with all the cuts they want over and over until the Senate accepts and Biden signs it. McCarthy says they won't send a clean bill to raise the debt ceiling and will try to blame the Senate for a default until Biden agrees to negotiate or accepts their bill. Well if the dumbass wants to drive pedal to the metal into the brick wall to reach the cliff on the other side...yeah, sure. I guess being known as the idiot who finally kicked off the Second Great Depression by sending America into default and making the entire world banking system collapse is one way to get your name into the history books.
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Mar 30, 2023 21:35
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Alkydere posted:Well if the dumbass wants to drive pedal to the metal into the brick wall to reach the cliff on the other side...yeah, sure. Pretty sure the people who own the History Book factory already have the chapter of how this was actually something Biden kicked off written and ready to print.
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Mar 30, 2023 21:41
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Main Paineframe posted:That narrative doesn't make sense. If a hypothetical trans person were violently lashing out against legislative oppression, they'd probably target a lobbyist group, not an elementary school. we already know that the shooter in this case has ties to the school and apparently attended. "christians" are also some of the most outspoken anti trans people. it really is not hard to come up with a plausible motive. it also doesn't have to be perfectly sound, because as you point out, you have to be deranged in the first place to go shooting up a school.
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Mar 30, 2023 21:42
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Yes, I know it doesn't make any kind of sense. After about the 500th time having to correct whatever dumbshit filtered out to local news about anything having to do with trans people, and I live in fuckin' New England, I've stopped expecting any kind of floor to what Joe Blow will think is plausible.
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Mar 30, 2023 21:49
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Zamujasa posted:we already know that the shooter in this case has ties to the school and apparently attended. "christians" are also some of the most outspoken anti trans people. Unfortunately, it's not perfectly symmetric, in that the counter stochastic violence just furthers the fascists' goals, because they are the ones prepared to exploit the event to increase fear of the out group.
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Mar 30, 2023 21:53
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Zamujasa posted:we already know that the shooter in this case has ties to the school and apparently attended. "christians" are also some of the most outspoken anti trans people. If she shot up the school because they abused her for being trans, then she didn't shoot up the school due to "gender ideology", she shot it up because she was abused. Yeah, it's easy to come up with a motive that's plausible to people who are actively trying to buy into right-wing framing, but there's not really a whole lot that can be done about that. When it comes to the Nashville case, the issue is that even though the authorities have her manifesto and all of her other writings and planning materials, they're dripfeeding out info of dubious credibility over a period of days, so that rather than getting a clear and accurate picture out in the first place, they're leaving people to speculate with incomplete facts. For example, cops quickly stated that the shooter was trans and a former student at the school, and didn't take long to claim that the attack was "planned and targeted". But we learned yesterday evening that the shooter had originally targeted public non-Christian schools, but settled on Covenant because it had less security. Moreover, we also learned that police think the shooter had also been planning to shoot up a local mall and kill "certain family members". quote:Nashville Council Member Robert Swope told The New York Post that the FBI’s Behavioral Analysis Unit (BAU) is working with the Metro Nashville Police Department (MNPD) to carry out “a very in-depth analysis” of both the manifesto and “certain aspects of the shooter’s life” as they investigate what led up to the horrific mass murder. Moreover, we also know that the suspect was receiving mental health treatment, and that the suspect's family had been pressuring them to sell their guns because the family "felt that she should not own weapons". quote:Prior to Monday’s massacre, Hale had been able to legally purchase seven firearms – despite receiving mental health treatment at the time.
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Mar 30, 2023 22:07
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Lots of people interested in gossip over a murderer. Everyone will head to their usual talking points and “centrists” will continue to shrug and say “someone should do something”. Publicizing the manifesto of a murderer doesn’t do anyone good and wouldn’t provide closure.
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Mar 30, 2023 22:12
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Grand Jury has voted to indict Trump on criminal charges.quote:A Manhattan grand jury voted to indict Donald J. Trump on Thursday for his role in paying hush money to a porn star, according to four people with knowledge of the matter, a historic development that will shake up the 2024 presidential race and forever mark him as the nation’s first former president to face criminal charges. https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/03/30/nyregion/trump-indictment-news
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Mar 30, 2023 22:32
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CNN reporting NY grand jury has voted to indict trump.
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Mar 30, 2023 22:32
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Beaten hard. Still happy.
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Mar 30, 2023 22:33
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Grand Jury has voted to indict Trump on criminal charges.  how long until his supporters do another Big Dumb
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Mar 30, 2023 22:35
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hopefully this time "ah! well. nevertheless," will finally be put to rest
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Mar 30, 2023 22:36
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Main Paineframe posted:If she shot up the school because they abused her for being trans, then she didn't shoot up the school due to "gender ideology", she shot it up because she was abused. Am I the only one who feels uncomfortable that so many people are referring to Hale as being a transman, while at the same time, using "she" to refer to him? It's a hard topic for me to bring up, because I don't want it to sound like I'm defending a school shooter, and I know it sounds like that. But I feel like when we people do this, it supports the narrative that, say, AFAB people who identify as men aren't really men, they're just mentally deranged deviants. If having your gender identity be respected is a fundamental human right, then being trans can't be something we have to earn through being a model citizen. And it can't be lost because the person is a criminal, even a child killer. Is it because people just don't feel there is enough evidence that Hale was really trans? From what I've read, there are multiple sources ranging from online stuff, people who knew him, and the goodbye text where Hale referred to himself as "Aiden", and was also entered into that friend's phone as "Aiden". I'm sorry if it feels like I'm taking this all out on you, Main Paineframe. You probably just aren't sure? But as a transperson myself, this year has ALREADY been horrifying, and now it's blowing up way worse and it just feels like this is a societal flashpoint where for the first time in years, a major person in the news who seems to identify as trans isn't having their gender, name, or pronouns respected by the press or the discourse and that reversal is very scary.
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Mar 30, 2023 22:36
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Grand Jury has voted to indict Trump on criminal charges. Announcement Bin Laden style. "Ladies and Gentlemen... We've got him.. er.. indicted him." yes, I know nothing matters, weakest bit of mycrimes.txt he's done, yadda yadda yadda. Let me enjoy this moment,
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Mar 30, 2023 22:43
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SirFozzie posted:Announcement Bin Laden style. Hell, pop a cold beverage and savor it.
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Mar 30, 2023 22:46
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hahahahahahaahahahaha
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Mar 30, 2023 22:47
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Farking Bastage posted:hahahahahahaahahahaha
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Mar 30, 2023 22:49
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Wow, trump got indicted. All I can think of is a line from super troopers: "Are you ready for the fun part? Because here comes the fun part!"
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Mar 30, 2023 22:50
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Even with those charges I still see him mopping the floor with DeSantis next year He'll just cry that he's the victim and his supporters will ignore the charges
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Mar 30, 2023 22:53
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XboxPants posted:Am I the only one who feels uncomfortable that so many people are referring to Hale as being a transman, while at the same time, using "she" to refer to him? Sorry, my mistake. When I first started writing that post, I was consciously trying to focus on using "the shooter" and gender-neutral pronouns because the authorities have been very unclear about the specifics of that (which, by itself, is another issue with the dripfeeding - they confirmed the shooter being trans right away, but it took days for a consensus to emerge on whether "Audrey" was the deadname or the real name). However, I rewrote basically the entire post a couple times while digging through sources and trying to settle on an argument to pursue, and apparently I totally forgot about the prononus while revising stuff and accidentally slipped into the framing the authorities have been using. My bad.
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Mar 30, 2023 22:53
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I doubt that anything from this indictment sticks in any real way, but it is very funny.
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Mar 30, 2023 22:53
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lol. lmao.
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Mar 30, 2023 22:56
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Well I guess the "Trump won't be indicted because no one will take the unprecedented act of indicting a former president" argument goes out the window for the other cases. 
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Mar 30, 2023 22:57
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Trump's 2024 campaign has put out a short statement:quote:Donald Trump was the victim of an extortion plot, yet he is the one being prosecuted. Says they will be releasing a full statement announcing how they plan to respond soon.
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Mar 30, 2023 22:57
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So what's next? Is the possibility of Trump being arrested, let alone brought to court or even prison, thinkable right now? I really doubt this is going to amount to much, I don't see a warrant being sent out for Trump, but hey who knows
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Mar 30, 2023 22:58
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Youremother posted:So what's next? Is the possibility of Trump being arrested, let alone brought to court or even prison, thinkable right now? I really doubt this is going to amount to much, I don't see a warrant being sent out for Trump, but hey who knows If he is indicted, then he will have to be arrested and booked. He will likely be allowed to surrender on his own, though. They won't issue a warrant unless he skips court.
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Mar 30, 2023 23:00
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Main Paineframe posted:Sorry, my mistake. It's cool! I'm unsure about it, myself. Especially after the other shooter who pretended to be non-binary. From what I've seen Hale does seem to have identifying as a transman, but it seemed like they were still comfortable with either Audrey or Aiden. Ugh it's such a mess. But hey, good news! I hope they respect Trump's request to bring him in with an orange jumpsuit and handcuffs and do a full perp walk.
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Mar 30, 2023 23:00
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This is good but a part of me has to go "really? The first one?"
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Mar 30, 2023 23:01
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:If he is indicted, then he will have to be arrested and booked. He will likely be allowed to surrender on his own, though. The man loves attention more than anything else, so I could see him refusing to turn himself in to force a dramatic arrest.
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Mar 30, 2023 23:03
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The rhetoric that the five were just spouting on Fox news was insane.
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Mar 30, 2023 23:07
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Trump was apparently caught off guard entirely by this per the Maggie Haberman in the NYT article live updatequote:Trump is at Mar-a-Lago absorbing this information, according to aides. It’s not clear what his next move will be. Trump aides were caught off guard by this happening today, according to several people close to the former president. They had believed reports by some news outlets that the grand jury in Manhattan was not hearing the Trump case. Some advisers had been confident that there would be no movement until the end of April at the earliest and were looking at the political implications for Trump’s closest potential rival, Gov. Ron DeSantis of Florida. also lol https://twitter.com/SebastianMurdoc/status/1641555934383095809
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Mar 30, 2023 23:08
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Mike Pence has a pre-scheduled live interview on CNN tonight a 9 pm. That probably just got a lot more exciting.
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Mar 30, 2023 23:09
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Like a 100% chance he hops on a private jet and skips the country, right?
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Mar 30, 2023 23:10
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coelomate posted:The man loves attention more than anything else, so I could see him refusing to turn himself in to force a dramatic arrest. He's said that he wants to be handcuffed lol. Which honestly I think will backfire big time as he could easily go too far and affect the other impending cases.
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Mar 30, 2023 23:10
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Grand Jury has voted to indict Trump on criminal charges. Something... matters? 
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Mar 30, 2023 23:13
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It's going to be interesting to see if Trump will come out of this looking more like a martyr or a weakling. It really could go either way, the only thing I can't see is amounting to very little
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Mar 30, 2023 23:13
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Mike Pence has a pre-scheduled live interview on CNN tonight a 9 pm. That probably just got a lot more exciting. BREAKING: Former Vice President Mike Pence sets world record for world's long "Uhh..." in response to CNN interview questions, 4 hours 38 minutes... and counting!
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Mar 30, 2023 23:14
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Youth Decay posted:He's said that he wants to be handcuffed lol. That Sideshow Bob speech where he confesses to all his crimes to brag about how good he is at getting away with stuff.
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Mar 30, 2023 23:14
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Doctor Yiff posted:Like a 100% chance he hops on a private jet and skips the country, right? No. He’ll get taken through a back door, processed without cameras present, released on his own recognizance, and start fundraising off of it.
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Mar 30, 2023 23:14
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