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Saltpowered posted:The judge cannot disbar them. The judge can refer them to the ethics board for that. Given the amount of work they didn't do, that doesn't seem like much of a consequence. Thanks for the answer though, even if it's less than heartening.
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 14:43 |
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# ? May 31, 2024 06:09 |
Wiggly Wayne DDS posted:it's not mentioned in the decision but Karagounis was also pro se lol that does seem pretty easily distinguishing!!
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 14:47 |
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I actually pulled up the case. It doesn't say what Martin claims. It's a different procedural posture. In fact, the case itself seems to pretty clearly state that a lawyer is in trouble if they know what they're filing is baseless. quote:Texas Rule of Civil Procedure 13 dictates that in signing a pleading, motion, or other paper, counsel certifies that he read the document and that the allegations contained in it are, to the best of his knowledge, neither 1) groundless and brought in bad faith or 2) groundless and brought for the purposes of harassment. Monroe v. Grider, 884 S.W.2d at 817; McCain v. NME Hosp., Inc., 856 S.W.2d 751, 757 (Tex. App.--Dallas 1993, no writ). This rule serves to "check abuses in the pleading process, i.e. to insure that at the time the challenged pleading was filed the litigant's position was factually well grounded and legally tenable." Home Owners Funding Corp. v. Scheppler, 815 S.W.2d 884, 889 (Tex. App.--Corpus Christi 1991, no writ). In other words, what Rule 13 regulates is the signing and filing of groundless pleadings in bad faith or for purposes of harassment, not the pursuit of an [**8] action later determined to be groundless after pleadings were filed. As much is revealed in the rule itself when it declares that "if a pleading, motion or other paper is signed in violation of this rule, the court . . . shall impose an appropriate sanction . . . ." TEX. R. CIV. P. 13 (emphasis added). It says nothing about levying sanctions if one pursues an action or pleading thought legitimate when filed but subsequently found baseless. As a result, the circumstances pivotal to the determination of whether sanctions should issue are those in existence at the time the pleading in question was signed and filed. Monroe v. Grider, 884 S.W.2d at 817; Campos v. Ysleta Gen. Hosp., Inc., 879 S.W.2d 67, 71 (Tex. App.--El Paso 1994, writ denied); McCain v. NME Hosp., Inc., 856 S.W.2d at 757; Home Owners Funding Corp. v. Scheppler, 815 S.W.2d at 889. It seems like that would absolutely allow for sanctions in the present case because the motion for new trial was filed in bad faith with outright fabrications that could be shown by trivial evaluation of the docket.
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 16:58 |
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Mr. Nice! posted:It seems like that would absolutely allow for sanctions in the present case because the motion for new trial was filed in bad faith with outright fabrications that could be shown by trivial evaluation of the docket. But a lawyer of his standing filed it. It's weird how Jones and Trump seem to have this field of negative competency that affects lawyers. I know it's probably just because they can't get a competent lawyer, but it also seems like formerly competent people just become incompetent around them. I'm sure it's that they won't listen to the attorney and just demand they do this or that but it still seems kind of strange to me.
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 18:15 |
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I think it's probably a combination of both. A terrible lawyer might be able to skate by with reasonable clients, and a competent lawyer might say no to unreasonable demands, but when the incompetent lawyer follows through with the unreasonable demands poo poo gets wild.
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 19:10 |
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my guess would be that lawyers are only as good as the people under them and they get greedy and refuse to hire the good people so they can keep more money and this happens
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 19:14 |
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Welp, seems like no video https://mobile.twitter.com/speechwrs/status/1644052452809777153 Piell fucked around with this message at 20:04 on Apr 6, 2023 |
# ? Apr 6, 2023 20:01 |
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yeah we only had a feed yesterday as bankston's clients requested one to view remotely but the court's open for anyone real shame as we'll miss the minutae of reynal and martin's legal attempts, but we should get a good enough summary from that account they handled yesterday fine
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 20:10 |
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pseudanonymous posted:But a lawyer of his standing filed it. my guess is he (foolishly) relied on reynal for the facts rather than reviewing the record himself
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 20:10 |
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evilweasel posted:my guess is he (foolishly) relied on reynal for the facts rather than reviewing the record himself
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 20:15 |
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rather than embedding every tweet and breaking the thread here's speechwrs account from inside the courtroom today, hashtags trimmed:speechwrs posted:Waiting for the court reporter to walk through the door. And here she is. Judge will be on the bench in a few minutes. Wiggly Wayne DDS fucked around with this message at 22:47 on Apr 6, 2023 |
# ? Apr 6, 2023 21:31 |
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Sp could someone more fluent in legalese summarize what's been said so far in that Twitter? I think I understand most of it, but want to make sure.
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 21:40 |
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Pity that they aren’t getting sanctions for the motion for a new trial. They’ll still get stuck with attorneys fees for Bankston and some other sanctions but no real monetary consequences. Hopefully they’ll get some sort of Ethics referral.
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 21:48 |
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continuing on from speechwrs account from inside the courtroom today, hashtags trimmed:speechwrs posted:Court reporter is back. Judge back. Plaintiffs' bankruptcy attorney on the stand.
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 22:59 |
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Them arguing "lack of specific detail" is pretty funny.
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# ? Apr 6, 2023 23:53 |
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Wiggly Wayne DDS posted:continuing on from speechwrs account from inside the courtroom today, hashtags trimmed: Thanks for posting all this. Very interesting.
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# ? Apr 7, 2023 01:55 |
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https://twitter.com/MoString/status/1644440362205757440 Alex Jones's Attorneys Filed a Hot Mess of a Motion but No New Sanctions Awarded Piell fucked around with this message at 21:56 on Apr 7, 2023 |
# ? Apr 7, 2023 21:42 |
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Alas, I do not subscribe to Hot Dockets, so I cannot read this
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# ? Apr 8, 2023 03:31 |
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p boss name for a legal blog, tho
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# ? Apr 8, 2023 03:39 |
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When does any part of this farce wind up before a judge with a god damned backbone?
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# ? Apr 8, 2023 04:22 |
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I feel weird copy pasting from here but I think it's ok to say Morgan stringer content is now free. https://mobile.twitter.com/MoString/status/1645533201367023618
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# ? Apr 10, 2023 23:02 |
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For the lazy of us, https://morganstringer.substack.com/p/alex-joness-attorneys-filed-a-hot The most relevant portion for me: quote:I believe that Judge Guerra-Gamble did not order sanctions here because these motions for a new trial are routine, and she did not want to give anyone the chance to say that she was too harsh on the Defendants in the Heslin v. Jones case. However, she was not pleased. Volmarias fucked around with this message at 23:21 on Apr 10, 2023 |
# ? Apr 10, 2023 23:10 |
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I forgot about the genesis of Lord Gribble Pibble of the Scribble Scrabble.
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 03:06 |
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Volmarias posted:For the lazy of us, https://morganstringer.substack.com/p/alex-joness-attorneys-filed-a-hot Can I just ask what the hell it actually takes for the judges to put their foot down? The judges in Alex Jones' cases kept treating him with kid gloves so they "couldn't be accused of being mean to him" despite all the bullshit he kept doing and saying about them, the defendants in this case files what amounted to 60 pages of pure nonsense and outright lies, as actual lawyers. It's just infuriating how they've turned the entire legal system into an outright joke at this point.
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 05:57 |
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Randalor posted:Can I just ask what the hell it actually takes for the judges to put their foot down? The judges in Alex Jones' cases kept treating him with kid gloves so they "couldn't be accused of being mean to him" despite all the bullshit he kept doing and saying about them, the defendants in this case files what amounted to 60 pages of pure nonsense and outright lies, as actual lawyers. It's just infuriating how they've turned the entire legal system into an outright joke at this point. ('Always has been' meme goes here)
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 06:00 |
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Think of it like a game, the judge is taking a minor amount of damage to be in a better position to deal a major blow The rougher the judge is, the more angles there are for appeals and complaints and whatnot. They're trying to be impossibly forgiving to make the legal nukes as appeal-proof as possible
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 06:02 |
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The Pop Team Epic "Your motherfucking life ends [x amount of time] from now" meme except that time never loving arrives because they never actually punish them for their bullshit. I lust for Alex Jones and his lawyers to be destitute and living beneath bridges.
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 06:06 |
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Sentient Data posted:Think of it like a game, the judge is taking a minor amount of damage to be in a better position to deal a major blow lol
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 06:23 |
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The punishment is losing.
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 12:02 |
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Sentient Data posted:Think of it like a game, the judge is taking a minor amount of damage to be in a better position to deal a major blow The anger comes from Jones getting this kid gloves "we have to be careful he can afford to fight back" treatment while a normal person gets told to go gently caress themselves right out of the gate, is then brutalized by the system the entire way through, suffering punishments and losses every step of the way whether innocent or not even if they fully comply. When a normal person hears five to six figure fines and ten times that in lawyer fees they're hosed right from the start and never even get to have this kind of "fair" treatment. They're just hosed. Meanwhile Jones gets to be a colossal belligerent rear end in a top hat for years and suffer no meaningful change in his standard of living. (And honestly probably none afterwards either.) Tell this "the Judge is charging up their spirit bomb" poo poo to a person who loses their job and then home to pre-trial detention on suspicion of driving while black before hearing "Oops wrong person."
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 12:41 |
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I'm not disagreeing, but Jones isn't in criminal court for any of these cases IIRC. They don't have the power to jail him.
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 12:44 |
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Yeah. It sucks, but there are historical cases where a judge let their mask slip a teeny tiny bit and then the person was able to (at least eventually) overturn their harsh punishment. I mentioned Jim Bakker before and his case is actually a good example of this. From Wikipedia: quote:The United States Court of Appeals for the Fourth Circuit upheld Bakker's conviction on the fraud and conspiracy charges, voided Bakker's 45-year sentence and $500,000 fine and ordered a new sentencing hearing in February 1991.[50] The court ruled that Potter's sentencing statement about Bakker, that "those of us who do have a religion are sick of being saps for money-grubbing preachers and priests",[51] was evidence that the judge had injected his religious beliefs into Bakker's sentence.[50] If it hadn't been for that statement he might still be rotting away in jail instead of out doing almost exactly what got him put in jail in the first place, and richer than anyone in this thread is. It's undeniably stupid as hell, but this kind of thing is exactly what they're trying to avoid, and unfortunately that does mean different treatment for someone who's perceived to have means and legal resources at their disposal (they're more likely to treat poorer defendants like poo poo because they don't have the resources to hire lawyers who'll do the legwork required, because getting this kind of stuff overturned does require a ton of legal work and a lot of money as a result).
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 12:54 |
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Jones owes more than a billion with a b dollars, far more than he'll ever earn. He's also been publicly embarrassed which may not seem like it's impacting him but it's probably making him feel extra lovely all the time. He's not a happy man and he probably never will be again. On top of that he's also very stupid and the longer this goes on the more likely it becomes that he'll do something unquestionably get-thrown-in-jail illegal like shooting at someone or something. Right now one of his lovely lawyers is getting publicly humiliated (which is going to be a bigger deal to him than Jones, since people have to want to hire him) and is probably going to eat a fine that wouldn't be much to Jones but is very much going to hurt for a lawyer who is suddenly struggling to get clients.
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 13:01 |
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Jones is better off than some people (even just looking at civil court) because he can afford representation even if his representation is a bunch of stupid assholes. I’m not an expert but I’m pretty sure even they’re still better than nothing.
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 13:11 |
univbee posted:
guess who was recently a guest on Alex's show
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 13:16 |
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Pirate Radar posted:Jones is better off than some people (even just looking at civil court) because he can afford representation even if his representation is a bunch of stupid assholes. I’m not an expert but I’m pretty sure even they’re still better than nothing. I dunno. Nothing wouldn't email opposing council all the evidence you were hiding from them
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 13:48 |
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I deliberated for a while before posting that because they’re pretty bad but he would more likely than not still have done worse if he represented himself, and he always has the option of blaming the loss on them for being bad lawyers.
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 13:51 |
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Papa Was A Video Toaster posted:I'm not disagreeing, but Jones isn't in criminal court for any of these cases IIRC. They don't have the power to jail him. Still wild that what he did to Sandy Hook parents isn't illegal
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 14:01 |
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Outrail posted:Still wild that what he did to Sandy Hook parents isn't illegal Now you know why the one father started a company that files DMCA takedown notices to get conspiracy videos delisted. It's the only thing that actually works since only companies and their rights matter anymore.
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 17:20 |
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# ? May 31, 2024 06:09 |
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Outrail posted:Still wild that what he did to Sandy Hook parents isn't illegal
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# ? Apr 11, 2023 17:30 |