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A dude ran over 100kms during Star Wars Celebration 2023 wearing Stormtrooper armor. He raised a bucket load of money for Make-A-Wish and Spread-A-Smile. Which is awesome. The fact that there would even be a question on if he's a visible minority bashing fash rear end in a top hat bigot because of the cosplay he's wearing is actually hosed up and I wish you all the best.
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Apr 11, 2023 18:20
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Eiba posted:Butterfly Valley, I think you're missing why your posts are getting pushback. I think you can fairly say that a guy dressed as a stormtrooper is, on balance, probably not a Nazi. But that's not what this conversation is about. It's about how Nazi imagery affects people. You're trying to say that everything is fine and they should not worry, but you are just objectively wrong about that. Whatever acceptance has been won over the years has been accompanied by a terrifying backlash. There are modern fascists attempting to leverage hate against trans people into political power. That didn't exist 40 years ago when people largely didn't know what trans people were. I grew up as a black kid born in the 70s, so I definitely get being *wary* around people constantly, possibly more than most since I've been doing it longer than most, and it's not like Trumpism being a direct counter to a black guy being president meant that the country thought better of black people than gay/trans people. I can actually empathize a ton with the idea but stormtroopers are kind of a weird hill to die on because their cultural impact and recognizability override the film reading. Culturally, they pretty much come off as dork-villain redshirts, and most people don't look much deeper. And, once again, lots of minorities and LGBT people cosplay as Stormtroopers specifically because they can "perfectly" portray a masked character from their beloved series while dorks online will make fun of them if they're trans-Indian Luke Skywalker or something. You literally have no idea who is under that outfit because it covers everything, so I'm not going to default make an assumption there. It's not quite dressing up as Calvin Candie with a Confederate flag cape levels of social flagging.
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Apr 11, 2023 18:24
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Eiba posted:I don't know where I personally come down on the issue. As a kid I thought the white helmets were cool. The officers in their grey outfits read as Nazis to me and seemed like assholes (British accents helped), and Darth Vader was obviously a bad guy, but the stormtrooper armor never sunk in as being Nazi-esque. It was just neat. I never really got what it was supposed to look like. I can imagine someone who felt that way carrying an innocent affection for that armor into adulthood. But I would also never be critical of someone having a negative reaction to the connotations, because those fascist connotations are real and deliberate, regardless of the intent of the cosplayer. I mean I know you post in the One Piece thread, would you suspect someone of being a cop if they said their favorite character was a Marine because the Marines are explicitly a military force protecting the elite? I'm not really coming at you I agree it's a complicated subject, but there are reasons for people (even queer people and POC) to relate to the bad guy over the good guy.
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Apr 11, 2023 18:28
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Rappaport posted:This is a searing hot take, but no one was discussing banning cosplay, just whether it has emotional ramifications for people. Which, you know, most actions tend to have. Eiba posted:Slasher movie villains were brought up as an absurd counter example, but honestly, it would be in really bad taste to dress as one if you knew you were going to hang out with someone who had a loved one traumatically murdered. The difference is that there are a lot more people affected by the political hate of fascists than people personally affected by murderers.
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Apr 11, 2023 18:40
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Eiba posted:It doesn't matter to the original anecdote if that particular cosplayer was personally a fascist. They were evoking a force that is absolutely real and current and targeting the OP I think this is the particular sticking point because the connection between stormtrooper imagery and supporting fascist causes is, to me, an absolutely baseless leap. Their design was also strongly influenced by samurai armour and long ago became such an instantly recognisable pop culture icon totally separate from the film context, and even then the first thing that comes to mind about stormtroopers for most non-terminally online people are "oh those cannon fodder mooks with bad aim". They've been sanitised and cleansed to the point that I'm currently surrounded by numerous little plastic space nazis and on Friday bought and enjoyed building myself a representation of a space nazi spaceship which in-universe committed numerous genocidal atrocities. It even came with a cute little space hitler. It's a Lego TIE Bomber. I don't think having this stuff makes me problematic. Maybe I am speaking in my ignorance and privilege as someone who doesn't generally present in a way that would invite discrimination but it seems to me making such a strong negative assumption about such a huge group of cosplayers without any actual evidence, circumstantial or otherwise, that they're doing it as an acceptable outward show of fascist tendencies is causing yourself unnecessary stress, to bring it back to OP for who an uneventful lift ride with a stormtrooper cosplayer was a traumatic event.
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Apr 11, 2023 18:41
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AndyElusive posted:Anyone who has a full Imperial Stormtrooper costume probably took the time and effort to make it themselves and probably did it out of love for Star Wars and not because they're some kind of Nazi gently caress. If you still think people who make Storm Trooper armor are people you have to fear in real life, check out the 501st Legion who do a lot of fundraising and charity work. These people are cool. It's about the fact that I have to ask myself the question and that's a scary reality to live in. I specifically mentioned that people wearing space naxi poo poo could just like Star Wars. But that I wouldn't ever know until it's too late. LividLiquid fucked around with this message at 18:57 on Apr 11, 2023 |
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Apr 11, 2023 18:54
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Respect to Jack Black for giving the portly dudes another option over who to cosplay that isnt Jabba or Porkins.
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Apr 11, 2023 18:58
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Just Chamber posted:Respect to Jack Black for giving the portly dudes another option over who to cosplay that isnt Jabba or Porkins. You forgot the dude that was crying over the Rancor.
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Apr 11, 2023 19:00
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Feels like you're missing the forest for the trees, because you keep pointing at other trees. I have a microfighter AT-AT on my desk too, no one is talking about having a lego set being problematic. I don't assume someone that puts on a Star Wars costume is automatically a nazi IRL. If they start talking about how they don't drink Bud Light anymore, well... I feel like I dodged this whole problem of thinking stormtroopers are cool because I'm pretty sure I first watched Star Wars and Empire Strikes Back back to back for the first time, and thus was immediately presented with an even cooler helmet. Granted mando worship has its own problems, and I've since grown out of it and feel differently about it now. Again I'm side-eyeing anyone that likes mythosaur skulls a bit too much. Someone cosplaying a mando at a convention? Whatever. AndyElusive posted:A dude ran over 100kms during Star Wars Celebration 2023 wearing Stormtrooper armor. He raised a bucket load of money for Make-A-Wish and Spread-A-Smile. Which is awesome. This is good. More of this please.
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Apr 11, 2023 19:01
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Darko posted:You forgot the Rancor.
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Apr 11, 2023 19:09
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Just Chamber posted:Jabba or Porkins. That's one hell of a range. Also they could have been Gamorreans
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Apr 11, 2023 19:26
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I would love to see a whole gaggle of gamorreans at a convention.
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Apr 11, 2023 19:31
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Sash! posted:That's one hell of a range. Nah, Disney has made Gamorreans into swole dudes.
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Apr 11, 2023 19:35
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The
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Apr 11, 2023 19:37
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Arc Hammer posted:Nah, Disney has made Gamorreans into swole dudes. It's still baffling to me that in all of America they apparently couldn't find two dudes massive enough to play convincing Gamorreans. I get that there's a minimum of fitness required for the stunt work, but still.
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Apr 11, 2023 19:37
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Still letting out an lol that two gamorreans with sticks were assigned to defend against landing craft full of blaster armed gangster aliens and this was considered a good plan.
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Apr 11, 2023 19:47
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Parkingtigers posted:Still letting out an lol that two gamorreans with sticks were assigned to defend against landing craft full of blaster armed gangster aliens and this was considered a good plan. My favorite Starwars story Two Gamorreans. That's what it's all about.
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Apr 11, 2023 19:55
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If would have worked if the enemy did not utilize gamorrean's biggest weakness - a giant cliff.
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Apr 11, 2023 20:08
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Good Nazi uniforms: stormtroopers, Vader, Palpatine Sus Nazi uniforms: 
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Apr 11, 2023 20:23
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Jerkface posted:The stormtroopers put me in time out at the parks for being a rebel sympathizer Yeah, this happened with my daughter when she was almost 4. Rey took her by the hand and asked if she would hide from the First Order with her. They ran around and hid behind trash cans and tables and stuff for like 5 minutes. My daughter is 6, almost 7, now, and she still talks about it to this day, how Rey is her favorite character ever, and that she's her friend, and how they hid from Stormtroopers together. It's adorable, and great.
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Apr 11, 2023 20:23
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Stormtrooper armor is also popular because it is standardized and made of common materials and there is a massive community to help you finish the project. The finished product is instantly recognizable. If you to cosplay your own bespoke Rebel partisan you have figure out how to staple half a football shoulder pad to an old army surplus jacket and poo poo.
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Apr 11, 2023 20:56
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Surprised no one's brought up the fact that Disney is leaning into all of this by making the official Star Wars TV intro a montage of a bunch of Imperial/First Order Helmets.
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Apr 11, 2023 21:07
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Marsupial Ape posted:Stormtrooper armor is also popular because it is standardized and made of common materials and there is a massive community to help you finish the project. The finished product is instantly recognizable. God bless Dash Rendar cosplayers.
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Apr 11, 2023 21:07
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Senrab posted:Surprised no one's brought up the fact that Disney is leaning into all of this by making the official Star Wars TV intro a montage of a bunch of Imperial/First Order Helmets. It’s just headshots, and they’ve tweaked it from show to show. They’ve also include droids (Astromechs and C-3PO), a Rebel flight helmet, I think a Mandalorian helmet as well, among others, so it’s not just solely Imperial/First Order ones.
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Apr 11, 2023 21:17
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Just dropping this here.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nd4Djoa-bM
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Apr 11, 2023 21:23
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fartknocker posted:It’s just headshots, and they’ve tweaked it from show to show. They’ve also include droids (Astromechs and C-3PO), a Rebel flight helmet, I think a Mandalorian helmet as well, among others, so it’s not just solely Imperial/First Order ones. I thought it actually alternated between good guy and bad guy characters too. At this point, you might as well be complaining about the Decepticon head wipes in a Transformers episode.
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Apr 11, 2023 21:54
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Sash! posted:I thought it actually alternated between good guy and bad guy characters too. Yeah it's just here's all the sick helmets/droid faces relevant to this series.
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Apr 11, 2023 22:54
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thrawn527 posted:Yeah, this happened with my daughter when she was almost 4. Rey took her by the hand and asked if she would hide from the First Order with her. They ran around and hid behind trash cans and tables and stuff for like 5 minutes. My daughter is 6, almost 7, now, and she still talks about it to this day, how Rey is her favorite character ever, and that she's her friend, and how they hid from Stormtroopers together. It's adorable, and great. 
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Apr 11, 2023 23:12
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The intro with the helmet and the droids is just a bunch of star wars iconography that Disney can hold the licensing rights too without much effort, ie no actor faces etc Its transparently commercial.
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Apr 12, 2023 00:12
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Jerkface posted:The intro with the helmet and the droids is just a bunch of star wars iconography that Disney can hold the licensing rights too without much effort, ie no actor faces etc Its transparently commercial. Add long as it doesn't get long like marvel
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Apr 12, 2023 00:20
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Darko posted:You forgot the dude that was crying over the Rancor. I will NEVER forget that dude! 7
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Apr 12, 2023 00:30
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Okay, again, I really can't stress this enough: I am not, nor did I ever say that literally anybody wearing a space nazi uniform is a nazi. I said it is scary having to ask myself if they're the kind of people who can't wear their actual nazi poo poo in public, so they wear space nazi poo poo, which is entirely acceptable. I don't think it shouldn't be made, I don't think it shouldn't be sold, and I don't think people shouldn't wear it. I never said any of that. The dozen or so posts all "hey, not ALL space nazis" really missed the point being made. I think Disney shouldn't make the space nazis awesome, badass, or relatable.
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Apr 12, 2023 00:31
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Jerusalem posted:I will NEVER forget that dude! I was so ready to be very sad at that comic, but surprise happy ending. This is now canon.
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Apr 12, 2023 00:54
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Parkingtigers posted:I was so ready to be very sad at that comic, but surprise happy ending. This is now canon. Where do you think Boba's baby rancor came from?
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Apr 12, 2023 01:20
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Butterfly Valley posted:I don't think having this stuff makes me problematic. i do. but for different reasons........
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Apr 12, 2023 01:32
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Dave Syndrome posted:It's still baffling to me that in all of America they apparently couldn't find two dudes massive enough to play convincing Gamorreans. some gamorreans might be dad bod style guys or maybe even fat as poo poo guys and some might be buff guys. or gals for that matter. like ppl. gamoreans are ppl too. or maybe this is human centeric thinking like kirk got roasted for in undiscovered country (?) .... much to consider
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Apr 12, 2023 01:35
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https://twitter.com/lizzo/status/1643994959081779204?s=61&t=lCUtLD2mloWN4vLs8kjQ2w I love that Lizzo is just a big sweet nerd, got to live out her nerd dreams *and* melt chud heads all at once. She seems like a really fun person to hang out with and I'll never be mad at Star Wars for picking cool people to come and play with the toys.
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Apr 12, 2023 01:37
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Parkingtigers posted:https://twitter.com/lizzo/status/1643994959081779204?s=61&t=lCUtLD2mloWN4vLs8kjQ2w I basically had About drat Time stuck in my head all summer last year, so yeah anything Lizzo wants to do is straight fire in my book. Her being the bougie queen of Rich Communist World with an Operation Paperclip schlub husband was funny and it's both sad, hilarious, and concerning that people are getting literally murderously mad about it online.
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Apr 12, 2023 01:41
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LividLiquid posted:Okay, again, I really can't stress this enough: We get it. I lived 45 of years of life of that and something I cant change to be safe since its skin color. People are just saying to pick better battles in your head. We have the same fight, just as someone living it longer, for personal health, you should dial a little back. I've been through all of this before and have huge issues I had to deal through and it's not fun.
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Apr 12, 2023 02:28
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LividLiquid posted:Okay, again, I really can't stress this enough: I feel for you there. Plenty of cool good people cosplay Stormtroopers, love video games where they get to play TIE fighters, and generally enjoy fictional bad guys without actually excusing them, partly since the fantasy nature of the setting distances it from real-world consequences. On the other hand ironic-not-ironic "When you think about it, the Empire is a legitimate government fighting a terrorist insurgency" takes got big with a pretty bad crowd, and it's hardly rare for people to identify with fictional villains and bullies because they identify with those properties. There's a person a block over from me with an Imperial sticker on their car. It's probably as revealing about the real person as a sticker of the Decepticon logo or Freddy Kreuger or something. It's probably less worrisome than a Punisher logo. But if the owner turned out to be some right-authoritarian type I'd be "yeah, that tracks."
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Apr 12, 2023 02:34
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