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Rand Brittain posted:13th Age's druid suffered really badly from being "here are five specializations; pick one to be adequate at and one to be bad at", which made the whole class feel very underwhelming. I feel like if they'd gone all-in on flexibility and just gave you, say, six talents to spend on the exact same list then the whole thing would work. Okay, you'll never get the equivalent of Evocation, but you legitimately are like 2.5 different character classes stapled together limited only by the fact that you have to decide which one to spend your standard actions on.
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Apr 22, 2023 22:55
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Rand Brittain posted:at which point Pelgrane swore they'd never work with him again https://twitter.com/13thAge/status/1145799864464347136 Reads like a "present state" sort of statement to me, conveniently phrased to imply "never again" for sure, but not actually stating it. It's very careful and corporate phrasing but it wouldn't work if people didn't want it to say "never again" enough to miss that it doesn't.
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Apr 22, 2023 23:04
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It implies it hard enough that I'm okay with my own phrasing. I have some sympathy for Pelgrane here, since they pretty obviously didn't want to work with Tweet and were forced to choose between working with him and throwing away what I assume is their most successful license, but at the end of the day that's what they decided to do.
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Apr 22, 2023 23:08
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I'm not sure you're not overestimating the strength of any boycott movement there, the playtest seems to be proceeding just fine.
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Apr 22, 2023 23:14
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like whether it sells in an age of D&D dominance with what it brings to the table (wizard options, at present) is gonna be quite another matter but I feel like if it's gonna fail it might well fail on its own merits. e: or rather, if it doesn't sell, it's probably gonna not sell not because of activism or design but simply because thats not what they play in Stranger Things and Critical Role. My Lovely Horse fucked around with this message at 23:26 on Apr 22, 2023 |
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Apr 22, 2023 23:19
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this hobby is full of dudes that suck and a market that also sucks
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Apr 23, 2023 00:14
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trapstar posted:I enjoy having characters commissioned and so I have had a total two wizard characters commissioned. I was just wondering what your guy's thoughts on which one of these looks like they would be the more powerful wizard/spellcaster. The thing is those two characters appear to come from largely different genres. We've got Female Main Character (or Smart Girl Sidekick) and Wizard Who Has Seen Some Bad poo poo and which one is more powerful depends on whether you're in a genre that expects a character looking like that to have a major role. If Female Main Character is genre-expected then Wizard Who Has Seen Some Bad poo poo is a mentor character and Female Main Character is going to become much more powerful than their mentor ever will for obvious reasons. In fact there are only three real choices for the mentor. (1) is that they get killed in act one to provide motivation and show just how serious the threat is, (2) is that they get out-scaled in act 2 and either retire or commit suicide through not being willing to admit they can't keep up. (3) is that they are really the BBEG and mentoring the main character wrongly; this is of course not incompatible with either 1 or 2. If Wizard Who Has Seen Some Bad poo poo is the genre-appropriate one then Female Main Character is all flash and no substance and isn't ready for the real world; it's going to end badly. Meanwhile the Wizard Who Has Seen Some Bad poo poo is subtler, and could either be a very low powered trickster who you really don't want to get on the wrong side of because they have all the smarts and dirty tricks, or they are really powerful but don't want to advertise it. Either way they are very different characters and one's likely to fit a game better than the other.
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Apr 23, 2023 01:00
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I don't want 13th Age 2 with him because the sidebars in the original made it clear that he was responsible for every bad regressive decision in 13th Age's rules.
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Apr 23, 2023 03:14
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Trapstar keeps finding reasons to post the art they've commissioned and by god I'm here for it But yes Alex definitely comes off more of a protagonist between the two of them.
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Apr 23, 2023 03:26
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Kwyndig posted:I don't want 13th Age 2 with him because the sidebars in the original made it clear that he was responsible for every bad regressive decision in 13th Age's rules.
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Apr 23, 2023 07:34
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Is there a more appropriate thread for random rear end RPG ideas that I came across? Latest one, realising Lancer would work really well in a Space Hulk setup. Players being stalked through an actively decaying orbital shipyard by mass-produced EVAs.
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Apr 23, 2023 10:30
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Kwyndig posted:I don't want 13th Age 2 with him because the sidebars in the original made it clear that he was responsible for every bad regressive decision in 13th Age's rules. It's a real shame, since 13th Age is pretty much the posterboy for games that really need a second edition that gets rid of all the bad design ideas.
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Apr 23, 2023 11:16
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has 13th age 2e actually come out yet or are you all just wringing your hands over "a designer i don't like for [x reason] is included and therefore the final version is guaranteed to suck and i'm pre-boycotting it" like regardless of why you dislike tweet, discarding the entire system/edition out of hand without seeing the final product is more than a little silly and self-defeating
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Apr 23, 2023 13:43
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Lemon-Lime posted:It's a real shame, since 13th Age is pretty much the posterboy for games that really need a second edition that gets rid of all the bad design ideas. Sounds like 13th Age is going need a 13th Age
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Apr 23, 2023 13:54
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I don't care whether it's good or not; I'm still not buying it.
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Apr 23, 2023 14:07
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Arivia posted:has 13th age 2e actually come out yet or are you all just wringing your hands over "a designer i don't like for [x reason] is included and therefore the final version is guaranteed to suck and i'm pre-boycotting it" I must admit, I don't care about Terrible Tweet Tweets either. Don't much care about 13th Age 2e either, tbh, but I might give it a try one day if there's a game.
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Apr 23, 2023 14:52
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I'm pretty sure the argument at hand here is: * no, 13th Age 2e has not come out yet * Jonathan Tweet is involved, over the objections of some people, due to Rob Heinsoo's insistence that he's entitled to still work on it since he was there for 1e * on the social side, J. Tweet has made public some objectionable views regarding "race science" that people might not want to patronize or associate with * on the design side, J. Tweet was the D&D 3e guy, and Heinsoo was the D&D 4e guy, so there's a certain expectation that a lot of the stuff that was not-good about 13th Age 1e might have come from Tweet, and will continue to come from Tweet, given his continued involvement in the project
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Apr 23, 2023 15:08
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gradenko_2000 posted:I'm pretty sure the argument at hand here is: 13th Age included a lot of designer commentary, so people know which bits were Tweets.
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Apr 23, 2023 15:12
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Arivia posted:has 13th age 2e actually come out yet or are you all just wringing your hands over "a designer i don't like for [x reason] is included and therefore the final version is guaranteed to suck and i'm pre-boycotting it"
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Apr 23, 2023 15:17
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There was an email a few weeks ago with some encouraging signs about 13A 2e. They have finally figured out that people don't want paladins and barbarians to be forever boring. So that's a thing.
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Apr 23, 2023 15:31
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Has anyone tried to make a setting based on the John Wick movies? Considering the worldbuilding on those I think it's fertile ground for some insane world of assassins thing.
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Apr 23, 2023 17:07
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Rand Brittain posted:I don't care whether it's good or not; I'm still not buying it. Okay so yes this is just a pity party. Got it. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Apr 23, 2023 17:30
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“I’m not going to buy this game because one of the leads has said extremely racist stuff” “I hope you grow and mature so one day we can really talk about pretending to be an elf as adults”
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Apr 23, 2023 17:50
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Thank gently caress Arivia is here to defend the honour and integrity of the race science guy.
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Apr 23, 2023 19:05
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I think it's gonna get increasingly hard for I Can't Believe It's Not Butter D&Ds to find their footing, because boy are a ton of them going to be hitting the market in rapid succession. You have Pathfinder continuing to have that market share cornered, you have Shadow of the Demon Lord and 13th Age putting out their second editions, you have all the old school heartbreakers, and now between Kobold Press, Cubicle7, Matt Colville, and the Critical Role team you're getting a lot of post-OGL names throwing their hats into the ring. And all of this is happening right at the cusp of a new edition-ish update coming for D&D, which could steal all the attention back off of these offshoots. In some ways, this is actually pretty exciting. In other ways, man is it seeming increasingly likely that these new products are going to cannibalize each other.
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Apr 23, 2023 19:25
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Plutonis posted:Has anyone tried to make a setting based on the John Wick movies? Considering the worldbuilding on those I think it's fertile ground for some insane world of assassins thing. Onyx Path has Trinity Continuum: Assassins, which is okay if you like Storypath. It is unabashedly the John Wick world. Excommunicado also fits although you can only fit so much world into those 8 pages. Oh, and if you want to play the idiots who wronged John Wick: http://thursdaymorningdd.blogspot.com/2017/09/john-wick-retired-ver-20.html Besides that there are of course a ton of good options for playing in the style of, they just don’t have the explicit background/setting material.
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Apr 23, 2023 19:48
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Arivia posted:Okay so yes this is just a pity party. Got it. So are you, personally, excited for 2nd edition 13th Age.
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Apr 23, 2023 20:04
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Tweet is funny because he's genuinely trying to be a seriously, helpful, and ideologically consistent liberal who doesn't let the side down for his fellow travelers. The only problem is that liberalism is inextricably entwined with race science and upon realizing this he decides to clench his fists, square his jaw, and step up to the plate instead of shrinking away and pretending he does not see it. On one hand I kinda respect it, but on the other hand not as much as I hold it in contempt. As others have noted, he was evidently responsible for all the worst aspects of 1E's design, so there's not even any tension between wanting to play the game and not wanting to financially or even culturally support this worm. Everybody wins!
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Apr 23, 2023 20:13
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Ferrinus posted:The only problem is that liberalism is inextricably entwined with race science As a genuine question, and my failure to understand may be down to some of the different meanings of "liberal" from one side of the Atlantic to the other, could you explain this one?
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Apr 23, 2023 20:22
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PurpleXVI posted:As a genuine question, and my failure to understand may be down to some of the different meanings of "liberal" from one side of the Atlantic to the other, could you explain this one? I don't blame you since I'm obviously using pretty provocative phrasing here, but by "liberal"/"liberalism"/etc. I mean a broad support of free speech and free markets, and hence a capitalist economy, that encompasses the entirety of the American political sphere, not just people who are pro- rather than anti- gay marriage or whatever. If your system of free association and fair, rules-delineated competition nevertheless conspicuously results in princes and paupers, and you're not willing to call capitalism itself (as opposed to, like, too much/too little regulation or other peripheral inefficiencies) the problem, you've really only got one recourse left to explain different health and economic outcomes across the population. Tweet is like, yes, "race" is scientifically real and is the mainspring behind a whole host of social disparities, but we need to be kind and fair-minded about this. And the thing is, both Donald Trump and Joe Biden would agree! You're just not supposed to say that so plainly.
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Apr 23, 2023 20:39
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PurpleXVI posted:As a genuine question, and my failure to understand may be down to some of the different meanings of "liberal" from one side of the Atlantic to the other, could you explain this one? It'd probably be more accurate to call it neoliberalism since that's the specific term for that post Reagan/Clinton/etc movement, but it's also been the dominant ideology in US politics for long enough that they may as well be synonyms. And to rephrase Ferrinus' point slightly, the data says that either race science is real or there are massive systemic issues in how things are run, and Tweet (and basically all of the US establishment) concluded that they know the system works so clearly race science has to be real on some level.
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Apr 23, 2023 21:42
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From the makers of 13th Age comes a new and exciting game… 14 Words!
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Apr 23, 2023 21:54
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Arivia posted:has 13th age 2e actually come out yet or are you all just wringing your hands over "a designer i don't like for [x reason] is included and therefore the final version is guaranteed to suck and i'm pre-boycotting it" Hello, welcome to traditional games. It is good to see new people in this community. Yes, it is pretty common for people to choose not to buy a product because it was worked on by a CHUD or to choose not to support developers who employ CHUDs. Anyway, we can recommend a few starter sets for you to try. See you around and don't be afraid to ask questions. BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 21:59 on Apr 23, 2023 |
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Apr 23, 2023 21:56
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Ah, yeah, that explanation absolutely makes sense. And thank you for the replies, I always get worried when I ask people to explain things like that, that I might accidentally come across as a concern troll or something of the sort.
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Apr 23, 2023 21:58
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I'm having a very hard time reconciling Jonathan Tweet as he presents himself on twitter and his blog with this image of Jonathan Tweet the unrepentant racist with a KKK hood in the hallway closet
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Apr 23, 2023 22:29
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My Lovely Horse posted:I'm having a very hard time reconciling Jonathan Tweet as he presents himself on twitter and his blog with this image of Jonathan Tweet the unrepentant racist with a KKK hood in the hallway closet Well, that's what I'm saying, he's really not. His point is roughly this: at the moment, reactionaries will openly throw around Bell Curve poo poo about genetic differences between races ("races"), and brag specifically about being brave enough to speak the unvarnished truth unlike most people in the media or the academy. This gives them a rhetorical advantage, since (according to Tweet) there really are genetic differences between races (such as, like, variations in what kind of medication his own daughter, who's Black, might need). His fellow progressives deny this for basically virtuous and well-meaning reasons, since we all know what happens when we start to openly acknowledge and make policy around genetic differences between races, but this leaves them in the uncomfortable position of being science-deniers in the face of reactionary science-avowers, which is a losing position in the long run. Now, I don't think he's wrong, because like I said I think race as the really-existing mainspring of history is actually an inextricable part of the liberal tradition ("neo" or otherwise). If you really believe that being able to freely withhold or dispose of your own private property is a necessary component of human civilization, then you're stuck in a world wherein some people are smart while others are stupid, some are worthy while others are unworthy, etc, on an essential level. But the answer here is not to bite the bullet and accept the doctrine of race but like in a touchy-feely and generous way, but rather to discard liberalism.
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Apr 23, 2023 22:42
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the fucj
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Apr 23, 2023 23:08
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So, anyone played anything fun this week?
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Apr 23, 2023 23:15
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Thread is going Places.
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Apr 23, 2023 23:19
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Antivehicular posted:So, anyone played anything fun this week? I ran a game of Eidolon where the players were trying to rob Disney World of Walt Disney's last and most prized possession. They fought some pink elephants and ended up in cartoon world by riding Steamboat Willie. They met Goofy. It ruled.
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Apr 23, 2023 23:27
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