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Gutey giveth and Gutey taketh away. For every positive thing he does, there’s also something extremely destructive. Tell me he’s not the worst GM in the NFC North right now. As for Rodgers, I was pretty firmly on his side until the vax stuff came out. I lost a ton of respect for him. And then he began to suck at football, so what use is he? So yeah, I’m a Packers fan who spent the last 3 years hating the GM and one-and-a-half years hating the QB. I’d be ecstatic if Jordan Love turned out to be The Guy, but there’s no reason to think that right now. And I’m not some psycho hater who blames Gutey for not keeping Davante Adams around. But I can blame him for steadfastly refusing to draft WR in the first 2 rounds (until he did), for drafting Amari Rodgers, and for signing Sammy Watkins as though that solved anything.
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Apr 25, 2023 02:34
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He also brought in Jimmy Graham.
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Apr 25, 2023 02:36
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Amari was a third round pick and Watkins was just there while the rookies got up to speed
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Apr 25, 2023 02:37
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ngl though Graham catching Trubisky’s last ball and just leaving the stadium made me lol for awhile
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Apr 25, 2023 02:37
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Also there's like nothing much that can be said about the Bears' or Vikings' GM as they've both barely been in their respective roles
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Apr 25, 2023 02:39
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He also draft ESB, who can’t even stand out on the Bears, and MVS, who can scrape by as WR4 or 5 on a stacked team. That’s a lot of why the Packers WR situation imploded the past few years. Ted Thompson regularly drafted 2nd round WRs who became great. Gutey seemed philosophically opposed until last year with Christian Watson - literally too little, too late for the Rodgers era.
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Apr 25, 2023 02:40
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And lowballed Jordy, who still ad a good season left in him.
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Apr 25, 2023 02:42
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Rod Hoofhearted posted:He also draft ESB, who can’t even stand out on the Bears, and MVS, who can scrape by as WR4 or 5 on a stacked team. That’s a lot of why the Packers WR situation imploded the past few years. 6th and 5th round picks respectively. Those are dart throws. MVS was a good pick for his position.
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Apr 25, 2023 02:48
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i hope the packers quarterback situation goes into the stink zone!!!!!!
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Apr 25, 2023 02:53
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Hot Diggity! posted:6th and 5th round picks respectively. Those are dart throws. MVS was a good pick for his position. I mean, that is an indictment in itself. Not committing to building around your Hall of Fame quarterback is dumb.
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Apr 25, 2023 02:54
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Sataere posted:I mean, that is an indictment in itself. Not committing to building around your Hall of Fame quarterback is dumb. Jaire was the first round pick of that draft class lol. Rodgers has had plenty of talent surrounding him offensively and the vast majority of the issues have been defense and special teams. Like even within that class J'mon Moore would have been a better case to make and he was just a 4th. Josh Jackson in the second seemed like a great pick due to his college play and eye test, but just didn't pan out. Burks in the third was a dude with crazy SPARQ scores but couldn't get anything going. The whole draft was making up for the nightmare of Ted Thompson's 2015 draft of Damarious Randall and Quintin Rollins.
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Apr 25, 2023 03:05
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Hot Diggity! posted:Jaire was the first round pick of that draft class lol. Rodgers has had plenty of talent surrounding him offensively and the vast majority of the issues have been defense and special teams. This isn't about one draft class. It is about constantly devaluing the position. When did the Packers invest premium draft capital to help Rodgers succeed under Gute? That is a problem.
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Apr 25, 2023 03:18
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The large number of swings and misses on defensive players has also contributed.
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Apr 25, 2023 03:22
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SKULL.GIF posted:I don't know what sort of weird vendetta you have but between hating Rodgers and wanting to see him fail and hating Gutey and wanting to see him fail I'm not entirely sure you're actually a Packers fan. Here, lemme help you. Rodgers is a lying, broken down, misinfo-pushing toxic piece of poo poo. Guntekunst is a unprofessional, incompetent, toxic piece of poo poo. Rod is aware of those things and seeing them, with their eyes. They really did deserve each other. It's a shame they couldn't be stuck together for the rest of their careers.
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Apr 25, 2023 03:26
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MJeff posted:Here, lemme help you. Seriously, the Bears told Andy Dalton they were drafting a quarterback after signing him, but they couldn't be bothered to talk to their Hall of Fame quarterback.
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Apr 25, 2023 03:28
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So much of the discourse right now sounds so strikingly loving familiar to the 2007-2008 discourse when Favre got unceremoniously shipped to New York and everyone was calling for FIRE TED THOMPSON!!! and buying posters avatars of Ted with a hellfire background. TED RUINED THE GREEN BAY PACKERS! HE DROVE FAVRE OUT OF TOWN! IF ONLY WE'D DRAFTED RODDY WHITE INSTEAD OF THAT CALIFORNIA KID, 2007 COULD'VE BEEN A SUPERBOWL!Abugadu posted:Gutey created the whole Problem in the first place by trading up for Love when Rodgers was nowhere near retiring. I'm never going to fault Gutey for drafting Love in 2020. It was the covid draft, poo poo was weird, we weren't sure if we were going to even have a draft the following year (what if college football was canceled outright? In that case sitting on a QB for a full season would've been a great idea). Rodgers had had like 3-4 seasons of seeming more and more on the decline towards mediocre and even his 2019 revival under LaFleur had no indications that he would go on to turn in two consecutive MVPs. I remember what Bakhtiari said after Love was drafted. It was something like "Oh man, you don't know Aaron, he's going to come out with his hair on fire." Arguably the Love pick was one of the big motivations for activating Rodgers's full-blown chip-on-his-shoulder psychosis to go MVP at ages 37 and 38. If we draft Tee Higgins or Michael Pittman Jr or whoever the gently caress, does Rodgers go full blown "gently caress THE GREEN BAY PACKERS I'LL SHOW THEM WHAT FOR!"? Is Higgins or Pittman Jr enough to get the Packers 14 more points in the 2020 playoffs? In the past I'd always hedged it and gone "Probably not", but no, today, I'm going to say "No, absolutely not". That's not how NFL offenses work. Justin Jefferson? Should Gutey have traded up for JJ? Given hindsight, yeah, probably. Did we have any idea Minnesota was going to take JJ (with Thielen and Diggs on the roster)? Did we have any idea JJ was going to be that drat good? Sataere posted:This isn't about one draft class. It is about constantly devaluing the position. When did the Packers invest premium draft capital to help Rodgers succeed under Gute? That is a problem. They didn't devalue the position (or the offense) lol. They didn't need to spend premium draft capital on it because the Packers were so consistently good at finding (and developing) offensive stars in the latter rounds of the draft. Bakhtiari was a fourth round pick. Aaron Jones was a ^ corrected AJ and Jamaal's draft positions, I was getting them mixed up with ESB and MVS. R.D. Mangles posted:i hope the packers quarterback situation goes into the stink zone!!!!!! No you don't. You want Jordan Love to be just slightly above mediocre so the Packers stay with him for at least a few more seasons. If he gasses up the joint the Packers get Caleb or Drake. SKULL.GIF fucked around with this message at 03:35 on Apr 25, 2023 |
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Apr 25, 2023 03:32
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The Packers tried to move up to draft both Jefferson and Aiyuk if you believe Rapaport.Abugadu posted:The large number of swings and misses on defensive players has also contributed. Generally happens when you're drafting at the end of the round too! Hot Diggity! fucked around with this message at 03:39 on Apr 25, 2023 |
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Apr 25, 2023 03:37
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JJ was chosen with the pick Buffalo gave Minnesota in the trade for Diggs.
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Apr 25, 2023 03:37
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SKULL.GIF posted:If we draft Tee Higgins or Michael Pittman Jr or whoever the gently caress, does Rodgers go full blown "gently caress THE GREEN BAY PACKERS I'LL SHOW THEM WHAT FOR!"? Is Higgins or Pittman Jr enough to get the Packers 14 more points in the 2020 playoffs? In the past I'd always hedged it and gone "Probably not", but no, today, I'm going to say "No, absolutely not". That's not how NFL offenses work. How it actually works is the better your players are at wide receiver, the easier it is to create mismatches that open up your offense. Having to constantly chuck it up to Adams because you don't trust the rest of your offense is a problem. Maybe if Rodgers had Pittman or Higgins, he'd have had someone else he could trust on offense and wouldn't have felt compelled to constantly play hero ball with Adams. quote:They didn't devalue the position (or the offense) lol. They didn't need to spend premium draft capital on it because the Packers were so consistently good at finding (and developing) offensive stars in the latter rounds of the draft. Bakhtiari was a fourth round pick. Aaron Jones was a Saying they used a bunch of day three picks on offense is not the argument you think it is when it comes to devaluing the position. To be clear, I'm not saying Gute is necessarily good or bad. I have liked a lot of what he has done. I am saying he has some serious flaws. And GMs who seem to think that running star players out of town is the right have historically shown they are arrogant assholes who look like idiots in hindsight. I remember Jerry Krause saying organizations win championships. Turns out it was the players.
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Apr 25, 2023 03:46
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Sataere posted:How it actually works is the better your players are at wide receiver, the easier it is to create mismatches that open up your offense. Having to constantly chuck it up to Adams because you don't trust the rest of your offense is a problem. Maybe if Rodgers had Pittman or Higgins, he'd have had someone else he could trust on offense and wouldn't have felt compelled to constantly play hero ball with Adams. Rodgers threw 48 loving touchdowns in 2020. There were five Pro Bowlers and three All-Pros on the 2020 offense. All of these players were drafted by Green Bay. Offensive talent wasn't the problem. When these picks hit you don't need to reach for offensive talent in the first round is the point I'm trying to make. Sataere posted:To be clear, I'm not saying Gute is necessarily good or bad. I have liked a lot of what he has done. I am saying he has some serious flaws. And GMs who seem to think that running star players out of town is the right have historically shown they are arrogant assholes who look like idiots in hindsight. I remember Jerry Krause saying organizations win championships. Turns out it was the players. Interesting, then, how when the Packers moved to accommodate Rodgers last season, giving him a contract extension, bringing back his friends, giving him more input and autonomy on personnel and offensive playcalling, that's exactly and specifically when he started declining. Not when Gutekunst started to "run him out of town" by drafting his replacement who fell from potentially a top 15 selection (I didn't pay much attention to the 2020 draft leadup (there were a couple other things drawing my attention at the time) but I distinctly recall Love being mocked to the Chargers at #6 more than a few times). And despite that they were still ready to stick with Aaron until he went to meditate for 96 hours on whether or not he should retire and came out 90% ready to retire only to find that the Packers accurately assessed he was ready to retire and had been planning around that eventuality. If anything Rodgers ran himself out of town. He picked his destination and Gutekunst accommodated that decision.
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Apr 25, 2023 03:57
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Lol packers
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Apr 25, 2023 03:58
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A fun fact about Jordan Love is he's still just 24
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Apr 25, 2023 04:05
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Darth Brooks posted:JJ was chosen with the pick Buffalo gave Minnesota in the trade for Diggs. Sure . He was picked with the 22nd, Packers had the 30th and traded a 5th to move up to the 26th to get Love. Not an expensive trade up, but it was clear their board was close to tapped so they went BPA.
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Apr 25, 2023 04:10
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Jordan Love is going to suck. Years of darkness await you.
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Apr 25, 2023 04:33
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SKULL.GIF posted:Rodgers threw 48 loving touchdowns in 2020. There were five Pro Bowlers and three All-Pros on the 2020 offense. All of these players were drafted by Green Bay. Offensive talent wasn't the problem. I'm really struggling to understand why you are defending things most Packers fans have been complaining about for years. You realize you can be a fan of a team while seeing the very apparent flaws. Even in 2020, nobody thought that level of production was sustainable long term. Your all pros were because you had the best receiver in football and a quarterback who played at an MVP level. Rodgers elevated the talent around him. quote:Interesting, then, how when the Packers moved to accommodate Rodgers last season, giving him a contract extension, bringing back his friends, giving him more input and autonomy on personnel and offensive playcalling, that's exactly and specifically when he started declining. Not when Gutekunst started to "run him out of town" by drafting his replacement who fell from potentially a top 15 selection (I didn't pay much attention to the 2020 draft leadup (there were a couple other things drawing my attention at the time) but I distinctly recall Love being mocked to the Chargers at #6 more than a few times). And despite that they were still ready to stick with Aaron until he went to meditate for 96 hours on whether or not he should retire and came out 90% ready to retire only to find that the Packers accurately assessed he was ready to retire and had been planning around that eventuality. I think I'm done with this conversation. If you really don't see the issues with Gute, I'm not gonna be the guy who changes your mind.
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Apr 25, 2023 04:37
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Just lol if you think Rodgers would've worked with any receivers drafted in 2020 instead of expecting them to read his mind.
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Apr 25, 2023 04:41
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Sataere posted:I'm really struggling to understand why you are defending things most Packers fans have been complaining about for years. You realize you can be a fan of a team while seeing the very apparent flaws. Even in 2020, nobody thought that level of production was sustainable long term. Your all pros were because you had the best receiver in football and a quarterback who played at an MVP level. Rodgers elevated the talent around him. Because there's a large contingent of Packers fans who think Gutekunst is the absolute worst GM in the world when he's probably somewhere around above average and I'm unbelievably tired of reading that bullshit. Tom Brady broke the brains of absolutely everyone following this sport. Without exception, 31 of 32 NFL teams fail embarrassingly every single loving season.
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Apr 25, 2023 04:46
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I think we can all agree that Rick Spielman was the superior GM, getting draft picks for players still on the roster.
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Apr 25, 2023 04:50
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Caleb Williams in Green Bay after a year of sucking with Love. That sounds dirty.
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Apr 25, 2023 04:55
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Aaron Rodgers, much like the McCaskeys, is proof that owning the Bears doesn't lead to playoff success.
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Apr 25, 2023 05:26
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SKULL.GIF posted:Rodgers threw 48 loving touchdowns in 2020. There were five Pro Bowlers and three All-Pros on the 2020 offense. All of these players were drafted by Green Bay. Offensive talent wasn't the problem. Only one of those five was actually selected by the current GM. If your argument is that they already had good players on offense so he didn’t need to draft more I’d say 1) you always need to restock with young talent and 2) he spent the picks on defense instead and it was still mediocre. Nervous posted:Caleb Williams in Green Bay after a year of sucking with Love. Neither the Packers nor the Jets will be bad enough for the Packers to get Caleb. Whoever has that pick is probably keeping it.
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Apr 25, 2023 06:17
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It was fun until it wasn't. Time to see what the future holds.
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Apr 25, 2023 08:10
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SKULL.GIF posted:Because there's a large contingent of Packers fans who think Gutekunst is the absolute worst GM in the world when he's probably somewhere around above average and I'm unbelievably tired of reading that bullshit. I don't think Gutenkust is the worlds worst GM - he's been above average at evaluating talent for sure - but he's been F- at handling the most important position in football and that's problematic when you're a GM. That can coexist with Rodgers being a real weird man child it's ok!!!!! I really do hope Jordan Love turns into the 3rd straight hall of fame quarterback while the Lions have jared goff reverting to norm and the Bears end up murdering yet another promising young QB and the Vikings are stuck on the Kirk Cousins mediocrity train but that's unlikely! Even if Jordan Love turns into a hall of fame QB you would - rightly I would add -question why the gently caress didn't they ship Aaron out sooner and build around Jordan OR trade Jordan for assets to help push the roster over the edge to win a Superbowl because he either wasted a hall of fame QB MVP seasons or wasted the literal most valuable assets in football - a cheap, cost controlled great quarterback and both put you pretty firmly in the bad GM category.
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Apr 25, 2023 08:19
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As a Packer fan I have to say we are the dumbest fuckers in sports. Congrats I guess.
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Apr 25, 2023 12:12
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SKULL.GIF posted:Tom Brady broke the brains of absolutely everyone following this sport. Without exception, 31 of 32 NFL teams fail embarrassingly every single loving season. Big wrongo here. Lions did beautifully last year, and they didn’t even make the playoffs. The secret is to have your team suck so terribly for your entire life that guys having fun while they lose is a positive. You packers fans need to embrace the mediocrity of the NFC North. Look to the future, not the past.
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Apr 25, 2023 12:46
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The Packers have a better idea of what Jordan Love is capable of than anybody and they chose to start a broken Aaron Rodgers that was actively tanking their season over him. Don't delude yourselves over this guy.
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Apr 25, 2023 13:09
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MJeff posted:The Packers have a better idea of what Aaron Rodgers is capable of than anybody and they chose to start a broken Brett Favre that was actively tanking their season over him. Don't delude yourselves over this guy. fixed
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Apr 25, 2023 14:15
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I think Jordan Love's last game pass was an Int to Tracy Walker. Lions gambling den is betting on themselves to win it all.
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Apr 25, 2023 14:15
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Abugadu posted:fixed So beaten down that you've already acknowledged that this guy's ceiling is toxic playoff choker. 
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Apr 25, 2023 14:27
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MJeff posted:So beaten down that you've already acknowledged that this guy's ceiling is toxic playoff choker. I’ll take one SB victory in 15 years and be content.
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Apr 25, 2023 14:59
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