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https://www.theverge.com/2023/4/25/23696722/amd-ryzen-z1-z1-extreme-rog-ally AMD announced a line of gaming handheld-specific APUs, not just the Ally getting this
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Apr 25, 2023 14:37
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change my name posted:https://www.theverge.com/2023/4/25/23696722/amd-ryzen-z1-z1-extreme-rog-ally I'm left somewhat confused by these configurations. Why is there no 8CU configuration? Why do they think that gaming handhelds have a use for 8 CPU cores? 6 cores/12CU, 4 cores/8CU, and 4 cores/4CU would make much more sense and would surely be cheaper to produce too. There's a reason why, when valve commissioned a custom APU, they gave it only 4 cores. I guess at least the 6 core 4CU version will be good as an emulation device, but it will probably be slower than the steam deck for native x86 games.
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Apr 25, 2023 15:49
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I'm left somewhat confused by these configurations. Why is there no 8CU configuration? Why do they think that gaming handhelds have a use for 8 CPU cores? 6 cores/12CU, 4 cores/8CU, and 4 cores/4CU would make much more sense and would surely be cheaper to produce too. There's a reason why, when valve commissioned a custom APU, they gave it only 4 cores. The Zen 3 and 4 module is 8 cores. Unless AMD is having huge yield problems or having a really hard time selling 8 core parts, they're going to sell 8 core parts. Zen 2 had a 4 core complex, so quad cores made sense. The Steam deck is Zen 2.
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Apr 25, 2023 16:03
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Maybe the fix you were thinking of is turning off VRR in the windows graphics settings? In the Windows settings menu, go to display>graphics>default graphics settings and turn off the "variable refresh rate" setting. Note that this doesn't disable VRR/Gsync in games. Disabling that setting only prevents gsync from interacting with random windows programs and poo poo. Thanks for this!
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Apr 25, 2023 16:04
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I'm left somewhat confused by these configurations. Why is there no 8CU configuration? Why do they think that gaming handhelds have a use for 8 CPU cores? 6 cores/12CU, 4 cores/8CU, and 4 cores/4CU would make much more sense and would surely be cheaper to produce too. There's a reason why, when valve commissioned a custom APU, they gave it only 4 cores. It likely will still be better as the steam deck is quite limited on its tdp, I believe it's capped to 15W where a lot of the handheld PCs are going up to 20+ on up through 28w, though it really doesn't do much after 20w on a 6800u. The steam deck does have the benefit of having a known hardware configuration that the steam deck OS can optimize for, and the other handheld PCs don't, and it's observed in the steam deck doing more with 15w tdp than some other setups do all the way up to 28w.
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Apr 25, 2023 16:06
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Someone just posted that the ally will have a VRR display which is also a first. It’s also probably going to be the first handheld with a native landscape display.
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Apr 25, 2023 16:12
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what effect does having a rotated portrait display have in practice? i guess vsync tears would be vertical instead of horizontal?
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Apr 25, 2023 16:13
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The specs are impressive but battery life will make or break it as actually useful and cost will determine how much of a success it is.
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Apr 25, 2023 16:14
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repiv posted:what effect does having a rotated portrait display have in practice? That and older games have issues. Like directx 8 ones particularly hate it. It can also get annoying with driver updates. I just updated my aya neo and the latest amd driver put it back in portrait mode.
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Apr 25, 2023 16:15
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oh yeah, some phones have used rotated screens before and it results in a "jelly scrolling" effect when you scroll vertically https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IC1PBjgKQY that might be an OLED specific effect though, does that happen on the steam deck?
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Apr 25, 2023 16:19
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repiv posted:what effect does having a rotated portrait display have in practice? This probably doesn’t apply universally and I don’t know the source of the issue, but my M27Q monitor has considerably worse latency when it’s flipped 180 degrees (which you might be tempted to do because of its BGR sub pixel layout).
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Apr 25, 2023 16:21
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repiv posted:what effect does having a rotated portrait display have in practice? Minor but polarization is also applied in a different direction so you can't use it with polarized sunglasses, it's just black
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Apr 25, 2023 16:22
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hobbesmaster posted:This just means you need to read the motherboard compatibility list. It doesn’t matter how closely you read the QVL, an AM5 system is not getting good memory clocks stably with 4 DIMMs AFAIK. Though maybe it’s just 4x32 that is really bad.
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Apr 25, 2023 17:04
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More talking about the chip but this is nothing but good for pc/linux/laptop/mobile gaming. Throw one of these into a desktop for your kids and done, you have FSR and all the other amd goodies.
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Apr 25, 2023 17:53
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wargames posted:Throw one of these into a desktop for your kids and done, you have FSR and all the other amd goodies. It's very unlikely you'll be able to get your hands on one of these, specifically, outside the gray market. AMD has never offered any of the H/S/U suffixed APUs to anyone but manufacturing partners... but something that looks a lot like this (with a higher TDP) will probably be available later this year as a boxed G-series APU.
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Apr 25, 2023 19:27
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mdxi posted:It's very unlikely you'll be able to get your hands on one of these, specifically, outside the gray market. AMD has never offered any of the H/S/U suffixed APUs to anyone but manufacturing partners... but something that looks a lot like this (with a higher TDP) will probably be available later this year as a boxed G-series APU. It's just a rebranded 7840U with custom power tuning
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Apr 25, 2023 19:32
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edit: I misunderstood the post I was quoting, this product stack is dumb af. edit edit: I suppose it doesn't preclude an OEM from grabbing a more generic 7000-series APU and using those, these must be tuned to ASUS's specifications a la the R7 4800HS, but they must not have paid for exclusivity right this time around. SwissArmyDruid fucked around with this message at 20:32 on Apr 25, 2023 |
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Apr 25, 2023 19:32
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change my name posted:It's just a rebranded 7840U with custom power tuning I refer the gentlegoon to my statement re: H/S/U series APUs and the DIY consumer market
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Apr 25, 2023 20:15
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mdxi posted:I refer the gentlegoon to my statement re: H/S/U series APUs and the DIY consumer market Sorry, I misread the second part of that. Yes, you're not going to be able to buy a mobile CPU independently, but you could probably just get a budget laptop with a 780M for $500 on sale for your kid and they'll be happy.
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Apr 25, 2023 20:20
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I’m sure we will see some micro PC with them in it for a reasonable price. It happened this last generation.
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Apr 25, 2023 20:28
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change my name posted:It's just a rebranded 7840U with custom power tuning I wonder if it has a different packaging too? The 7840U has a pretty big overall footprint compared to the cute lil Van Gogh SoC in the deck. I imagine a smaller footprint would help the handheld designs? Or it could just be dumb marketing stuff as per usual lol.
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Apr 25, 2023 21:45
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Cygni posted:I wonder if it has a different packaging too? The 7840U has a pretty big overall footprint compared to the cute lil Van Gogh SoC in the deck. I imagine a smaller footprint would help the handheld designs? Nah, here's a pic of the Rog Ally's internals: https://videocardz.com/newz/asus-rog-ally-console-prototypes-have-been-pictured-featuring-a-closer-look-at-amd-ryzen-z1-extreme-chip It's like a full rear end laptop APU
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Apr 25, 2023 22:01
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change my name posted:Nah, here's a pic of the Rog Ally's internals: https://videocardz.com/newz/asus-rog-ally-console-prototypes-have-been-pictured-featuring-a-closer-look-at-amd-ryzen-z1-extreme-chip Yup sure does, didn't know that was the actual internals. Marketing at it again i guess.
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Apr 25, 2023 22:11
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I tried Windows 11 on a deck and it was immediately exhausting. That is 1 strike against the Ally.
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Apr 25, 2023 22:37
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Lockback posted:I tried Windows 11 on a deck and it was immediately exhausting. That is 1 strike against the Ally. I'm really not convinced something like a front end could fix it totally.
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Apr 25, 2023 22:51
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Lockback posted:I'd be interested in what kind of performance difference there actually is on a non-multi tasked system at 16GB vs 32GB. That said, if I were building a new system I'd get 32GB but I'm not looking to upgrade from 16 until I actually have a scenario in front of me that makes a substantive difference. There are YouTube videos about it. The answer is sometimes there's a decent difference in 1% and 0.1% lows but that's about it.
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Apr 25, 2023 23:28
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E: ^ I recently upgraded from 4x8GB of Micron E die to 4x32GB of B die. There's no fuckin way I'm ever getting to 3800mhz/1800FCLK again, but it's still holding decently tight timings (CL16-16-16-32-50? iirc) at 1.385v. It's just enough to offset the fucky E die timings I was using. 1/0.1% lows improved ever so slightly which surprised me. Otherwise I've not found any regressions in the limited testing I've done Subjunctive posted:I did always wonder why ray tracing used random rays rather than just iterating the light sources, generating sorted sample sets, and walking them. Anything that doesn’t get hit is in shadow, badabing. Don't ask me to explain this paper: A Generalized Ray Formulation For Wave-Optics Rendering, but it seems like there are better ways to model and calculate this sort of stuff that we haven't quite figured out yet. Dogen posted:Pininfarina is out of cars and into GPUs!  Give me a blower card with last gen style Pontiac Trans Am style flared hood scoops.MarcusSA posted:I'm really not convinced something like a front end could fix it totally. I can't find the article but there's some skunkworks project within MSFT to make a steamdeck-friendly interface that is allegedly coming together well enough that it might see the light of day. They're real mad about Linux again 🍿 New Zealand can eat me fucked around with this message at 07:06 on Apr 26, 2023 |
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Apr 26, 2023 06:57
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Lockback posted:I tried Windows 11 on a deck and it was immediately exhausting. That is 1 strike against the Ally. Yeah, that's the thing, hardware is really a small part of the equation
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Apr 26, 2023 07:37
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alguJBl-R3I&t=827s I'd be super smug about my $500 A4000 but it recently started blue screening while watching youtube.
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Apr 26, 2023 09:33
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can't you just install steamos? it's just a pc, surely it can run lunix
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Apr 26, 2023 10:17
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Kivi posted:I'd be super smug about my $500 A4000 but it recently started blue screening while watching youtube. that's just nvidia driver 99% of the time, try downgrading/upgrading it and see if it still happens
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Apr 26, 2023 10:19
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Truga posted:can't you just install steamos? it's just a pc, surely it can run lunix Is the steam deck version of steamos actually available for general use yet? the one that comes up on google is an ancient version that isn't supported anymore.
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Apr 26, 2023 10:25
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Is the steam deck version of steamos actually available for general use yet? the one that comes up on google is an ancient version that isn't supported anymore. ETAPrime has made a bunch of videos where he uses a project to allow the Steam Deck OS to work on desktops. The primary limitation is that it only works with AMD GPUs.
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Apr 26, 2023 10:28
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Kivi posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alguJBl-R3I&t=827s don't blame me I've been on team "buy the 3090 if you are going to buy one gpu during covid" for a while, it was closest to msrp and the best long term deal at its msrp and also mining unlocked but yes NVIDIA's current gen are insufficiently specced below the top end. 4090 is fine-ish. everything below that is kinda stingy, I agree, it is barely specced to handle current games at target resolutions. horizon zero dawn (on 3080) was the tip of the sphere on LOD swapdowns, and that was a couple years ago, the "bad port effect" has been a long time coming. imagine if GPU compute ever takes off and needs a resident dataset in VRAM etc. (There actually are 3070 16GB, it's called a Mobile 3080 16GB.) And discrete systems simply can't match certain types of compute magic (coherent buses/etc) and just need relatively higher spec/cost. Like I do see it, enthusiast gaming hardware costs are going up hugely and that's where the profit in the market lies right now. You can still build a much better system than a console but you can't compete on raw cost anymore, not even close. A good PC build is like $1500 minimum now unless you buy refurb/used poo poo. 5800X3D is a powerhouse, and big DDR4 ECC UDIMMs are cheap and reliable, while DDR5 builds are expensive and fickle but have an upgrade path. But what you put together for $700 doesn't compare favorably against a console or w/e. the ampere a4000 remains very interesting as a single-slot powerhouse. the low-profile ada a4000 replacement doesn't quite fit the same form-factors, and it has quadro capabilities (passthrough, CAD/etc) and 16gb so actually it's desirable and prices seem to have bounced up (to ~$600 from a low of around $450). of course AMD are not racing to launch their own "Radeon VII II"/RDNA3 Frontier Edition either. nobody really wants to cut too far into the workstation/server/hpc market. like you could totes launch a 7900XT 40GB right? $749, in the classic Radeon VII tradition? Any day now, I bet. Should you really be accepting this much inflation over the original Frontier Edition price tiering? Or such a drastic drop in relative specs at this price point? Is a Frontier Edition ever really worth more than $749? That's what we paid in 2017... Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at 11:57 on Apr 26, 2023 |
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Apr 26, 2023 10:32
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4080 isn't stringy on specs, it's just priced like crap.
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Apr 26, 2023 14:22
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Subjunctive posted:I did always wonder why ray tracing used random rays rather than just iterating the light sources, generating sorted sample sets, and walking them. Anything that doesn’t get hit is in shadow, badabing.
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Apr 26, 2023 18:24
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It's a classic Monte Carlo approach. Shoot the rays randomly and sum the results. Keep adding rays until it converges. It's what they do for photorealistic renders for movies
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Apr 26, 2023 18:33
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Shipon posted:Nintendo has correctly realized its playerbase doesn't care about graphics very much so they lean more into good art design that can run on a potato. Not the worst strategy, to be honest repiv posted:unfortunately even with their low-fi art direction the current potato is struggling to keep up, like the advance wars remake isn't much to look at but has unstable FPS even after being delayed for a year case in point, BOTW2/TOTK previews are going up and the already meagre target of 30fps (without motion blur to fill the gaps) is regularly missed  i haven't seen any detailed frame counts but some of the footage looks to be in the 20-25fps range
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Apr 26, 2023 20:32
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Can someone explain why anisotropic filtering keeps being broken in games on my systems. Last 3 computers I had, GT555M, GTX970M and RTX2070S, they all had this issue of AF just not working unless I forced it in Nvidia control panel. I ended up forcing it on globally because it's an issue in many games. But even then there are games where it doesn't work or randomly stops working after game or driver update. I think the latest one of that kind is Forza Horizon 4, I'm pretty sure it had functioning AF first 100 hours I played, but about a month ago it just doesn't work anymore or is limited to low value like 4x. Does this happen to anyone else or has anyone read about this being an issue? I want to at least know I'm not alone in this. Sininu fucked around with this message at 21:24 on Apr 26, 2023 |
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Apr 26, 2023 21:20
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repiv posted:case in point, BOTW2/TOTK previews are going up and the already meagre target of 30fps (without motion blur to fill the gaps) is regularly missed The awful performance of the most recent Pokemon game and disappointing performance of ToTK make me think the Switch Pro was actually a thing and those games were targeting it originally for ideal gameplay. I'd wait to play ToTK on the next Nintendo system if I could trust Nintendo to make it backwards compatible and improve the performance.
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Apr 26, 2023 21:23
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