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Jorath posted:Does 'sandbagged' in climbing mean that the routes are harder than advertised? In volleyball (my primary sport) "sandbagging" means "playing in a division below your skill level (in order to win easily) ". Yeah, that's what it means in climbing. It's either first ascensionist's open ended grading system anxiety about the humiliation of someone downgrading the route on the second ascent, or bragging about how it only felt 5.9 to them. In competitive road cycling I think it means acting weak to lure someone into chasing you. Then you "let the sand out" and burn them off. Weird how three pursuits use the same word.
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Apr 17, 2023 21:46
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Endjinneer posted:Weird how three pursuits use the same word. lot of sports use it I believe. poker definitely. I had to google into it a bit just now, apparently it comes from way back when "ruffians" would sneak up on someone and use a bag (sock?) filled with sand to knock someone out and rob them. Were some rocks mixed in with that sand?? Sandbagging => robbing someone => later the connotation of acting weak to rob/steal/cheat, maybe from cards/gambling. And now climbing has just the acting weak piece.
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Apr 17, 2023 22:17
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Baddog posted:lot of sports use it I believe. poker definitely. Wow, I always assumed it had to do with like, weighing yourself down with sandbags (as you would a hot air balloon), maybe to fake or artificially create a disadvantage? but I could never really make that metaphor make sense. Thanks.
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Apr 17, 2023 22:54
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I’ll tell you all, I was intensely uninspired when I headed to the climbing gym last night, just wasn’t feeling it all. And then a little kid marveled at me from the ground while I was negotiating a roof and I tell you I felt like I could climb a 5.14 So basically get yourself a miniature hype man and watch as your projects bend to your will
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Apr 20, 2023 01:42
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I felt this way yesterday when working with a new guy on a V3. I sucked (hadn't climbed anything challenging in weeks, and had just run laps up and down the auto belay), but he was impressed anyway. Made me feel great, even as a relatively new climber. Thanks all for the tips on rappelling. I was taught how to do it by two different experienced climbers, neither of which even mentioned having a backup/third hand or extended rappel. I learned that stuff from youtube. And now I've learned to use the Rap rings from the internet. I had always assumed that "sandbagging" in Volleyball meant that you would be playing at that level if you had sandbags tied to you. Thanks for the research.
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Apr 20, 2023 05:59
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Freaquency posted:So basically get yourself a miniature hype man and watch as your projects bend to your will I had the opposite experience, I had a kid in rental shoes come up and ask if I needed beta after watching me fail the crux of a route. I said sure, why not, and turns out rental shoes kid had some pretty good tips on transitioning from the overhang to the headwall. I was able to send the route after watching him. It was hilarious, he even made a point to come back over and ask me how it went. Thanks miniature coach!
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Apr 20, 2023 12:49
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Kid feet grow fast. Rental shoes happen on my kid sometimes and she climbs way harder than most. Can absolutely imagine her giving a beta. Maybe mini coach sends stuff. Either way, you sent it so way to go!
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Apr 24, 2023 02:50
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my crew and i went outside for the first time a couple weeks ago and it went great! it was way too loving hot (30 degrees) but we found shelter in cracks/caves where still cold winter air was coming out. it was awesome. i normally climb in the high 5.10s and low 5.11s in the gym and was terrified leading my first 5.5 outside lol. i'm dying to get back outside but we just got an early window of nice weather, it's been rainy since then and at least another week of rain ahead  at some point this year i'd like to try a multipitch. there's not a ton near me (most of southern ontario is hilly with the odd jutting out of niagara escarpment, almost exclusively single pitch) but there is one 70 m 4 pitch slab that is bolted the whole way up i've been looking at. when we were climbing outside we set up quads on the anchors for the rest of our party for toproping on, so me and my brother (currently the only 2 leaders in our group) have experience setting and cleaning anchors in that way. i've read a few articles but figured i'd ask here as well: what additional gear and skills are required for sport multi-pitch that we may not have for sport single pitch?
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Apr 27, 2023 17:35
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You need to learn how to belay from above and how those devices work. Learn to rap if you don't know how. I would ditch the quad, just use two draws for top roping, use a locker if you are worried. What route you looking at?
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Apr 27, 2023 17:48
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yeah we only used the quad cause we had several top ropers, and even then it was partly an excuse to just use/learn that anchor for future uses (like sport multipitch). next time we're probably just gonna go with 2 locking draws. learning to rap is a big one, yeah. belaying from above i've read is pretty straightforward with a grigri - which is what we use - so i'm not worried there. the route we're looking at is at eagles nest up in bancroft. there's a fair bit of multipitch there, almost all trad (or mixed). just 1 sport route - Migizi Wazoson
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Apr 27, 2023 18:36
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I would think you'd still want a sling/cordelette anchor handy for anchors that are in a weird place or not at even height. But this brings up an interesting question I've been wondering about for a while. And I say this as someone who always uses a quad, cause if I already have it handy why bother bringing two locking draws as well. The common wisdom I've always heard (that was also hinted at above) is this: go ahead and use opposing draws (at least one locking) if just one or two top ropes are happening on it. Use a quad (or cordelette/sling anchor of choice) if people are top roping on it a whole lot. Why? Why would it make a difference how many times it's being climbed? If draws are safe for one TR, why are they any less safe for 12? If a quad is safer for 12, why wouldn't you want the same level of safety for 1?
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Apr 27, 2023 18:53
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hot cocoa on the couch posted:yeah we only used the quad cause we had several top ropers, and even then it was partly an excuse to just use/learn that anchor for future uses (like sport multipitch). next time we're probably just gonna go with 2 locking draws. Why use lockers for TR?
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Apr 27, 2023 19:04
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Sigmund Fraud posted:Why use a quad for MP? i could ask the very same in return, i'm new to outdoor climbing and only have the wisdom of my teachers and what i've read on the internet. i assume you're testing my knowledge. but from what i know: for single pitch sport: draws are fine for TR because bolts are typically spaced to allow easy equalization and load sharing, without putting the carabiner at an unfavourable loading angle. my draws are rated for 22 kn each so this system is reasonably equalized, strong and redundant. lockers ensure the gates don't open if the draws are pulled against a rock in a weird way for multi pitch sport: a quad is a commonly recommended anchor because it is redundant, strong and easy to equalize even on weirdly spaced bolts. you can attach multiple climbers and haul bags directly to the anchor. it is easy to configure the length to make it comfortable to belay off of. most importantly me and my climbing partner have rehearsed it a lot and can tie and construct the anchor with our eyes closed. we use lockers on our quad as well, btw hot cocoa on the couch fucked around with this message at 19:22 on Apr 27, 2023 |
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Apr 27, 2023 19:19
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alnilam posted:I would think you'd still want a sling/cordelette anchor handy for anchors that are in a weird place or not at even height. this is actually a great question. i've also heard this common wisdom but i don't know why either.
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Apr 27, 2023 19:20
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hot cocoa on the couch posted:this is actually a great question. i've also heard this common wisdom but i don't know why either. Wisdom like this makes a lot of assumptions. A properly tied quad, with cord in good condition, which is then used correctly on good bolts or good trad placements, is a very safe anchor solution. Two gates opposed quickdraws, also in good condition on good bolt/gear, is also a very safe anchor solution. If I'm setting a top rope for group use, and I know it's going to be up for a while and see a bunch of climbs, I will put up a quad for peace of mind. That's particularly true in the scenario where most of the people climbing that line are gym climbers who only top rope. If I'm out with a group of 6 trad climbers and we're all storming up a few sport lines, I will probably just throw two quickdraws on it because I know everyone who is going to climb it is competent enough to not do something stupid at the top. The quad is more foolproof, but both are "safe". On the flipside, if I'm tag teaming a trad line that I know has bolted anchors, sometimes my partner and I will each carry a pre-tied quad because it's fast and easy and not all that heavy. It also means you have some cord and extra lockers on hand if something goes wrong and you need to improvise.
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Apr 27, 2023 19:58
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Any particular tips for bouldering outside? Got two huge crash pads, so set on that. I'm coming off recovery from a wrist injury, so I'm going to climb exclusively on the lowest grades, but was curious if there's anything i should look out for going from gym -> actual rock.
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Apr 27, 2023 20:17
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RIP ZEEZ
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foutre posted:Any particular tips for bouldering outside? Got two huge crash pads, so set on that. I'm coming off recovery from a wrist injury, so I'm going to climb exclusively on the lowest grades, but was curious if there's anything i should look out for going from gym -> actual rock. Snakes, hornets, wasps
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Apr 27, 2023 20:45
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hot cocoa on the couch posted:this is actually a great question. i've also heard this common wisdom but i don't know why either. The gyms I work at all use two opposing non-lockers as TR anchors. Nobody's dead yet. Outside draws are much more multi functional than some pre tied anchor. For one it allows you to clip two more bolts should the route have more bolts than you anticipated. Or use as a personal anchor to, for example, go in direct. For a commercial setting with non climbers it's standard to use a non-openable anchor when outdoors. But with friends whom you trust not to clean the anchor they're hanging off I don't see the point. One argument I've heard for not using draws as anchors is to reduce wear on the bottom biner. I don't agree. Provided you don't climb at mega sandy locations and drag your rope through the dirt the wear isn't that bad. I just retired a bunch of old draws for wear and none of them had significant damage to the bottom biner. They all had quite badly damaged top biners from bolt hangers (sharp steel wins out against aluminium). Do you want to wear out expensive lockers when you could spread out the wear over 15 different draws?
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Apr 27, 2023 21:38
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hot cocoa on the couch posted:for single pitch sport: draws are fine for TR because bolts are typically spaced to allow easy equalization and load sharing, without putting the carabiner at an unfavourable loading angle. hot cocoa on the couch posted:what additional gear and skills are required for sport multi-pitch that we may not have for sport single pitch? As for skills, I recommend multipitchclimbing.com but don't overthink it and go for some advanced system. Just keep it simple and you'll be fine. Pick a day not too windy and you'll be able to communicate by shouting when at different anchors. You want to avoid confusion. Also talk through your system before hand. A walk off is preferable to rapping of you're new. Rapping multiple pitches can be confusing. Sigmund Fraud fucked around with this message at 21:59 on Apr 27, 2023 |
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Apr 27, 2023 21:41
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My buddies and I are doing a Colorado trip this summer, and are trying to decide between Salida and Durango. I've been to Salida before and am somewhat familiar with the climbing options in the area, but not Durango. Has anyone here climbed there? What is it like?
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Apr 28, 2023 00:11
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Slow News Day posted:My buddies and I are doing a Colorado trip this summer, and are trying to decide between Salida and Durango. I've been to Salida before and am somewhat familiar with the climbing options in the area, but not Durango. Has anyone here climbed there? What is it like? Define summer. Both are going to be hot as balls potentially. Sigmund Fraud posted:One argument I've heard for not using draws as anchors is to reduce wear on the bottom biner. I don't agree. Provided you don't climb at mega sandy locations and drag your rope through the dirt the wear isn't that bad. I just retired a bunch of old draws for wear and none of them had significant damage to the bottom biner. They all had quite badly damaged top biners from bolt hangers (sharp steel wins out against aluminium). Do you want to wear out expensive lockers when you could spread out the wear over 15 different draws? If you do a ton of TR you can always get a couple steel cabs. foutre posted:Any particular tips for bouldering outside? Got two huge crash pads, so set on that. I'm coming off recovery from a wrist injury, so I'm going to climb exclusively on the lowest grades, but was curious if there's anything i should look out for going from gym -> actual rock. Assume your spotters are worthless as most of them are half paying attention at best. hot cocoa on the couch posted:i could ask the very same in return, i'm new to outdoor climbing and only have the wisdom of my teachers and what i've read on the internet. i assume you're testing my knowledge. but from what i know: in a TR situation the loads are basically non existent. Plus equalization is pretty much a lie anyways. I have used the quad, even used it on a 10 pitch sport climb. It is fine but I would rather just use my cord to tie an anchor in the right spot. There is something to be said about being comfortable with a system so I will give you that. being adaptable is pretty important in multipitch climbing though. Looks like a fun route.
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Apr 28, 2023 02:45
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spwrozek posted:Define summer. Both are going to be hot as balls potentially. End of July. I live in Texas so Colorado summers don't bother me at all.
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Apr 28, 2023 02:50
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Slow News Day posted:My buddies and I are doing a Colorado trip this summer, and are trying to decide between Salida and Durango. I've been to Salida before and am somewhat familiar with the climbing options in the area, but not Durango. Has anyone here climbed there? What is it like? I’ve only bouldered in Durango, but sailing hawks was fun, and has some very quality sandstone. It’s also shaded for parts of the day, so you can easily get some good half days in the morning or evening. Turtle lake will be too hot. Didn’t try anything else while I was there
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Apr 28, 2023 22:57
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My daughters' school had an event at the local gym last night. None of us had ever done anything like it, but something sparked in my 10 year old like I'd never seen in a class or sport or activity. While most of her friends played around for a half hour then made smores and gossipped, she harnessed up in the auto belay room and didn't leave for over 2 hours. Her only complaint the whole way home was, "ninja class sucks, I want to do this," and "why are the little nubs close to the ground so hard to use?" I read the OP while she was in the bath, and when I told her we should have rented shoes instead of climbing in our sneakers, she was all-in. Very much, "this is who I am now" energy. I also had a terrific time, and aside from being sore (obviously) it's kind of all I can think about today. I don't really have a question, other than about shoes. Should we rush out and have them before we go again (assuming we join)? Are rentals actually just OK for the time being? The REI down the road has a pair for $90. Everything in the pro shop was $200. Are the $90s OK for me? Are even cheaper shoes on Amazon OK for the kids, since they're growing? I think our next thing is a big family conversation about whether we want to actually join, having slept on it, and if so getting into the intro to bouldering class (for me) and whatever kids instructional stuff there is for them. e: the two of us realizing that the colors mattered and what the little tags meant was a great moment. We were so excited! Huxley fucked around with this message at 17:19 on May 8, 2023 |
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May 8, 2023 17:17
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Rental shoes are awful, it’s a good investment to buy some shoes of your own if you’re climbing more than twice a month, but it’s not worth buying the $200 pairs yet. I would recommend trying on a bunch at your gym and/or a REI and making a choice based on fit/feel. Glad you found climbing and welcome to never being bored again (when you’re climbing)! I’ve never had to fit a kid for shoes, but I imagine they grow so quick that cheaper ones should be fine . . . Personally that might even be the one scenario I’d consider buying them used? Ubiquitus fucked around with this message at 17:29 on May 8, 2023 |
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May 8, 2023 17:26
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I can't believe they even let you climb with sneakers, that's weird. I wouldn't buy shoes before getting a membership; make sure you both definitely really enjoy it before dropping money on shoes. Rentals are perfectly serviceable while learning, hell even as an intermediate climber you can still wear rentals and climb well. Definitely go the cheap route on shoes for a first pair, absolutely no reason to be blowing $200 on shoes as a newcomer. Like, I've been climbing for 4 years, I make good money and only just bought a $220 pair because I had a decent REI giftcard to burn. My first 2 or 3 pairs were all in the $80 - $120 range. Just get whatever fits tightly without being uncomfortable. Definitely try on as many pairs as you can to make sure they feel good.
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May 8, 2023 17:28
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Sab669 posted:I can't believe they even let you climb with sneakers, that's weird. super normal for kids parties and stuff. Huxley posted:My daughters' school had an event at the local gym last night. None of us had ever done anything like it, but something sparked in my 10 year old like I'd never seen in a class or sport or activity. I typically buy the cheapest shoe I can find for the gym. even with great technique (which you will not have) the walls and holds at a gym are very abrasive. Also using rental shoes a few more times is totally fine. I will rent shoes on work travel on a whim every once in a while to go to a gym, it really is totally fine. Also way to back your daughter on wanting to dive into the sport, it is great fun.
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May 8, 2023 17:54
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That's awesome Huxley. I agree with rentals, for the first couple sessions at least! Fyi, for anyone just getting into the sport, you do NOT want a shoe that is too aggressive/tight/bind-y. A bit comfortable and flat is ok to start (although that is gonna be relative). Everyone at my kids climbing gym went through La Sportiva Maverinks like crazy, but it seems like they don't make them anymore, bah. I dunno about these Tarantula Jrs, but the Aragon gets a thumbs up now for more relaxed/casual stuff. Still a bit expensive, maybe a second shoe (or a candidate for your first). I wouldn't buy anything on amazon just yet, you gotta try these on, cus the sizing is a bit unpredictable. Depends if you want to wear socks or not too. You're gonna want her to be *psyched* about this purchase, not "gently caress I hate wearing these shoes".
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May 8, 2023 17:56
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The Tenaya Tanta is my preferred bang for the buck gym shoe, $110 full price and if you wait for a coupon or sale you can get them for around $90. Although I am using a really old pair of Scarpa Vapors right now.
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May 8, 2023 18:00
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Tarantulaces are a good gym shoe imo
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May 8, 2023 19:09
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I suggest you get her a pair of entry level shoes as soon as possible if she's the kind of kid that doesn't switch hobbies every few months. You'll save money quite quickly (unless rentals are super cheap at your gym) and it's more fun to climb in shoes that aren't super slippery. The exact pair doesn't really matter, just get her to try the entry level shoes from all the brands available and let her pick something she thinks looks nice and isn't uncomfortable. You could also look at used shoes since kids don't go through shoes very fast at all. All the shoes my kids have were bought used and were in almost perfect condition. I don't know where you live, but Decathlon probably has the cheapest entry level shoe you can find and they are more than adequate for a beginner gym climber.
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May 8, 2023 19:40
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My Moccasyms finally wore out after like 10 years and I had to get new shoes and I was sad to discover, after trying on like 20 different types of shoe in multiple sizes, that the TC Pros really were *easily* the most comfortable shoe for my foot. Stupid feet with expensive taste > : (
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May 8, 2023 20:16
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Papercut posted:My Moccasyms finally wore out after like 10 years :| How many resoles did you get out of that pair?
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May 8, 2023 21:49
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Papercut posted:My Moccasyms finally wore out after like 10 years and I had to get new shoes and I was sad to discover, after trying on like 20 different types of shoe in multiple sizes, that the TC Pros really were *easily* the most comfortable shoe for my foot. Stupid feet with expensive taste > : ( Have you tried unparallel moccs? Same factory as the old 5.10 stuff before they got bought by Adidas, with designs that are barely legally distinct from the 5.10 line.
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May 8, 2023 21:58
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KingColliwog posted::| How many resoles did you get out of that pair? I think twice? There was a long period in there that I took off from climbing. interrodactyl posted:Have you tried unparallel moccs? Same factory as the old 5.10 stuff before they got bought by Adidas, with designs that are barely legally distinct from the 5.10 line. I had no idea these existed! It's okay though, the new shoes feel real good on my feet 
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May 9, 2023 02:27
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Yeah but it's always good to have a backup pair of shoes or two...
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May 9, 2023 02:34
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It is annoyingly hard trying to find climbing shoes to fit big wide feet
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May 9, 2023 06:27
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Butora has wide versions of their shoes
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May 9, 2023 14:36
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Some shoe manufacturers also tend to go narrow/wide. from my understanding Scarpa, Butora, Evolv are the ones you want to check out for larger wider feet. If you check out each manufacturer’s website they’ve gotten better about specifying what foot width specific shoe lasts/families are intended for.
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May 9, 2023 17:07
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anyone else use thecrag.com? i quite like it and it seems to have more thorough coverage of my local climbing scene. hard to gauge which is the "most popular" in my area. mountainproject seems to be missing a lot, both content and feature wise
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May 9, 2023 17:10
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