(Thread IKs:
ZShakespeare)
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jettisonedstuff posted:Do they have some argument for why Trudeau and Fortier will suddenly decide to give us all WFH and the 15% increase over 3 years in exchange for no concessions when they can just wait us out, eventually get to binding arbitration and take the PIC recommendations instead? Hold on, what “concessions” do you think your labour union is offering up here?
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May 4, 2023 01:30
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| # ? Jun 7, 2024 11:57 |
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Arbitrators are sticklers for tying wage increases to inflation. If money is all that matters it's the way you wanna go. Largely the reason cops are so highly paid now. I don't think that would have worked out for the gov
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May 4, 2023 03:01
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infernal machines posted:It helps them by raising their leverage, by forcing the Liberal government to do the political calculus between offering a better contract or "spending political capital" to try to pass legislation to force them into arbitration. Obviously. The point being made is that Jettison thinks the calculus has been made by the Libs and unless you were in on the negotiations you have no idea what their stance in private actually is. Everyone is criticising the deal without having the information to make such a judgement. They are making a declaration in an information vacuum based on their political biases.
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May 4, 2023 03:31
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What matters is what the membership in aggregate believe, and so far we've only had a few PSAC members post here. This is a politics forum on something awful dot com, I have no idea what you think the standard of discourse is here, but I guarantee you it's stupid. So yes, people are posting their takes based on their political biases, because that is the thing that is done here.
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May 4, 2023 03:34
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infernal machines posted:What matters is what the membership in aggregate believe, and so far we've only had a few PSAC members post here. excuse me there are three rules with corresponding sections and subsections about creating discourse in this very subforum that is the exact opposite of stupid, you [[personal attack under rule I.C.1]]
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May 4, 2023 03:59
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Koos will not tread here, I think you've seen to that.
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May 4, 2023 04:09
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infernal machines posted:Koos will not tread here, I think you've seen to that. accusations! accusations from a friend and former ally! wounded i am, wounded!
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May 4, 2023 04:13
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Well this is pretty bold
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May 4, 2023 04:55
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https://twitter.com/CraigBaird/status/1641869267288338432?s=20 This didn't get enough love
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May 4, 2023 05:58
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drat I didn't realize Diefenbaker killed Laura Palmer
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May 4, 2023 06:19
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Thinking about the Toronto Life writer who had a breakdown because there weren't any Jungle Jims in an Edmonton exurb
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May 4, 2023 13:42
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DaysBefore posted:Thinking about the Toronto Life writer who had a breakdown because there weren't any Jungle Jims in an Edmonton exurb Pardon? This sounds like it should be something like a Rainforest Cafe
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May 4, 2023 13:44
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Oh sorry it was Cactus Club lol
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May 4, 2023 13:46
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Aaayyyyy PSAC member reporting in here, and the general mood from my co-workers is "this deal kinda sucks, did we spend two weeks striking for that?" but it varies from person to person whether they're more irritated with the wage increase amounts or the general toothlessness around WFH changes. Me, I'm mostly too sore in the joints from all the picketing to have a stronger opinion than wanting to see the full deal details, and I want to get some perspective on the matter that's not cranky knee-jerk Facebook comments. Thanks for the additional context RE: ACFO, jettisonedstuff, that was helpful and clarifying.
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May 4, 2023 14:17
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ACTRA union members have been locked out for over a year from doing any commercial work in Canada (the agencies are trying to cut rates 80% or more, back to pre 1990s rates) and the CBC has done more hits on the WGA strike in the last few days than the preceding year about ACTRA. My wife is basically making 1/10th what she made in the previous year due to the lockout, this sucks
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May 4, 2023 14:41
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jettisonedstuff posted:The problem is that there's nothing forcing the government to give us a wage increase matching inflation and that's not a default expectation with collective bargaining agreements, especially not in periods of high inflation. There's no law that says the government has to give us yearly inflation adjustments and no arbitrator is going to give it to us, we have to negotiate that for every contract. By your logic, there's no reason to engage in job action or even have a union, because the employer will just give you whatever it feels like and refuse to budge. And it's perfectly valid to complain that the wage increases don't match inflation, or that your union took you out on strike without actually gaining much of anything.
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May 4, 2023 15:38
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Nilbop posted:Hold on, what “concessions” do you think your labour union is offering up here? If we know roughly what the result of binding arbitration would be, there isn't much incentive for either side to take a deal significantly worse for them than that. The difference between a contract agreed upon by the union and employer and a contract through arbitration is going to be based on how badly each side wants to avoid further strike action. If one side wants to move the wage increase around, they have to concede on something else to convince the other side, because the endgame is always just going to binding arbitration, the result of which is usually pretty clear from the outset (it's very clear in this case). IMO the increase that we got over the ACFO contract/PIC recommendations represents the government's interest in ending the strike early, and I don't think the pressure would have built on them faster than it would have on union members in subsequent weeks of striking. linoleum floors posted:Arbitrators are sticklers for tying wage increases to inflation. Gonna need a citation on that, specifically for Canadian government workers' CBA's. To my knowledge the pattern is generally that government workers usually do a bit better than inflation in low inflation years and are below in high inflation years. Like I posted above, ACFO signed a deal last fall significantly below inflation and the PIC released recommendations in February with similar wage increase figures. I shouldn't poo poo on them too much, as they might have had good reason to think they wouldn't have gotten a better deal than that, I'm not really sure. I get that people are upset but generally union demands aren't met in full. These CBA negotiations start out with both sides tabling pie-in-the-sky demands and they bargain their way to something in between. Neither side can publicly claim what their settling point is as it would preclude them from getting anything more than that, so union members need to use their brains and read between the lines a bit. If you are disappointed and demand the leadership/negotiators heads every time they settle for something below their initial demands you'll be firing your leaders after every CBA.
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May 4, 2023 15:51
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tagesschau posted:By your logic, there's no reason to engage in job action or even have a union, because the employer will just give you whatever it feels like and refuse to budge. The employer was offering 8% over 4 years up until the union's strike deadline and we ended up with 12%. At the strike deadline they offered 9%/3years. We ended up with 9.75% over 3 years. The .75% increase over 9%/3 years (which we would not have gotten in arbitration or caving early) pays off my lost wages due to strike pay in less than two years, and I will continue getting that for the rest of my career, compounded with any other future increases. It definitely paid off. It's valid to complain about anything. What I'd like is for people to be realistic about what our union leaders are able to achieve, given the very real constraints they have to bargain under and the risks to members they have to consider. There are valid complaints and criticisms to be made but insisting that just continuing the strike indefinitely would have led to the government caving and giving us all of our initial demands is ignorant. We could have ended up with 6-8 weeks of striking, complete depletion of PSAC and several other union's strike funds (unions loan each other money to fund strike actions), and a large proportion of PSAC members essentially being forced to scab with no agreement reached. Such a situation would have resulted in the union either taking whatever the government had on the table or asking for binding arbitration, which, again, would have gotten us roughly the PIC recommendation/ACFO deal.
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May 4, 2023 17:14
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Petanque posted:drat I didn't realize Diefenbaker killed Laura Palmer jowlishly "she was a punk!"
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May 4, 2023 18:02
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jettisonedstuff posted:The employer was offering 8% over 4 years up until the union's strike deadline and we ended up with 12%. At the strike deadline they offered 9%/3years. We ended up with 9.75% over 3 years. The .75% increase over 9%/3 years (which we would not have gotten in arbitration or caving early) pays off my lost wages due to strike pay in less than two years, and I will continue getting that for the rest of my career, compounded with any other future increases. It definitely paid off. That doesn't change the fact that the union accepted a tentative deal that constitutes a pay cut in real-dollar terms relative the end of the previous collective agreement. And that's not even considering how much of that would be eaten up by them forcing you back into the office five days a week for no good reason. It would be one thing to have accepted a tad less than inflation in exchange for concessions on remote work or workload, but the employer didn't budge on either of those, so I feel perfectly comfortable saying that it's anything but a win for the union.
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May 4, 2023 18:07
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The union should be doing media conferences deriding the government for forcing a below inflation wage deal on Canadiaa and putting pressure on them that way. (Though it is getting lost in the noise of everything the government is up to this week)
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May 4, 2023 18:28
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https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/psac-union-cra-strike-deal-1.6829165 "One difference in the union's Thursday announcement about the CRA deal is that remote work requests would be assessed individually and will be subject to grievances." Sticking it out seems to have granted them a much better contract on remote work. 3 days longer and stronger.
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May 4, 2023 19:13
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Chillyrabbit posted:The union should be doing media conferences deriding the government for forcing a below inflation wage deal on Canadiaa and putting pressure on them that way. (Though it is getting lost in the noise of everything the government is up to this week) 👏Media👏is👏owned👏by👏Capital👏too👏 Another Bill fucked around with this message at 19:33 on May 4, 2023 |
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May 4, 2023 19:19
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MikeC posted:Just not ready Belated lol for dredging up a failed 8 year-old Conservative meme.
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May 4, 2023 19:26
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Nice hair though
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May 4, 2023 20:16
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folytopo posted:https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/psac-union-cra-strike-deal-1.6829165 Sounds like the same thing as the rest of the PSAC unions got: https://psacunion.ca/psac-has-reached-tentative-agreement-pa-sv-tc-and "PSAC members will now be protected from arbitrary decisions about remote work. We have negotiated language in a letter of agreement that requires managers to assess remote work requests individually, not by group, and provide written responses that will allow members and PSAC to hold the employer accountable to equitable and fair decision-making on remote work. Having all remote work requests reviewed on an individual basis will prevent future "one size fits all" type mandates like the government announced in December last year. That means employee rights around remote work arrangements will be protected through a grievance process, and grievances that are not settled prior to the final step of the grievance process can be referred to a new joint union-management panel for review in each department to address issues related to the employer’s application of the remote work directive in the workplace. "
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May 4, 2023 20:23
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It sure sounds like requests to work remotely more than three days a week are going to be categorically denied.Government of Canada posted:The Government of Canada continues to be committed to a modern, hybrid workplace that provides employees, where applicable, with the flexibility to continue to work up to 3 days from home a week. I see absolutely no indicator that the larger PSAC bargaining unit got anything remotely along the lines of "remote work shall be approved unless there's a business case for it being denied."
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May 4, 2023 20:36
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https://twitter.com/thejagmeetsingh/status/1654187892640567324?s=46&t=dQl6Iu6Wmq7antcZ30Prgw
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May 4, 2023 21:16
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On the one hand, that's cheesy as gently caress. On the other hand... he's not wrong.
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May 4, 2023 21:38
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cringe, but positive cringe.
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May 4, 2023 22:22
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Be the cringe you want to see in the world.
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May 5, 2023 02:06
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I refuse to believe Jagmeet's chest is that sparse.
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May 5, 2023 02:11
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Shockingly, he was arrested. However, since that was his plan to begin with, good news?
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May 5, 2023 02:27
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tagesschau posted:It sure sounds like requests to work remotely more than three days a week are going to be categorically denied. My wife is actually pretty happy with the language in the new contract. Leading up to the strike rumor was basically 100% of duty to accomodate requests were being denied on orders from treasury. Now the fact that they have to be decided on a case by case basis by managers with reasons provided in writing they are expecting fewer really egregious denials for people with disabilities.
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May 5, 2023 03:07
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 This is fine. We've had a week of record high temps since they announced a fire ban here. Powershift fucked around with this message at 04:26 on May 5, 2023 |
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May 5, 2023 04:23
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Powershift posted:
And the UCP is attacking the NDP for the "cost" of net zero energy infrastructure (they hosed up the math and the company they consulted was like "nah man its not double"). Also Danielle Smith has a tattoo for the sumarian word for "freedom" but it actually means "free from obligations" or "free from debt". This has been stupid province update.
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May 5, 2023 04:36
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Powershift posted:
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May 5, 2023 05:09
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Ive been visiting the Edmonton area from NS since Saturday, and had the chance to do the Jasper-Banff-Canmore-Calgary and back route (the Rockies are loving amazing and no picture or movie can really prepare you for it) but that's all to say I've gotten Had a 100km detour around the Entwistle one, and actually got to see the Banff fire yesterday before they got it under control. Can't believe it's like this in MAY. Stay safe prairie goons. Edit: 16!
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May 5, 2023 05:38
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Apparently the NWT are super hot. Like 20+ degrees over norm right now too.
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May 5, 2023 06:05
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| # ? Jun 7, 2024 11:57 |
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apatheticman posted:And the UCP is attacking the NDP for the "cost" of net zero energy infrastructure (they hosed up the math and the company they consulted was like "nah man its not double"). Since it was presented without context, the scratchy ink she has on her forearm is Ama-gi, which some Libertarians have taken as a symbol and logo, particularly the Liberty Fund, founded by Pierre F. Goodrich in 1960. Which in turn has been plaguing the political landscape of the US since then. Basically putting a thin veneer of legitimacy over the "gently caress-you-got-mine" of Reaganism. Even then, they mistranslated the cuneiform. https://www.businessinsider.com/ironies-never-cease-great-moments-in-libertarian-history-2012-1 posted:What the history-failures at Liberty Fund hilariously mistranslated was that the term “return to mother” is Sumerian-speak for “jubilee”–as in “debt forgiveness” or “freedom from debt.” Point is, if I had a nickel every time a conservative, white, "christian" organization would co-opt an old civilization's symbol and distort its meaning to suit their own purpose I'd have two nickels. Which isn't much but it's weird that it's happened twice. And the UCP is doubling down on the report. They're spinning it, but hoping it'll go away next news cycle.
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May 5, 2023 06:52
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