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4d3d3d posted:I think they felt justified in new oil exploration (among other things) because of the IRA, which was met with a lot of empty-headed triumphalism. Political capital I thought Biden was just playing up the whole having Irish ancestry thing, I didn't know he's digging for oil with the IRA.
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May 14, 2023 17:42
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| # ? Jun 7, 2024 14:46 |
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Trabisnikof posted:Don’t forget IRA includes massive increases in tax credits for pumping co2 underground to use to extract more oil lol that's minuscule compared to the massively positive effects of the bill like im as cynical as anyone here but IRA is very very good. the problem is it's just baby steps and way too late
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May 14, 2023 17:57
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Thorn Wishes Talon posted:that's minuscule compared to the massively positive effects of the bill lol you're wrong as gently caress. the IRA will most likely do nothing to help the climate, with a significant chance of making things worse. please tell us, what's the part of IRA that's "very very good"? The EV tax credits? 45Q? the funding for blue hydrogen? the ITC? the PTC? what?
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May 14, 2023 18:04
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Thorn Wishes Talon posted:that's minuscule compared to the massively positive effects of the bill you're a dumbass
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May 14, 2023 18:12
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Thorn Wishes Talon posted:that's minuscule compared to the massively positive effects of the bill 
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May 14, 2023 18:13
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i've had several arguments about the inflation reduction act i just abandon because I'm too lazy to look at the math of it's supposed benefits I do know that it was represented as overly optimistic because all of the fossil fuel industry handouts worked into the bill weren't actually quantified. Just undefined unspecific future amounts of deals, permitting and drilling in exchange for what everyone points to which is a non-zero amount of immediate positive actions.
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May 14, 2023 18:27
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Thorn Wishes Talon posted:that's minuscule compared to the massively positive effects of the bill 
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May 14, 2023 18:27
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Thorn Wishes Talon posted:that's minuscule compared to the massively positive effects of the bill There was only ever one good IRA
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May 14, 2023 18:33
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Trabisnikof posted:lol you're wrong as gently caress. the IRA will most likely do nothing to help the climate, with a significant chance of making things worse. https://www.evergreenaction.com/blog/evergreen-explains-the-climate-impact-of-the-inflation-reduction-act quote:According to an analysis from Senate Majority Leader Schumer’s office, the IRA will help cut climate pollution by 40% below 2005 levels by 2030. The Biden Administration has calculated a similar 40% estimate. These estimates have also been corroborated by independent experts. One analysis, conducted by the Rhodium Group, offers a 37.5% reduction as its central estimate for emissions reduction by 2030. A second analysis, conducted by the firm Energy Innovation, found a central estimate of a 39% reduction in emissions by 2030, and that “further, for every ton of emissions increases generated by IRA oil and gas provisions, at least 24 tons of emissions are avoided by the other provisions.” And a third analysis, by the Rapid Energy Policy Evaluation and Analysis Toolkit (REPEAT) Project at Princeton University, found that the IRA would deliver a 41% reduction in emissions by 2030.
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May 14, 2023 18:41
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Gotta be honest "rhodium group" & "Blue green" sound like slightly ominous front organizations
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May 14, 2023 18:45
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Thorn Wishes Talon posted:https://www.evergreenaction.com/blog/evergreen-explains-the-climate-impact-of-the-inflation-reduction-act quote:According to an analysis from Senate Majority Leader Schumer’s office, the IRA will help cut climate pollution by 40% below 2005 levels by 2030. The Biden Administration has calculated a similar 40% estimate. quote:These estimates have also been corroborated by independent experts. One analysis, conducted by the Rhodium Group, offers a 37.5% reduction as its central estimate for emissions reduction by 2030. quote:Daniel H. Rosen (born 1967) is an American business executive, academic and author. He is an expert on the Chinese economy, and writes and publishes on the topic of China's marketplace. A contributor to public debate, he has advised key policy-shaping government bodies.[1][2][3]
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May 14, 2023 18:45
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Thorn Wishes Talon posted:https://www.evergreenaction.com/blog/evergreen-explains-the-climate-impact-of-the-inflation-reduction-act this is one of my favorite slight of hand: quote:puts the U.S. on a path to roughly 40% emissions reductions by 2030 notice how it doesn't say "the IRA may reduce emissions by 40%" ? the 40% number includes all existing reductions too that's not saying the IRA may reduce the emissions by 40%, that's saying in the best possible post IRA world emissions may be reduced by 40%, the optimistic scenario for the IRA only contributes a fraction to that number. and that's still on a baseline of assuming things like for 45q assuming no oil & gas companies will do EOR (bad for climate) but everyone will max out the CDR (good for climate) credits (and that it will all work with no leaks of course). meanwhile the oil and gas companies are saying "we're so excited to expand EOR thanks to the increased 45q credits" (bad for climate)
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May 14, 2023 18:59
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Thorn Wishes Talon posted:that's minuscule compared to the massively positive effects of the bill Well, at least someone is doing something, right?  
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May 14, 2023 19:00
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Apparently rhodium is tied to Blackrock & blue-green alliance is ran by ex Obama admins & democrat commerce department people. So idk probably not entirely fake news but 
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May 14, 2023 19:01
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https://twitter.com/ClimateBen/status/1657792188649025538
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May 14, 2023 19:03
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cat botherer posted:lol Look, it is theoretically possible that with careful oversight, enforcement, self sacrifice from patriotic private industry and the public, and cooperation from all branches of government at every level that every dollar will be used with 150% efficiency for the stated goals of the bill. This will have the effect described. Since we can't know that won't happen we can only assume that it must or else we're left brown eco racist utopian wrecker doomers
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May 14, 2023 19:08
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I've learned from a lot of experience having my hopes dashed by politics that any thing that says it "may" do something definitely wont. If there is no mechanisms to actually enforce something, it may as well just be wishes.
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May 14, 2023 19:14
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maybe is just a passive no
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May 14, 2023 19:17
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Koirhor posted:I am completely convinced that capitalism is the great filter and that humanity will just be another failed species among millions of others in the universe. Just enjoy what you can while you can I guess.
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May 14, 2023 19:19
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I love being put on a little path to roughly
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May 14, 2023 19:19
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i've seen projections that have turned out to be wildly optimistic over and over in my professional life, whether it's about costs or time or people or just about anything you can imagine. i've seen the same with people and personal projects. i very much doubt that i'm the only one, and honestly i'd say that if anything they're the norm but this bill with immediate negative consequences and positive consequences later that may or may not happen and may or may not even be possible depending on technology and which is filled with weasel words and has no real way to ensure the positive consequences happen will definitely achieve the most optimistic projections
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May 14, 2023 19:54
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Remember when the baseline used to be 1990 levels instead of 2005? Pepperidge Farm loving remembers.
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May 14, 2023 20:18
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Pepperidge farm implicated in illegal methane disposal, settles out of court for $5,000 & the CEO pinky swearing to not do it again. Abnormally high cringe levels determined to be unrelated
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May 14, 2023 20:22
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Koirhor posted:I am completely convinced that capitalism is the great filter and that humanity will just be another failed species among millions of others in the universe. Just enjoy what you can while you can I guess. This guys page was linked in the thread a while back, you may have read this article but if not check it out: http://www.paulchefurka.ca/Fermi.html
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May 14, 2023 20:30
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was there someone here really defending the IRA? I shouldn't check this thread anymore
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May 14, 2023 20:47
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we don't need thatcherites in here anyway
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May 14, 2023 20:51
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Hubbert posted:me, investigating the environmental impact of tires Not having the wheel didn't stop mesoamerican civilizations from destroying themselves through environmental degradation
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May 14, 2023 20:56
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Brendan Rodgers posted:This guys page was linked in the thread a while back, you may have read this article but if not check it out: maximum power principle, baybeeee 
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May 14, 2023 20:57
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4d3d3d posted:was there someone here really defending the IRA? I shouldn't check this thread anymore Thorn is still D&D at heart
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May 14, 2023 21:02
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Personally I'm looking forward to the extinction of coffee within the next decade or two lol. That's gonna be hilarious.
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May 14, 2023 21:14
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Gravid Topiary posted:if you evacuate down highway 43 i'll give you a cheery wave to build your morale up, assuming i'm not actively on fire at the time ftfy 
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May 14, 2023 21:18
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excited to try some single estate Yukon coffee
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May 14, 2023 21:20
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Wheeee posted:excited to try some single estate Yukon coffee im all about that Ilex vomitoria
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May 14, 2023 21:22
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Deep Dish Fuckfest posted:i've seen projections that have turned out to be wildly optimistic over and over in my professional life, whether it's about costs or time or people or just about anything you can imagine. i've seen the same with people and personal projects. i very much doubt that i'm the only one, and honestly i'd say that if anything they're the norm Hofstadter's law consumes all
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May 14, 2023 21:26
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I have no sources or reasoning for this beyond gut feeling and my general comprehension of the world, but the U.S. is not going to cut emissions by 40% over the next seven years. If it does happen it won't be because of the IRA but because of a massive and sustained campaign of people blowing up fossile fuel infrastructure.
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May 14, 2023 21:30
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harder, wetter, faster, hotter
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May 14, 2023 21:32
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Just a Moron posted:I have no sources or reasoning for this beyond gut feeling and my general comprehension of the world, but the U.S. is not going to cut emissions by 40% over the next seven years. If it does happen it won't be because of the IRA but because of a massive and sustained campaign of people blowing up fossile fuel infrastructure. Pff, are you kidding? It'll be easy. Our finest accountants are already on the case inventing entirely new climate instruments to ensure that the US's stated emissions hit every target set.
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May 14, 2023 21:43
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Just a Moron posted:I have no sources or reasoning for this beyond gut feeling and my general comprehension of the world, but the U.S. is not going to cut emissions by 40% over the next seven years. If it does happen it won't be because of the IRA but because of a massive and sustained campaign of people blowing up fossile fuel infrastructure. an odd way to refer to global thermonuclear war, but i suppose it is technically accurate that it'll be done by people and it will blow up fossil fuel infrastructure
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May 14, 2023 22:42
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Brendan Rodgers posted:This guys page was linked in the thread a while back, you may have read this article but if not check it out:
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May 14, 2023 22:58
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| # ? Jun 7, 2024 14:46 |
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this thread is where hope comes to die
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May 14, 2023 22:59
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