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Brendan Rodgers posted:Well they didn't have control of Starcraft 1 esports, and that's the problem, in terms of how Blizzard see it. No yeah for sure. I was just generalizing since I was mobile posting. But yeah Activision Blizzard are just so bad at maintaining any of their competitive scenes. Like incredibly loving bad at it.
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May 17, 2023 23:37
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widespread posted:By now I expected him to have some new startup akin to Metzen He probably already works for one or is in some consulting role and being private about it. A lot of veteran Blizzard folks moved to other offshoots, like LightForge or Mike Morhaime's Dreamhaven and its subsidiaries. Metzen's company is apparently focusing on tabletop games. I also wouldn't be surprised if he just hosed off and lived a quiet life away from the games industry; it's a tough scene and I imagine Overwatch has caused a fair amount of stress and burnout. I also think Kaplan didn't necessarily leave of his own accord, but was forced out. I'd be pretty done with the industry if that happened to me.
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May 18, 2023 00:13
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Wheeee posted:wonder what jeff's up to these days who do you think bought the forums? 
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May 18, 2023 00:55
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The REAL Goobusters posted:No yeah for sure. I was just generalizing since I was mobile posting. But yeah Activision Blizzard are just so bad at maintaining any of their competitive scenes. Like incredibly loving bad at it. They had some very capable, passionate people working on it but they also had a big issue with chronically penny pinching wrt expenses and some other issues with some nepo hires getting put into high places in the backend of esports division. killing OW's grassroots pro scene was one of the stupidest esports decisions ever made. firing the beloved talent instead of paying them a bit more was probably one of the second stupidest esports decisions ever made. granted the first one isn't stupid insofar as it made them a mountain of money, but for maintaining the health of the esport/pro community, god it was dumb
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May 18, 2023 01:52
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I only just now found out about the PvE mode being axed. Lol. Oh well. I can finally uninstall the game and unbookmark this thread. GGs!
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May 18, 2023 03:11
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Brendan Rodgers posted:Yeah the franchises in the OWL all paid millions for the privilege of entering a team into the league and they're all feeling a bit scammed. I know lhcloudy (former OWL tank player) talked on stream a couple months ago very candidly about why he quit. “Basically everyone you see with like one or two exceptions is getting paid league minimum. So you’re earning like, $40,000 USD. Which sounds great to a kid and everything, but you’re working literally 12 hour days, every day. Nothing but scrums and practices and strat sessions all day every day. It’s really a poo poo deal and I’m glad I left”.
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May 18, 2023 03:32
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toadee posted:I know lhcloudy (former OWL tank player) talked on stream a couple months ago very candidly about why he quit. “Basically everyone you see with like one or two exceptions is getting paid league minimum. So you’re earning like, $40,000 USD. Which sounds great to a kid and everything, but you’re working literally 12 hour days, every day. Nothing but scrums and practices and strat sessions all day every day. It’s really a poo poo deal and I’m glad I left”. 40k for a horrible work life balance, yeesh. I didn't know they were getting paid so little.
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May 18, 2023 03:55
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buglord posted:40k for a horrible work life balance, yeesh. I didn't know they were getting paid so little. Not to mention perma-hosed eyes AND psyche. Staring at a monitor for 6-12 hours with the only free time being meals and sleep? Yeah nah, I think an addy overdose is a better outcome.
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May 18, 2023 03:58
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They should be getting 140k. I wonder what kind of mistreatment it would take for the whole league to go on strike. Prob doesn't exist, cause a lot of these players are too young to have the agency or backgrounds built up to go through with something like that, let alone enough to commit to something as a collective.
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May 18, 2023 04:04
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Endorph posted:like tf2 has a half-finished co-op mode that hasnt been updated in ages that consists entirely of a few waves of enemies that are the same every time and there are people who have been playing exclusively that mode for a decade now, there are people with thousands of hours in it
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May 18, 2023 08:44
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IronicDongz posted:this thread is genuinely the only place where I've ever seen people have a "whatever, who cares" reaction to the cancelled pve announcement. even twitch streamers who play the game's pvp more than almost anyone else up at gm+ are pissed about it, it's really funny that someone can have their head stuck in the sand to the degree that they don't realize that a whole lot of people really really wanted this(and secondly, that there just are way more pve gamers than pvp gamers out there) i mean it is their livelihood, people in this thread are just people who maybe hoped to play a fun pve game in whatever number of years it took blizzard to finish it. if your livelihood is ow content, then your livelihood is entirely linked to people wanting to play/watch/be emotionally invested in OW and pve getting cancelled is basically the end of any realistic shot of OW regaining mainstream popularity. if you're an ow streamer, then pve getting cancelled is really bad news
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May 18, 2023 09:33
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Since OW2 was released as a F2P "upgrade" to OW1 I can't really say it's anywhere as terrible as if they had, say, charged $40 for it, then strung us along, promising that the big Diablo-style coop mode was just around the corner all this time... only to finally drop it. However, regardless of them not charging for a ticket before cancelling the concert, they still operated a cash shop for skins and cosmetics so they're not off the hook. Regardless, my disappointment is immeasurable and the season is ruined.
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May 18, 2023 09:42
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it'd be nice to be able to fire up OW1 sometime, but, you know
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May 18, 2023 09:45
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Wheeee posted:it'd be nice to be able to fire up OW1 sometime, but, you know None of the previous Counter Strikes have ever replaced another, but first time for everything.
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May 18, 2023 10:08
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Love how under Kaplan's watch the studio wasted years of dev time and resources trying to make Titan again while their actual game languished, then he bails leaving the current devs to clean up his mess and now they're getting hammered while he somehow walks away from all this with a pristine reputation.
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May 18, 2023 10:22
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IronicDongz posted:this thread is genuinely the only place where I've ever seen people have a "whatever, who cares" reaction to the cancelled pve announcement. even twitch streamers who play the game's pvp more than almost anyone else up at gm+ are pissed about it, it's really funny that someone can have their head stuck in the sand to the degree that they don't realize that a whole lot of people really really wanted this(and secondly, that there just are way more pve gamers than pvp gamers out there) Isn't this putting words in peoples mouths? The people in this thread who don't care have very much stated they know its popular, they just don't understand why.
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May 18, 2023 10:38
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dogstile posted:Isn't this putting words in peoples mouths? anyways I'm just thinking about how bobby kotick made $185 million in 2019, and how if even half that money was put towards making the pve campaign they could have had a whole secondary team to work on it alongside the main team doing stuff for the seasonal pvp
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May 18, 2023 10:51
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IronicDongz posted:no Oh, I must have glazed over. But it isn't just really about money. I don't think blizzard actually has the skill to do it anymore, the brain drain is real, people have been leaving the company in droves and all the new hires don't have time to get up to speed before getting burned out.
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May 18, 2023 10:54
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They'd likely keep a lot of that brain if they paid it properly.  Ooh, ooh, and they didn't abuse it.
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May 18, 2023 10:56
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Sorry i can't hear you, i'm stealing breast milk.
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May 18, 2023 10:57
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Hahahaha! We're all nerdy enough to be familiar with the mythical man-month but Blizzard is definitely at the point of an anti-work/BFC job thread where somebody is cupping their hands and shouting "WHAT IF YOU COMPENSATED YOUR EMPLOYEES PROPERLY"
Doomykins fucked around with this message at 11:07 on May 18, 2023 |
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May 18, 2023 11:02
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I'm pretty new, has the matchmaking always been so bad or is it a result of the shrinking player base? I played maybe 8 or 10 games this afternoon and I either got like 2 kills, or 25-30 with basically no inbetween
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May 18, 2023 11:02
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field balm posted:I'm pretty new, has the matchmaking always been so bad or is it a result of the shrinking player base? I played maybe 8 or 10 games this afternoon and I either got like 2 kills, or 25-30 with basically no inbetween yes
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May 18, 2023 11:04
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IronicDongz posted:no More money won't help, if the core gameplay isn't that good. OW-PVE has always been ok at best and solving how to make it to be addicting gamemode that you spend hundreds of hours playing is hard. Don't Co-op PVE games usually have heavy looting focus? Guess what you can't have with OW Heroes? I was looking forward to more stories from the PVE, but eh. 
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May 18, 2023 11:13
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Issaries posted:More money won't help, if the core gameplay isn't that good. DRG doesn't and it's more or less set the gold standard. The looting focus can be highly variable and I can think of a lot of PvE Co-Op games where you could remove it and the game wouldn't really suffer for it.
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May 18, 2023 12:04
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KazigluBey posted:DRG doesn't and it's more or less set the gold standard. It depends on what you mean by "looting". DRG is still all about accumulating stuff during missions so you can buy progression between missions. It just doesn't make you do loving inventory management. Which is great.
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May 18, 2023 12:06
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Issaries posted:More money won't help, if the core gameplay isn't that good. Why can’t you have loot with OW heroes? There are loads of ways that would work. People forget that the fundamental promise was that they were literally making a new game.
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May 18, 2023 12:08
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The Grumbles posted:Why can’t you have loot with OW heroes? There are loads of ways that would work. People forget that the fundamental promise was that they were literally making a new game. If I'm saving the world (tm) as a Rein, whole concept of looting and collecting scrap feels bad. Also No weapon swapping, so no weapons. Although Hammond with a Sniper rifle?!?
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May 18, 2023 12:15
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dogstile posted:Oh, I must have glazed over. blizzard was mass firing people while having record profits and if rumormongering people itt are to be believed, overwatch development was being cannibalized instead of backfilled to find people to push diablo out the door
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May 18, 2023 12:22
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field balm posted:I'm pretty new, has the matchmaking always been so bad or is it a result of the shrinking player base? I played maybe 8 or 10 games this afternoon and I either got like 2 kills, or 25-30 with basically no inbetween but i suspect the player count is dire because you keep running into the exact same people in quickplay or ranked in non-peak times over and over again lol. you only need 10 people to make a game.
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May 18, 2023 12:26
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Assepoester posted:You know this makes me wonder, will CS2 just straight up replace CSGO like Actiblizz pulled with Overwatch? Yes CS2 is replacing CSGO.
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May 18, 2023 12:26
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Issaries posted:If I'm saving the world (tm) as a Rein, whole concept of looting and collecting scrap feels bad. It's easy to imagine alternate weapons, or even the same weapons/armour/accessories with added modifiers/stats. This is literally how loot in games like Diablo works. You don't even need to look to Diablo. Team Fortress 2, the game that Overwatch is based on, infamously has an inventory system.
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May 18, 2023 12:26
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Assepoester posted:You know this makes me wonder, will CS2 just straight up replace CSGO like Actiblizz pulled with Overwatch?
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May 18, 2023 12:41
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Jack Trades posted:It depends on what you mean by "looting". DRG is still all about accumulating stuff during missions so you can buy progression between missions. When people say "Co-op PVE" with a "heavy looting focus" they explicitly mean gear-score, they mean a billion weapons with incremental half-% bonuses to two dozen stats in half a dozen color-coded rarities. DRG has none of that. You can go a step further and replace all the things you mine in DRG missions with "XP" that goes into "Skill Trees" and functionally you'd have what OW2's PvE was supposed to be. e.: Person I was quoting meant a BL style looter, as clarified: Issaries posted:If I'm saving the world (tm) as a Rein, whole concept of looting and collecting scrap feels bad. You could have had an OW PvE experience where the only take-away from mission-end was some fashion of XP which then unlocked "stuff", there was no need for this mode to even come close to being a looter. And games like DRG prove you can be quite a few steps removed from the BL style of looter and still do great as a PvE Co-op experience. or, as poster below points out, L4D 1 & 2, which have no loot factor at ALL and are still immensely popular off the back of excellent moment to moment gameplay KazigluBey fucked around with this message at 13:01 on May 18, 2023 |
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May 18, 2023 12:56
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dont ppl still play left4dead i dont think that game even has any pve progression or w/e besides the satisfaction of getting better at shooting zombies
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May 18, 2023 13:00
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novaSphere posted:I still don't understand why they're still on YouTube though. Twitch has a lot of bot views compared to YT but man, Google must have given them a lot of money for the deal for them to continue on the platform after I thought their exclusivity contract ended.
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May 18, 2023 13:06
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and also yeah you dont need looting or meta progression for a popular PVE game
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May 18, 2023 13:09
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Endorph posted:and also yeah you dont need looting or meta progression for a popular PVE game But making a good game is difficult and requires talent though. Why go through all that effort when you can just make a treadmill instead?
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May 18, 2023 13:10
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heck even if you want a treadmill you could just make like, a bunch of weapon skins and like one character skin per season locked behind grinding out the pve mode and people would absolutely play it
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May 18, 2023 13:14
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There's already been a bunch of people pointing out that if you make a fun PvE game you don't need a treadmill, but if you wanted to do gameplay loot, you don't even need to do poo poo like Tracer with a rocket launcher or D.Va with a sniper rifle or whatever, you can just rip off TF2 and have characters have variant weapons that operate mostly the same do cool things with their existing kit. Give Tracer a gun that makes her blink cause explosions. Give Reaper a slug shotgun that works at longer ranges but does less damage. Give Winston a gun that makes his dome electrocute enemies in it to death. There's existing examples of how to do this in a way that isn't "+8% damage to insects" modern AAA game poo poo or Borderlands lootsplosions.
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May 18, 2023 13:27
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