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Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




OwlFancier posted:

That they would be providing the same service and "choice" would have to amount to "choosing things that don't work"

Oh yeah my bad, I see, "alternative medicine"

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Dysgenesis
Jul 12, 2012

HAVE AT THEE!


Jaeluni Asjil posted:

I'm a bit confused by this. I worked in the NHS in the late 80s and most of the 90s. The whole Working For Patients thing and competition was starting back then and one of my main jobs was compiling an asset register from scratch for all the hospitals in the health authority in which I worked, computerizing it, then splitting up assets (including creating leases and sub leases where none existed, agreeing boundaries between NHS Trusts where a property was being split, between different waves of NHS trust creation. (We'd gone through 6 waves by the time I left and I was starting to see the same properties come back to be reorganized yet again) GP Fundholders got started. The whole premise being patients (or rather their GPs) should pick and choose where to send patients for treatment while the introduction of Capital Charging based on property valuations and added to the costs of service provision was brought in (with the Tory agenda being to price London healthcare out of the market and push the selling off of lucrative London land for redevelopment which I figured out and got 7 District Valuation officers in a room to agree that what we needed were the lowest asset valuations possible within their professional judgement. One said 'this hospital saved my son's life I will do anything I can within my power legally and professionally to help you out.'
I left the NHS in 1997.
You guys are talking as if Cameron introduced some of this stuff some 20 years later?

I can only attest to my period of experience which is 2003 to present.

Cameron government brought in deliberate private competition in the heath sector under the guise of getting value for money for the taxpayer, something that would obviously appeal to his core voters.

The example I give is imagine you were are supermarket selling everything. You sell petrol at a loss and fresh fruit and vegetables which are very profitable. A specialist shop opens next to you optimised for selling fresh fruit and vegetables and they get the contract to sell them (because the ccg commissioned services from secondary care providers on a local basis) which means the supermarket loses the right to sell profitable fresh fruit and vegetables. You can't stop selling petrol at a loss because the nhs contract says you have to provide all services and you can't put your prices up. There us no company looking to sell petrol because it is not profitable.

Basically every hospital out there is balancing the books by taking profitable areas such as day case procedures and radiology and subsiding areas of the hospital which lose money - this includes the emergency department and intensive care.

This is why you sell lots of private provision for eg radiology ( my area), and day case surgery but you never see a private major trauma unit or paediatric ICU.

Mebh
May 10, 2010


I thought by choice they meant like "Right to choose" for ADHD etc. You can choose to go on a different NHS waiting list if it's shorter elsewhere or choose to have a private doc that accepts right to choose patients do it and the NHS pays.

I figured it was a stealth privatisation thing.

forkboy84
Jun 13, 2012

Corgis love bread. And Puro


https://www.theguardian.com/money/2023/may/22/can-i-just-rest-guilt-the-four-day-working-week-and-what-to-do-with-the-fifth-day

Cracking stupid article from The Guardian.

If you got a 4 day work week would you be wracked with guilt? I'd not. Arbeit does not macht frei as far as I'm concerned. I'd rock the 0 day work week and not even feel a twinge of guilt.

History Comes Inside!
Nov 20, 2004




If I didn’t have to pay bills and not starve to death I would never work a single second ever again it absolutely loving sucks.

I could do a 4 day week right now if I compressed my working hours but that just makes my days feel endless and it’s just not worth the hassle and having to spend an extra 2 hours a day setting high scores in spreadsheet hero.

ItohRespectArmy
Sep 11, 2019

Cutest In The World, Six Time DDT Ironheavymetalweight champion, Two Time International Princess champion, winner of two tournaments, a Princess Tag Team champion, And a pretty good singer too!
"When I was an idol, I felt nothing every day but now that I'm a pro wrestler I'm in pain constantly!"

depends on the work

at my old job I'd probably work 1 shift a week just to remember what it's like to suffer

at my current job I set my own hours and work 6 days a week so I'd probably just do that.

i like keeping busy though

History Comes Inside!
Nov 20, 2004




I respect it but I’ll never understand it.

I was unemployed for ~18 months once and spent the whole time at home doing gently caress all and it was amazing 10/10 would do it again in a heartbeat, other than not having any money.

If I didn’t need the money I could do basically nothing forever, sorted.

Guavanaut
Nov 27, 2009

Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998



Toilet Rascal

quote:

Can you justify non-work on a weekday?
It's not a weekday if it's part of your weekend.

This is almost going down the path of some Peter Hitchens level "no, but Friday is a weekday" where he's just universalizing his childhood of church on Sundays and cisgender road signs to everyone, and suspecting that countries like Bangladesh and Iran that work Sundays but not Fridays are somehow doing it on purpose to spite English Jesus.

Not quite as bad because at least it admits that the five day week and 8 hour day were social achievements that could be taken from us or taken further by us, but there is no such thing as a naturally occurring workday.

forkboy84
Jun 13, 2012

Corgis love bread. And Puro


ItohRespectArmy posted:

depends on the work

at my old job I'd probably work 1 shift a week just to remember what it's like to suffer

at my current job I set my own hours and work 6 days a week so I'd probably just do that.

i like keeping busy though

It's super easy keeping busy by say watching professional wrestling and sleeping and going for afternoon walks down the beach and reading and posting and sometimes just sitting around and enjoying the simple beauty of procrastination.

But then I've never had a job that I actually woke up and didn't dread going to so YMMV

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




Guavanaut posted:

but there is no such thing as a naturally occurring workday.

Imagine if that was a thing. You'd try to do something on Sunday and it would be physically impossible.

History Comes Inside!
Nov 20, 2004




I can’t think of a job that exists that I’d actually want to get up and do for 35-40 hours a week.

Brendan Rodgers posted:

Imagine if that was a thing. You'd try to do something on Sunday and it would be physically impossible.

This is called living in a rural area with no personal transport.

Guavanaut
Nov 27, 2009

Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998



Toilet Rascal
*strikes a lighter on the Sabbath and instead of a flame lighting a giant ball of eyes appears and throws rocks at me*

Jaeluni Asjil
Apr 18, 2018

Sorry I thought you were a landlord when I gave you your old avatar!
Gl*nner has made an appalling post on Twitter (shan't share it) if you check it out report it (select 'Media' from his profile). (Transman post op photo)

Someone said he made two but I didn't look for a second when I reported it.

Guavanaut
Nov 27, 2009

Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998



Toilet Rascal
That's all he does. all he know is transphobia’s , check he phone, tweet, be divorced , eat hot chip & lie

Microplastics
Jul 6, 2007

:discourse:
It's what's for dinner.
EVERY MORNING I WAKE UP AND OPEN PALM SLAM A USERNAME AND PASSWORD INTO THE LOGIN PAGE. ITS TWITTER AND RIGHT THEN AND THERE I START TWEETING TRANSPHOBIC GARBAGE

ItohRespectArmy
Sep 11, 2019

Cutest In The World, Six Time DDT Ironheavymetalweight champion, Two Time International Princess champion, winner of two tournaments, a Princess Tag Team champion, And a pretty good singer too!
"When I was an idol, I felt nothing every day but now that I'm a pro wrestler I'm in pain constantly!"

forkboy84 posted:

It's super easy keeping busy by say watching professional wrestling and sleeping and going for afternoon walks down the beach and reading and posting and sometimes just sitting around and enjoying the simple beauty of procrastination.

But then I've never had a job that I actually woke up and didn't dread going to so YMMV

I spent alot of years as a full blown NEET and at a certain point I was just incredibly depressed by it. There's only so much time I could spend compiling Maki Itoh lore and playing paradox games, it turned out.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Brendan Rodgers posted:

Imagine if that was a thing. You'd try to do something on Sunday and it would be physically impossible.

I would argue that because this is how it feels when I try to do work on any day of the week, all days are natural no-work days.

I have woken up, and with my organ of divine perception I have observed that today, as all other days, is not auspicious for work, and yet the moloch of society expects me to act in opposition to the universal will?

OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 00:12 on May 22, 2023

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




OwlFancier posted:

I would argue that because this is how it feels when I try to do work on any day of the week, all days are natural no-work days.

I have woken up, and with my organ of divine perception I have observed that today, as all other days, is not auspicious for work, and yet the moloch of society expects me to act in opposition to the universal will?

The closest thing to a universal morality is the mitigation of entropy. An object in motion stays in motion but that also means an object at rest can stay at rest. The most moral act is to not act at all.

Brendan Rodgers fucked around with this message at 00:58 on May 22, 2023

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




Guavanaut
Nov 27, 2009

Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998



Toilet Rascal
Also definitely don't take photos of people's organ of divine perception and put it on Twitter.

I think I've found glindr's latest apartment. Completely isolated from reality and funnelling huge streams of piss into the overspill.

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




I bet that's like £2000 a month.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Sequel to cube 2: hypercube looking good

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




Cube 2: Cuboid

Confusedslight
Jan 9, 2020
Not from or in the uk but I've been following the Schofield drama from afar.
https://twitter.com/andrewmacfnz/status/1660449874494779392?s=20

fizzy
Dec 2, 2022

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Great news for the UK economy.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/may/21/uk-arms-sales-reach-record-85bn-as-global-tensions-escalate

British arms exports doubled during 2022 to a record £8.5bn according to the only publicly available official figures, reflecting escalating geopolitical uncertainties and fallout from Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.

The largest destination for UK-made weaponry was Qatar, which bought £2.7bn-worth, and 54% went to countries designated as “not free” by the human rights group Freedom House. These include Saudi Arabia and Turkey, as well as Qatar.

The £8.5bn recorded in 2022 is comfortably a record since the UK began publishing export data in 2008, and is more than double the £4.1bn recorded in 2021. The previous high was £6.9bn in 2015, a time when Syria had collapsed into civil war.

...

Even so, the true level of weapons exports is far greater because the value of a large proportion of UK arms sales is not counted up. Only the value of single-use export licences is publicly released, while broader open-export licences, including much of the UK’s exports to Saudi Arabia, are not quantified.

The UK government says it takes its arms-licensing responsibilities seriously, considering applications against “a strict risk assessment framework”. It has sought to defend continuing sales to Saudi by saying that there is not a “clear risk” that war crimes – which include the targeting of civilians - could result from use of the weapons.

Mega Comrade
Apr 22, 2004

Listen buddy, we all got problems!

forkboy84 posted:

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2023/may/22/can-i-just-rest-guilt-the-four-day-working-week-and-what-to-do-with-the-fifth-day

Cracking stupid article from The Guardian.

If you got a 4 day work week would you be wracked with guilt? I'd not. Arbeit does not macht frei as far as I'm concerned. I'd rock the 0 day work week and not even feel a twinge of guilt.

It's a very guardiany written article but the point it makes I know it's true for a lot of people. Some people really struggle to relax and switch off, society and capitalism has ingrained in us that being busy is a sign of climbing status and a lot of people can't just switch that off by going to a 4 day week.

Roller Coast Guard
Aug 27, 2006

With this magnificent aircraft,
and my magnificent facial hair,
the British Empire will never fall!


Confusedslight posted:

Not from or in the uk but I've been following the Schofield drama from afar.
https://twitter.com/andrewmacfnz/status/1660449874494779392?s=20

I see the camera crew are fully prepped to catch the moment he walks into the ocean.

The Question IRL
Jun 8, 2013

Only two contestants left! Here is Doom's chance for revenge...

Mega Comrade posted:

It's a very guardiany written article but the point it makes I know it's true for a lot of people. Some people really struggle to relax and switch off, society and capitalism has ingrained in us that being busy is a sign of climbing status and a lot of people can't just switch that off by going to a 4 day week.

This is definitely true.
In my job I provide legal advice to members of the public, and I've lost count of the number of people who have said some variant of "I need help." And then have to justify it with, "I've worked all my life and never claimed social welfare. I'm not lazy/ a sponger."

So many people have been brought up on the pipeline of "being productive is good" to "not working is lazy" to "being lazy is a moral failing" to "not working is a moral failing."
So helping people to understand this ends up being one part of my job, along with helping them access social supports that they are entitled to.

As it relates to this topic, I have been lucky enough to work a bunch of jobs where I do have direct contact with members of the public and help them with problems. It can make it harder to switch off from the job, but it also makes the work rewarding and makes me want to go into work every day.
Like not enough to work a 5 day week if my contract said 4 days, but definitely enough to work this job even if I was financially secure.

forkboy84
Jun 13, 2012

Corgis love bread. And Puro


I am an evangelist for being lazy.

The happiest I have been in my life is while long-term unemployed but with enough money in the bank to not have to worry about money so long as I was frugal, thanks to a grandparent dying and leaving me a chunk of coin in her will.

I hope others are able to find calm and meaning in having time to do things that enjoy instead of things that make someone else richer.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

I have been giving advice to everyone at work on how to maximise their billable time without doing any work before I leave so I like to think I'm helping.

Failed Imagineer
Sep 22, 2018
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8An2SxNFvmU

mrpwase
Apr 21, 2010

I HAVE GREAT AVATAR IDEAS
For the Many, Not the Few


I think if I had a situation where I could have a phased transition from working to not working with enough money to support myself at the end of it, I would be able to manage that eventually. But any time I don't have something to occupy myself with I fall off a cliff into depression. More often that not on Sunday evenings I am in a quantum superposition of both looking forward to and dreading Monday morning.

The last term I was unemployed for more than a few months, which was for about a year with a few part time jobs, that was the first time I felt suicidal. Hell, I was unemployed for a few months after moving to Leeds from the countryside, and by the end of that I felt terrible. It's not even that I enjoy work especially.

Zalakwe
Jun 4, 2007
Likes Cake, Hates Hamsters



We have effectively abolished rest in favour of every possible second of our attention being monetised through one device or another.

The devices then try and sell rest back to us in the form of holidays and self help books.

Z the IVth
Jan 28, 2009

The trouble with your "expendable machines"
Fun Shoe

Brendan Rodgers posted:

Oh yeah my bad, I see, "alternative medicine"



More or less.

If you subscribe to mainstream evidence based medicine there is really very little choice as to what is the "best" course of treatment. People spend absurd amounts of time combing through published evidence and collating everything together to produce best practice guidelines which any clinician worth mentioning will use as the basis for their care. These do include consideration of published evidence for alternative therapy (most notably acupuncture for warts ?????) but understandably it's usually labelled with "not recommended" "not enough evidence" or "try at own risk".

You can choose who you want to deliver your care but all worthwhile practitioners will be chanting from the same hymm sheet.

Nuclear Spoon
Aug 18, 2010

I want to cry out
but I don’t scream and I don’t shout
And I feel so proud
to be alive
the best i've felt in recent memory was last year where i got signed off for 6 weeks with covid during the summer. physical symptoms weren't great but also: i could just loving exist without worrying about being fired and consequently evicted

since then i've changed to a new 4-day week job and i'm so loving glad for it

Nuclear Spoon fucked around with this message at 09:45 on May 22, 2023

Private Speech
Mar 30, 2011

I HAVE EVEN MORE WORTHLESS BEANIE BABIES IN MY COLLECTION THAN I HAVE WORTHLESS POSTS IN THE BEANIE BABY THREAD YET I STILL HAVE THE TEMERITY TO CRITICIZE OTHERS' COLLECTIONS

IF YOU SEE ME TALKING ABOUT BEANIE BABIES, PLEASE TELL ME TO

EAT. SHIT.


Mondays, huh. Really brings out the joy from work.

At least the next one is off.

fuctifino
Jun 11, 2001


Ashworth used that word three times in this tweet

https://twitter.com/JonAshworth/status/1660565806575394816

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Everyone must return to work, everyone wants to return to work.

sebzilla
Mar 17, 2009

Kid's blasting everything in sight with that new-fangled musket.


Being furloughed on full pay for a few months was the best time of my life.

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History Comes Inside!
Nov 20, 2004




It’s “everyone wants to go back to the office so they can spend money they don’t have on commuting and coffee” taken to the extreme

sebzilla posted:

Being furloughed on full pay for a few months was the best time of my life.

My role was too “business critical” to be furloughed and I missed out entirely, very bitter about this

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