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Critical Role Truthers are both hilarious and not worth arguing with. If someone wants to hang on to their delusions that CR is scripted content despite there not being any evidence, feel free to go off while I laugh at you.
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May 31, 2023 21:54
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They don't know the main beats of each session though? They all create backstories with Matt or each other if there is a connection between characters, and then they play. There are beats the players know about themselves because they made said backstory. but they aren't sitting down and outlining an entire campaign together. Matt can be pretty railroady and he himself probably has an idea or path he wants to go down, but I would be fairly shocked if they plotted out the main beats of each session in advance together, considering some of the nonsense that I have watched from them. There are things they can do because it's a job or whatever that you at your table could like never get away with(splitting the party and running like a couple of months with half of the party not at the table telling a story).
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May 31, 2023 21:57
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This is why people hate Critical Role
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May 31, 2023 21:57
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Impermanent posted:is there like a real reason to dislike critical role because they've always been in my "they're bad for some reason" books but I can't remember why. They're somewhat low on the TG Company Shitometer, with a few notable missteps, but they overall seem like mostly OK people who have accidentally created a corporation, and corporations are just inherently lovely. My dislike of them is purely taste-based. I don't like most of the games they play, I don't actually like Actual Plays, and I really don't like their kind of twee Geek positivity and their parasocial fandom. My opinion is 100% vibes-based; I'm sure they're fine, they just give me cringey game-store polycule vibes.
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May 31, 2023 22:01
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Politically speaking, they're pretty much exactly what you would expect if a bunch of liberal-to-left voice actors found themselves as the creators and owners of a relatively valuable piece of intellectual property. In other words, well meaning, hearts in the right place, operating within the system, but supportive of people like the WGA etc. They annoyed a few people with their somewhat mealymouthed stance on WOTC during the OGL debacle, but I wasn't expecting much different because , basically, WOTC put out two of their books and they aren't averse to money. Creatively speaking they're... fine to good. Better than they were. I never watched their Campaign 1 but I'm currently listening to it as a podcast and they're distinctly better as players and performers by the time they hit Campaign 3. Matt has several tropes that he really likes revisiting in terms of his stories and his encounters, by which I mean he's a 5e DM. Given the choice I would take Brennan Lee Mulligan over him as a DM, but his shows aren't unenjoyable. Trinket is the most annoying character that has existed in any actual play, which is saying a lot considering that Trinket isn't even a character
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May 31, 2023 22:08
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yeah the parasocial poo poo around them is completely wild. I generally like medium to long form actual plays, like them/FatT/D20/TTS and some others. But yeah, engaging with the fandom is mostly misery. Also yeah Brian Foster, outside of the fandom was the most lovely critical role person. Just constantly quote tweeting and sending that fanbase to harass people on twitter.
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May 31, 2023 22:10
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Dexo posted:They don't know the main beats of each session though? Agreed, I very much doubt they know the beats. What I get from them is that they're approaching the sessions with an eye to play-as-performance, which is pretty much exactly what I've heard other Actual Players do.
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May 31, 2023 22:11
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It's mostly just that the CR are big enough that the tiny percentage of haters everything and everyone has still translates to A Whole Lot of Very Vocal People. They're also Annoying Theater Kids which triggers some people.
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May 31, 2023 22:11
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Dexo posted:Also yeah Brian Foster, outside of the fandom was the most lovely critical role person. Just constantly quote tweeting and sending that fanbase to harass people on twitter. Yeah, CR didn't yank on his leash for way too long. This was before everything was known, of course.
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May 31, 2023 22:15
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Personally if I was going to script a TTRPG actual play I would not script the cast to have interminably long shopping trips or planning sessions where they agonize about their next move and then never follow through. I was a big fan from the beginning of Campaign 2 until things got fucky with the pandemic and just kind of kept watching through inertia into Campaign 3 but I haven't watched in a long time. I just don't have the energy or free time to watch 4 hour episodes. I like the cast and I like the characters they make but I don't see myself going back to the actual show.
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May 31, 2023 22:18
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I'm occasionally in the AP sphere and have both done them and helped work on them in the background and it isn't a wild assumption that people would plot out certain interactions or beats at all. That's just good showmanship. Also the porn thing was a little hamfisted of a way to say it but their often quite young listenership does routinely post about how they want a gm exactly like Mercer and so on. Hell it's called The Mercer Effect, like you can Google that poo poo.
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May 31, 2023 22:26
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Well yeah of course people are going to try to emulate the thing they saw that they liked. I don't think that's inherently a bad thing, and managing the gap between your expectations and what you're capable of is a natural part of being a human and developing a skill. Using porn is a negative comparison is itself kinda hosed up since the links between porn and sexual dysfunction are kind of iffy and a lot more grounded in discomfort with sex work than an honest concern about the effects.
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May 31, 2023 22:38
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theironjef posted:I'm occasionally in the AP sphere and have both done them and helped work on them in the background and it isn't a wild assumption that people would plot out certain interactions or beats at all. That's just good showmanship. It's also not that different from real games either. Sometimes you have an idea and you go to your buddy, "Hey Grishnack is gonna ask your character about X next time he gets the chance, just letting you know so you can have something prepared."
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May 31, 2023 22:46
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admanb posted:Well yeah of course people are going to try to emulate the thing they saw that they liked. I don't think that's inherently a bad thing, and managing the gap between your expectations and what you're capable of is a natural part of being a human and developing a skill. Sure, if you're primarily discussing adults that should know better, but both porn and Critical Role have huge audiences of teens. Have you ever seen the studies that show how clearly teenage sex behavior tracks towards porn trends? Like a few years ago the rate of consensual and non-consensual choking shot up because choking and slapping were experiencing a moment in porn. Am I saying that like Critical Role needs to make a commitment to be worse at D&D or something to be responsible to their audience? No, of course not. I don't personally share the opinion that Critical Role is "so good that it's a bad thing, actually" even. It's just a real thing that is actually happening and already being discussed, is all. Regarding the Mercer Effect stuff, like yeah, I don't disagree that people want to replicate the popular dance trends of their favorite celebrity or whatever, and yeah, who cares? The difference in this case is largely a matter of the wild dedication some outlier folks have to this, like... no one calls it the McElroy effect. You occasionally see hilarious stories about people wanting to exactly replicate specific episodes of CR at their gaming table, like "If you join, you're going to play X specific character and you better know what they did in this arc!" and that's fun to laugh at, so boom, it gets a silly name and a ScreenRant article. theironjef fucked around with this message at 23:03 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 22:56
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Epi Lepi posted:I can't believe there are still people who believe this. You're the same idiot who said "Look their company has a creative director! That means the game is scripted!" aren't you? No, that was RPGPundit in a video podcast (although it repeated the porn comparison, but I don't think it started it). But Mercer has actually stated in interview that they do talk before the session to come up with an overview of what's going to happen. Most professional RPG podcasts do because of the need to keep to reasonable timing. The problem is that it's a form of secretly cheating around the immersion/story tradeoff - with that initial discussion, you can do things that'd normally need a narrative RPG to do well, yet make the way in which they happen look acceptable to people who only want the traditional RPG experience.
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May 31, 2023 23:02
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I have to applaud Critical Role's stated positions on Zak, Mearls, that other shitbag consultant, Satine "the Herald of Compassion" Phoenix, the OGL debacle, promoting Wendy's, and leveraging their position to generally be a force for good in the hobby Or would, if having strong opinions wouldn't get in the way of cementing an insufferable parasocial fanbase. I can't say I'd do better in their position, but the kind of person I strive to be would. E: actually I think they did walk back the Wendy's thing so that's good for them. moths fucked around with this message at 23:05 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 23:02
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Splicer posted:To belabour the analogy even further, TAZ and other D&D in name only podcasts are like if ball torture porn was the most visible porn available, but the actual videos were just a couple of attractive people engaging in enjoyable, consensual, extremely vanilla sexual activities with the occasional non-sequitur about how much their balls hurt. Splicer fucked around with this message at 23:06 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 23:02
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Splicer posted:I have reached the point where I can fully participate in this thread just by posting my old posts. I have become my own chinese room.
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May 31, 2023 23:06
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Splicer posted:Hi folks I just need a post referencing the rule of three for a bit I'm doing.
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May 31, 2023 23:19
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Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres
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May 31, 2023 23:22
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Dexo posted:Also yeah Brian Foster, outside of the fandom was the most lovely critical role person. Just constantly quote tweeting and sending that fanbase to harass people on twitter. lol, even you forgot Orion existed.
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May 31, 2023 23:28
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There's something about metaphors involving comparing Critical Role to porn or kinky sex videos that's weird and off-putting to me in a way that's hard to articulate...Nissin Cup Nudist posted:I always though a Zelda minis game would be fun. Gorons, Zoras, Rito etc there's a lot to work with there That's true. I could see official Nintendo board games and card games before a full TTRPG. But I don't know... maybe they would be receptive to a D&D supplement or they saw how much money the Avatar: The Last Airbender kickstarter raked in and figured that could be easy cash for the work of a basic PbtA hack? Nuns with Guns fucked around with this message at 23:35 on May 31, 2023 |
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May 31, 2023 23:33
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I remember Critical Role doing some thing where they did some campaign in a pseudo Middle East/North Africa setting and they all dressed up like a bunch of British explorers and that went over about as well as you might expect.
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May 31, 2023 23:36
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at the end of the day the reason is they are very very popular. it all comes back to that
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May 31, 2023 23:39
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Kai Tave posted:I remember Critical Role doing some thing where they did some campaign in a pseudo Middle East/North Africa setting and they all dressed up like a bunch of British explorers and that went over about as well as you might expect. IIRC they did a fantasy japan campaign and they all did really racist japanese accents the entire time
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May 31, 2023 23:40
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theironjef posted:Sure, if you're primarily discussing adults that should know better, but both porn and Critical Role have huge audiences of teens. Have you ever seen the studies that show how clearly teenage sex behavior tracks towards porn trends? Like a few years ago the rate of consensual and non-consensual choking shot up because choking and slapping were experiencing a moment in porn. The cause-and-effect on that seems a little suspect. 50 Shades of Gray (the movie) came out in 2015 and I feel like BDSM-adjacent kinks had entered the wider public consciousness even before that. That seems more like both porn and teens reacting to the same trend. Toshimo posted:lol, even you forgot Orion existed. Brian Foster is still definitely the shittiest Critical Role-adjacent person.
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May 31, 2023 23:40
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i forget was this the thread where someone posted a picture of sam reigel of critical role in green face paint pretending to be a goblin for an ad but they darkened the image to make it look like he was in blackface and posted "THIS is what people watch and defend?" ttrpg people get nuts
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May 31, 2023 23:43
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Critical Role themselves periodically do something that's kind of dumb but in a "it's not horrible sex pest revelations" way like the Wendy's thing or cultural insensitivity stuff, which places it squarely below a lot of other industry shittiness but still kind of embarrassing that they keep doing stuff like it and then writing stereotypical notesapp apologies about learning and growing. By far the worst stuff about Critical Role is the stuff that surrounds it, like a lot of the fanbase gets insufferable or how other industry influencers did a whole "yes Critical Role made 10 million dollars last year but that's not REALLY that much money when you think about it" spiel in an industry where anyone not named Wizards of the Coast is lucky to make enough to cover their rent, but also people who bemoan the "Critical Role effect" or make dumb comparisons to porn or whatever. There's enough you could criticize CR for (their attempts at running any game that isn't D&D seem pretty dire if their shot at Monsterhearts is any indication) without having to make poo poo up about how they give other GMs imposter syndrome.
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May 31, 2023 23:59
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iirc the monserhearts author was psyched at their oneshot and made a poo poo ton of sales off of it. i remember someone posting really angry that they called for a roll at the wrong time and about how its extremely irresponsible of them to not play the game perfect with their platform
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Jun 1, 2023 00:01
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Farg posted:iirc the monserhearts author was psyched at their oneshot and made a poo poo ton of sales off of it. i remember someone posting really angry that they called for a roll at the wrong time and about how its extremely irresponsible of them to not play the game perfect with their platform yeah even when CR plays something poorly they're going to do it with all of their usual enthusiasm and positivity, so it is absolutely not a bad thing for that product
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Jun 1, 2023 00:10
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Kai Tave posted:Critical Role themselves periodically do something that's kind of dumb but in a "it's not horrible sex pest revelations" way like the Wendy's thing or cultural insensitivity stuff, which places it squarely below a lot of other industry shittiness but still kind of embarrassing that they keep doing stuff like it and then writing stereotypical notesapp apologies about learning and growing. gently caress off with that, no one in here is making it up. It's just some thing that already was made up and people were just discussing. Like it actually does have a Screen Rant article. Here, enjoy: https://screenrant.com/critical-role-dnd-mercer-effect-dungeons-dragons-expectations/ Like you can disagree with the existence of the thing, and you can agree it exists and say it doesn't matter (I'm personally here), but you can't really say Hyphz or I are making it up.
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Jun 1, 2023 00:14
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theironjef posted:gently caress off with that, no one in here is making it up. It's just some thing that already was made up and people were just discussing. Like it actually does have a Screen Rant article. Here, enjoy: https://screenrant.com/critical-role-dnd-mercer-effect-dungeons-dragons-expectations/ An article that posits this syndrome exists and explains what it's supposed to be without any actual evidence to support that it's anything but random people griping is not doing a lot to convince me that this is an actual widespread phenomenon sorry. Like, their evidence is "here's a link to a reddit thread," come the gently caress on.
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Jun 1, 2023 00:21
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Kai Tave posted:An article that posits this syndrome exists and explains what it's supposed to be without any actual evidence to support that it's anything but random people griping is not doing a lot to convince me that this is an actual widespread phenomenon sorry. All I'm saying is that the discussion already existed. I don't care if it's a Reddit thread or the comments on one of those rambly blog recipe sites, it already existed. It's like getting pissy because someone said GNS theory existed. It did, it probably does, there are weirdos that believe it's still relevant, but relevance of source isn't actually a factor. Plus it's a Reddit thread that Mercer himself commented in and addressed this specific thing in. Like, of all the Reddit threads, it's a pretty good one to use as a source. theironjef fucked around with this message at 00:29 on Jun 1, 2023 |
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Jun 1, 2023 00:26
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Stringstorm, a nerdy music youtuber, noted for his work making parody songs for Battletech and WH40k, has uploaded a video admitting to...... gently caress it. He groomed a minor.
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Jun 1, 2023 00:27
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:I always though a Zelda minis game would be fun. Gorons, Zoras, Rito etc there's a lot to work with there Brutal Legend, however, is almost perfect for a minis wargame but..
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Jun 1, 2023 00:33
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Are abuse confession videos automatically demonetized or is that how they wring their last drops of revenue?
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Jun 1, 2023 00:36
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why are multiple people comparing actual plays to porn oh my god edit: i'll own up that the adventure zone got me back into elf games (that and meeting a dude at denny's who was running a WOD game when i worked security) and i like playing pretend but it'd be SO much harder to make it a Thing for an audience edit 2: what's the deal with wendys other than they're fast food and have annoying twitter presence Ominous Jazz fucked around with this message at 01:18 on Jun 1, 2023 |
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Jun 1, 2023 01:14
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Wendy's is pretty much the only major fast food chain to not sign up with the Fair Food Program, which is intended to crack down on human rights abuses in farming.
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Jun 1, 2023 01:23
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Ominous Jazz posted:edit 2: what's the deal with wendys other than they're fast food and have annoying twitter presence They made a weird RPG module thing which was basically a longform Wendy's ad and Critical Role decided to run it at some convention, unprompted. It wasn't a sponsored thing as far as I can recall, but "Critical Role decides to do a big ad spot for a fast food corporation" was a weird look, and then people pointed out that Wendy's is notable for refusing to join a program to help ensure that their produce was harvested under fair working conditions and CR did a notesapp apology.
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Jun 1, 2023 01:26
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ah dang gently caress wendys
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Jun 1, 2023 01:27
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