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Defiance Industries posted:The numbers corroborate to how many 16th of a ton of standard armor they can destroy in a single volley This makes sense even if it's really abstract
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Jun 1, 2023 21:37
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biosterous posted:forget all thoughts you have of making an ac/15 because you could headshot with it. what we need is an ac/16 so it can destroy exactly one ton of armour per volley Need an AC/10.72 for my anti-Mackie Mech
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Jun 1, 2023 22:00
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Piell posted:The -3C is one of the best Cicada designs but Cicadas are bad so that just makes it kind of mediocre, let's wait for something good and take nothing for now. Even with no jump jets, 7/11 with a PPC has the potential to be extremely dangerous at lower levels - it is as fast on ground as a Jenner, but without the Jenner's need to get in close. Zipping around at long range to make itself extremely difficult to hit while still bringing heavy damage (for the size level), or else making mad dashes to the rear to pound the other guy's rear armor with that same heavy damage (note that a single CT (rear) hit with a PPC would destroy a Commando or Locust, and would burn clean through the armor of any mech used in this battle, while a LT(R) or RT(R) would take that torso (and attached arm) straight off a Locust). That is not a trivial capacity. Checking the list, without LosTech, the CDA-3R is the fastest PPC-armed 'mech in the game. Only a few hover tanks (which have their own special serious vulnerabilities) can match it. That's far from nothing.
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Jun 1, 2023 22:30
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Scintilla posted:As for the AC/2, I think I would re-class it as its own thing. It has a niche, unlike the current AC/5. The best brainspark I've had for the ac/2 is this: turn it into a rapid fire/tri-barrel thing, but in a way that keeps it easy to use and keeps it in the anti-aircraft role: You roll 3d6 for your attack, and compare each pair independantly. ie, 5, 6 , 2 makes 11, 7, 8, so its potentially an ac 2-6 maybe do the same thing for the ac5. I think more common use of quirks could also go a long way towards making AC's better: There's a fairly simple tradeoff that makes use of their low heat generation, which are the cooling jacket negatives paying for accurate or stabilized weapon. An ac5 sucks, an ac5 at -1 or -2 to-hit is a lot more interesting.
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Jun 1, 2023 22:49
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TheParadigm posted:I think more common use of quirks could also go a long way towards making AC's better: There's a fairly simple tradeoff that makes use of their low heat generation, which are the cooling jacket negatives paying for accurate or stabilized weapon. A Mekwars server I used to play on allowed pilots to develop skills, which included a bonus with specific weapons - I had a 2/5 pilot that had a -2 bonus to the AC/5. Even with a substantial BV penalty (the Clint was well into the heavy/low assault cost range), firing that thing on a 0 was really powerful.
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Jun 1, 2023 23:15
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Autocannon calibre has never made sense to me. I assumed they were inches but even that is ridiculously excessive when you compare AC/2 to AC/20.Defiance Industries posted:The numbers corroborate to how many 16th of a ton of standard armor they can destroy in a single volley Is that it?? That's a wild and weird way to measure it for sure ilmucche fucked around with this message at 00:10 on Jun 2, 2023 |
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Jun 2, 2023 00:08
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I suppose it's no more or less abstract than having 'small' and 'medium' lasers Irl these things usually have a functional, tactical difference rather than being broken down by size which I guess they AC's kind of do, if the ac5's tactical role consists of being mostly useless
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Jun 2, 2023 00:10
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Honestly the AC/2+5's should have had a double shot instead to counteract their poo poo damage due to their higher rate of fire compared to the AC/10+20.
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Jun 2, 2023 00:38
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Historically, the term hit point came from naval plannning, where the number of hitpoints of a warship was determined by the number of 14 inch shells it could withstand before sinking. So AC calibre being based on arbitrary amounts of armor is not that unreasonable.
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Jun 2, 2023 00:55
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Wouldn't that be a UAC5?
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Jun 2, 2023 00:56
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If I remember properly, a little math indicates that at least autocannon ammo floats on water. It is not good to think about math and physics while being near battletech.
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Jun 2, 2023 01:07
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ilmucche posted:Autocannon calibre has never made sense to me. I assumed they were inches but even that is ridiculously excessive when you compare AC/2 to AC/20. A point of damage does seem to have in universe relevance as the minimum threshold for being able to damage BAR10 armor. Like a light rifle can't do that much damage so you could fire an infinite number of light rifles at a locust and it would do nothing. So an AC/2 does double the minimum amount of damage that you need to be able to do.
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Jun 2, 2023 02:24
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Gnoman posted:Even with no jump jets, 7/11 with a PPC has the potential to be extremely dangerous at lower levels - it is as fast on ground as a Jenner, but without the Jenner's need to get in close. Yeah, but as we have seen, it's extremely fragile for it's weight (our Locust-3V has only half a ton less armor at 20 tons lighter, half the weight) and a single shot can easily punch through the armor and start doing some real damage. It's a pretty decent sniper, but it's very much a glass cannon, and there are a mechs I like a lot better at 40 or even 35 tons - if we're looking for a PPC mech I'd much rather have another Panther-9R, for example. Piell fucked around with this message at 04:23 on Jun 2, 2023 |
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Jun 2, 2023 02:52
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biosterous posted:forget all thoughts you have of making an ac/15 because you could headshot with it. what we need is an ac/16 so it can destroy exactly one ton of armour per volley 
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Jun 2, 2023 05:04
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Slavvy posted:Wouldn't that be a UAC5? Uac2/5 would fire 4 in this regime
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Jun 2, 2023 05:06
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Piell posted:Yeah, but as we have seen, it's extremely fragile for it's weight (our Locust-3V has only half a ton less armor at 20 tons lighter, half the weight) and a single shot can easily punch through the armor and start doing some real damage. It's a pretty decent sniper, but it's very much a glass cannon, and there are a mechs I like a lot better at 40 or even 35 tons - if we're looking for a PPC mech I'd much rather have another Panther-9R, for example. The Panther also has the advantage of being an incredibly common workhorse trooper mech.
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Jun 2, 2023 05:29
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The Panther is also, sadly, very slow for it's tonnage. I suppose the Cicada could be a bit better if only we could take off those awful machine guns and up it's armor instead.
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Jun 3, 2023 09:42
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The Panther does get jets, which can be just as good as being fast, in the right environment. Also it's way cooler, which by default makes it a better mech.
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Jun 3, 2023 09:53
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I've always liked the Panther and I especially liked it in HBS. It wasn't "use it for the entire run" tier but there was really only one light mech that was, and during the time you were still dropping with lights you could do a lot worse than a big limb-removing sniper that hopped around in the woods.
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Jun 3, 2023 09:59
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Dachshundofdoom posted:there was really only one light mech that was, firestarter
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Jun 3, 2023 23:46
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aniviron posted:The Panther does get jets, which can be just as good as being fast, in the right environment. The Panther has two things going for it: 1. PPC 2. Jumpjets The only other IS light 'mech I'd consider is the Wolfhound. Is our campaign before that comes out?
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Jun 4, 2023 01:47
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painedforever posted:The only other IS light 'mech I'd consider is the Wolfhound. Yeah, we're in 3015 so it's a while before the Wolfhound shows up.
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Jun 4, 2023 02:00
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Koorisch posted:Yeah, we're in 3015 so it's a while before the Wolfhound shows up. Also they did a really good job of keeping control of it. Until the Clan Invasion there was literally one in existence outside the control of the AFFC and its two specialest boys, the Dragoons and Hounds.
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Jun 4, 2023 02:08
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painedforever posted:The Panther has two things going for it: What about the Raven? Is ecm very effective in this?
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Jun 4, 2023 02:08
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Doesn't exist yet either. And the first version of it is really really bad, since it uses 7 tons on ECM and none of the equipment that is disrupted by ECM has been invented yet.
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Jun 4, 2023 02:22
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That sounds like a feature packed forward thinking product targeted at early adopters to me
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Jun 4, 2023 02:37
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ECM is really not important until 3052 when C3 comes out. And by that time you can get a Guardian suite that does the exact same thing at a wider range for 1/5 the weight.
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Jun 4, 2023 03:33
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Defiance Industries posted:Doesn't exist yet either. And the first version of it is really really bad, since it uses 7 tons on ECM and none of the equipment that is disrupted by ECM has been invented yet. i don't know which side here is the stupid one: the one where they invented a thing before it had any use or the one that invented a thing designed to be defeated by yesteryear's tech
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Jun 4, 2023 04:24
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C3 is EXTREMELY loving powerful and for ECM to beat it you have to insert yourself between two of the members on the network, which often means showing your back to one of them. Inventing ECM in 3015 was extremely dumb.
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Jun 4, 2023 05:03
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Space Kablooey posted:i don't know which side here is the stupid one: the one where they invented a thing before it had any use or the one that invented a thing designed to be defeated by yesteryear's tech i can 100% buy people intentionally discounting the weakness to ECM at first, like, "behold our new wonder weapon! and its only weakness is that horribly overweight ECM that nobody wants to use because of how useless it is! i am confident this will not lead our enemies to develop better ECM" [...] "oh. poo poo."
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Jun 4, 2023 05:05
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Space Kablooey posted:i don't know which side here is the stupid one: the one where they invented a thing before it had any use or the one that invented a thing designed to be defeated by yesteryear's tech The RVN-1X's electronics warfare equipment did, in fact, debut before it had any function in play - it was intially just a 'mech with 7.5 tons of wasted space - but in-universe it is supposed to be an attempt to replicate the LosTech Guardian ECM and Beagle Active Probe - shorter ranged and heavier than those two systems, but better than most people had. The BAP is of somewhat limited use unless you're playing double-blind (which is a pain in the rear end on an actual tabletop for obvious reasons, but quite easy in Megamek). In the fluff it is a lot more important. The Guardian ECM blocks a BAP and a C3 network, but also nullifies NARC systems and the Artemis IV fire control systems. Of those systems, only the C3 network postdates the ECM's invention in-universe - the other two systems are merely LosTech. In fluff, the primary function is wrecking communications, which is all but impossible to represent in standard tabletop play (though in a GM format like this one it is possible that Scintilla could find a way to make use of it).
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Jun 4, 2023 05:05
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Gnoman posted:The Guardian ECM blocks a BAP and a C3 network, but also nullifies NARC systems and the Artemis IV fire control systems. Of those systems, only the C3 network postdates the ECM's invention in-universe - the other two systems are merely LosTech. In fluff, the primary function is wrecking communications, which is all but impossible to represent in standard tabletop play (though in a GM format like this one it is possible that Scintilla could find a way to make use of it). I have a few ideas about ECM. Units mounting it could have their armour and weapons listed as 'Unknown' due to the system blocking attempts to scan them. Player units with ECM could also prevent or delay the OpFor from calling in reinforcements by blocking their distress calls.
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Jun 4, 2023 05:59
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I'm more of a "seek-then-destroy" type, so I prefer Mediums rather than Lights. I should like the Locust because it's so purely a scout, but that's all it's good for. Aside from terrorizing infantry, and even there.... Commando's sort of the best of a bad bunch. I kinda like the LAMs in theory, but they're so awful in every practical (and gameplay) sense. Light 'Mechs didn't become cool until after the Clan era. Cougar, Adder, Fire Moth, Hollander.... I mean, there's the Urbie, but y'know, it's the Urbie.
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Jun 4, 2023 08:07
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Mediums are my preference but I do like a lot of lights, they're just very challenging to use in the approximately lance sized battles that you often get in TT or Megamek.
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Jun 4, 2023 15:10
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Defiance Industries posted:C3 is EXTREMELY loving powerful and for ECM to beat it you have to insert yourself between two of the members on the network, which often means showing your back to one of them. Alternately, if you can park a unit within ECM range of the C3 Master Unit, you can shut down the entire network in one go. Alternately/Alternately, if you run a LOT of ECM, it can make it difficult for your opponent to properly take advantage of C3 because there's so many dead zones they have to keep track of. One wrong move can leave a unit isolated from the network. The more complications you can throw into the enemy's strategy, the greater the risk they miss something and get hosed.
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Jun 4, 2023 19:54
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William Henry Hairytaint posted:Mediums are my preference but I do like a lot of lights, they're just very challenging to use in the approximately lance sized battles that you often get in TT or Megamek. Well, yeah, that's my big issue, isn't it? I've played mostly MechWarrior video games, where you're a prima-donna hot-shot one-man-army. I'm sorta not good at thinking in terms of lances and teamwork, more along the lines of, "Stop stealing my kills, just distract the others while I take care of business."
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Jun 5, 2023 04:20
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painedforever posted:Well, yeah, that's my big issue, isn't it? I've played mostly MechWarrior video games, where you're a prima-donna hot-shot one-man-army. I'm sorta not good at thinking in terms of lances and teamwork, more along the lines of, "Stop stealing my kills, just distract the others while I take care of business." I just fired up mw4mercs and in your second mission spectre is grousing at convoy drivers, lol
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Jun 5, 2023 05:04
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Captain Foo posted:I just fired up mw4mercs and in your second mission spectre is grousing at convoy drivers, lol Most relatable MechWarrior protagonist, ever. Hates escort missions, same as all of us.
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Jun 5, 2023 21:52
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Captain Foo posted:I just fired up mw4mercs and in your second mission spectre is grousing at convoy drivers, lol The payoff for that mission is amazing, though. Once you've escorted the tanks back to base your DropShip powers up its weapons and obliterates the bandits who have been harassing you for the entire mission. It makes all the pain of babysitting those useless hunks of metal worthwhile.
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Jun 6, 2023 17:03
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Scintilla posted:The payoff for that mission is amazing, though. Once you've escorted the tanks back to base your DropShip powers up its weapons and obliterates the bandits who have been harassing you for the entire mission. It makes all the pain of babysitting those useless hunks of metal worthwhile. Hell yeah I forgot how hard the styk missions are
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Jun 6, 2023 17:05
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