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mcmagic posted:The amount of text on the cards in this set is bad. Seems about the same as any recent set, but given how much outside interest this IP will bring, they probably could have done a set with much simpler cards and keywords, like an intro product or low complexity environment. But considering folks already question whether every card could possibly push in the formats it's allowed in as it is, doubt a set with a bunch of near vanilla or simple cards would be appreciated.
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Jun 6, 2023 01:06
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A 2-mana 2/2 that gets +1/+1 under certain (relatively trivial) conditions is less powerful than a 2-mana 3/3, but they're more likely to print the former than the latter these days because it looks more interesting.
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Jun 6, 2023 01:20
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The only complexity creep that bothers me is ring-tempting. Creating not one but two additional things to track is annoying, see for instance the stupid Initiative
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Jun 6, 2023 01:32
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W.T. Fits posted:https://twitter.com/manacurves/status/1665843920926826498?s=46&t=q7vwKZLBjSrKXxJHX2sEeg This is loving busted holy poo poo
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Jun 6, 2023 01:47
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what sucks is that most of the ring mechanic will just be permalocked to this set and never expanded in others unless wotc decides to implement "the one ring" outside LOTR stuff.
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Jun 6, 2023 01:47
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Silhouette posted:This is loving busted holy poo poo yeah that card is pretty great. Spirits already had pretty good ways to dodge spot removal, but this is pretty much the final form of that
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Jun 6, 2023 01:58
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Silhouette posted:This is loving busted holy poo poo It's just pseudo-protection from targeting effects. Wrath effects (even poo poo like Anger of the Gods) still owns him. I love the design. But it isn't close to busted.
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Jun 6, 2023 02:27
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Also it only works if he's already on the field (so you can't play or vial it in in response to removal like you can with Selfless Spirit or Rattlechains), and also it costs 4 so when are you ever playing it? Maybe you can make it work as essentially a control finisher (nobody's keeping in board wipes against control, right? Though he's pretty small and doesn't play nicely with your own board wipes), but it's not a fit for the current Spirits deck at all.
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Jun 6, 2023 02:37
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AlternateNu posted:It's just pseudo-protection from targeting effects. Wrath effects (even poo poo like Anger of the Gods) still owns him. You can target it with any random spell of your own in response, also this pairs well with Guardian of Faith Edit: this isn't for the Spirits deck, it's for bw tokens and may actually make that deck a thing/lingering souls playable again Edit 2: Kaya, Geist Hunter may actually have a home now Silhouette fucked around with this message at 03:10 on Jun 6, 2023 |
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Jun 6, 2023 03:06
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Silhouette posted:You can target it with any random spell of your own in response, also this pairs well with Guardian of Faith That still makes it a one-for-one, and all the value you've earned from him will still die in the wrath.
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Jun 6, 2023 03:10
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 it sticks around and brings a friend post-wrath, also wraths aren't the most common type of removal in modern by a long shot. Push, Heat, Ending and Bolt are still the most played removal pieces in the formst
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Jun 6, 2023 03:23
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fatal push is not the reason lingering souls is bad, though. how is a card that beats fatal push harder while not doing anything about the real problems going to help the deck?
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Jun 6, 2023 03:26
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Silhouette posted:
As a huge b/w tokens cheerleader myself, this card only has some fringe playability in the deck. b/w token sucks because its too slow to defeat basically anything in the format and doesn't generate enough value compared to about a dozen other strategies. You want opponents to try and 1v1 your tokens with removal. You don't need to strengthen that gameplan any further. The card being b/w instead of u/w is most of the deciding factor than anything about the card and its viability. This would more fit in the "does modern spirits play a 4 drop" line of questioning. Is it in the discussion for a spirit played at the 4 drop slot if you want to even have a 4 drop slot?
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Jun 6, 2023 03:37
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Jabor posted:it costs 4 so when are you ever playing it? there's this format called commander, you see
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Jun 6, 2023 03:40
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RE: text on cards, I think it's more of an indication that WOTC doesn't want to just keyword everything. Serra Angel looks simple but imagine how much text it would be if the actual effects of "vigilance" or "flying" had to actually be written out, in full. Now compare that to a relatively common effect that we see everywhere these days as an example: "Look at the top X cards of your library. You may reveal a [criteria] card from among them and put it into your hand. Put the rest on the bottom of your library in a random order." That's a lot of words for a pretty simple game action to actually perform, and I'd argue that the majority of cards coming out are similarly easy to understand in actual play. That's not to say that nothing's changed though. IMO, what's really going on is not so much that the game is more complicated, but that WOTC has been steadily moving power away from instants/sorceries and into permanents - and, especially, creatures. This comes up in two ways: one, most creatures are getting a keyword or two just so that combat is more engaging than vanilla 3/2 attacking a vanilla 2/3 after your stuff has an ETB effect. I suppose that's a bit more complexity but I'm not going to fault them for trying to make actually attacking more interesting. Two, instead of people having a fistful of instants just waiting to pounce on the stack, we have more trigger effects already in play on the field. It's not changing the total amount of interaction that's occuring, but it means that instead of just "throw it out and make them have it" you now know if they have it. The proactive player isn't able to do the spellcasting equivalent of "math is for blockers" with their opponent's interaction, now the proactive player actually has the on-board knowledge to know what the outcome of their action will be and are forced to "do the math" themselves.
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Jun 6, 2023 05:19
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orangelex44 posted:Serra Angel looks simple but imagine how much text it would be if the actual effects of "vigilance" or "flying" had to actually be written out, in full. You mean like theyve done a dozen times? 
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Jun 6, 2023 05:26
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Jun 6, 2023 07:20
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orangelex44 posted:RE: text on cards, I think it's more of an indication that WOTC doesn't want to just keyword everything. Serra Angel looks simple but imagine how much text it would be if the actual effects of "vigilance" or "flying" had to actually be written out, in full. Bro vigilance wasn't even a keyword until like 2004 Nice, bad for modern but decent removal in edh
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Jun 6, 2023 07:48
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W.T. Fits posted:https://twitter.com/manacurves/status/1665843920926826498?s=46&t=q7vwKZLBjSrKXxJHX2sEeg Another card that pairs well with Indicate. Silhouette posted:You can target it with any random spell of your own in response, also this pairs well with Guardian of Faith Seems too slow for a deck that normally handles spot removal pretty well, but drat it'd be nice to dust off the old tokens deck and not have it suck.
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Jun 6, 2023 08:08
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love her   Legendary Creature - Elf Noble Whenever you scry, put a +1/+1 counter on target creature. 4GU: Scry 2.
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Jun 6, 2023 14:40
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the spirit legend not dodging fury, solitude, leyline binding, or 3feri makes me feel kinda shrug about it, but it seems fun to target with my own stuff.
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Jun 6, 2023 14:59
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Procrastinator posted:the spirit legend not dodging fury, solitude, leyline binding, or 3feri makes me feel kinda shrug about it, but it seems fun to target with my own stuff. Oh I didn't catch that actually. I thought a spell was any card other than a land? Maybe that's just on the stack? Do other cards refer to instants/sorceries as spells to distinguish between them and triggered abilities? I guess I've just never noticed somehow
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Jun 6, 2023 15:13
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Procrastinator posted:the spirit legend not dodging fury, solitude, leyline binding, or 3feri makes me feel kinda shrug about it, but it seems fun to target with my own stuff. oh I missed that. Fury is one of the major reasons why I gave up on bw tokens
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Jun 6, 2023 15:14
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Weird Pumpkin posted:Oh I didn't catch that actually. I thought a spell was any card other than a land? Maybe that's just on the stack? It's not just instants and sorceries (you can also be targeted by enchantments and creatures on the stack, for example) and the distinction between spells and triggered/activated abilities has been part of the rules since Alpha. eg, here's a pair of cards from Visions and Mirage: https://scryfall.com/card/vis/15/peace-talks vs https://scryfall.com/card/mir/278/reparations MrL_JaKiri fucked around with this message at 15:36 on Jun 6, 2023 |
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Jun 6, 2023 15:31
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Weird Pumpkin posted:Oh I didn't catch that actually. I thought a spell was any card other than a land? Maybe that's just on the stack? You'd be looking for "targetted by a spell or ability" and this only says "spell". So it works on fatal push, bolt, unholy heat, etc. but not abilities (either triggered or activated) like the pitch elementals ETBs or a planeswalker or creature activation.
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Jun 6, 2023 15:33
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Procrastinator posted:You'd be looking for "targetted by a spell or ability" and this only says "spell". So it works on fatal push, bolt, unholy heat, etc. but not abilities (either triggered or activated) like the pitch elementals ETBs or a planeswalker or creature activation. oh duh How on earth did I just completely skip that lol. tbh it's a wonder I can even play a game of magic with how little I actually end up thinking about the rules at all
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Jun 6, 2023 18:02
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Weird Pumpkin posted:oh duh that, counterintuitively, means the rules are clearly and well-written, because you're able to internalize them and implement them correctly without needing to check everything exactly every time. it's GOOD that magic has poo poo like layers, and it's even better that we don't need them in 99% of games.
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Jun 6, 2023 18:48
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Goa Tse-tung posted:love her drat this is sick.
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Jun 6, 2023 20:20
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Jun 6, 2023 21:06
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kinda surprised it's not a dfc with gollum on the other side
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Jun 6, 2023 21:08
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Jun 6, 2023 21:31
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That's a hella neat design.
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Jun 6, 2023 21:33
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            Elvish Hymn - 3G Enchantment (Rare) You may look at the top card of your library at any time. You may cast creature spells from the top of your library. Creatures you control have "Tap: Add one mana of any color". Strong Sauce fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Jun 6, 2023 |
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Jun 6, 2023 21:42
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Lots of very fun cards and Red Meathook Massacre, interesting.
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Jun 6, 2023 21:47
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meanolmrcloud posted:They ran outta clean designs half a decade ago. Complexity is good and should be encouraged. It feels special nowadays whenever we get a card with a one word name.
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Jun 6, 2023 21:51
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Goddamn this set is cool
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Jun 6, 2023 22:08
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Cool set but they should post some stories so we know about this plane and all these legendaries. Dysgenesis posted:It feels special nowadays whenever we get a card with a one word name. Feels like you should have a really strong, solid, clear design for cards like that too. Fritzy's Ritzy Kill can have some draft archetypes word salad, but a spell called Kill should pretty unequivocally destroy permanents without EULA written on the card. Don't know if this is historically true, but I like the Anger cycle. Good use of one word concepts
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Jun 6, 2023 22:36
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god help me I want to play this in nic fit just because
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Jun 6, 2023 23:27
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 Apparently someone got a collector booster packs early and are showing them off on whatnot. Most of these are Commander cards                                            
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Jun 7, 2023 01:30
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Strong Sauce posted:
hopefully they and their spouse or roommates have undergone resistance training because the pinkertons are en route
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Jun 7, 2023 01:37
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