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BIG HEADLINE posted:One of the biggest things holding back Siberian agriculture is a lack of long-term labor. You can't tell me that in some early planning stages of the Ukrainian invasion, the evil fucks didn't Not just long-term labor, but lack of infrastructure. Industrial scale agriculture requires a decent amount of infrastructure - nothing like you'd see in a city, but you need to plant, harvest, store, and transport all those crops. It requires decent roads/rail, water supplies for irrigation, etc. What infrastructure is there was designed and built with the idea that permafrost would be permanent. This is not an insurmountable task, but Russia is also likely to undergo severe economic shocks for some period of years after the invasion of Ukraine - as a nation, they are deeply unpopular in most of the world, and nobody knows just how long that will last.
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May 7, 2023 07:10
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at the possibility of sending tens/hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians up to work the fields in Siberia. As it stands, I've always thought "Plan B" will come when the Indian Subcontinent becomes inhospitable to those without access to air conditioning.
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We're going to have destructive degrowth, it's just not going to be human politics that cause it. The effects of climate change are going to hit us whether or not it's politically convenient or realistic to acknowledge.
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May 7, 2023 07:22
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Shooting Blanks posted:The ELF (Earth Liberation Front) is the only thing that comes to mind, and I haven't heard of them in quite awhile. It was also completely decentralized, which is probably what allowed for them to operate for so long, while simultaneously limiting the potential scope of their actions. ELF and ALF were considered the two biggest terrorist organizations in the US for quite a long time.
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May 7, 2023 23:24
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Regarding the battery installation I’m seeing It’s the blue 2023. That’s the stuff I’ve been seeing in transit in warehouses.
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May 15, 2023 18:16
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I don't like that it is leveling off in 2025. It needs to go hockey-stick.
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May 15, 2023 18:32
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I did some math for Germany I think and they'd have to double newly installed capacity every year for at least a decade to get anywhere lol.
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May 15, 2023 18:50
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Thorn Wishes Talon posted:I don't like that it is leveling off in 2025. It needs to go hockey-stick. I think that’s the end of the IRA money.
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May 15, 2023 19:34
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:Misunderstanding of economics, industrialized society and heavily biased politics lead to doomerism. Command economics have done the same if not more environmental damage than markets. only a planned climate war economy has even the faintest hope of saving even a remnant of civilization from itself, let alone initiating the generation reterraforming project that needs to happen. planned economies can, you know, actually plan for the future. markets can't.
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May 16, 2023 09:06
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there has never been a command economy ever that has been oriented towards biosphere restoration. that's our only hope. otherwise - if it's tyool 2023 and you still don't know we're doomed, you probably still believe neoclassical econ is anything more than a hallucinatory psuedoscience.
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May 16, 2023 09:07
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Osv18 posted:only a planned climate war economy has even the faintest hope of saving even a remnant of civilization from itself, let alone initiating the generation reterraforming project that needs to happen. Whats your plan to create a climate-themed theocracy and how have you acted on it.
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May 18, 2023 14:37
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Baron Porkface posted:Whats your plan to create a climate-themed theocracy and how have you acted on it. Why a theocracy?
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May 18, 2023 18:48
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Probably "theocracy" isn't quite right but what is being proposed is solidly in the authoritarian camp. Except that even authoritarian governments need some sort of popular support from some significant part of the population, and I'm not sure who the constituency is for this destructive degrowth policy.
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May 18, 2023 19:00
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Zeta Taskforce posted:Probably "theocracy" isn't quite right but what is being proposed is solidly in the authoritarian camp. Except that even authoritarian governments need some sort of popular support from some significant part of the population, and I'm not sure who the constituency is for this destructive degrowth policy. It's not a good answer, and I think it is far more likely that middling efforts will continue to be made as the problems multiply. Ultimately, this will lead to massively decreased production and CO2 output anyway, as large-scale integrated industrial civilization breaks down.
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May 18, 2023 19:09
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https://twitter.com/Ant_Partnership/status/1659080928075939841 In other news Antarctic sea-ice is not in good shape. As some may remember, Antarctic sea-ice extent was actually increasing for a few years because changes in wind patterns pushed ice towards the continent, increasing the stability of the pack ice. Arctic sea-ice is hemmed in by all the land surrounding the Arctic Ocean, but Antarctic sea-ice is subject to the open Southern Ocean, so there's only a relatively narrow band of fast ice that forms, which is sensitive to wind patterns. Nonetheless, the atmospheric and ocean warming is overriding this big time now.
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May 18, 2023 19:16
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cat botherer posted:In all seriousness, something like a revolution along Marxist-Leninist lines will be necessary, because entrenched powers in our capitalist society will never effectively fight climate change because it would mean the end of the current economic system. The problems of biosphere collapse are manifold, and there's simply no answer that both leaves the world livable and our current socioeconomic system intact. We will need changes to our society of similar magnitude to the huge changes we are wreaking on the planet. I do have news for you. There are entrenched powers and elites in Marxist-Leninist systems too. That's pretty bad. Antarctica is going into winter besides. This chart measures the sea ice anomaly, not absolute coverage. Being winter I'm sure that the absolute coverage is still increasing, but sea ice forms a protective barrier around ice shelves. Melting sea ice does nothing to change sea level, but without it waves, currents, and storms are all much more destructive, and that will produce sea level rise
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May 19, 2023 02:36
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Zeta Taskforce posted:I do have news for you. There are entrenched powers and elites in Marxist-Leninist systems too.
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May 19, 2023 02:44
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Historic Colorado River deal not enough to stave off long-term crisis, experts say https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/may/23/colorado-river-water-usage-deal-analysis quote:A hard-fought agreement between California, Arizona and Nevada to slash the states’ use of the shrinking Colorado River is only a temporary salve to a long-term water crisis that continues to threaten the foundations of life in the American west, experts have warned. The deal the Biden admin worked out between Colorado river basin states is better than nothing, but it will fall short. The funny thing is that if it were used less stupidly, there would be enough water even with climate change, but there's an insistence of growing things like alfalfa in the desert.
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May 23, 2023 16:16
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The thing with agreements like this is that the initial deal is usually the hardest part, and it is relatively much easier to amend it as time goes on because there is a framework in place. So it’s one of those things I’m cautiously optimistic about.
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May 24, 2023 02:54
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Slow News Day posted:The thing with agreements like this is that the initial deal is usually the hardest part, and it is relatively much easier to amend it as time goes on because there is a framework in place. So it’s one of those things I’m cautiously optimistic about.
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May 24, 2023 03:06
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I was invited to a clubhouse (online voice chat app) panel, a group called “Understanding Climate Change.” I knew it was going off the rails when one of the participants started talking about carbon sequestration from CO2 in ocean water that would create freshwater and generate electricity. The next clue was floating cities. Finally most novel climate, denial thing I’ve ever heard, they used some BS quantum mechanic explanation for why it really wasn’t a CEO to blame, but was the urban heat islands that were causing the problem. At that point, I lost it because they weren’t letting me really say much, and I finally said I had an F-ing Ivy League physics degree and you guys are all full of crap and then I left. I hate doing that appeal to authority, but this was a complete waste of time. It was when the more novel climate denying things I ever heard. Discussing how electrons are excited by photons and blah blah blah, and leading to some bizarre conclusion about greenhouse gases, not really mattering.
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May 29, 2023 22:48
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Hey cat botherer. This is the battery and semiconductor manufacturing. 
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Jun 7, 2023 02:58
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Bar Ran Dun posted:Hey cat botherer.
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Jun 7, 2023 04:55
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https://twitter.com/william_volk/status/1666858024257093632?s=20 I'm going to look back on that game (I produced it) when stuff really goes off the rails and not enjoy it at all.
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Jun 8, 2023 18:49
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VideoGameVet posted:https://twitter.com/william_volk/status/1666858024257093632?s=20 https://twitter.com/WeatherProf/status/1666940759759630338 It's more dramatic in this plot:  That really strikes me as some bifurcation being hit.
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Jun 9, 2023 17:44
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Things are spiraling out of control rapidly, and we are still refusing to slam on the brakes in terms of emissions or general consumption. Completely unhinged behavior at a collective level.
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Jun 9, 2023 18:16
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What breaks would you hit? I'm serious, if you were in charge what would you do?
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Jun 9, 2023 18:31
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:What breaks would you hit? I'm serious, if you were in charge what would you do?
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Jun 9, 2023 18:34
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Not really, I wouldn't be necessarily be opposed to similar things that happen in the United States when it was shifted to a command economy during World War II but combating climate change instead of Nazis. In theory, it's not a half bad idea. But even then, like then what? What actual polices would you implement? Would we ban cars? Commercial air travel? Air conditioning? You'd also have to somehow stay in office AND get the rest of the world to get on board. How would that work?
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Jun 9, 2023 18:42
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:Not really, I wouldn't be necessarily be opposed to similar things that happen in the United States when it was shifted to a command economy during World War II but combating climate change instead of Nazis. In theory, it's not a half bad idea. Our current system of production is not sustainable. We can either stop it voluntarily, and move to a better system without mass death and collapse. Or, we can keep doing what we're doing until the current system of production simply stops due to the Earth's physical constraints. Either way, things like personal automobiles, single-use plastics, and McMansions are going away. All of these things require massive resource consumption and social/productive complexity. Many civilizations have collapsed before, where high complexity socio-economic systems give way to smaller, localized, unspecialized production. We're not special now, and in fact we're in a worse situation.
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Jun 9, 2023 18:54
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One of the most frustrating things is that many of the things we need to do would dramatically improve living conditions for many if not most people. Less time commuting, physical activity easier, big reduction in traffic deaths and pollution from cars.
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Jun 9, 2023 19:00
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:You'd also have to somehow stay in office AND get the rest of the world to get on board. How would that work? Man, if only we had some kind of communication device that allowed us to stay home
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Jun 9, 2023 19:02
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Vitamin Me posted:Man, if only we had some kind of communication device that allowed us to stay home Think he means politicians (unless that's the joke). I don't think democracy could save us, certainly not the one we've got.
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Jun 9, 2023 19:10
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cat botherer posted:Heavily discourage/almost ban personal cars. Huge public transit projects. Thousands of nuclear plants. Sorry, that's the kind of thing that's needed. It's not the answer you want to hear, but it's the truth. If that's not ever politically realistic (it's not now, and it may not ever be), we're hosed. I think you are making some enormous assumptions about me but to be absolutely clear you are entirely correct that the reduction of and to be absolutely specific near elimination of personal automobiles would be a extremely effective way to combat climate change. Even better than EVs. Hell, I would love if the whole world would had something like the Deutsche Bahn from Germany or Metropolitan Rapid Transit in Thailand. Vitamin Me posted:Man, if only we had some kind of communication device that allowed us to stay home Remote work applies to maybe a third of the population. Globally, not everyone even has a computer or reliable internet. Even during lockdown, global emissions fell by only a few percent.
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Jun 9, 2023 19:12
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:But even then, like then what? What actual polices would you implement? Would we ban cars? Commercial air travel? Air conditioning? You'd also have to somehow stay in office AND get the rest of the world to get on board. How would that work? I think it's pretty easy and self-evident 1. You enact a massive carbon tax and the rationing of fossil fuels that would put the country on a 1.5°C path 2. When the population announces a general strike, you try to put it down with the loyal parts of the military and send the instigators to the camps 3. Civil war! 4. Country is completely devastated by the civil war and half the population is dead and you are now on a 1.4 °C path
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Jun 9, 2023 19:18
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Yeah kinda read that wrong. One policy I would enact as leader of the world is banning all fake poo poo from china and meaningless alibaba gadgets being shipped around everywhere. Also no more cruises
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Jun 9, 2023 19:22
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GABA ghoul posted:I think it's pretty easy and self-evident So... Eco-Hitler? 
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Jun 9, 2023 19:31
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At this point I'd take it over humanity slowly burning to death along with all the other species we've doomed
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Jun 9, 2023 19:34
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:So... Eco-Hitler? Uncontrolled climate change will induce huge migrations and all manner of social problems. That's the kind of situation where you get a regular Hitler.
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Jun 9, 2023 19:49
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Professor Beetus posted:At this point I'd take it over humanity slowly burning to death along with all the other species we've doomed In the past, societies have confronted less severe climate change, and issues like soil loss. There has always been the fallback of decreased social and material complexity to reach a new stable regime. In severe cases, sometimes this has meant reversion to hunter-gatherer situations. There would be no such option under severe climate change. You need things to hunt or gather to be a hunter-gatherer.
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Jun 9, 2023 19:58
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| # ? Jun 7, 2024 03:36 |
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My initial list would be: 1. Ban private aircraft. No more rich people flying all over the place willy nilly. Everyone takes commercial airlines if they want to fly somewhere. 2. Implement new pricing scheme for commercial flights whereby the price doubles with every trip that year. First trip is regular price, then it starts to double, and the tax money that's generated from that is put into a federal fund that sends checks to every citizen regularly on a sliding scale based on income level. This allows people to take flights once a year to see family and whatnot, but severely discourages additional flights, and also ensures that lower income people who are most affected by climate change receive some sort of direct compensation. 3. Build HSR along (or maybe even over) every interstate highway. Once these are built, you would see a ton of voluntary reduction in private car usage. 4. Allocate federal funds to create a massive subsidy program that aggressively rewards cities for reducing the number of cars on their roads. That way every city can decide how they want to accomplish that. 5. Immediately cease all oil and gas drilling projects. Order existing wells to be decommissioned within five years. 6. Order all coal power plants shut down within three years. Allocate federal funds to replace that power generation with solar and wind. etcetera
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Jun 9, 2023 19:59
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