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Namor, Kang and the Flash can go to France and make a Luc Besson movie. The French don't care.
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Jun 11, 2023 20:06
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Saw ATSV again, still great. I had a much more reactive audience this time, made it a lot of fun, and they practically exploded in noise when the end credits hit. Overheard a lot of conversations afterwards about it (even well after I left the theater, which was pretty funny to randomly hear people in the subway talking about Miles), so it definitely engaged people. Re: the earlier conversation about events near the end: The "Earth 1610" title and "Earth 42" screen flash up really quick, quicker than other similar shots, so it definitely feels like they were intending for those to be missed, and I'm not surprised if people did. On the other hand, some of the other clues are really obvious watching it again, like Rio's eye color. I like the continuity from the first movie that apparently Comic-Con exists in every universe except Miles'. Didn't appreciate the first viewing just how gorgeous the art style of Gwen's universe is. The animation in some of the conversations with her and her dad is almost abstract, it's a really cool look. Random little detail I had missed: When Rio snaps her fingers after learning Miles has a B in Spanish, the visual sound effect is a little version of the Puerto Rican flag. The headquarters alone is going to reveal so many details when this comes out on home video.
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Jun 11, 2023 22:28
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Jamesman posted:Some odd rumors came up on my feed, saying that Marvel might be casting BLACKPINK's Jennie or possibly Rosé to play Luna Snow in an upcoming project. Luna Snow? Really? Have they actually used her somewhere outside of Future Fight?
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Jun 12, 2023 01:41
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Vandar posted:Luna Snow? Really? Yeah, she's been in Agents of Atlas whenever that turns up.
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Jun 12, 2023 02:39
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https://twitter.com/DCeballos95/status/1666590906286473216
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Jun 12, 2023 03:00
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Him acting out Rio is great, lol
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Jun 12, 2023 03:24
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Now that's how you do a cliffhanger, goddamn
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Jun 12, 2023 06:10
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Was planning to rewatch Across the Spider-Verse with some friends at the weekend but the plans fell through, and now it looks like it’s been bumped from cinemas in favour of the Flash this weekend. I can only assume that they know people would literally never watch The Flash if Spider-Verse was still available.
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Jun 12, 2023 09:45
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I absolutely love the little hand motion she does when scolding Miles in Spanish after "my fault"
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Jun 12, 2023 10:09
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Yvonmukluk posted:Was planning to rewatch Across the Spider-Verse with some friends at the weekend but the plans fell through, and now it looks like it’s been bumped from cinemas in favour of the Flash this weekend. I can only assume that they know people would literally never watch The Flash if Spider-Verse was still available. That seems weird, ATSV is still going strong in cinemas.
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Jun 12, 2023 10:25
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Yeah spiderverse got bumped from most imax but it's still playing at the theaters. It's only the 2nd week. Oh if you're ordering tickets a whole week in advance, some theaters like AMC only have their full showtime list posted midweek, that might be it. Sharkopath fucked around with this message at 11:40 on Jun 12, 2023 |
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Jun 12, 2023 11:09
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By and large, I enjoyed Across the Spider-Verse. The only bit I didn't really like was the fact that Miles was seemingly the only Spider-Man in the multiverse who didn't fall in line with Miguel. To me there's a difference between Spider-Ham saying "the worst thing about this job is you can't save everyone" and several hundred thousand Peter Parkers being convinced that every Uncle Ben and Captain Stacy is fated to die and you shouldn't even try to save them. I understand how it fits into Miles' story and the broader themes but I also have a hard time buying that so many Spideys would accept that line of thinking.
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Jun 12, 2023 15:13
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Miguel's team isn't all the Spiders in the multiverse, it's all the Spiders Miguel hand picked.
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Jun 12, 2023 15:15
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Splint Chesthair posted:By and large, I enjoyed Across the Spider-Verse. The only bit I didn't really like was the fact that Miles was seemingly the only Spider-Man in the multiverse who didn't fall in line with Miguel. To me there's a difference between Spider-Ham saying "the worst thing about this job is you can't save everyone" and several hundred thousand Peter Parkers being convinced that every Uncle Ben and Captain Stacy is fated to die and you shouldn't even try to save them. I understand how it fits into Miles' story and the broader themes but I also have a hard time buying that so many Spideys would accept that line of thinking. I don't think that's the implication. Firstly there's Spiderpunk. Secondly the people at his base are just the spiders he was able to recruit, as we can see Miguel doesn't recruit everyone. Folks like the Bollywood Spiderman don't seem aware of the canon event stuff at all. My guess is that Miguel just usually recruits people *after* their canon events, at which point they are emotionally vulnerable to his message that whatever happened had to happen.
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Jun 12, 2023 15:19
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Aphrodite posted:Miguel's team isn't all the Spiders in the multiverse, it's all the Spiders Miguel hand picked. Plus Miles isn't the only Spider-Man in the movie to question Miguel's plan. Hell, he's not even the first my man Hobie...
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Jun 12, 2023 15:21
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Aphrodite posted:Miguel's team isn't all the Spiders in the multiverse, it's all the Spiders Miguel hand picked. Yeah, he even has to be convinced to let Gwen join, after repeatedly saying she can't.
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Jun 12, 2023 15:43
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Fangz posted:I don't think that's the implication. Firstly there's Spiderpunk. Secondly the people at his base are just the spiders he was able to recruit, as we can see Miguel doesn't recruit everyone. Folks like the Bollywood Spiderman don't seem aware of the canon event stuff at all. Gwen's bracelet thing warned her that there was an "incoming canon event" before Spider-Man India's incident with the bus, and she knew immediately she had to stop Miles from interrupting it. That gave me the impression all the Spider-People know about the "canon" and why Miguel wants to keep it intact.
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Jun 12, 2023 16:20
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Pavitr says "I can do both" while struggling to keep the bus safe. He couldn't. Not without help. So I think he was aware of it but still tried to stop it. Like always, Spider-Man would have an easier time if he wasn't so hesitant to accept help and thought he had to do everything on his own. Spider-Verse spoilers above.
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Jun 12, 2023 16:32
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Codependent Poster posted:Pavitr says "I can do both" while struggling to keep the bus safe. He couldn't. Not without help. So I think he was aware of it but still tried to stop it. Like always, Spider-Man would have an easier time if he wasn't so hesitant to accept help and thought he had to do everything on his own. But that's the thing that bothers me — Pavitr believes he can save both his girlfriend and her father alone, even if he can't. That's different from all the other Spideys accepting the idea that certain people are going to die because it's preordained. It's all the other Spideys hanging back and saying "this horrible thing needs to happen" that bugs me because to me that's central to the idea of Spider-Man - the regret and guilt that comes from being able to do something but choosing not to. Miguel's team is a whole bunch of Spider-Men choosing not to do the thing they all regret not doing, over and over again. A lot of this is me being really disappointed in Sweatpants Spidey from the first movie, mind you.
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Jun 12, 2023 16:47
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Splint Chesthair posted:But that's the thing that bothers me — Pavitr believes he can save both his girlfriend and her father alone, even if he can't. That's different from all the other Spideys accepting the idea that certain people are going to die because it's preordained. It's all the other Spideys hanging back and saying "this horrible thing needs to happen" that bugs me because to me that's central to the idea of Spider-Man - the regret and guilt that comes from being able to do something but choosing not to. Miguel's team is a whole bunch of Spider-Men choosing not to do the thing they all regret not doing, over and over again. I think that them knowing it will/has to happen doesn't stop them from trying as individuals, but it stops the entire Spider Society from showing up to make sure it doesn't happen. Like, Peter was surprised when Miguel decided to lock Miles away. I think he thought it was a conversation to prepare Miles for it and help him understand that a whole lot of Spider-people have gone through it, and that they can't interfere or it could make things worse. But Miguel then went all Spider-Dad and decided he knew best and grounded Miles instead of listening to him. I mean, there has to be a good reason to say why bad things happen and why this team of multiversal Spider-people don't stop everything bad from ever happening, and "it might destroy the universe/multiverse" is a good reason.
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Jun 12, 2023 16:55
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Miguel is essentially telling them they didn't fail, it was just preordained. Probably helps the sale. Also, is Pavitr in the society? He's aware of it obviously, but he doesn't have a watch.
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Jun 12, 2023 17:02
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Aphrodite posted:Miguel is essentially telling them they didn't fail, it was just preordained. Probably helps the sale. Yeah, he is. He asks if Miles knows about Hobie, so he's definitely worked with Gwen and Hobie before.
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Jun 12, 2023 17:15
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Isn't it stated in the movie that the 'society' has only been around for a year or two, having been put together not long after the events of the first movie? I kind of get the sense that most of the Spider people haven't had the chance to grapple with the ethics of allowing "cannon" events to play out, due in part to Miguel mostly handpicking those who have already lived through theirs, and them rarely being in universe during such an event to intervene. They mention past instances, but notably in the context of fixing missed events. I think there is a reason so many of them ended up disillusioned after what goes down with Miles.
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Jun 12, 2023 17:17
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Gotta admit, while I have seen some occasional grousing I'm rather pleasantly surprised the fanbase has so willingly bought into the idea that most Spider-people, fan favorites like the Spectacular and Insomniac Spideys included, would side with Miguel. If the movie was even a little bit less stellar overall there'd probably be a massive firestorm about that.
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Jun 12, 2023 17:21
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the one thing that wasn't entirely clear to me is why miguel is considering jefferson's imminent death the canon event, when ItSV and even this movie laid it out pretty clear that it was aaron's death in the first movie that was miles' canon event
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Jun 12, 2023 17:23
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site posted:the one thing that wasn't entirely clear to me is why miguel is considering jefferson's imminent death the canon event, when ItSV and even this movie laid it out pretty clear that it was aaron's death in the first movie that was miles' canon event The implication is that Aaron's death in the first movie was Miles' "Uncle Ben" moment, but Jeff's impending death was supposed to be his "Captain Stacy" moment. Miguel also implies other things like hosting a symbiote and getting married were things that were "supposed" to happen to Spider-Man.
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Jun 12, 2023 17:27
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site posted:the one thing that wasn't entirely clear to me is why miguel is considering jefferson's imminent death the canon event, when ItSV and even this movie laid it out pretty clear that it was aaron's death in the first movie that was miles' canon event It seemed to me there’s multiple potential canon events. Uncle Ben/Uncle Aaron is usually the inciting one, but the death of a Captain is another, and I imagine for a lot of Spiders the death of a Gwen would be a third, which could be why Miguel was so resistant to Gwen joining the society and had her on such a short leash, knowing she stands a good chance to be somebody else’s canon event.
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Jun 12, 2023 17:29
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Arist posted:Gotta admit, while I have seen some occasional grousing I'm rather pleasantly surprised the fanbase has so willingly bought into the idea that most Spider-people, fan favorites like the Spectacular and Insomniac Spideys included, would side with Miguel. If the movie was even a little bit less stellar overall there'd probably be a massive firestorm about that. Again, these are the ones Miguel hand picked. I’m guessing a big part of Beyond will be Gwen putting her own team together, beyond the og group
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Jun 12, 2023 17:29
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Splint Chesthair posted:The implication is that Aaron's death in the first movie was Miles' "Uncle Ben" moment, but Jeff's impending death was supposed to be his "Captain Stacy" moment. i guess i'm not familiar enough with spider-man to know about that one
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Jun 12, 2023 17:32
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Sanschel posted:It seemed to me there’s multiple potential canon events. Uncle Ben/Uncle Aaron is usually the inciting one, but the death of a Captain is another, and I imagine for a lot of Spiders the death of a Gwen would be a third, which could be why Miguel was so resistant to Gwen joining the society and had her on such a short leash, knowing she stands a good chance to be somebody else’s canon event. I mean canonically, Spider-gwen's Ben is Peter, and maaaaybe also her Gwen. Alternatively Miles is her Gwen lol.
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Jun 12, 2023 17:40
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Dexo posted:I mean canonically, Spider-gwen's Ben is Peter, and maaaaybe also her Gwen. It’s Miles. She has a line about it when they’re hanging from the building
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Jun 12, 2023 17:41
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Miguel is in the dirt when both Miles and Gwen are each other's "Gwen". well okay he'd just kill Miles probably lol
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Jun 12, 2023 17:44
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site posted:i guess i'm not familiar enough with spider-man to know about that one It's fine - to be honest the death of Captain Stacy is a relatively deep cut in terms of Spider-Man lore.
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Jun 12, 2023 17:55
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site posted:i guess i'm not familiar enough with spider-man to know about that one They refer to it by the issue of Amazing Spider-Man where it happens. Of course series relaunches probably makes that numbering scheme very confusing
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Jun 12, 2023 17:59
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Yea okay I guess enough time has passed that we can be a liiittle bit critical of this particular matter because I'll be honest, this also kinda bothered me about the third act of this apex-tier film. Although, to be fair, some of this is going to depend on how they stick the landing in the final film, and I'm really hoping for a reveal or twist or something that'll alleviate the issues I had here. So, I like the idea of canon events. I like that the multiverse itself has a set story it wants to tell, a set fate it has in store for its "characters," and that it'll react badly when things don't go the way it wants. I like that the other Spider-folks have beholden themselves to this crazy unfair system, and that Miles has to be the one to fight back against this idea, against what the world has determined him to be, against what other people think he should be, against "canon." That part's all great. No notes. But. I think the idea of Captain Stacy's death specifically being some sort of pivotal canon event for Spider-Man that is set in stone for him and his universe?...is a fuckin' weird pull. Because this dude dying was...not that big a deal? Like, it's a little important, sure, but it's also mostly something that writers can and do write around all the time. It's kinda telling that they could only find one single movie out of eight live-action Spider-Man movies to be able to show clips of this happening from, because like...Whathisname Stacy's death is simply not that big an event and I don't think people even remember that this happened, most of the time, and it’s weird to hinge the fabric of reality on it. Gwen's death was the event, the nexus point, the big fat deal. Gwen's death was the crux that her father's death kinda just...orbits around. So the whole time that this movie was trying to convince us of how important Well, we find out that the Doylist reason that this death needs to be important to Spider-Canon, as far as the plot goes, is because they want to tie in the notion that Miles' dad dying is important to canon, so that they can put Jeff Morales' life on the line. Because apparently.......okay...apparently it's not just that Captain Stacy has to die, it's that all police captains that all Spider-Mans know have to die for the sake of proper canon. Which...yeah...this is a stretch. It just is, right? It's a roundabout way to insert personal stakes for Miles here which, sure yeah, personal stakes are nice, but it doesn't change how stretched the logic here has become, which makes the rest of the movie kinda weird because whether or not Jeff Morales has to die -- because he's police captain, see -- becomes the core conflict for the rest of the film. So I'm hoping this gets clarified or outright just revealed to be bullshit in the final film. 'Cuz like, I get what they’re trying to do, here: Spider-Man "needs" to lose people. Spider-Man ""needs"" to be unhappy, to be burdened by loss, to sacrifice. The universe itself demands it. It's a weird concept, but could be interesting if handled well, especially since the logical conclusion of it all is that Miles is going to flip this poo poo on its head. But still, the actual mechanics of it all are a bit thin, and I can't help but feel like this "the world will explode if we don't adhere to police chief canon" stuff probably coulda used another draft, especially since it all gets delivered in a somewhat strained exposition dump. Anyway, near-flawless movie, I've already seen it twice and I might actually go again.
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Jun 12, 2023 18:00
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To me it’s pretty clear that Spider-Man 2099 is not a reliable source for any of this Also for Miles he not only lost his uncle in the first movie, but his hero Peter died saving him. Like clearly the events that happen to him are different from what they are talking about with the other Spider People
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Jun 12, 2023 18:04
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FlamingLiberal posted:Also for Miles he not only lost his uncle in the first movie, but his hero Peter died saving him. Like clearly the events that happen to him are different from what they are talking about with the other Spider People Which is extra-weird because Miguel insists Miles was never supposed to be Spider-Man. So why does he also insist Miles needs to have a canon event? Does he need it to make him more Spider-Manny? Anyway I'm nitpicking the middle section of a trilogy that's not finished yet and like you said Miguel is not shown to be in his right mind. He's literally shooting up when he's introduced. Splint Chesthair fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Jun 12, 2023 |
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Jun 12, 2023 18:17
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Splint Chesthair posted:But that's the thing that bothers me — Pavitr believes he can save both his girlfriend and her father alone, even if he can't. That's different from all the other Spideys accepting the idea that certain people are going to die because it's preordained. It's all the other Spideys hanging back and saying "this horrible thing needs to happen" that bugs me because to me that's central to the idea of Spider-Man - the regret and guilt that comes from being able to do something but choosing not to. Miguel's team is a whole bunch of Spider-Men choosing not to do the thing they all regret not doing, over and over again. But they are convinced that the thing they feel they should do is the thing they'd regret. Miguel and the events in Mumbattan have done that. And I would argue the regret & guilt from not doing something you were supposed to is only central to the creation of Spider-Man but clearly that's not always the case. The first movie was about anyone being Spider-Man and the second asks if all of them have to be Spider-Man in the same way. Miles, Gwen, Miguel, Jessica, and Hobie are the characters this time around to show that not everyone has to follow the Peter Parker path.
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Jun 12, 2023 18:52
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Something I only really noticed on a second viewing: Miguel's theme music is incredibly close to the Prowler's. Can someone remind me if Miguel actually has a reason to believe the universe he moved to unraveled because he was disrupting canon? It seems like he just immediately assumed "oh, the universe I was happy in died, must be because I was too happy."
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Jun 12, 2023 18:54
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BrianWilly posted:Yea okay I guess enough time has passed that we can be a liiittle bit critical of this particular matter because I'll be honest, this also kinda bothered me about the third act of this apex-tier film. Although, to be fair, some of this is going to depend on how they stick the landing in the final film, and I'm really hoping for a reveal or twist or something that'll alleviate the issues I had here. I don't think they're trying to elevate The Death of an Important Captain to an event that must be present in every Spidey story, because as you said, that clearly has not always happened. The evidence shows that when there IS an important Captain in a Spider-Man's life they will die saving somebody. So the frequency suggests it's a canon event and therefore cannot be tampered with. When it comes to the record of other shows and TV, they can't put this canon stuff on Gwen because Bryce Dallas Howard was just fine and to make it about this Gwen in these movies would mean the canon has to stretch across dimensions since Gwen is not Miles' Gwen.
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Jun 12, 2023 19:29
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