Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
shrike82
Jun 11, 2005

there's an aliens real time tactical squad game launching next week that looks good too

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

orange juche
Mar 14, 2012



Starship Troopers without any of the spirit is just not going to be great imo

GruntyThrst
Oct 9, 2007

*clang*

orange juche posted:

Starship Troopers without any of the spirit is just not going to be great imo

The spirit lives in the players. I have probably 60 hours in it and not a single round goes by without someone quoting the movie, for good or ill.

Cao Ni Ma
May 25, 2010



repiv posted:

speaking of not enough VRAM, yuzu just landed a major improvement for TOTK

it makes heavy use of ASTC compressed textures which aren't supported by PC GPUs, so it would decompress them, and TOTK in particular was overflowing even 8GB cards with uncompressed textures. now there's an "ASTC recompression" toggle which makes it re-encode them to one of the compressed formats that PC cards do support.

I stopped trying to make yuzu play my ToTK because of the weird pixelated lines that darted through most of the landscape, apparently because I'm on a RDNA 3 gpu. Just gave up and played it on my switch like Aonuma intended

Lockback
Sep 3, 2006

All days are nights to see till I see thee; and nights bright days when dreams do show me thee.

Shipon posted:

it feels wrong to make a starship troopers game that lacks the satire element of the movie, but hey maybe they'll pull a spec ops the line



orange juche posted:

Starship Troopers without any of the spirit is just not going to be great imo

So basically just the books then?

repiv
Aug 13, 2009

Cao Ni Ma posted:

I stopped trying to make yuzu play my ToTK because of the weird pixelated lines that darted through most of the landscape, apparently because I'm on a RDNA 3 gpu. Just gave up and played it on my switch like Aonuma intended

i'm near the end now, having played the whole thing at double resolution and 60fps with only a handful of issues

i'm on nvidia though which is apparently good for yuzu because there's a cleaner mapping from the switches maxwell GPU to nvidia cards

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009


Zero VGS posted:

I mostly mean it's worth getting with a GPU coupon so assumedly less money goes to the pro-CCP sex pests of Blizzard.
How much of the $70 D4 cost do you think Nvidia paid to Blizzard for each game code in their 40 series promo?

MechanicalTomPetty
Oct 30, 2011

Runnin' down a dream
That never would come to me

GruntyThrst posted:

The spirit lives in the players. I have probably 60 hours in it and not a single round goes by without someone quoting the movie, for good or ill.

I'M DOING MY PART!

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?

repiv posted:

i'm near the end now, having played the whole thing at double resolution and 60fps with only a handful of issues

i'm on nvidia though which is apparently good for yuzu because there's a cleaner mapping from the switches maxwell GPU to nvidia cards

It’s still nuts to me that you can say this about a current gen system. Never happened before afaik (maybe GBA? but that’s a bit of an apple to oranges comparison) and maybe won’t happen again.

repiv
Aug 13, 2009

it happened before with dolphin, there's even a handful of retail wii games which use anti-emulator techniques specifically to break dolphin

dolphin had a significant head-start with the wii though, with it being largely the same architecture as the gamecube just faster

repiv fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Jun 18, 2023

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?
Oh right, cause the wii was internally barely different from a game cube, and most of the emulation work carried over?

E:b by the edit

RoastBeef
Jul 11, 2008


I beat Crash Bandicoot running it on bleem.

repiv
Aug 13, 2009

but yeah the switch was the perfect storm, between it using an off-the-shelf SOC (AFAIK the low-level technical documents are NDA'ed but they've all leaked), it getting jailbroken very early thanks to the RCM exploit, and it generally being slow enough to manage the overhead on a decent PC

nevertheless it's the first mature emulator for a system with a modern DX11/DX12-class GPU, so it had to break new ground there

Shipon
Nov 7, 2005

Rinkles posted:

It’s still nuts to me that you can say this about a current gen system. Never happened before afaik (maybe GBA? but that’s a bit of an apple to oranges comparison) and maybe won’t happen again.

"current gen" really is loose in this case, the Switch is like 2014-2015 era hardware

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?
I mean that it’s actively being developed on and the successor hasn’t even been announced. And it’s not like Yuzu has only recently become performant.

Not to mention plenty of older consoles have worse emulation (even arguably the 3DS in some areas)

Teabag Dome Scandal
Mar 19, 2002


https://www.newegg.com/asrock-radeon-rx-6700-xt-rx6700xt-cld-12go/p/N82E16814930059
this is a pretty good deal on this card, yeah? Is the 6750XT worth the extra $40?

repiv
Aug 13, 2009

Rinkles posted:

I mean that it’s actively being developed on and the successor hasn’t even been announced. And it’s not like Yuzu has only recently become performant.

i'm morbidly curious to find out what that denuvo anti-emulator product for switch developers does, but no devs have taken up their offer yet

the wii games with emulator countermeasures used some gnarly code which is dependent on the behaviour of the CPU cache on real hardware, which emulators don't simulate (and couldn't even if they wanted to, it's too slow and usually doesn't matter)

Bloodplay it again
Aug 25, 2003

Oh, Dee, you card. :-*

RoastBeef posted:

I beat Crash Bandicoot running it on bleem.

Bleem and Bleemcast were insanely impressive. Bleemcast, in particular, ran PlayStation games at 640x480. The only real downside was that Sega's controller had fewer buttons than Sony's, so even if you got a game to run perfectly, you might not have enough buttons to play it.

Yudo
May 15, 2003

Teabag Dome Scandal posted:

https://www.newegg.com/asrock-radeon-rx-6700-xt-rx6700xt-cld-12go/p/N82E16814930059
this is a pretty good deal on this card, yeah? Is the 6750XT worth the extra $40?

I think the 6750XT is only $30 more.

Edit: I'm incorrect. The 6750XT is 8% faster for 13% more money, so not really.

Yudo fucked around with this message at 22:30 on Jun 18, 2023

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?
Yup I forgot about that. Back in the era when Apple welcomed emulation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OqMcqRI-xA

istewart
Apr 13, 2005

Still contemplating why I didn't register here under a clever pseudonym

Bloodplay it again posted:

Bleem and Bleemcast were insanely impressive. Bleemcast, in particular, ran PlayStation games at 640x480. The only real downside was that Sega's controller had fewer buttons than Sony's, so even if you got a game to run perfectly, you might not have enough buttons to play it.


Rinkles posted:

Yup I forgot about that. Back in the era when Apple welcomed emulation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OqMcqRI-xA

Yeah, Connectix Virtual Game Station was pretty solid for PSX games that came out closer to launch. I told all my friends that my iBook was a portable PlayStation years before the PSP. I don't remember that more popular, intensive games like FF7 and RE2 ever worked right, but I was able to entirely beat the original Air Combat (Ace Combat 1), get pretty far in Crash Bandicoot, and also almost beat the Star Wars Episode 1 tie-in game. The latter was only derailed by being kind of a crappy game to actually play. I think they stopped updating it and trying to make games run better when the legal trouble with Sony started, and a few years later, Microsoft bought out Connectix for Virtual PC and it was buried anyway.

Subjunctive
Sep 12, 2006

✨sparkle and shine✨

repiv posted:

the wii games with emulator countermeasures used some gnarly code which is dependent on the behaviour of the CPU cache on real hardware, which emulators don't simulate (and couldn't even if they wanted to, it's too slow and usually doesn't matter)

I wonder if they could emulate the cache details only for the Denovo code, once it was isolated.

Zero VGS
Aug 16, 2002
ASK ME ABOUT HOW HUMAN LIVES THAT MADE VIDEO GAME CONTROLLERS ARE WORTH MORE
Lipstick Apathy

Josh Lyman posted:

How much of the $70 D4 cost do you think Nvidia paid to Blizzard for each game code in their 40 series promo?

Just wild guessing, if someone fully redeems the code they maybe pay $30 or $40? It's a lot of sales that wouldn't have otherwise happened, and Blizzard might even take less money as a loss leader (give out copies for pennies on the dollar hoping some will get hooked and buy DLC or cosmetics). I'm sure they figure the people who were willing to pay $70 already did.

I for one was 100% not going to play this if I hadn't gotten it free, and won't be getting the expansions once I'm done grinding. I'll either go back to PoE or :filez: D2R and play it single player.

repiv
Aug 13, 2009

Subjunctive posted:

I wonder if they could emulate the cache details only for the Denovo code, once it was isolated.

knowing denuvo, the emulator checks would be absolutely everywhere in the binary

their whole deal is grinding reverse engineers into dust by sheer volume of checks and layers of obfuscation, hence why there's only one deranged individual who defeats it with any regularity

there's quite a few things they could do aside from cache invalidation shenanigans. flooding the JIT to tank performance, look for discrepancies in non-IEEE floating point instructions, measure instruction timings... though some of those might cause issues on future official hardware with backwards compatibility

repiv fucked around with this message at 04:13 on Jun 19, 2023

Paul MaudDib
May 3, 2006

TEAM NVIDIA:
FORUM POLICE

repiv posted:

their whole deal is grinding reverse engineers into dust by sheer volume of checks and layers of obfuscation, hence why there's only one deranged individual who defeats it with any regularity

the other bizarre thing is that it's sort of an acquihire play. You're smart and broadly experienced and determined enough to crack denuvo? hey kid how about you want a job? we'll pay you a million bucks a year to help it make it loving impenetrable to whatever poo poo you were writing.

but yea it's funny the two people who know how to crack denuvo are (a) absolutely deranged and psychotic findom lady, and (b) a chad who only cracks FIFA, refuses to elaborate further, and leaves. Because Denuvo is robbing the cradle.

Subjunctive
Sep 12, 2006

✨sparkle and shine✨

Paul MaudDib posted:

but yea it's funny the two people who know how to crack denuvo are (a) absolutely deranged and psychotic findom lady, and (b) a chad who only cracks FIFA, refuses to elaborate further, and leaves. Because Denuvo is robbing the cradle.

I really want to read more about this.

shrike82
Jun 11, 2005

it seems to be working - i get the impression games launching with denuvo are uncrackable for the launch period

Former Human
Oct 15, 2001

There were emulators for PS1, N64, and GBA while those systems were all current. Dolphin and Yuzu aren't that groundbreaking.

repiv
Aug 13, 2009

shrike82 posted:

it seems to be working - i get the impression games launching with denuvo are uncrackable for the launch period

barring the cases where the publisher screwed up and released a DRM free build by accident it usually takes at least a few months to crack yeah, sometimes much longer if the game isn't in as high demand, or if there's a switch version that people can emulate in lieu of the PC version

denuvo cracks are also usually a one-time deal so any fixes or DLCs that come out later are off the table, since that would entail cracking the newer exe all over again

repiv fucked around with this message at 04:39 on Jun 19, 2023

Paul MaudDib
May 3, 2006

TEAM NVIDIA:
FORUM POLICE

Subjunctive posted:

I really want to read more about this.

https://twitter.com/young_particle/status/1631257198327132164?t=4EhHsb0Sg0hFXK89j-FMNA&s=19

full thing: https://www.reddit.com/r/PiratedGames/comments/11fnc66/empress_explains_how_denuvo_works_through_the_one/

https://twitter.com/DenuvoScum/status/1628635273042051072

iirc her telegram thing was some findom scam too, charge tons of money to be around EMPRESS?

she's like terry davis level SCHIZO and VITRIOLIC (ok i'll stop) but she actually legitimately is breaking DRM that's resisted everyone else. And iirc she does the findom thing instead and only does Denuvo cracking to prove how much better she actually is. She charges $500 and will only do one game till it's finished, which takes her a couple months. She's previously gotten mad at people for criticizing the fact she wants money, which lol, she’s right, that's such a bizarrely nominal sum for the work. Mad as a hatter, through and through.

and the other guy only cracks Football Manager games (MKDEV) and supposedly it's an older version of denuvo since football games are infinite refreshes on a single engine.

Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at 06:42 on Jun 19, 2023

HalloKitty
Sep 30, 2005

Adjust the bass and let the Alpine blast

Bloodplay it again posted:

Bleem and Bleemcast were insanely impressive. Bleemcast, in particular, ran PlayStation games at 640x480. The only real downside was that Sega's controller had fewer buttons than Sony's, so even if you got a game to run perfectly, you might not have enough buttons to play it.

Yeah, 4x resolution with anti-aliasing and bilinear texture filtering. I have an original gran turismo 2 bleemcast disc, the image was considerably cleaner

Nalin
Sep 29, 2007

Hair Elf

Cao Ni Ma posted:

I stopped trying to make yuzu play my ToTK because of the weird pixelated lines that darted through most of the landscape, apparently because I'm on a RDNA 3 gpu. Just gave up and played it on my switch like Aonuma intended

I gave up on all the Yuzu issues and just switched to Ryujinx. I would rather things work and play at a stable 30 fps than constantly fight with issues.

Taima
Dec 31, 2006

tfw you're peeing next to someone in the lineup and they don't know
Yuzu TOTK has just been so good on Nvidia hardware for me, AND Yuzu supports Windows 11 Auto HDR somehow which is completely bewildering to me but it owns so much.

I had to sell my Switch because it's such hot trash at this point so Yuzu coming up so fast has been a god send. Some games even have a photo mode which jacks the graphics like crazy, and there are mods that make the game run 100% of the time in photo mode and it looks so good.

I'm pretty new to it, and only got into switch emu because of Totk but there have been lots of surprises along the way. For example Luigis Mansion 3 looks eye wateringly good at 4K.

Then on top of that you can patch out dynamic resolution and other things like depth of field that only really exist in the Switch to obscure how much it sucks.

The only lame part is it's kind of sad playing Yuzu because it's so clear that if the Switch had power equivalent to a PS5 it would be insane. Like, by far the best console. It would eat everyone's lunch. But Nintendo is obsessed with making lots of money on console sales and it's the most "can't see the forest for the trees" choice ever, but they ARE very rich so maybe it's me who is dumb.

Taima fucked around with this message at 10:46 on Jun 19, 2023

orange juche
Mar 14, 2012



Paul MaudDib posted:

https://twitter.com/young_particle/status/1631257198327132164?t=4EhHsb0Sg0hFXK89j-FMNA&s=19

full thing: https://www.reddit.com/r/PiratedGames/comments/11fnc66/empress_explains_how_denuvo_works_through_the_one/

https://twitter.com/DenuvoScum/status/1628635273042051072

iirc her telegram thing was some findom scam too, charge tons of money to be around EMPRESS?

she's like terry davis level SCHIZO and VITRIOLIC (ok i'll stop) but she actually legitimately is breaking DRM that's resisted everyone else. And iirc she does the findom thing instead and only does Denuvo cracking to prove how much better she actually is. She charges $500 and will only do one game till it's finished, which takes her a couple months. She's previously gotten mad at people for criticizing the fact she wants money, which lol, she’s right, that's such a bizarrely nominal sum for the work. Mad as a hatter, through and through.

and the other guy only cracks Football Manager games (MKDEV) and supposedly it's an older version of denuvo since football games are infinite refreshes on a single engine.

Empress is legit loving nuts, she's on Timecube level brain, but you have to be loving nuts to crack poo poo like Denuvo.

HalloKitty
Sep 30, 2005

Adjust the bass and let the Alpine blast

Taima posted:

Yuzu TOTK has just been so good on Nvidia hardware for me, AND Yuzu supports Windows 11 Auto HDR somehow which is completely bewildering to me but it owns so much.

I had to sell my Switch because it's such hot trash at this point so Yuzu coming up so fast has been a god send. Some games even have a photo mode which jacks the graphics like crazy, and there are mods that make the game run 100% of the time in photo mode and it looks so good.

I'm pretty new to it, and only got into switch emu because of Totk but there have been lots of surprises along the way. For example Luigis Mansion 3 looks eye wateringly good at 4K.

Then on top of that you can patch out dynamic resolution and other things like depth of field that only really exist in the Switch to obscure how much it sucks.

The only lame part is it's kind of sad playing Yuzu because it's so clear that if the Switch had power equivalent to a PS5 it would be insane. Like, by far the best console. It would eat everyone's lunch. But Nintendo is obsessed with making lots of money on console sales and it's the most "can't see the forest for the trees" choice ever, but they ARE very rich so maybe it's me who is dumb.

I feel the same way about totk as I did about gta v when it hit 360/ps3. I waited until it came out on pc, because the hardware was too old to do the game justice. I have a switch, but it'd rather emulate totk; or at least wait until everything's ironed out, then emulate it

HalloKitty fucked around with this message at 12:06 on Jun 19, 2023

Truga
May 4, 2014
Lipstick Apathy

orange juche posted:

Empress is legit loving nuts, she's on Timecube level brain, but you have to be loving nuts to crack poo poo like Denuvo.

if cracking denuvo was just another 9to5 job there'd be plenty of crackers

you do have to be clinically insane to be able to deal with the internet part of being a cracker though

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
Do Intel GPUs have:

1. a super-resolution feature like Nvidia's Dynamic Super Resolution?

2. a generic upscaler like NIS or FSR/RSR?

Truga posted:

if cracking denuvo was just another 9to5 job there'd be plenty of crackers

isn't that how Denuvo managed to curb the number of crackers? Every time someone did it, they found the person and gave them a 9-to-5.

Eventually you're going to get someone who won't take the money, but the person who's like that is... well... that

ijyt
Apr 10, 2012

orange juche posted:

Empress is legit loving nuts, she's on Timecube level brain, but you have to be loving nuts to crack poo poo like Denuvo.

Having read all that, it feels more like an absurd smokescreen to cover a denuvo insider who's good at what they do and need the paycheque.

shrike82
Jun 11, 2005

Yeah wouldn't surprise me if it's just a front for a more professional outfit

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

repiv
Aug 13, 2009

gradenko_2000 posted:

isn't that how Denuvo managed to curb the number of crackers? Every time someone did it, they found the person and gave them a 9-to-5.

for that to work they had to reduce the pool of people willing to work on cracks to almost nothing though, that was their main success

the old bragging-rights reward for pulling off a big release could only sustain so many months of tedium for each game, so the old school scene basically gave up and now just focuses on churning out games with basic DRM and ignores denuvo games completely

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply