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The other problem, of course, is that being a fascist with no life is something with which a segment of gamers can readily identify.Dawgstar posted:Dredd's had his moments, too, of course. You get the compelling one-shot story "Letter from a Democrat" which was the first time Dredd as a franchise really tackled democracy right after after a story about ghost pirates.
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Jun 21, 2023 17:41
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admanb posted:I don't think anyone's saying that Space Marines should be horrific because they're fascists; they should be horrific because the canonical process of creating a Space Marine is horrific. I feel like the space Marines being horrific post-human abominations beneath the gleaming polished armor but perfect chiseled jaw heroes from the neck up is the sort of thing space fash would actually do for the propaganda look.
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Jun 21, 2023 17:56
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admanb posted:I don't think anyone's saying that Space Marines should be horrific because they're fascists I am. The process is a part of the fiction, it can be as trivial or traumatic as the authors want, but if their purpose is to show that fascism will compress and distort the bodies and minds of ordinary citizens to be obedient executors of its (the fascist state) will, then the end-result should be grotesque. Elsewise you run the risk of people making statues of real life fascists with all the trappings of your fantasy world, in an attempt to glorify them. The problem is, as Tim said in his piece, that GW was also trying to sell minis so that meant later authors smoothing over the satire and not making the horror of what (say) a dreadnaught is, quite so overt. I want to refine this post but lunch is over, hopefully this is good enough.
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Jun 21, 2023 18:02
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Halloween Jack posted:Judge Dredd is depicted as a lantern-jawed he-man, and the satire is conveyed by the fact that he's a fascist with no life. But like somebody said, Judge Dredd isn't written by dozens of people and has better editorial control. The company behind Judge Dredd isn't primarily trying to sell you Judge Dredd miniatures, so at least they don't really have this editorial need to make sure everything they make is a cool mini someone will want to buy, paint, and play with. Ideally, the objects of satire, especially on the terms set out in 40k's attempt at satire, should probably not look like cool badasses that people really want to paint and show off, but then, GW does need to sell miniatures, so perhaps we shouldn't expect our fiction writers and miniature sellers to be the same people, and when they are, expect compromise somewhere.
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Jun 21, 2023 18:15
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They don't look like cool badasses, though, they look utterly ridiculous. 40k fans just have terrible taste.
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Jun 21, 2023 18:31
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Dawgstar posted:Dredd's had his moments, too, of course. You get the compelling one-shot story "Letter from a Democrat" which was the first time Dredd as a franchise really tackled democracy right after after a story about ghost pirates. Dredd also has !Nigel Farage get arrested for being a public nuisance. Now I'm not saying Warhammer 40k should feature some fiction where a chaos cult worshipping a trump figure as a god-emperor get nuked from orbit but it would send a message
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Jun 21, 2023 19:18
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 the gw judge dredd minis were great
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Jun 21, 2023 19:26
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jarofpiss posted:
GWs whole 40k gig started because of dumb poo poo licensing stuff on the backend of making judge Dredd minis. (a series that does fascist parody/critique much better imo)
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Jun 21, 2023 23:13
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jarofpiss posted:
You can get a whole squad of Judge Dredds to shoot your gangs up in Necromunda 1E too. Not sure if they have them in the more recent editions though.
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Jun 22, 2023 03:23
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The current edition of Necromunda has Enforcers, which are like the Dollar Store knockoff version of Arbites since if actual Arbites saw some of the poo poo going on things would get pretty spicy. Don't fear, though. There are new Arbites available for Kill Team and Imperial Agents now.
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Jun 22, 2023 04:40
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Midjack posted:You can get a whole squad of Judge Dredds to shoot your gangs up in Necromunda 1E too. Not sure if they have them in the more recent editions though. Robert Facepalmer posted:Don't fear, though. There are new Arbites available for Kill Team and Imperial Agents now.   
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Jun 22, 2023 09:20
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that is the coppest dog to ever copdog
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Jun 22, 2023 09:51
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Lmao they have dogs now?
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Jun 22, 2023 12:12
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Midjack posted:Lmao they have dogs now? Dogs are all over the place now - rogue traders have them, witch hunters have them (as for mordheim sanctioned tradition), chaos has dogs and not even khornate ones Covermeinsunshine fucked around with this message at 12:22 on Jun 22, 2023 |
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Jun 22, 2023 12:20
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GW has realized people like dogs.
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Jun 22, 2023 13:28
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Midjack posted:Lmao they have dogs now? They have dogs now.
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Jun 22, 2023 13:53
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There being dogs in Kill Team is cute until you realize that you're going to have to order your Orks to bludgeon it to death
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Jun 22, 2023 14:25
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Froghammer posted:There being dogs in Kill Team is cute until you realize that you're going to have to order your Orks to bludgeon it to death It's more Roomba than Rover. Meanwhile, Squigs are still good boys/girls/thingys.
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Jun 22, 2023 14:43
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In Kill Team, your squig will happily explode for you.
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Jun 22, 2023 15:16
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Your character has a badass cyber-dog in Necromunda: Hired Gun
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Jun 22, 2023 16:29
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Nurglings are just fat bipedal kitties.
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Jun 22, 2023 16:30
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Midjack posted:Lmao they have dogs now? The OG Necromunda arbiters had a robo dog too.
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Jun 22, 2023 16:39
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Covermeinsunshine posted:I mean Gaunts Ghosts that do that and they are not new books (first and only is 1999) while also being some best regarded wh40k fiction The Ghosts are also explicitly not remotely like regular Imperial Guard, to the point that any number of officers have tried to have Gaunt killed over how soft he is on his troops, and keep sending them on suicide missions.
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Jun 27, 2023 09:25
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Liquid Communism posted:The Ghosts are also explicitly not remotely like regular Imperial Guard, to the point that any number of officers have tried to have Gaunt killed over how soft he is on his troops, and keep sending them on suicide missions. Bluebloods and Pardans also get their moments later on in books so the point of guard overall being shown as reasonably good at their job stands.
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Jun 27, 2023 09:38
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The first unit Ciaphas Cain was with was shown to be decent as well. And the ones he was posted with later generally got better because he actually tried to lead them, but I don't think he ever got stuck in with a Guard unit that was actively bad.
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Jun 27, 2023 16:04
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seaborgium posted:The first unit Ciaphas Cain was with was shown to be decent as well. And the ones he was posted with later generally got better because he actually tried to lead them, but I don't think he ever got stuck in with a Guard unit that was actively bad. Probably most actively harmeful to themselves people cain got saddled with were sisters of battle (with I have issues with but ech)
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Jun 27, 2023 16:52
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seaborgium posted:The first unit Ciaphas Cain was with was shown to be decent as well. And the ones he was posted with later generally got better because he actually tried to lead them, but I don't think he ever got stuck in with a Guard unit that was actively bad. Well, the Valhallans were on the verge of killing each other before he sat down with the COs of both former companies and threatened to start executing people from the top down unless they figure out a compromise, and the Ciaphas Cain novels have shown other regiments that, while not incompetent, actively hindered efforts to figure out what the gently caress was going on.
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Jun 27, 2023 18:12
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Randalor posted:Well, the Valhallans were on the verge of killing each other before he sat down with the COs of both former companies and threatened to start executing people from the top down unless they figure out a compromise, and the Ciaphas Cain novels have shown other regiments that, while not incompetent, actively hindered efforts to figure out what the gently caress was going on. iirc they were literally killing each other
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Jun 28, 2023 04:46
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The Valhallans had a riot which killed multiple soldiers and naval enforcers, and they had to have a whole-rear end trial for that, which Cain fixed beforehand.
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Jun 28, 2023 08:56
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So - how do you go about getting work as a proofer/editor in the elfgame space?
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Jun 28, 2023 15:30
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First write a whole rpg then reluctantly do that stuff yourself afterwards.
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Jun 28, 2023 15:41
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Digital release, brag about how there are no typos. Then lurk reddit and let the contrarian savants do all your work for you.
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Jun 28, 2023 15:49
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Loomer posted:So - how do you go about getting work as a proofer/editor in the elfgame space? elfgames have proofers and editors? 
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Jun 28, 2023 15:50
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Loomer posted:So - how do you go about getting work as a proofer/editor in the elfgame space? Saw this immediately after seeing your post, so this is DESTINY: https://www.reddit.com/r/rpg/comments/14laehd/small_balcan_publisher_is_looking_for_an_editor/ (They probably pay in goulash.)
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Jun 28, 2023 15:59
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:elfgames have proofers and editors? The credits in the books claim they do. I have my suspicions
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Jun 28, 2023 16:09
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The Everlasting, as I recall, had a Limner.
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Jun 28, 2023 16:11
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theironjef posted:First write a whole rpg then reluctantly do that stuff yourself afterwards. Don't tempt me. I have a 300 page d100-based doorstopper halfway developed. Megazver posted:Saw this immediately after seeing your post, so this is DESTINY: Paprika owns, but by god I'd better not have to supply my own sour cream... (Also: You are a legend, thank you.)
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Jun 28, 2023 16:24
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Loomer posted:So - how do you go about getting work as a proofer/editor in the elfgame space?
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Jun 28, 2023 16:24
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Randalor posted:Well, the Valhallans were on the verge of killing each other before he sat down with the COs of both former companies and threatened to start executing people from the top down unless they figure out a compromise, and the Ciaphas Cain novels have shown other regiments that, while not incompetent, actively hindered efforts to figure out what the gently caress was going on. That's true for the Valhallans, but they did get better once he got involved. They were people who were actively hostile to each other, but they were still competent on the battlefield. Put them on different planets or ships and they would have just been decent regiments. I'm definitely not saying the Imperial Guard is full of great regiments, but they have a lot of lovely, lovely leaders. That kind of thing trickles down, and Cain had the authority to actually force them to listen and fix it and he wanted to make it better. My point was more that Cain ran into some lovely regiments, but he still worked with mostly decent ones. They're not all crap and it seemed like a lot was caused by lovely leadership more than the troops being incompetent.
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Jun 28, 2023 18:07
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The Guard is a huge organisation that's often poorly ran, and that's when it's actually made up of professional soldiers and not conscripts and sometimes poo poo like rounding up entire gangs and throwing them at the enemy. Basically look at the history of armies especially around WWI and previously, where the actual professional army has been more the exception than the rule until relatively recently. Commissars can even make a bit more sense looking at the brute-force application of discipline when the leaders can't be bothered actually engaging with issues. Though also literally the whole point of the Imperial Guard is that it contains literally every military trope you can possibly imagine somewhere or another.
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Jun 29, 2023 05:49
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