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Zulily Zoetrope posted:which part? [...] The part where Serini's an experienced negotiator and mediator with loads of experience of getting through to monsters who are otherwise KOS by the PC races. She's not gonna be the one to get through to Redcloak, but she seems like the best possible candidate to learn from.
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Jun 26, 2023 18:13
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Serini can't possibly be anything other than Chaotic Good or Neutral Good.
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Jun 27, 2023 03:00
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Also good to know they can throw in Redcloak's face he's been treating other sapient monsters exactly as shittily as the PC races have been treating goblins. Not that I'm sure Redcloak's capable of feeling such shame at this point, but hey.
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Jun 27, 2023 03:21
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He's still capable of feeling anger
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Jun 27, 2023 05:13
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Baby Sunny is very 
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Jun 27, 2023 09:40
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mmkay posted:Baby Sunny is very Life sized plushie when can we have it
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Jun 27, 2023 13:00
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jeebus bob posted:Life sized plushie when can we have it A lawyer at WotC just started salivating and doesn't know why.
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Jun 27, 2023 13:25
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habeasdorkus posted:Serini can't possibly be anything other than Chaotic Good or Neutral Good.
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Jun 27, 2023 13:58
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girl dick energy posted:I think she started out as True Neutral or Chaotic Neutral, but her recent experiences turned her into a very unusual sort of Chaotic Good. Given that the first we know of her was her involvement in a selfless, epic quest to save the world, it's hard to see how she's ever been not-Good.
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Jun 27, 2023 15:17
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Tree Reformat posted:Also good to know they can throw in Redcloak's face he's been treating other sapient monsters exactly as shittily as the PC races have been treating goblins. He did have a bit of that during an assault on one of the cities. He was just throwing lives away on frontal assaults and realized how lovely he was being, though that wasn't monsters but was just different kinds of goblins.
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Jun 27, 2023 16:08
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Vizuyos posted:Given that the first we know of her was her involvement in a selfless, epic quest to save the world, it's hard to see how she's ever been not-Good. Belkar was also involved in a selfless, epic quest to save the world.
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Jun 27, 2023 16:47
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Serini's the one who was all about friendship on the crayon pages, and didn't read as anything but good.
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Jun 27, 2023 16:51
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THE BAR posted:Serini's the one who was all about friendship on the crayon pages, and didn't read as anything but good. I actually agree with you but isn't part of the point of the crayon pages is that they are not inherently accurate/true?
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Jun 27, 2023 16:52
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I've never considered that regarding the order's relationship, only the story and myth. Don't think that's how you're supposed to read it, but possibly?
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Jun 27, 2023 16:57
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Bongo Bill posted:Belkar was also involved in a selfless, epic quest to save the world. Belkar is involved in an epic quest to troll anyone who annoyed him and murder anyone who pissed him off. Until recently, the world-saving wasn't really his concern. He barely even knew about the world-saving bit until this chapter. While everyone else was getting the "saving the world" thing explained to them, he was occupied with trying to annoy Miko to death or de-paladinization. After that, he apparently didn't give enough of a poo poo to ask about why they were chasing the Gates until the trip to the North Pole (by which point his reformation was fairly well along).
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Jun 27, 2023 16:59
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ImpAtom posted:I actually agree with you but isn't part of the point of the crayon pages is that they are not inherently accurate/true? That's never explicitly stated, but it's been my headcanon for a while now. My take is that any crayon page is either an outright fabrication, or a story that's been dulled so heavily by the march of time that it only barely resembles the reality.
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Jun 27, 2023 17:03
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I think it's more of a case of "Unreliable Narrativium". They're not necessarily *false* but we should have a pinch of salt on hand.
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Jun 27, 2023 17:07
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THE BAR posted:Serini's the one who was all about friendship on the crayon pages, and didn't read as anything but good. But that's before Kraagor's death and everyone becoming hyper suspecting of the other members. She always has been chaotic good, which is why she wouldn't just kill her prisoners but make amnesia potion for them. Nenonen fucked around with this message at 17:14 on Jun 27, 2023 |
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Jun 27, 2023 17:12
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Raenir Salazar posted:I think it's more of a case of "Unreliable Narrativium". They're not necessarily *false* but we should have a pinch of salt on hand. I've generally taken them to be completely honest in that they aren't lying, but only partially true because each one is someone's interpretation and is going to be influenced by how they fill in all the things they don't know
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Jun 27, 2023 17:16
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I think Rich might be making up the entire story
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Jun 27, 2023 17:19
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Nenonen posted:I think Rich might be making up the entire story Death
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Jun 27, 2023 17:22
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Note this old post from The Giant, back when he participated in his own forum.quote:
The crayon pages are something being told by a character in-story rather than the usual Omniscient Narrator. If the panels are not crayon, then everything shown happens exactly in the way it appears (though they don't show everything depending on where the camera is pointed). In crayon, there's somebody telling the story who can interject their own biases, interpretations, etc.
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Jun 27, 2023 17:26
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Gnoman posted:In crayon, there's somebody telling the story who can interject their own biases, interpretations, etc. The crayon author is Sunny. Also the gold dragon with purple wings from that page appears to be Urdook in the most recent update.
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Jun 27, 2023 17:34
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SKULL.GIF posted:The crayon author is Sunny. Not Urdook, just a dragon of the same type. Kraagor is in that drawing.
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Jun 27, 2023 17:37
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Nenonen posted:which is why she wouldn't just kill her prisoners but make amnesia potion for them. That always struck me as less a moral position and more a practical concern. If you kill the people who come to scout out the gate, the people who sent them will eventually notice that they never returned, then potentially send a larger force to avenge them or whatever. By using an amnesia potion, Serini can encourage the scouts to return to whoever sent them packing a "all's clear, Boss, nothin' there" report, thus reducing or eliminating pressure from that lord or polity on her reality linchpin.
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Jun 27, 2023 17:48
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Nenonen posted:I think Rich might be making up the entire story it was actually revealed to him in a dream
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Jun 27, 2023 17:53
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Oh it's actually a historical piece, eventually they fail and the stickverse is destroyed and the gods decide to roll another low-magic all-human setting.
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Jun 27, 2023 18:06
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Vizuyos posted:Belkar is involved in an epic quest to troll anyone who annoyed him and murder anyone who pissed him off. Until recently, the world-saving wasn't really his concern. Mind, he achieved both those things, which in my book makes him by the most successful member of the Order.
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Jun 27, 2023 18:46
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Belkar's character arc will be complete when he is reminded of Miko's ultimate fate and feels sort of bad about it. Then he'll die.
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Jun 27, 2023 19:39
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:Oh it's actually a historical piece, eventually they fail and the stickverse is destroyed and the gods decide to roll another low-magic all-human setting. In fact, the comic is just a translation of the Red Book of West Despotonia. Interesting, the comics are all from the original work, but the delay is due to translating the humor from the original Despotic dialects to English.
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Jun 27, 2023 19:49
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Cup Runneth Over posted:Belkar's character arc will be complete when he is reminded of Miko's ultimate fate and feels sort of bad about it. Miko is responsible for everything that happened to her. Belkar just kinda nudged her along.
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Jun 27, 2023 20:47
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Shugojin posted:I've generally taken them to be completely honest in that they aren't lying, but only partially true because each one is someone's interpretation and is going to be influenced by how they fill in all the things they don't know It's true, from a certain point of view
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Jun 27, 2023 21:05
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Gynovore posted:Miko is responsible for everything that happened to her. Belkar just kinda nudged her along. He would absolutely have taken credit for it
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Jun 27, 2023 22:05
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Cup Runneth Over posted:He would absolutely have taken credit for it He didn’t take credit for it, though. He even stabbed an oracle over the fact that he didn’t cause it!
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Jun 27, 2023 23:53
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Older, more enlightened belkar will appreciate that the self righteous jerk paladin was the source of her own failure
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Jun 28, 2023 00:28
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Serini is Good because she traded the trolls for their blood instead of just killing them, treating them like equals. https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1227.html
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Jun 28, 2023 00:40
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The X-man cometh posted:Serini is Good because she traded the trolls for their blood instead of just killing them, treating them like equals. and the paladins who slaughtered Redcloak's friends and family are also Good because they did that thing
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Jun 28, 2023 00:52
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Shugojin posted:Older, more enlightened belkar will appreciate that the self righteous jerk paladin was the source of her own failure She did have a crisis of faith because the Order and her superiors protected him from her "justice." But yeah, Miko's own flaws did the lion share of the work.
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Jun 28, 2023 01:07
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Saraiguma posted:and the paladins who slaughtered Redcloak's friends and family are also Good because they did that thing I think Rich said that some of the Paladins who attacked Redcloak's village fell (albeit in a less visible way than Miko did).
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Jun 28, 2023 16:39
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The concept of transcendental good and evil remains unsettling and difficult to grapple with. Especially coupled with Gods who clearly have human flaws being the arbiters of it. Was Miko's act evil because the 12 gods say so, or did they say so because it was evil? That's a legitimate in-universe question to ask. On the flip side, the presence of detect good and detect evil give the potential for methodological empirical ethics. "When the lab assistant fed rat A twice as much as they then fed rat B, their evil level rose 1.6 nanohitlers compared to the control assistant who fed both rats the lesser amount"
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