Formula One 2023: McLaren fans are dark energy

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > Formula One 2023: McLaren fans are dark energy

Judge Schnoopy: Nov 2, 2005; dont even TRY it, pal

How about them new extremely long drs-train inducing Vegas straights?

I'd rather watch drivers struggle with no straights on Sonoma than watch a Vegas traffic simulation

# ? Jun 28, 2023 16:25

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# ? May 29, 2024 03:27

Thanks Ants: May 21, 2004; #essereFerrari

If F1 is about cost cutting then losing DRS would help. How about a sprint race where they disable DRS to see what it's like?

# ? Jun 28, 2023 16:26

Rinkles: Oct 24, 2010; What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?

Thanks Ants posted:

If F1 is about cost cutting then losing DRS would help.

How so?

# ? Jun 28, 2023 16:27

SocksAndSandals: Jun 6, 2011

BetaTauri

# ? Jun 28, 2023 16:34

Thanks Ants: May 21, 2004; #essereFerrari

It's a moving part to develop and manufacture. It's not a massive shift like losing MGU-H or whatever but I think it's had its day now, never really did much to improve racing, and aero rule changes to make following easier is the way to go.

# ? Jun 28, 2023 16:44

F1DriverQuidenBerg: Jan 19, 2014

DRS is bad

# ? Jun 28, 2023 16:47

Mechafunkzilla: Sep 11, 2006; If you want a vision of the future...

Keep DRS but only the cars in 4th-20th can use it, with no proximity restrictions

# ? Jun 28, 2023 16:56

Theophany: Jul 22, 2014; SUCCHIAMI IL MIO CAZZO DA DIETRO, RANA RAGAZZO

2022 FIA Formula 1 WDC

tony quidtana posted:

This is like asking someone to define what makes a good painting, you can't apply a quantitative process to something that isn't quantitative.

A good track should have some level of character imo, the location is important but it typically helps if the track itself has some overall characteristic that maybe favours one area of development over another.

Philip Island is probably my favourite race track, it's like right on a cliff beside the ocean, just a bunch of relentless flowing corners with a tiny rear end straight. Contrast that with Baku where it's a bunch of long rear end straights stapled together with angular corners on a street circuit in a gorgeous old city centre with zero room for error. Both are good tracks and they share nothing in common. Don't try and find some unifying connective tissue for what makes a good track because there isn't one.

To add to this - a good track is fun to drive but it doesn't necessarily make the racing fun to watch. The formula is currently boring, the cars are too big and the overtakes are largely artificial to cater to the attention deficit masses watching the sport. The paradoxes of F1 are that it can't be sustained as a profit-making enterprise by Liberty if they cater to us grogs who get rock hard watching a driver line up and attempt a pass over several laps without some dipshit 'go faster button' gimmick and that despite the cost cap, manufacturer's can't justify the relative high cost of F1 if there is limited relevance to their road car businesses and sponsors won't spend money if there aren't any eyeballs looking at their logos.

The example of Baku is perfect because it's an incredibly dull track to drive compared to say old Hockenheim or the Nordschleife, but F1 around either of the latter would be a boring procession either because of a DRS train or because the track simply isn't wide enough to allow these enormous cars to race wheel to wheel.

Now that we're back in a spell of single driver/single team dominance I've been spending my weekends watching other series around the F1 schedule where there is greater parity between the competitors and I find myself actually concentrating on watching the races rather than having it on in the background and listening out for those moments where the commentators get animated.

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:00

Thanks Ants: May 21, 2004; #essereFerrari

Charles Leclerc posted:

listening out for those moments where the commentators get animated.

How many times have you let David Croft mislead you that there is action happening?

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:04

ilmucche: Mar 16, 2016; What did you say the strategy was?

Philip island is a beautiful track and catching the occasional race from there on tv was always a nice surprise.

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:11

F1DriverQuidenBerg: Jan 19, 2014

Mechafunkzilla posted:

Keep DRS but only the cars in 4th-20th can use it, with no proximity restrictions

Just kill it all together. We've had a decade plus where the need to overtake hasn't been any sort of a major consideration in car design because there is a button for that and the direction of the series is worse for it.

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:12

Just-In-Timeberlake: Aug 18, 2003

Keep DRS but you only get X minutes of use, where X minutes is inversely proportional to your starting position. You can use it at any point in the DRS zone, regardless of whether you are in front or behind anybody.

Wouldn't matter for this season since Max is out of DRS range by lap 2, but gotta start somewhere.

Just-In-Timeberlake fucked around with this message at 17:22 on Jun 28, 2023

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:18

FAUXTON: Jun 2, 2005; spero che tu stia bene

tony quidtana posted:

Just kill it all together. We've had a decade plus where the need to overtake hasn't been any sort of a major consideration in car design because there is a button for that and the direction of the series is worse for it.

there's more money to be made by turning it into a contest of engineering first and driving second, that goes hand in hand with the straights-and-hairpins approach to track design.

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:24

the milk machine: Jul 23, 2002; lick my keys

make it the Drag Addition System and pressing the button makes speed brakes deploy on cars that are near you

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:25

Sunk Dunk: Apr 14, 2021

what about instead of drivers, the same people that engineer the car have to drive it

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:27

F1DriverQuidenBerg: Jan 19, 2014

FAUXTON posted:

there's more money to be made by turning it into a contest of engineering first and driving second, that goes hand in hand with the straights-and-hairpins approach to track design.

Nothing I say is ever going to happen because 1. Things are done the way they are now to maximize profit and also more importantly 2. Im wildly out of step with what the average person wants.

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:31

Thanks Ants: May 21, 2004; #essereFerrari

Everybody wants a Ferrari win, OP

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:34

Theophany: Jul 22, 2014; SUCCHIAMI IL MIO CAZZO DA DIETRO, RANA RAGAZZO

2022 FIA Formula 1 WDC

Thanks Ants posted:

How many times have you let David Croft mislead you that there is action happening?

That is actually the reason I switched to F1TV lol, I genuinely could not stand his shouty horseshit any more.

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:35

FAUXTON: Jun 2, 2005; spero che tu stia bene

the milk machine posted:

make it the Drag Addition System and pressing the button makes speed brakes deploy on cars that are near you

like they'd allow them to add drag to the Miami GP

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:36

Diet Crack: Jan 15, 2001

LL Cool J and all that guff at the start was enough of a drag

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:53

MustardFacial: Jun 20, 2011; George Russel's
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Khablam posted:

The problem with tilke-dromes is they're an object lesson in why removing context is such a bad idea. He strings together corners and layout ideas from other circuits, without respect to why they work on the original circuit.
Add in intentional design elements with specific cynical design elements designed for specific end results (this specific straight length and corner combination should result in WHEEL TO WHEEL action in two corners), and the racing on them feels soulless.

It's important to remember that not every Tilkedrome is inherently a bad circuit (with the exception of Abu Dhabi). Sepang, Bahrain, Turkey are all great tracks, COTA as well is pretty good. But the main issue with most of the hate Tilke gets is that all of his tracks crib from each other. The T14 T15 start/finish that works great in Sepang is also in Bahrain, China, Korea, and COTA. They all have some kind of huge braking zone, couple fast left-right sections, and then the rest of the complex is just big flashy buildings.

By itself, those elements can make for a good circuit, and again if you looks at Sepang, Bahrain, Turkey, and COTA they do make good circuits. But I think the big reason why Tilkedromes get so much hate is because:

1. Abu Dhabi loving sucks so much
2. He's made too many tracks in a row.

There was that time in the early-mid 2000's where every single new F1 track was a complex designed by Tilke. When you show off that much architecture back to back from a single firm, the similarities in the designs shine brighter than the differences.

# ? Jun 28, 2023 17:59

Thanks Ants: May 21, 2004; #essereFerrari

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUw76qzRzcs

:gizz:

# ? Jun 28, 2023 18:05

uninterrupted: Jun 20, 2011

Sunk Dunk posted:

what about instead of drivers, the same people that engineer the car have to drive it

Adrian newey binned a few cars working to get himself into Le Mans, which he finished once, before he realized it was dumb as poo poo for him to be behind the wheel.

# ? Jun 28, 2023 18:15

SocksAndSandals: Jun 6, 2011

Remove all aero from the cars. run them naked. Engine, wheels, and a cockpit.

it's called MOTOR racing, hello?!

# ? Jun 28, 2023 18:20

Judge Schnoopy: Nov 2, 2005; dont even TRY it, pal

I already do not understand why formula E has human drivers. Make the engineers program AI to whip them around the track and fully deliver the sport to nerds.

Once it's developed well enough, port some real-time driving assists to F1

# ? Jun 28, 2023 18:25

Theophany: Jul 22, 2014; SUCCHIAMI IL MIO CAZZO DA DIETRO, RANA RAGAZZO

2022 FIA Formula 1 WDC

SocksAndSandals posted:

Remove all aero from the cars. run them naked. Engine, wheels, and a cockpit.

it's called MOTOR racing, hello?!

jochenrindt.txt

# ? Jun 28, 2023 18:26

the milk machine: Jul 23, 2002; lick my keys

Judge Schnoopy posted:

I already do not understand why formula E has human drivers. Make the engineers program AI to whip them around the track and fully deliver the sport to nerds.

Once it's developed well enough, port some real-time driving assists to F1

pretend I posted that video of the self driving race car that turns hard left and suicides into the wall as soon as it�s activated

# ? Jun 28, 2023 18:28

ArmedZombie: Jun 6, 2004

SocksAndSandals posted:

Remove all aero from the cars. run them naked. Engine, wheels, and a cockpit.

it's called MOTOR racing, hello?!

Enzo levels of passione

# ? Jun 28, 2023 18:36

ArmedZombie: Jun 6, 2004

Judge Schnoopy posted:

I already do not understand why formula E has human drivers. Make the engineers program AI to whip them around the track and fully deliver the sport to nerds.

Once it's developed well enough, port some real-time driving assists to F1

Formula DrOne

# ? Jun 28, 2023 18:38