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Dawgstar posted:I've always wondered where that art comes from. I assume it's fanart. Reading her wiki entry she doesn't appear to have ever been drawn much because all the pictures are of other people. Around 10 years ago there was some online card thing that was official, but all the art was done by (I think) the same person who was basically a fan artist and everyone she drew had the same cartoony style. But she did a lot of obscure late-EU post-ROTJ characters so her work is the only official depiction of a lot of them. I think the Essential Guide to Warfare had a pic of Abeloth looking like Callista with tentacles.
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Jun 28, 2023 16:01
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I was absolutely hate-reading FOTJ by the end. I think I did some terrified giggling when Denning once again demonstrated his unwillingness to wrap anything up permanently. Towards the very end of the book there’s a report about one of Abeloth’s tentacles appearing out of midair and trying to strange some Jedi after she supposedly died. If Disney hadn’t done the buyout there’s a good chance Denning would still be writing about Abeloth, Ship, and Vestara.
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Jun 28, 2023 16:58
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The only thing Denning was willing to wrap up was trying tonprove once and for all his Jedi were better than Traviss Mandalorians which is why he had jedi using the force to mortal kombat fatality Mandos.
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Jun 28, 2023 17:06
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I do kind of wonder what the EU would be doing now if the Disney buyout hadn't happened. I'm sure Denning would have continued to dominate the post-NJO era. Probably at some point Anakin Solo would have been resurrected or he would have gotten his way and used the Clone Wars Mortis planet to reset the timeline and wipe Legacy out of continuity. I'm guessing Filoni would have still been a big player and would have kept Ahsoka from getting involved with the rest of the EU. I do think that even without the Disney buyout there would have ultimately been some kind of continuity reset or parallel universe or something like that eventually. Even before the Disney purchase Del Rey and Dark Horse were basically trying to do soft-reboot type works with their Empire and Rebellion books and Brian Wood comic series, which were still part of the existing canon but were both marketed as not having any direct links to any other work outside of the OT movies and therefore being safe for new readers to start with. I remember being really disappointed with the Wood comic because from the initial description I thought it was going to basically be like a new take on the 70s Marvel comics where it started with the end of A New Hope and then just went off and did completely new things in an alternate timeline to the main EU. Still think that would have been a better idea.
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Jun 28, 2023 17:11
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I’m not sure who else would have taken over so Lucasfilm would probably have continued letting him steer unless they started really bad. There’s always recruiting a Sci-Fi author who hadn’t worked with them before too.
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Jun 28, 2023 20:27
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Chairman Capone posted:I do think that even without the Disney buyout there would have ultimately been some kind of continuity reset or parallel universe or something like that eventually. Even before the Disney purchase Del Rey and Dark Horse were basically trying to do soft-reboot type works with their Empire and Rebellion books and Brian Wood comic series, which were still part of the existing canon but were both marketed as not having any direct links to any other work outside of the OT movies and therefore being safe for new readers to start with. George was planning a 2010s sequel trilogy even before the Disney purchase, so yes, a continuity reset at the very least was basically assured.
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Jun 28, 2023 23:28
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Chairman Capone posted:Yeah, Tyers also wrote Balance Point (also a low point for NJO) where Mara learns that she’s pregnant, and Tyers had an interview where she talked about how it was important to have a scene where Mara reflects that abortion is wrong. You know, it suddenly makes a lot more sense why I keep stumbling over pro-life/trad-wife Mara Jade fans on tumblr.
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Jun 29, 2023 00:37
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There's a sizable minority of Christian and especially Mormon sci-fi fans. I wasn't really online at that point, but as a young teen I would sometimes venture onto the theforce.net forums and I seem to remember a huge percentage of people there with crucifixes and Bible quotes in their signatures, to the degree that it kind of turned me off browsing there. I did look up Tyers to see if she was a Mormon but she's a Presbyterian, which is a pretty boring theology. I'm surprised she even cares that much about abortion.
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Jun 29, 2023 01:50
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Wolverton was a Mormon and taught creative writing at BYU. His students include Brandon Sanderson and Stephanie Meyer. Wikipedia lists more but it’s nobody I’m familiar with. I noticed when he died that he’d edited many volumes of a Sci-fi anthology series published by the Church of Scientology. Which is sketchy but a lot of famous authors seem to hold their nose and sometimes publish with them.
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Jun 29, 2023 02:02
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One of the more unfortunate fathers of sci-fi is Mormon (Scott-Card). Wolverton is odd to me given that he wrote Courtship, which was rather matriarchal in it's overviews.
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Jun 29, 2023 02:18
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Amazonians are also a classic sci-fi trope, though. And while OSC is a piece of poo poo, from memory, his books are not really polemic. I think there was some iffy stuff with one of the Battle School veterans establishing a caliphate, but it's been a long time. At risk of steering us even further off course, I do have a hot take about Mormon sci-fi authors in particular. I think some Mormons, whether consciously or unconsciously, kind of understand that the founding myth, so to speak, of LDS is rather shaky. It's not even 200 years old, there's a whole lot about its early history that was published in newspapers that you can still read. That's not to say that their beliefs are worthy of particular ridicule, it is self-evidently a useful way of approaching the world for many people. I think you largely get out of religion what you put into it; a creed isn't going to make a bad person out of a good person or vice versa. Having said that, I think that if you realize that some of the stories you were taught as a child are bullshit, it fosters the idea that you, yes you, can also just make poo poo up. And it doesn't have to be a parable or moralize in some way, you can just tell stories about sexy Conan women snoo-snooing a space wizard or a bunch of sub-Clancy bullshit about a war between, uh, Armenia and Thailand? It's been a long time. I'll take off the fedora.
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Jun 29, 2023 02:41
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Everyone knows that the best Mormon Science Fiction is the DOOM novelization where DoomGuy goes back to Earth and gets a hot DoomGal wife and they fight off the demons like God intended. Yeah he's catholic but that just means he's got more beef with the demons and Sandy Peterson is Mormon anyways and doomguy teams up with Mormons on earth to fight the demons.
Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 04:13 on Jun 29, 2023 |
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Jun 29, 2023 03:43
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Rochallor posted:There's a sizable minority of Christian and especially Mormon sci-fi fans. I wasn't really online at that point, but as a young teen I would sometimes venture onto the theforce.net forums and I seem to remember a huge percentage of people there with crucifixes and Bible quotes in their signatures, to the degree that it kind of turned me off browsing there.
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Jun 29, 2023 04:19
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Calax posted:One of the more unfortunate fathers of sci-fi is Mormon (Scott-Card). Wolverton is odd to me given that he wrote Courtship, which was rather matriarchal in it's overviews. It’s flawed of course, but still interesting. For someone who is so publicly homophobic it sure does have a lot of homoerotic subtext. I made a few abortive attempts to read Speaker for the Dead, the first not long after my first reading of the first book, and couldn’t get into it. I read Ender’s Shadow a couple of times. That’s all the Card I ever ended up reading. Arquinsiel posted:Is she a Wee Free? If so those are more like Southern Baptists who miss the 50s. Casimir Radon fucked around with this message at 04:42 on Jun 29, 2023 |
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Jun 29, 2023 04:29
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if you just read ender's game and speaker for the dead you would definitely think card was catholic. the mormonism doesn't really hit until book 3
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Jun 29, 2023 04:52
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Arc Hammer posted:Everyone knows that the best Mormon Science Fiction is the DOOM novelization where DoomGuy goes back to Earth and gets a hot DoomGal wife and they fight off the demons like God intended. Yeah he's catholic but that just means he's got more beef with the demons and Sandy Peterson is Mormon anyways and doomguy teams up with Mormons on earth to fight the demons. Those are up there with the Resident Evil novels. Admittedly S.D. Perry was working off some badly translated notes of story elements she had to include, but they're still goofy fun like trying to rational just why the women dress as they do in some of the games. Especially Jill in RE3.
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Jun 29, 2023 10:29
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Casimir Radon posted:I ended up with a copy of Ender’s Game as a kid because my mom was at the bookstore picking up the first three X-Wing books and some guy working there suggested it. I read it the first time at age 8 and missed out on a lot of the non-action commentary. Read it again around middle school age and got a little more. Read it again toward the end of high school, by which point I knew Card was insane, and got more out of it. Card sucks but managed to create something interesting seemingly by accident.  poo poo.
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Jun 29, 2023 14:29
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Arquinsiel posted:A friend of mine who was an academic in the field of media studies for a while and did a lot of sentiment analysis on writings etc is 100% convinced that Card is gay and his conservative shift is him failing to reconcile society's view on his sexuality with his faith's view on it. She's used her own pre-transition writings as a control for someone in denial too which is some Most of the time the "homophobes must be secretly gay" thing is wrong and bad, but there are some cases where the signs are blindingly obvious. Card is one of them.
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Jun 29, 2023 15:26
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Lemniscate Blue posted:Most of the time the "homophobes must be secretly gay" thing is wrong and bad, but there are some cases where the signs are blindingly obvious. Card is one of them. Yeah, his anti-gay rants are of the "We have to make gay marriage illegal, otherwise everyone would want to marry dudes, right? ...right?" kind.
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Jun 29, 2023 15:47
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I went to college in Greensboro where Card lives and a guy I knew managed to interview him for some political science project, all I remember was him saying that Card was a weird guy in person. Connecting it back to Star Wars tangentially, kind of weird to think that Card worked on some of the early 90s LucasArts classics.
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Jun 29, 2023 15:54
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Chairman Capone posted:I went to college in Greensboro where Card lives and a guy I knew managed to interview him for some political science project, all I remember was him saying that Card was a weird guy in person. Yeah, it wrinkles my brain he wrote the sword fighting dialogue for Monkey Island.
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Jun 29, 2023 16:07
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Card did some Insult Swordfighting dialogue for SOMI, has a “Thanks To” credit for Loom, and a dialogue credit for The Dig. The last one had a troubled development, being originally pitched in ‘89 with involvement from Spielberg, but only actually coming out in ‘95. So when Card actually worked on it is possibly up for debate. He also has a dialogue credit on NeoHunter, which Lucasarts was going to publish but then went to Virgin Interactive for some reason. Then he doesn’t do anything video game related until 2005’s infamous Advent Rising. Where he developed the script and dialogue.
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Jun 29, 2023 16:43
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The writer profiles in the old WEG Adventure Journals had a lot of similarly weird stuff in them. Lots of people really needed us to know their specific religious beliefs, or how they thought families should be organised. Similarly there were other authors who just loved getting to put their nonsensical OC Do Not Steal into the universe.
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Jun 29, 2023 17:10
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Casimir Radon posted:Card did some Insult Swordfighting dialogue for SOMI, has a “Thanks To” credit for Loom, and a dialogue credit for The Dig. The last one had a troubled development, being originally pitched in ‘89 with involvement from Spielberg, but only actually coming out in ‘95. So when Card actually worked on it is possibly up for debate. He also has a dialogue credit on NeoHunter, which Lucasarts was going to publish but then went to Virgin Interactive for some reason. I remember reading his tie-in novel to Shadow Complex and having to stop after like 50 pages as it was too stupid even by the standards of Bush-era Tom Clancy knockoffs.
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Jun 29, 2023 17:32
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Chairman Capone posted:I remember reading his tie-in novel to Shadow Complex and having to stop after like 50 pages as it was too stupid even by the standards of Bush-era Tom Clancy knockoffs.
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Jun 29, 2023 19:35
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Arquinsiel posted:The writer profiles in the old WEG Adventure Journals had a lot of similarly weird stuff in them. Lots of people really needed us to know their specific religious beliefs, or how they thought families should be organised. Similarly there were other authors who just loved getting to put their nonsensical OC Do Not Steal into the universe. Adventure Journals was a wonderful concept that we shall not see the like of again but yeah, it was also a real grab bag with some people who thought they were going to make their MARK ON STAR WARS in between write ups of different tramp freighters and a scenario for the original miniatures game.
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Jun 29, 2023 19:37
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Dawgstar posted:Adventure Journals was a wonderful concept that we shall not see the like of again but yeah, it was also a real grab bag with some people who thought they were going to make their MARK ON STAR WARS in between write ups of different tramp freighters and a scenario for the original miniatures game. Some of those people did. I ran across one from 1996 recently that featured a story written by one Pablo Hidalgo, starring a Squib named Mace Windu. EDIT: Wait, I posted this like two weeks ago, I thought that was in a different thread. Oh well.
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Jun 29, 2023 20:16
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Mace Windu was a name in an early version of the Star Wars script that Lucas later reused for the prequels, same with Utapau (which itself was almost used for Naboo). Hence also Mace Towani in the Ewoks TV movies.
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Jun 29, 2023 20:26
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Chairman Capone posted:Mace Windu was a name in an early version of the Star Wars script that Lucas later reused for the prequels, same with Utapau (which itself was almost used for Naboo). Hence also Mace Towani in the Ewoks TV movies. Yeah I know it had been floating around and was up for grabs before it got used for the canon guy. I just thought it was funny.
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Jun 29, 2023 20:40
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Dawgstar posted:Adventure Journals was a wonderful concept that we shall not see the like of again but yeah, it was also a real grab bag with some people who thought they were going to make their MARK ON STAR WARS in between write ups of different tramp freighters and a scenario for the original miniatures game.
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Jun 29, 2023 20:42
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Casimir Radon posted:I ended up with a copy of Ender’s Game as a kid because my mom was at the bookstore picking up the first three X-Wing books and some guy working there suggested it. I read it the first time at age 8 and missed out on a lot of the non-action commentary. Read it again around middle school age and got a little more. Read it again toward the end of high school, by which point I knew Card was insane, and got more out of it. Card sucks but managed to create something interesting seemingly by accident. quote:Wikipedia says she’s a member of Presbyterian Church in America (PCA), the second largest Presbyterian church in the US. The first being Presbyterian Church USA (PCUSA). The former being the more conservative of the two. I don’t know for sure if I’ve known anyone who was Presbyterian. They only account for 2% of the population in Minnesota. ...  To rope it back to Star Wars, has there ever been anything to confirm what we learned about Cardaria was true in modern continutity?
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Jun 29, 2023 22:58
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The next wave of Essential Legends books leaked on Amazon some time ago, but I don't think anyone in thread has mentioned it. The books will be: Star Wars: Wraith Squadron Order 66: A Republic Commando Novel Knight Errant I've never heard of that last one.
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Jul 5, 2023 10:14
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OhFunny posted:I've never heard of that last one. iirc it's a companion novel to the Knight Errant comic series that ran shortly before Disney bought everything. It's set in the timeframe leading up to Darth Bane creating the Rule-of-Two, so the galaxy is just mass-chaos of Sith Lords fighting both against the Republic and each other
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Jul 5, 2023 11:11
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The comic was pretty good so I may get that one.
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Jul 5, 2023 12:07
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Arquinsiel posted:The comic was pretty good so I may get that one. Yeah, John Jackson Miller's Star Wars stuff was always really good. Loved his KOTOR comic. Knight Errant doesn't have any interpersonal dynamics as fun as Zayne bouncing off of The Gryph or Jarael but it does show Sith Lords being different flavors of weird petty tyrants. (I genuinely don't think people were allowed to write Jedi with genuine senses of humor in the novels so Kerra doesn't get to show a lot of wit, which is a shame as JJM was good at that.)
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Jul 5, 2023 13:43
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Knight Errant was great, both book and comic. I think it suffered from coming out so late in the EU era. Even before the Disney buyout, I think a lot of people were struggling to keep interest up then, when both Del Rey and Dark Horse seemed like they were floundering. I will say that while I like most of John Jackson Miller's stuff, I thought his KOTOR: War miniseries was really bad. Just a total misfire that kind of spoiled the ending of the main KOTOR comic. On a completely different tangent, I was wondering: in the old post-ROTJ EU, who was the first Jedi Master after Luke? I seem to recall the first person being identified as such being Kyp Durron early in the NJO, but there has to have been someone else beforehand (publishing-wise I mean, not internal continuity).
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Jul 5, 2023 14:42
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Chairman Capone posted:On a completely different tangent, I was wondering: in the old post-ROTJ EU, who was the first Jedi Master after Luke? I seem to recall the first person being identified as such being Kyp Durron early in the NJO, but there has to have been someone else beforehand (publishing-wise I mean, not internal continuity). kyle katarn i think lol if you put kyle's mastery aside as just video game bullshit it's probably kam solusar? but kyp might have been the first master in terms of publishing continuity
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Jul 5, 2023 16:25
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Chairman Capone posted:I will say that while I like most of John Jackson Miller's stuff, I thought his KOTOR: War miniseries was really bad. Just a total misfire that kind of spoiled the ending of the main KOTOR comic.
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Jul 5, 2023 16:47
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Jazerus posted:kyle katarn i think lol I don't have it handy, but some quick checking on Wookiepedia says the New Essential Guide to Characters implies that Kyle Katarn, Kyp Durron, and Kam Solusar all have the rank/title Jedi Master by the start of the Yuuzhan Vong invasion. I think Kenth Hamner might be too by then. I'm not sure when exactly they all got the title, but it feels like there's a few people besides Luke by the time the NJO starts.
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Jul 5, 2023 16:56
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Wasn't Kam already a master in exile when Luke met him or am I getting him mixed up with another guy?
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Jul 5, 2023 17:27
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