(Thread IKs:
weg, Toxic Mental)
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It's always projecting their own failings onto others when it comes to vatnik trash. Why does Europe still need to tiptoe around these shameless barbarians?
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Jul 3, 2023 23:23
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zone posted:It's always projecting their own failings onto others when it comes to vatnik trash. Why does Europe still need to tiptoe around these shameless barbarians? i dunno, indian dude, what do you propose we do?
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Jul 3, 2023 23:31
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If I was the Netherlands I'd be telling the Russian embassy to pack their poo poo up for offending human decency at this point, then level the building and turn it into a loving memorial for victims of Russian terrorism. Absolute scumbags.
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Jul 3, 2023 23:45
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NoiseAnnoys posted:i dunno, indian dude, what do you propose we do? Don't do that
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Jul 3, 2023 23:54
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zone posted:It's always projecting their own failings onto others when it comes to vatnik trash. Why does Europe still need to tiptoe around these shameless barbarians? Nukes 
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Jul 3, 2023 23:57
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i'm just confused as to what more us in europe as a semi-organized entity can do to combat bad russian trolling irl, because i don't see a whole lot of this tiptoeing round it in my parts of it. like if europe should be doing something more to combat russian embassies being dicks, what exactly does that mean?
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Jul 3, 2023 23:58
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NoiseAnnoys posted:i'm just confused as to what more us in europe as a semi-organized entity can do to combat bad russian trolling irl, because i don't see a whole lot of this tiptoeing round it in my parts of it. The correct action here is to use diplomatic provocations to increase aid sent to Ukraine grumplestiltzkin posted:Nukes As Macron put it, Russia isn't the only European power with nukes. It's a toothless threat because it annihilates Russia too and they won't do it. I don't understand the worry about nukes. You're no more or less dead than anyone else in a nuclear exchange. There's never going to be a scenario in which there is a limited nuclear exchange that doesn't lead to a general exchange. HonorableTB fucked around with this message at 00:05 on Jul 4, 2023 |
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Jul 4, 2023 00:03
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NoiseAnnoys posted:i'm just confused as to what more us in europe as a semi-organized entity can do to combat bad russian trolling irl, because i don't see a whole lot of this tiptoeing round it in my parts of it. Maybe don't use someones birth place as a way to start a debate would help.
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Jul 4, 2023 00:04
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Tai posted:Maybe don't use someones birth place as a way to start a debate would help. sorry about that. in my defense, it’s also grating as hell to be told nebulously that Europe (a very large place with very different people) isn’t doing enough against this poo poo. so, it kinda rankles and i snapped a bit. HonorableTB posted:The correct action here is to use diplomatic provocations to increase aid sent to Ukraine lord knows Pavel is doing a fair amount here, and is pushing for more. hell, as i posted a few days ago, we’d be doing even more here if Poland and Hungary weren’t blocking funds for Ukrainian refugees in order to go on their own anti-migrant thing. NoiseAnnoys fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Jul 4, 2023 |
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Jul 4, 2023 00:09
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Drone_Fragger posted:If I was the Netherlands I'd be telling the Russian embassy to pack their poo poo up for offending human decency at this point, then level the building and turn it into a loving memorial for victims of Russian terrorism. Absolute scumbags. This is in Moscow, but I agree with the sentiment.
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Jul 4, 2023 00:14
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HonorableTB posted:As Macron put it, Russia isn't the only European power with nukes. It's a toothless threat because it annihilates Russia too and they won't do it. I don't understand the worry about nukes. You're no more or less dead than anyone else in a nuclear exchange. There's never going to be a scenario in which there is a limited nuclear exchange that doesn't lead to a general exchange. If you're going to flat out lose you press the button. For a lot, it means if your country is being literally destroyed. For a dictator like Putin or Kim, if it's THEY are going to be destroyed. Very, very big difference.
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Jul 4, 2023 00:16
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HonorableTB posted:- What a brown coup looks like I fully support Ween seizing control of Russia.
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Jul 4, 2023 00:26
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pro starcraft loser posted:If you're going to flat out lose you press the button. Putin is not going to fire off nukes because he loses in Ukraine. For one, the most likely scenario would be he'd have to nuke himself because the most likely way he leaves power outside of a natural causes death is in a coup led by someone who isn't an idiot. It's just not even worth considering tbh. Kim on the other hand I could see nuking invading troops but that's because Kim and Putin are entirely, entirely different dictators with wildly different motivations, personalities, and needs. Kim rules through a cult of personality, Putin does not. Putin beats obedience into the population and dissent out of it. Kim by comparison tied his uncle to a howitizer and fired it. It's like comparing apples and Mazdas. E: to further illustrate the extreme disparity between Kim and Putin, Putin relies on a veneer of legitimacy to take his actions. Kim just does it and kills anyone who questions it out of hand. Putin still has to care about the facade of law; Kim *IS* the law. A much more apt comparison would be to compare Kim to Stalin, tbh. HonorableTB fucked around with this message at 00:34 on Jul 4, 2023 |
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Jul 4, 2023 00:30
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Also the first thing I point to when people are concerned about nuclear war in the sense of "oh no two nuclear armed states are at war with each other" is just point to the Kargil War because if nukes didn't fly then, the necessary flashpoint would have to be substantially worse than that. On topic: https://www.politico.eu/article/ukraine-warn-disaster-russia-zaporizhzhia-nuclear-power-plant/amp/ quote:Ukraine warns of nuclear disaster as Russia orders staff to leave power plant Russia never met a war crime it didn't like, nor a crime against humanity. HonorableTB fucked around with this message at 01:02 on Jul 4, 2023 |
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Jul 4, 2023 00:36
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Priggy's coup in retrospect feels very Burn After Reading. "Accidental almost coup to make an awkward statement" is definitely a Coen plot anyway.
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Jul 4, 2023 03:18
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Good news for Ukraine - Kyiv's domestic intelligence agency have identified, captured and charged a traitor within their highest ranks before the traitor could do any further harm to Ukraine. https://www.theguardian.com/world/l...f08d551cf54cacd Ukrainian authorities have charged a former top security official with treason, says Kyiv’s domestic intelligence agency 15h ago 13.27 BST Ukrainian authorities have charged a former top security official with treason, Kyiv’s domestic intelligence agency said on Monday, Reuters reports. Oleh Kulinich, who headed the security service of Ukraine’s (SBU) Crimea directorate, was arrested last July over accusations of recruiting other Russian-friendly operatives on orders from Moscow. Investigators said Kulinich was working for Russia’s Federal Security Service and was overseen by other former Ukrainian officials who had defected to Moscow. “This is a clear signal to all those who work for the enemy: the SBU will definitely find you and make you answer for what you have done,” SBU chief Vasyl Malyuk, who oversaw the operation to detain Kulinich, said in a statement. If convicted, Kulinich faces up to 15 years in prison. President Volodymyr Zelenskiy last year hailed Kulinich’s arrest as part of a process of “self-purification”. Ukrainian authorities are also investigating Andriy Naumov, a former head of the SBU’s department of internal security, who turned up in Serbia last year in a car stuffed with cash and emeralds, police said.
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Jul 4, 2023 04:13
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HonorableTB posted:If you ever come across an advocate of Lysenkoism then you are obligated to give them an atomic wedgie. They exist, they walk among us, and God help us they try to publish papers sometimes. Communism is like the Operation board game, only instead of tweezers you use jumper cables and instead of getting an annoying buzz you get a devastating famine.
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Jul 4, 2023 04:25
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Lammasu posted:Communism is like the Operation board game, only instead of tweezers you use jumper cables and instead of getting an annoying buzz you get a devastating famine. I sometimes wonder how communism would have ended up if it hadn’t taken such a detour into extreme Authoritarianism.
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Jul 4, 2023 04:50
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Revolutions have a nasty habit in general of doing that in general even if you have strong desires for democracy if you're unable to deal with the contradiction of requiring a person or group with overwhelming power to get rid of the previous group/ruler. That the soviets got power via couping the government against the other people that also contributed i; the case of Russia didn't help either though.
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Jul 4, 2023 05:04
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Sucrose posted:I sometimes wonder how communism would have ended up if it hadn’t taken such a detour into extreme Authoritarianism. probably not a ton better tbqh. the planned economy that is a critical part of communism is still very much an unsolved problem, that was actually the biggest thing that marx took as flak from actual contemporaries when he was publishing. even since then the primary solution that's come up to handle the humongously complex task of planning, executing, and enforcing a spanning economic scheme to keep the market reasonably stable and curtail cheaters has basically been "an AGI". like yeah sure if we get one of those maybe we can revisit the concept. in the meantime, socialism is still great and has been proven to work the world over!
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Jul 4, 2023 05:06
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Coolguye posted:probably not a ton better tbqh. the planned economy that is a critical part of communism is still very much an unsolved problem, that was actually the biggest thing that marx took as flak from actual contemporaries when he was publishing. even since then the primary solution that's come up to handle the humongously complex task of planning, executing, and enforcing a spanning economic scheme to keep the market reasonably stable and curtail cheaters has basically been "an AGI". They had the chance and intentionally didn't take it because it would loosen the party leadership's power. HonorableTB posted:fun fact, did you know the Soviets almost invented the internet 7 years before ARPANET went online? The National Automated System for Computation and Information Processing (abbreviating OGAS) was a Soviet project attempting to create a nationwide linked information network that began in 1962 but got funding denied in 1970 and the idea was abandoned because the second the Soviet government had in its possession the means to actually optimize their centrally planned economy and make socialism work in a way much closer to how it was intended to work, they promptly lost all interest in the idea and abandoned the system because:
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Jul 4, 2023 05:21
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Bad news for Russia - Ukraine's main force has not been committed yet, and already Ukraine has liberated several settlements from Russian control, including some positions occupied by Russia since 2014. https://kyivindependent.com/ukraine-war-latest-russia-launches-small-scale-offensives-in-attempt-to-regain-control/ Ukraine war latest: Russia launches small-scale offensives in attempt to regain control by Asami Terajima July 3, 2023 12:33 AM 4 min read Ukraine is attacking Russian forces in the Berdiansk and Melitopol directions in southeastern Zaporizhzhia Oblast, "creating conditions for a speedy advance," Deputy Defense Minister Hanna Maliar said on July 2. Maliar reported fierce fighting across all fronts as Russian forces were pushing back. In the southeastern front, for example, Ukrainian forces are facing "intense enemy resistance, remote mining and redeployment of (Russian) military reserves," according to the official. The Armed Forces reported that Ukraine made some progress on the southern flank of Bakhmut – one of the axes where Kyiv is launching its ongoing counteroffensive. The authorities said there was "partial success" on the southern flank near the villages of Klishchiivka and Kurdiumivka. On the northern flank, Maliar said Russia deployed two air assault regiments to prevent a further Ukrainian advance. Ukraine had more success south of Bakhmut, where more villages like the southwestern Ivanivske are located, rather than in the north – an open field where every movement is easily detected. The reports of Ukrainian advance in recent days come nearly a month into the long-awaited Ukrainian counteroffensive, raging on the Bakhmut front, the southern part of Donetsk Oblast, and in Zaporizhzhia Oblast. The high-stakes operation, launched in early June, has found limited success so far though the main force has not been committed yet, with several settlements liberated from Russian control, including some positions occupied by Russia since 2014.
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Jul 4, 2023 05:31
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Is there an alternate site where Special Kherson Cat / NOELREPORTS / DEFMON3 etc etc is posting? Musk throwing up the twiiter loginwall due to his own incompetence makes quick checking of somewhat up to date info difficult.
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Jul 4, 2023 05:32
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CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:Is there an alternate site where Special Kherson Cat / NOELREPORTS / DEFMON3 etc etc is posting? Musk throwing up the twiiter loginwall due to his own incompetence makes quick checking of somewhat up to date info difficult. You can skip the middleman and go right to telegram, that's where a lot of their info comes from anyway e: Noelreport: https://t.me/noel_reports Defmon: https://t.me/s/defmon3war HonorableTB fucked around with this message at 05:50 on Jul 4, 2023 |
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Jul 4, 2023 05:47
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The offensive starts today July 4th. Happy 'murica day Ukraines going to send the fireworks across the donbass.
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Jul 4, 2023 05:48
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:The offensive starts today July 4th. the offensive has been ongoing for a month by now
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Jul 4, 2023 05:50
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HonorableTB posted:the offensive has been ongoing for a month by now Ukraine has stated that the main thrust of the offensive would be occuring today (July 4th) and as early as a week ago was stating that the offensives main force had not been invested into the effort yet. We will see if they were bsing or not today.
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Jul 4, 2023 05:53
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Good news for Ukraine - Multiple Western officials agree and acknowledge that the progress of Ukraine's offensive is justified. https://edition.cnn.com/2023/07/04/europe/ukraine-counteroffensive-slow-progress-intl/index.html Ukraine’s counteroffensive hasn’t met expectations. Here’s why progress has been slow By Ivana Kottasová, CNN Published 12:00 AM EDT, Tue July 4, 2023 ... Ukraine’s Western allies are getting nervous about the fact that the progress of Kyiv’s long-awaited counteroffensive is being measured in meters, rather than kilometers. Kyiv’s allies are well aware that Ukraine cannot defeat Russia without their help. But the slower than expected pace of the counteroffensive means their support could become increasingly unsustainable if the conflict drags on. Many of the countries that are supporting Ukraine’s war efforts are struggling with high inflation, rising interest rates and sluggish growth. Their leaders – some of whom are facing elections in the next year and a half – need to justify the huge amount of resources they’ve poured into Ukraine when their own voters are struggling to make ends meet. That can become difficult if there isn’t much battlefield success to show for it. For now though, the support appears unfaltering. Multiple Ukrainian and Western officials have admitted that the counteroffensive has so far failed to yield major advances – but most were quick to add that the slow progress was justified. The front lines in southern and eastern Ukraine have not moved much over the past months, giving Russian troops plenty of time to dig in and prepare for a counteroffensive. According to an assessment by the Washington-based think tank Institute for the Study of War (ISW), some of the most strategic sections of the front line are guarded by multiple lines of defense, making it very difficult for the Ukrainians to break through. Chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Mark Milley said that the pace is not surprising, given that Ukrainian soldiers were fighting “for their life.” “We are giving them as much help as humanly possible, but at the end of the day, Ukrainian soldiers are assaulting through minefields and into trenches,” he said. “So yes, sure, it goes a little slow, but that is part of the nature of war,” Milley said at the National Press Club on Friday. Milley stressed that, while slowly, the Ukrainians were pushing ahead. “(The offensive) is advancing steadily, deliberately, working its way through very difficult minefields … you know, 500 meters a day, 1,000 meters a day, 2,000 meters a day, that kind of thing,” he said. While Ukraine’s forces work their way through deadly minefields on the ground, they are still lacking air superiority and are under frequent attacks from above. Legion, a master-sergeant in Ukraine’s 47th Brigade which is involved in the fighting in the south, said it was clear that Russian forces have been preparing for this moment for months. “They knew that this area is where the main attack will take place, so they prepared thoroughly. They have artillery and aviation here, and both fighters and helicopters are working regularly,” he said. Legion told CNN the fighting in the area was comparable to “what it was like in Bakhmut during the hottest phase.” ... Milley urged observers to remain patient, saying he expects the counteroffensive to last as long as 10 weeks. “What I had said was this is going to take six, eight, 10 weeks. It’s going to be very difficult. It’s going to be very long, and it’s going to be very, very bloody. And no one should have any illusions about any of that,” he said.
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Jul 4, 2023 06:14
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fizzy posted:Bad news for Russia - Ukraine's main force has not been committed yet, and already Ukraine has liberated several settlements from Russian control, including some positions occupied by Russia since 2014. Can’t be true, that random old dude on Twitter said that all of Ukraine’s army is already dead actually
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Jul 4, 2023 06:34
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a cyborg mug posted:Can’t be true, that random old dude on Twitter said that all of Ukraine’s army is already dead actually
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Jul 4, 2023 06:36
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The Guardian Ukraine liveblog posted:Russia's foreign ministry says Ukraine attempted 'terrorist' attack on airport I feel like I've played this game before
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Jul 4, 2023 07:16
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Bad news for Russia - Their feeble air defences are unable to prevent Ukraine's drones from penetrating all the way into the very heart of Moscow. https://www.theguardian.com/world/l...f0808e4930e5d3e Moscow mayor confirms drone attack, blaming Ukraine 2h ago 06.12 BST Sergei Sobyanin, Moscow’s mayor, said on Tuesday that Ukraine launched another drone attack on the Russian capital and its region, temporarily disrupting flight operations at the Vnukovo airport. “At this moment, the attacks have been repelled by air defence forces,” Sobyanin said on Telegram. “All detected drones have been eliminated.” There were no casualties or injured reported, Sobyanin added.
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Jul 4, 2023 08:04
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Coolguye posted:probably not a ton better tbqh. the planned economy that is a critical part of communism is still very much an unsolved problem, that was actually the biggest thing that marx took as flak from actual contemporaries when he was publishing. even since then the primary solution that's come up to handle the humongously complex task of planning, executing, and enforcing a spanning economic scheme to keep the market reasonably stable and curtail cheaters has basically been "an AGI". If it was planned economy controlled by gamers, they would min-max it within a week. Although we would all eat only cabbage and only produced space lasers.
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Jul 4, 2023 08:14
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Autisanal Cheese posted:I feel like I've played this game before "Remember, no Ukrainian." EDIT: I admit, I'm not sure how different Ukrainian is to Russian.
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Jul 4, 2023 08:15
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CommissarMega posted:"Remember, no Ukrainian." My Russian friend applied for a job once that required Ukrainian, she has a Ukrainian surname but doesn't know the language at all and almost passed the language test they gave her.
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Jul 4, 2023 08:20
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Bad news for Russia - They are running out of artillery ammunition. https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidhambling/2023/04/05/when-will-ammunition-shortage-silence-russias-artillery/?sh=1faa82d96d95 Stalin famously called artillery ‘the god of war,’ and during WWII the Red Army honed the tactic of concentrating thousands of guns on a narrow section of front to deliver devastating barrages. Artillery has been similarly important in the current campaign, causing around 80% of the casualties, but many analysts including the U.K.’s Ministry of Defence are suggesting that Russian forces are now facing a critical shortage of ammunition. Is this wishful thinking, or will Russian guns start to fall silent? Any assessment relies on knowing how many shells Russia had to start with, and the rate at which shells are being expended. And we have seen a wide range of figures thrown around. ... Many commentators concur that the rate of fire is falling off, though whether this is from 60,000 a day to 20,000 or 20,000 to 5,000 is impossible to tell. ... The sharp reduction in the amount being fired suggests that stockpiles are now severely depleted. Russia is reportedly drawing on old ammunition reserves, but reportedly as many of 50% of the shells are visibly rusty and are not in a satisfactory state due to poor storage and sheer age. Troops are reportedly being issued ammunition previously declared unfit for use. How has Russia run through such ammunition reserves, reserves which presumably were supposed to be sufficient for a full-scale war with NATO, without achieving its war aims in Ukraine? While Ukraine has increasingly developed precision indirect fire to make best use of their resources, using drones to adjust their aim and hitting Russian tanks with a few well-directed shells, the Russians have relied on more and more firepower. In an article entitled ‘Why Russia Keeps Turning to Mass Firepower’ in Foreign Policy, Lucian Staiano-Daniels notes that while the U.S. emphasizes the need for precise artillery fire, Russia prefers to use massed fires to make up for inadequacies in its army, tracing this back to the Napoleonic wars and beyond: “an army that is unable or unwilling to invest in its manpower must compensate with something else.” This has been particularly obvious in urban warfare, where Russian forces have repeated the tactics developed in Chechnya, Rather than infantry fighting building-by-building, massed artillery demolishes entire blocks when they encounter any resistance. The result is the utter devastation of the towns and cities they capture, and the expenditure of large quantities of ammunition. Even when fighting Ukrainian forces in the open countryside, Russian artillery is notable for throwing shells in the general direction of the enemy rather than at specific targets, leaving landscapes reminiscent of a WWI battlefield. This is very much by the book for Russian artillery commanders. Russian army firing tables lay down the number of shells needed to carry out a barrage against any given type of target, and according to these hundreds of rounds are required even to destroy a single armored vehicle. In addition to this inefficient use of ammunition, Russia has another problem: stockpiles are being blown up by long-range strikes. This seems to have been one of the main uses of the U.S.-suppled HIMARS rockets, with Ukraine claiming to have destroyed 50 ammo dumps in July. Since those first few months Russian ammunition has been stored even further back from the front line, but clearly significant quantities have been blown up, and forward storage sites and even individual ammunition trucks are still regularly hit. Once the stockpile is gone, the only source will be new deliveries. According to Ukrainian estimates, Russia has capacity to produce around 20,000 rounds a month or less than 700 rounds a day. One 152mm gun fires 7-8 rounds a minute, so a single battery of 6 guns will expend that 700 rounds in one 15-minute bombardment – leaving nothing for any other Russian forces anywhere in Ukraine... Russia still has some ammunition reserves, and the steady trickle of new ammunition will continue and perhaps increase as Russian industry shifts to meet Putin’s demands. Maybe they will succeed in buying additional ammunition from Iran. But expending 40,000 rounds, or even 20,000 or 10,000 in one day will no longer be feasible. Ukraine's General Staff believe that Russia will experience critical ammunition shortages in the next two months. Russian artillery is being starved into uselessness...
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Jul 4, 2023 08:22
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twitter death has made these forums a mess. 
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Jul 4, 2023 08:25
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fizzy posted:Bad news for Russia - They are running out of artillery ammunition. Edit: regarding potential nuclear escalation, there was an interesting essay written recently - The death of nuclear fear In the wake of Prigozhin’s mutiny, war hawks are once again brandishing Russia’s nuclear potential. Why aren’t their threats working? quote:Those who like to threaten a nuclear attack, while avoiding any mention of repercussions for Russia itself, should consider what Prigozhin’s mutiny has revealed about Russian society and its way of responding to extraordinary situations. The lesson is simple: When people sense that what’s happening affects not only their well-being but even their physical safety, they start acting quickly, uncontrollably, and on a mass scale. Dwesa fucked around with this message at 08:35 on Jul 4, 2023 |
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Jul 4, 2023 08:27
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I feel like there has been Russia will run out of ammo articles every few weeks and yet they still can outgun Ukraine easily. Sure ammo dumps go boom and they ain't firing like they could a year ago but they still are lobbing a lot at Ukraine forces
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Jul 4, 2023 08:30
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NoiseAnnoys posted:i dunno, indian dude, what do you propose we do? I apologize if I came off as sounding insensitive last night, I'm sorry, seeing blatant lies on a scale like this can sometimes be very frustrating. No hard feelings, I hope.
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Jul 4, 2023 08:31
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