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Is the refresh coming up going to the end of LGA1700? I assume yes.
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Jul 3, 2023 19:16
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Ya, Meteor Lake won’t fit. (Although maybe Intel will make a mess of things/try to squeeze every cent out of the existing socket and release another refresh.)
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Jul 3, 2023 20:51
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SuperTeeJay posted:Ya, Meteor Lake won’t fit. Since when has Intel ever decided to squeeze /more/ life out of a socket? They love nothing more than to change sockets every other generation, and have done so for like almost 15 years at this point lol
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Jul 3, 2023 23:37
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Well, the question was about the third series that will be compatible with LGA1700, so 'Now'?
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Jul 4, 2023 01:18
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Shipon posted:Since when has Intel ever decided to squeeze /more/ life out of a socket? They love nothing more than to change sockets every other generation, and have done so for like almost 15 years at this point lol Alder Lake Raptor Lake Raptor Lake refresh three generations!
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Jul 4, 2023 01:29
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Why squeeze more money out of a socket when you can make a new socket and soak everyone again?
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Jul 4, 2023 02:10
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Why squeeze more money out of a socket when you can make a new socket and soak everyone again? Because then people buy your poo poo less? Consumers aren't idiots* *exceptions apply
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Jul 4, 2023 03:02
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It make sense seeing how the pinout is a bottleneck. Each gen is an opportunity to cram even more pins in the socket.
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Jul 4, 2023 09:06
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Beef posted:It make sense seeing how the pinout is a bottleneck. Each gen is an opportunity to cram even more pins in the socket. lmao at this point they're adding more pins for power than data the bottleneck is the contact resistance against 150 amps
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Jul 4, 2023 13:09
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I really want to upgrade my living room PC with my office 5800x3d but both AMD and Intel current and near-future offerings are less than desirable for different reasons. Looks like I'm waiting until next year. I told myself I'm done with AMD for awhile due to all the jankiness but then I looked at the Intel tdp and had a hearty lol. I live in Tampa Bay (and my office gets full sun) so heat dissipation is a factor. It's funny how back in the day Intel was known for efficiency and AMD was all about power. Kaddish fucked around with this message at 13:36 on Jul 4, 2023 |
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Jul 4, 2023 13:33
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Kaddish posted:
When was this? Both Athlon XPs and 64s looked really efficient against Pentium 4s. Hell, K6es weren't that hot unless you were trying to overclock the poo poo out of them.
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Jul 4, 2023 16:52
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Twerk from Home posted:When was this? Both Athlon XPs and 64s looked really efficient against Pentium 4s. Hell, K6es weren't that hot unless you were trying to overclock the poo poo out of them. I'm thinking mid-2000's maybe? There was an Opteron meant for server but popular with enthusiasts. I also remember Athlon XP commonly running 90c but maybe I'm totally off-base! Of course, there was the AMD FX series that had a tdp of something like 200+ watts? I'm old and could be making all of this up! My AMD experience went from K6 -> Opteron -> Phenom II -> 5800X/X3D with Intel used in between - so my AMD knowledge is admittedly dodgy. I also had one of the early Radeons pretty soon after they bought ATI and never bought another after that experience. Kaddish fucked around with this message at 17:14 on Jul 4, 2023 |
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Jul 4, 2023 17:06
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Twerk from Home posted:When was this? Both Athlon XPs and 64s looked really efficient against Pentium 4s. Hell, K6es weren't that hot unless you were trying to overclock the poo poo out of them. K6 also had the problem of a pipeline all of four stages deep. It just didn’t scale well to higher clocks, and I’m a little impressed they got up to 550MHz with K6-3+ and its sizable cache. But the efficiency advantage has bounced between Intel and AMD repeatedly - Netburst was power-drinking trash versus K7 and K8 positively pantsed it, Conroe/Core 2 put Intel back on top until things leveled out again with Phenom II, and then Intel made a huge jump on efficiency with Sandy Bridge that they maintained over AMD’s construction cores until Ryzen came back around and started competing on efficiency while Intel was stuck on 14nm for half a decade plus. My growing suspicion is that the don’t-call-it-Atom-descended E cores will eventually be grown to supersede the P cores in future Intel designs, as the latter is grossly less efficient in real terms for everything but SIMD-heavy work. Zen4c was an interesting recent development - I’ll be interested in seeing where things shake out in the next five years.
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Jul 4, 2023 18:12
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Hasturtium posted:My growing suspicion is that the don’t-call-it-Atom-descended E cores will eventually be grown to supersede the P cores in future Intel designs, as the latter is grossly less efficient in real terms for everything but SIMD-heavy work. Zen4c was an interesting recent development - I’ll be interested in seeing where things shake out in the next five years. Intel will need to do it quickly… Tremont is like sandy bridge and Gracemont is like Skylake. There’s still a lot of ground to make up.
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Jul 4, 2023 18:20
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Twerk from Home posted:When was this? Both Athlon XPs and 64s looked really efficient against Pentium 4s. Hell, K6es weren't that hot unless you were trying to overclock the poo poo out of them. Like the FX-6200 vs i5 ivy bridge type stuff era.
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Jul 5, 2023 00:29
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Kaddish posted:I'm thinking mid-2000's maybe? There was an Opteron meant for server but popular with enthusiasts. I also remember Athlon XP commonly running 90c but maybe I'm totally off-base! Of course, there was the AMD FX series that had a tdp of something like 200+ watts? I'm old and could be making all of this up! Prescott P4s were the infamous blast furnace of the time, Intel was suffering brutally with heat back then relatively speaking
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Jul 5, 2023 02:17
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Shipon posted:Prescott P4s were the infamous blast furnace of the time, Intel was suffering brutally with heat back then relatively speaking Don't forget Pentium D! What could be better than one Preshott? Two!
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Jul 5, 2023 06:27
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Shipon posted:Prescott P4s were the infamous blast furnace of the time, Intel was suffering brutally with heat back then relatively speaking I do like how Intel's response to 'Processor make PC too hot?' was coming up with an entire new BTX form factor, so they could kick that thermal can down the road another few years.
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Jul 5, 2023 22:25
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well ...
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Jul 5, 2023 22:42
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Methylethylaldehyde posted:I do like how Intel's response to 'Processor make PC too hot?' was coming up with an entire new BTX form factor, so they could kick that thermal can down the road another few years. in retrospect they were just ahead of the times on that front
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Jul 5, 2023 23:19
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The #1 entry on the TOP 500 supercomputers is using whole-datacenter closed-loop cooling:  Blue pipes carry cold water, red carries hot, with more details here.
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Jul 6, 2023 11:22
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https://twitter.com/VideoCardz/status/1678746130555850754?s=20
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Jul 11, 2023 14:01
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STH is the site breaking the news, and has more details. Notably, this means there'll be no more tiny systems with vPro (read: an in-band base management controller that implements IPMI and vKVM).
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Jul 11, 2023 14:07
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Intel really wants to make themselves irrelevant. Strange.
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Jul 11, 2023 14:18
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BlankSystemDaemon posted:Notably, this means there'll be no more tiny systems with vPro (read: an in-band base management controller that implements IPMI and vKVM). I dont see this part anywhere? NUCs weren’t the only vPro systems, and all of the Tiny Mini Micros from Dell, HP, and Lenovo have vPro as an option. Tbh I don’t really see the NUC announcement as that big of a deal. As STH pointed out, they were competing with their own customers and losing money doing so, and I don’t think the NUCs were ever that popular in the market. Just like the original Intel designed Ultrabooks, the strangest part was that the Windows OEMs were SO bad at one point that they ever needed to exist at all.
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Jul 11, 2023 15:19
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Cygni posted:I dont see this part anywhere? NUCs weren’t the only vPro systems, and all of the Tiny Mini Micros from Dell, HP, and Lenovo have vPro as an option. It often seems like the vendors claim to sell them, but don't actually wanna bother.
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Jul 11, 2023 15:23
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I've used one of the little HP Prodesk minis at work and it has vPro, and that's about as commoditized as a little computer can be. Can't you order directly from HP or Dell in Europe?
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Jul 11, 2023 16:01
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I've not really seen NUC available here so it may have as well not existed.
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Jul 11, 2023 18:31
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HalloKitty posted:Intel really wants to make themselves irrelevant. Strange. they are focusing on what they are good at, which is umm fabbing for companies that cant afford tsmc
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Jul 11, 2023 20:05
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That's our Intel babyyy, right as brands like Minisforum and Beelink are popularizing the ultra small form factor for consumers they pull up stakes and leave the market
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Jul 11, 2023 20:12
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DoombatINC posted:That's our Intel babyyy, right as brands like Minisforum and Beelink are popularizing the ultra small form factor for consumers they pull up stakes and leave the market It’s amazing - they’ve been the flagbearer for the sector, to the point that a recent knockoff low-end brand is called ATOPNUC, and they’re kiboshing the line. The flop sweat is alarming.
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Jul 11, 2023 21:31
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Twerk from Home posted:When was this? Both Athlon XPs and 64s looked really efficient against Pentium 4s. Hell, K6es weren't that hot unless you were trying to overclock the poo poo out of them. The 'construction machine' Family 15h chips - Bulldozer and its successors Piledriver, Steamroller, and Excavator - were all pretty bad. With Bulldozer, AMD bet the farm on a novel idea for making highly threaded server chips. Many server workloads don't need the FPU much, so they came up with an idea for a 2-thread 'module' where there are two independent cache/integer complexes sharing one FPU. Sort of like Intel hyperthreading, except much less resource sharing between the two threads. The idea was that one module was substantially smaller than two fully independent cores, but would perform like independent cores on integer workloads. Due to the size reduction, AMD could pack more cores into a big server chip. Since the integer execution width for each thread in a module was somewhat narrow, AMD needed to target very high clock frequencies. However, as I understand it, AMD didn't hit their power targets and was forced to back frequencies way off. Even with the clock speed reduction, the chips still used lots of power, and performance was not great.
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Jul 12, 2023 00:32
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BobHoward posted:The 'construction machine' Family 15h chips - Bulldozer and its successors Piledriver, Steamroller, and Excavator - were all pretty bad. Yes - clustered modular threading/CMT didn’t pan out for AMD. The siloed integer/cache complexes only shared a prefetch unit, a decode unit (which was re-duplicated for Steamroller to improve performance, then rolled back to one for Excavator for power savings), and the FPU. The FPU was dual-issue and capable of handling two 128-bit values at once, and at least for Excavator those could be ganged together for 256-bit work, as those last chips finally added support for AVX2. With lower IPC and clocks failing to scale to the levels needed for competitive performance (partly due to AMD's process disadvantage with Global Foundries), the chips were only capable in well-threaded and integer-heavy niches. I knew a few people who kept them around for munching DVD rips and cheap build servers, and I swore by my FX-8320 as a quirky but decent workhorse, but Intel's chips outclassed them for general workloads. Simple as that. As a weird side note/epilogue, there’s a dirt cheap mini PC made by ATOPNUC available now, the MA90, featuring an AMD A9 9400 - a single module/dual thread Excavator from 2016 with a Radeon R5. I obtained it for the princely sum of $86 before taxes, as it is cheaper than a Pi-alike for running Pi-Hole, and in my initial testing it will not surprise you to learn, dear goons, that it is slow. Hasturtium fucked around with this message at 02:53 on Jul 12, 2023 |
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Jul 12, 2023 01:26
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I used an A10-7860K for about a week while sorting out some troubleshooting woes and you could really feel it chug just opening browsers and such.
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Jul 12, 2023 03:35
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I had an FX-8350 and it was fine for daily use and gaming, but when it died (power supply failed so badly it fried the CPU) I replaced it with a cheap used 6c/12t X58 Gulftown system that performed much better despite being a year older.
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Jul 12, 2023 04:00
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I still use an A9-something craptop. And get this, most of the time I limit the CPU speed to 70%.  (Because it sits next to my bed and I don't want the fan to turn on.) If I want to watch a youtube at higher than 720p I download it with yt-dlp, because a browser decoder drops frames. It sucks, but the two things I do with it are watch video or type plain text and given that it's actually ok. The GPU has better video decode than whatever celeron was in $300 laptops in 2018. TBQH I don't hate it! FuturePastNow posted:I had an FX-8350 and it was fine for daily use and gaming, but when it died (power supply failed so badly it fried the CPU) I replaced it with a cheap used 6c/12t X58 Gulftown system that performed much better despite being a year older. The later FXes got through the worst deficits of the Construction arch through clockspeed and extravagant TDP. Funny how that pattern keeps repeating!
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Jul 12, 2023 04:48
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i haven't had a computer processor chug on internet browsing since ... probably the asus eee pc netbook back in 2008
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Jul 12, 2023 04:59
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Cygni posted:I dont see this part anywhere? NUCs weren’t the only vPro systems, and all of the Tiny Mini Micros from Dell, HP, and Lenovo have vPro as an option. Can't remember if it was Pat or Bob who went on record throwing shade at the Microsoft Surface for "competing with their own OEM customers". If anyone was actually buying the NUC that would have been a very hypocritical thing to say!
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Jul 12, 2023 05:19
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Investors want to see that perpetual double digit growth. Intel trying to eat its own customers makes some kind of perverse  sense back when it had 98% server market share and facing a stagnating client and enterprise segments.
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Jul 12, 2023 10:38
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I'm surprised, considering how hard it was to find 8th gen NUCs that weren't going for $arm and $leg used during the pandemic, let alone new.
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Jul 12, 2023 11:08
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