|
Notably any time someone primes after Clive has taken their power (which, to be fair, we only see twice) there are extreme circumstances. Either extreme desperation in Benedikta’s case or extreme amounts of aether in Hugo’s. They also both prime in berserk mode and don’t have control (see: orange eyes). That seems to suggest whatever Clive takes is important for their ability to prime but it’s never fully explained I don’t think.
Harrow fucked around with this message at 01:12 on Jul 8, 2023 |
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 01:10
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 10, 2024 23:48 |
|
|
Untrue, Bahamut manages to casually dragonify at the end. Notably he's also the one who got the most time to rest afterward.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 01:12
|
|
|
Clarste posted:Untrue, Bahamut manages to casually dragonify at the end. Notably he's also the one who got the most time to rest afterward. Ahhhh right, I was just thinking about fights. Never mind! I have no idea then lol
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 01:13
|
|
|
They actually do mention in Dion's case that priming after Clive yoinks their power drove them crazy and he's like gently caress it, I'ma do it anyway how else are you getting up to Origin? (I expected Mid to finish her airship and that would do it)
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 01:15
|
|
|
I like that plot point because Clive, Joshua, and Dion discuss and are also completely unsure about how it works. Like it was literally something like "well, we know you can still prime, but it seems like you can't control it as well". Which makes sense because nobody else in recorded history has had this power before! So, the rules are what we see happen in the game. It drains your powers temporarily, but if you take some time to recover, you're basically no worse for wear. Heck, before the final battle you can even get Jill as a party member again, and she has no trouble using her ice magic, same as ever.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 01:16
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:Joshua was saved by the Undying Speaking of that, is it explained why they didn’t save Clive as well? Did they arrive after the Imperials and Joshua was conveniently under a pile of rubble?
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 01:18
|
|
|
Well the place was swarming with imperials, and they left with Clive, so I assume Jote dug out Joshua after they cleared out.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 01:21
|
|
|
The depiction of the undying makes me easily believe they’d be the sorts to just say “eh, that guy isn’t the Phoenix, gently caress him.”
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 01:23
|
|
|
There’s some easily missed dialogue that they were planning to assassinate him because he almost killed Joshua, until Joshua told them to stop. And yes that means they knew he was a slave for 13 years and did nothing. Maybe Joshua thought he was safer there EDIT: If you talk to Cyril in the inn between receiving the badge and leaving Tabor he says this: quote:The history of our order spans generations...but I expect you are most interested in the events of our more recent past. RatHat fucked around with this message at 01:32 on Jul 8, 2023 |
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 01:25
|
|
|
Is there any way to access the crystal wave you can see and that the bard mentions? Wonder if that's a DLC hook or just cut content.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 02:04
|
|
|
Bugblatter posted:Is there any way to access the crystal wave you can see and that the bard mentions? Wonder if that's a DLC hook or just cut content. dlc hook/cut content. i kept seeing it and being like "is that a mothercrystal?"
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 02:09
|
|
|
Definitely a future hook. If anything was cut out of this game they hide it very well.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 02:10
|
|
|
It's sort of in the direction where Drake's Eye would be too.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 03:14
|
|
|
SettingSun posted:Definitely a future hook. If anything was cut out of this game they hide it very well. I need to know what's behind the fallen ruin door in The Dim on your way to Rosaria. I hope it's Leviathan(somehow) and 2-3 minigames Clive can play against people across the continent.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 03:36
|
|
|
at first i thought that the frozen wave was just the aftermath of a little scuffle jill got into on her way to northreach, since she and clive took separate routes
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 03:38
|
|
|
CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:I need to know what's behind the fallen ruin door in The Dim on your way to Rosaria. You open the door, a dim hallway illuminated in soft blue light. You walk, the lights glowing dimmer and dimmer, until you are in pitch blackness. Suddenly, without warning, the playonline theme begins playing and a new quest objective appears; Navigate playonline and win tetra master matches. 0/3.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 03:50
|
|
|
Inside the door is a blitzball stadium.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 04:36
|
|
|
It's the Jack Garland superboss.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 04:40
|
|
|
SettingSun posted:Also hey what's the deal with Clive stealing the powers of other Dominants? There is a lore thing that basically states that they can still Prime but it is way riskier and harder. Notably nobody who primes after Clive takes their powers lives long enough for us to see.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 05:34
|
|
|
Well as mentioned Bahamut does. I’ve been reading the tomes in ng+ and there’s some interesting bits that get thrown in there after the credits. It mentions that there are 16 Ultimas that share a single consciousness, and Origin is the ship they used to arrive in Valisthea.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 05:42
|
|
|
Dion never survives the transformation back though. He doesn't go batshit insane like Benedikta or Hugo does, but we don't know what sort of toll it took on his body because he gets counter-gigaflared by Ultima.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 06:05
|
|
|
SettingSun posted:Well as mentioned Bahamut does. Those are there if you max out Harpocretes before the final mission but yeah. Joshua sealing Ultima(1 of 16 apparently) really did fuckall
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 06:21
|
|
|
Is Joshua proportionally weaker as an adult party member than as a child? When you play as him as a kid, he knows Curaga and his fire spells can two-shot knights the same level as him. He knows a couple of very flashy spells as an adult, but I don't know if he ever just deletes enemies the way he can in his pov section.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 06:49
|
|
|
Harrow posted:FF6 and 15's worlds both get wildly hosed up before their endings, too True, but they don't have continuations after that.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 07:17
|
|
|
FF6 famously continues on after the world gets hosed
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 07:21
|
|
|
Where did the mothercrystals come from? Are they a natural occurrence that have always been there or did something cause them?
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 15:15
|
|
|
Ultima put all of them down (and powered them with a copy of himself at the heart). They’re giant aether siphons.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 15:17
|
|
|
Someone brought this up in the main thread, but it's kind of wild to me that there's another continent mentioned in the game that doesn't seem to have any of Valisthea's problems. The game's events feel like they're world-shaking but they're spurred by something that seems to be really localized. Are there Mothercrystals on the other continent? Do they have the Blight? We can reasonably assume they don't have Dominants and Eikons because those came from Ultima (who was very focused on Valisthea), but are they aware of them? When Clive removes magic from the world in the ending, is that the whole world or just Valisthea? Does it only apply to magic from crystals? Can Bearers still use their magic in Valisthea? What about the other continent? I feel like a sequel is pretty unlikely but boy I really wonder what the hell was going on in the rest of the world during FFXVI's story.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 15:50
|
|
|
Is Valisthea the planet or just Storm and Ash? The codex calls Valisthea a realm but Ultima intends to remake the world. Is Origin a space ship?
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 15:58
|
|
|
There's at least one much bigger continent that's hard to get to but sometimes trades with Valisthea, I dont think the game goes into more detail than that
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 16:10
|
|
|
SettingSun posted:Is Valisthea the planet or just Storm and Ash? The codex calls Valisthea a realm but Ultima intends to remake the world. Is Origin a space ship? I kind of assumed they'd just come from elsewhere on the planet, but the fact that they all had to shed their physical bodies to "undertake an unprecedented journey" makes it sound like it's something more extreme than an ocean voyage. Origin either traveled through space or from another dimension (Ultima does take you to the interdimensional vortex after all). I don't think the other continents are ruined by blight, because a) we hear about like the Seven Great Houses of merchants and only two of them are on the Twins (Byron and his rival in Dhalmekia) and b) it would be boring if they were.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 16:15
|
|
|
the continent was supposedly colonized by the remnants of the fallen who didn't get zapped by ultima after their rebellion. barnabas is one of the last spinoffs of a cult from that population that have spent the centuries begging forgiveness for their transgressions. nothing about the civilization itself, though
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 16:17
|
|
|
Magic is the art of channeling aether. That can be done in two ways: innately as a bearer or dominant, or by using a crystal to draw it for you. That makes sense. Ultima is deliberately trying to create a vessel that can channel vast amount of aether for his Raise spell. And the mother crystals are designed to channel aether so naturally shards of it can do it too. Aether is life so it’s still around at the end of the game. The crystals are gone. What about the bearers? Is the knowledge of magic just lost?
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 18:18
|
|
|
SettingSun posted:Magic is the art of channeling aether. That can be done in two ways: innately as a bearer or dominant, or by using a crystal to draw it for you. Clive specifically calls out "Ultima's Legacy: Bearers, Dominants, crystals, Magick" as something he is going to consign to the flames. Combined with the fact magic is the cause of the Blight it's pretty safe to assume they are just gone. It's like the ending of FF6, magic as a thing is just gone from the world. Maybe another Ultima-like godlike being could start the whole blight cycle over again but at least for now they're back to using flint to start fires.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 18:27
|
|
|
They mention that crystals stopped working when Ultima casts the Bad Weather Spell, but I think bearers can still use magic. I think that humans, as creations of the Fallen, can still use magic that draws on their own aether, but without the crystals they can no longer pull it out of the land. So the blight is over, but bearer slavery is still something that could be a problem. Indeed, Cid explicitly says at one point that his plan to destroy the mothercrystals may make that problem worse before it gets better. It's so interesting to me that we never see bearers using magic for anything but household chores. Healing people, doing laundry, etc. They really avoid the like Dragon Age thing where mages are discriminated against... but it's for a good reason! They can just go crazy and turn into a demon and kill a whole town at any time! There's never any indication that bearers are more dangerous than the average person, they can just do the same mundane sort of stuff that crystals can do, but without a crystal. There are indications that they can use it for combat, of course, just like crystals, but it's never shown on screen. The bearers who were slaughtered at that church early on defended themselves until they ran out of aether and turned to dust, and presumably your assassin buddies in the opening could do some combat magic as well. If they wanted to do a sequel/spinoff about rebuilding the world and truly ending bearer slavery, there's plenty of meat left on that bone.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 18:29
|
|
|
The big argument against destroying all magic for me is thematic, because as much as magic is often a source of hardship for bearers it feels like it betrays Cid's ideals - where he explicitly said that bearer talents should win them respect & is implicitly destroying the Mothercrystals partially to force spciety to stop treating bearers as the cheap, disposable alternative to crystals - to just say "ok now that bearers are literally identical to everyone else there's no more oppression!"
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 18:32
|
|
|
In addition to Clive specifically saying bearers being one of the things he’ll end, in the post credits scene where the kid is lighting a fire with flint he wishes he could use magic and his mom laughs it off as a fairy tale. Pretty sure it’s all just gone.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 18:35
|
|
|
Begemot posted:They mention that crystals stopped working when Ultima casts the Bad Weather Spell, but I think bearers can still use magic. No, Bearers can use combat magic. In fact one of the big sidequests (the one where your contact gets revealed as a secret bearer) happens because he uses a combat spell to save some children from danger. They don't do it often because people freak the gently caress out and they mention that secret bearers usually keep a crystal nearby so they can fake using it to cast magic. They dont' do it more because they are beaten down slaves. Also the ending of the makes it pretty blunt magic isn't around anymore. The kids wishes he could use magic to start a fire and it's dismissed as a fairytale, and since magic itself was the caught of the Blight and Clive calls out 'consigning it to the flames" it would't make any sense for it to remain around.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 18:36
|
|
|
Begemot posted:They mention that crystals stopped working when Ultima casts the Bad Weather Spell, but I think bearers can still use magic. they can’t. bearer magic sputters out when the crystals break as well. every region has slavers at their wits’ end over it
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 18:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 10, 2024 23:48 |
|
|
Right. Without magic, the blight doesn’t spread. Presumably.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2023 18:38
|
|