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Zereth posted:And those things that look like holes with gratings in the side walls aren't enough ventilation? Another row of holes along the bottom would help a lot.
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Jul 13, 2023 06:37
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Check me on this math. 400,000BTU/hr. Methane is about 1000 BTU per ft^3, so we're looking at 400 cubic feet of gas combustion per hour (at full power/max setting) in that shed. The heater is rated for about 85% efficiency, so 60k BTU/hr of waste heat will heat that building to roasty temps and dump 400 cubic feet of a mix of water vapor, carbon dioxide, and some carbon monoxide. Just eyeballing the structure at 6x6x5 feet means 180 cubic feet of space, and take away some amount for the stuff inside, so maybe 150 cubic feet of volume in there. So the time for the heater to totally fill the thing with asphyxiating gas mix is about 440/150 = 2.9, or roughly 3 times per hour, so in 20 minutes that structure is completely unable to support life regardless of those 2 inch hole cutouts at the top. And if you aren't getting a feeling for the heat getting dumped into there, 60k BTU/hr is equivalent to 17,500 watts of space heaters. That's a bit more than 3 of your standard space heaters running full blast whenever the heater is running. It's just a mess. Easy to fix, and will probably turn out safe and sane after some minor remediation work on the project. But right now it's a serious death trap and maybe even a fire hazard.
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Jul 13, 2023 07:18
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Carbon dioxide don’t need to displace oxygen to kill you. Even if twenty percent of the atmosphere is oxygen, ten percent carbon dioxide is quite deadly. The shed would hit that in six minutes.
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Jul 13, 2023 07:49
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I feel like that is a case for a roof without walls, to protect it from direct sun and rain without impeding airflow. Just remove all the walls from that shed.
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Jul 13, 2023 10:53
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VictualSquid posted:I feel like that is a case for a roof without walls, to protect it from direct sun and rain without impeding airflow. Replace them with chicken wire to keep the seagulls out?
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Jul 13, 2023 11:22
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VictualSquid posted:I feel like that is a case for a roof without walls, to protect it from direct sun and rain without impeding airflow. If the equipment is on the East or West side of the house, couldn’t the poster just completely rip out the side walls of that shed to allow full cross ventilation. But leave the front and door to protect from morning/evening sun and to allow access of chicken wire is replacing the sidewalls. Also, in regards to heat, isn’t the whole point of a pool heater to dump the majority of the heat into the water cycling through the system? So if it is 85% efficient, then only 15% of the heat is waste heat that is going into the shed. Or am I missing something? CO2 buildup will still be deadly, but heat will not be quite so bad.
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Jul 13, 2023 12:54
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Yeah, the 15% is still 60kbtu. I think the furnace for my house is only 72kbtu.
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Jul 13, 2023 14:23
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I don't know poo poo about pool heaters, is there not some way to vent the exhaust up and out via a pipe so that you could still have all that crap hidden in a shed without asphyxiating yourself?
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Jul 13, 2023 14:27
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Most heaters have a kit to convert from just a grille venting to be able to use a flue. Edit: page 13 https://hayward-pool-assets.com/assets/documents/pools/pdf/manuals/UniversalH-seriesLowNOx-HxxxFDService&Installation.pdf Qwijib0 fucked around with this message at 14:50 on Jul 13, 2023 |
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Jul 13, 2023 14:43
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OK, not sure if this is crappy construction or brilliant construction, but I saw this on Twitter: https://twitter.com/CohenSite/status/1679338265449734145 To me that just looks like a 1/9 hotel pan embedded in the wall. I'm wondering if there's any code issue with just embedding a metal pan in an interior wall like that, or if there's some ludicrously expensive code-compliant device for this purpose.
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Jul 13, 2023 16:04
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There was an unsuccessful Kickstarter for a round one https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1622875428/the-knob-gobbler It may very well be a pan, I'm struggling to think about the code implications for a little inset, they'd be similar to a recess for a toilet paper holder which aren't onerous.
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Jul 13, 2023 16:24
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FISHMANPET posted:OK, not sure if this is crappy construction or brilliant construction, but I saw this on Twitter: That looks like a hotel pan to me too, lol. I think the only code issue would be if it was a dividing or party wall, and then it can still be acceptable if you five side the drywall around it. The only official product I could find it this and just lol at the name. Knob Gobbler
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Jul 13, 2023 16:57
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Looking at the rest of the thread, it appears that specific image is taken from a demo unit that's just built on some piers outside, but it appears to be a replica of an actual unit layout from the larger apartment building. At least in the case of that particular floor plan, that wall is entirely within the unit, so no issues with fire break between units being compromised there.
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Jul 13, 2023 17:46
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The presence of the door to the left would lead me to beleive there is a closet or bathroom behind that wall. Edit, also Twitter is so loving broken can we agree to post screenshots and download pics?
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Jul 13, 2023 17:54
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She'll be coming down with the mountain when she comes She'll be sliding six white houses when she comes
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Jul 13, 2023 20:27
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It’s not a code concern, but if you imagined someone’s hand spanning the recess, and the door swinging open hard, one might incur more injury from the handle than you would from a traditional doorstop setup. Kind of seems like a reach though.
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Jul 13, 2023 21:33
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Wtf, why is the front door opening inward???
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Jul 13, 2023 21:38
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Nenonen posted:Wtf, why is the front door opening inward??? huh? does your front door swing outward? That would put the hinge pins on the outside, people usually consider that a security risk.
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Jul 13, 2023 21:45
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Nenonen posted:Wtf, why is the front door opening inward??? What country do you live in? I've never seen a front door open outwards.
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Jul 13, 2023 21:46
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I've had it explained as weather related. If you get deep snow, your front door should open inward so you're not trapped by a snowbank. If you have high winds, the door opens outward so it doesn't blow open. Hinge pins and security makes sense, i guess. Although if someone had the time to yank the hinge pins out of your front door, they have time to do basically any other entry they might want. Dareon fucked around with this message at 21:51 on Jul 13, 2023 |
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Jul 13, 2023 21:48
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VelociBacon posted:What country do you live in? I've never seen a front door open outwards. I mean, ours do as well? Seems to be about 50-50 here, though outwards-swinging front doors absolutely seem handier since there's more space for them outside than inside.
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Jul 13, 2023 21:49
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My screen door opens outwards but the door behind it opens inwards.
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Jul 13, 2023 21:52
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PurpleXVI posted:I mean, ours do as well? Seems to be about 50-50 here, though outwards-swinging front doors absolutely seem handier since there's more space for them outside than inside. Not sure if you are also Canadian but guessing you're assuming I'm from the states. I don't know if it's a code thing but I live where we get barely any snow and it's front door inwards all day long. I always figured it was a hinge thing as another poster mentioned.
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Jul 13, 2023 21:52
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Oh, no, I'm from Denmark. We thankfully don't get deep snows(any longer, anyway, lmao thank you climate change, for robbing us of one of life's basic joys) nor any particularly gruesome high winds.
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Jul 13, 2023 21:56
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I live in Florida and my door opens outwards, but even if I lived in Canada I'd prefer it that way. I figure I have a lot more time to figure out snow than fire. Motronic will probably explain it to us if we make enough annoyingly wrong guesses. ComradePyro fucked around with this message at 22:10 on Jul 13, 2023 |
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Jul 13, 2023 22:07
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I have an outward swinging door but it also has 2 deadbolts on each side (so 8 total) so that even if you knock off the hinge pins, you still won't be able to pull out the door (I don't actually, but the door to my detached garage actually opens outwards).
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Jul 13, 2023 22:21
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IIRC the Finnish "doors must open outwards" comes from a couple tragedies in something like the 1700s where people in a church panicked and tried to exit all at once, causing a crush at the inwards-opening doors. So it's an evacuation/fire safety thing.
Loezi fucked around with this message at 22:37 on Jul 13, 2023 |
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Jul 13, 2023 22:30
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Loezi posted:IIRC the Finnish "doors must open outwards" comes from a couple tragedies in something like the 1700s where people in a church panicked and tried to exit all at once, causing a crush at the inwards-opening doors. So it's an evacuation/fire safety thing. Thats the same with just about every public place I've been to in both Canada and Freedom land. As a result of fires or whatever kind of people crushing activities. That being said, its perfectly normal here to have a scree door open outwards, while the uhhhh "main" door opens inwards. Presumably in a house fire, there might be a bunch of people trying to get out the same door, but not 400 people behind you crushing you against that poo poo.
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Jul 13, 2023 22:54
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All main commercial doors open outward to assist in evacuation. Doors in individual smaller occupancy rooms of a building (including apartment front doors) largely open inward so they don't obstruct the evacuation route or smack someone walking by right in the face. Similarly residential doors open inward to keep people inside from smacking someone with the door.
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Jul 13, 2023 23:00
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Leperflesh posted:huh? We should probably set up an FAQ about this, given how regularly this gets discussed The Nordic countries typically mandate outwards facing doors since the 1800s, after a number of incidents where dozens of people died in fires or stampedes in churches that had doors that opened inwards. And no, our front doors can't be stolen off the house because the hinges have built-in jamb pins. 
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Jul 13, 2023 23:04
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ComradePyro posted:Motronic will probably explain it to us if we make enough annoyingly wrong guesses. Doors open inward because of the coriolis effect. You’ll find they open outward in places like Australia.
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Jul 13, 2023 23:08
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Doors on commercial businesses open outward because the first major large scale manufacturer of door hinges primarily supplied old west saloons, who stipulated that the louver doors open outward in order to allow for people who they don't like round these parts to be thrown into the horse trough.
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Jul 13, 2023 23:13
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Loezi posted:IIRC the Finnish "doors must open outwards" comes from a couple tragedies in something like the 1700s where people in a church panicked and tried to exit all at once, causing a crush at the inwards-opening doors. So it's an evacuation/fire safety thing. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Hall_disaster Bad Munki posted:Doors open inward because of the coriolis effect. You’ll find they open outward in places like Australia. Door opening direction is largely due to social norms that evolved from the rate of left-handedness. Pulling the door inwards is more natural for lefties, and given the creative tendencies of the sinistral members of humanity, they tend to design more buildings than those of us cursed with dexterity.
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Jul 13, 2023 23:17
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ComradePyro posted:Door opening direction is largely due to social norms that evolved from the rate of left-handedness. Pulling the door inwards is more natural for lefties, and given the creative tendencies of the sinistral members of humanity, they tend to design more buildings than those of us cursed with dexterity. welcome to the leftorium!
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Jul 13, 2023 23:21
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Bad Munki posted:Doors open inward because of the coriolis effect. You’ll find they open outward in places like Australia.
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Jul 14, 2023 02:19
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IBC (most common baseline building code most US jurisdictions use and modify) egress-related requirements for door swing direction don't apply until the expected occupancy is 50 or more people.
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Jul 14, 2023 14:09
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Nenonen posted:Wtf, why is the front door opening inward??? America is a great satan, and not in the good way (either word). They literally cannot fathom of real door hinges so they've deluded themselves into thinking using lovely indoor door hinges on the front door is normal and therefore the door must swing inward to avoid popping the pins. The real reason is that cops and all the fake cops want to be able to enter your home easily to kill you and your entire family. e: They also love using locks that can be picked, zipped, zipped, bumped, raked, combed, impressioned, and/or straight-up bypassed. ee: If someone actually needs to break a door down (i.e. firefighters or ambulancefighters), any door opening inwards will kill you because you're lying right there unconscious so they can't get in. 3D Megadoodoo fucked around with this message at 14:45 on Jul 14, 2023 |
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Jul 14, 2023 14:40
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oh they'll get in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nz1NJ3fhso0&t=80s
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Jul 14, 2023 14:52
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3D Megadoodoo posted:ee: If someone actually needs to break a door down (i.e. firefighters or ambulancefighters), any door opening inwards will kill you because you're lying right there unconscious so they can't get in. Your Finnishness is showing. Here in  our houses are bigger than just the entryway behind the door. Many of them even have separate rooms and it's very likely that we would never step foot inside the entryway as when we need to exit we just have our manservant Enrique carry us over the threshold. It's all irrelevant though because what would actually happen is it would be the cops breaking the door down and they'd shoot the person inside, which conveniently means the ambulancefighters don't have to bother taking us to the doctorfighters and everyone wins.
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Jul 14, 2023 19:10
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FISHMANPET posted:OK, not sure if this is crappy construction or brilliant construction, but I saw this on Twitter: StormDrain posted:That looks like a hotel pan to me too, lol. I think the only code issue would be if it was a dividing or party wall, and then it can still be acceptable if you five side the drywall around it. This one of you guys? https://twitter.com/fishmanpet/status/1679478067826130944 Jasper Tin Neck posted:We should probably set up an FAQ about this, given how regularly this gets discussed That's pretty neat.
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Jul 14, 2023 20:59
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