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Nelson Mandingo posted:Got any advice for someone who's got a new player who is going to be playing a melee rogue? Delaying your turn until after a melee teammate often lets you just move to a flanking position and get in 2 sneak attacks. As opposed to wasting actions doing Twin Feints and Tumble Throughs or whatever to try and "OFF GUARD" the enemy by yourself. edit: added the quote because top of the page shame
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Jul 12, 2023 17:39
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If you have a wizard in the group, you can try to get them to cast synchronize steps on you and another melee. That way you both can take reactions to move to set up flanking for sneak attacks.
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Jul 12, 2023 17:42
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gurragadon posted:If you have a wizard in the group, you can try to get them to cast synchronize steps on you and another melee. That way you both can take reactions to move to set up flanking for sneak attacks. This poo poo is wild, thanks. Thanks for great advice everyone.
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Jul 12, 2023 18:08
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This is a pretty good video about how Stealth functions in Pathfinder 2e and helped me break through a couple of conceptual walls, hth: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJ9M89CQM08
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Jul 12, 2023 20:09
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Does anyone have a good tl;dr for the strengths weaknesses of spell traditions (Arcane, Primal, Occult, Divine)? I have a player looking to play a Witch and they're trying to decide which Patron to take.
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Jul 13, 2023 16:22
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The Slack Lagoon posted:Does anyone have a good tl;dr for the strengths weaknesses of spell traditions (Arcane, Primal, Occult, Divine)? I have a player looking to play a Witch and they're trying to decide which Patron to take. https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_RPG/comments/ir6tki/comment/g4wumx7/ TL;DR Arcane: Matter and Mind Occult: Spirit and Mind Divine: Spirit and Life Primal: Matter and Life
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Jul 13, 2023 16:37
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The Slack Lagoon posted:Does anyone have a good tl;dr for the strengths weaknesses of spell traditions (Arcane, Primal, Occult, Divine)? I have a player looking to play a Witch and they're trying to decide which Patron to take. Primal: Strong elemental blasting; decent healing and support. Not many good options for targeting will saves, and fort options are poison heavy. Good for a Nature Witch. Occult: Solid buffs and support, and some of the best control options in the game. Tons of great will targeting options. Illusions/charms/enchantment type stuff lives here. Probably your most 'classic' witch spells are going to be here. Direct damage and blasting are very lacking. Divine: Best buffs/heals/support, but struggles mightily with direct damage unless you have alignment options to play with. Will become much stronger in the remaster once alignment based spells all get reworked, but for now, if you want the Divine list, you probably know you want the divine list. Divine witch does introduce some cool flavor stuff though. Arcane: The best defense is a good offense, which is good, because this is the only list with absolutely no healing options. Defense and support in general is a weakness of this list, but it has some of the best utility spells (especially out of combat utility), and of course, the absolute creme de la creme of offense and blasting all lives within the Arcane tradition. It's your classic wizard list, with all that that entails.
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Jul 13, 2023 16:37
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Didn't they admit that they never finished the witch because something happened to the designer and it was shipped underbaked? I think it is the weakest caster in a system that is full of well-balanced casters that aren't overpowered like those you find in other games. It is probably going to feel especially bad as an introduction to pf2e from 5ed. If the player is completely new and doesn't have caster-supremacy baggage from D&D, you'll probably be fine. Otherwise, sorcerer is just so much better. Witch is supposed to be getting fixed in November.
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Jul 13, 2023 16:52
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The Slack Lagoon posted:Does anyone have a good tl;dr for the strengths weaknesses of spell traditions (Arcane, Primal, Occult, Divine)? I have a player looking to play a Witch and they're trying to decide which Patron to take. Pathfinder is a teamwork focused game so it depends on what the other characters are as well.
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Jul 13, 2023 17:11
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Mechayahiko posted:Pathfinder is a teamwork focused game so it depends on what the other characters are as well. So far a Druid, Rogue, Barbarian, Witch, and possibly 1 TBD
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Jul 13, 2023 17:25
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The problem with the Witch is that it's basically a worse version of a different casting class, because it doesn't get much in the way of class features aside from generic prepared spellcasting. This is most obvious when you compare an arcane Witch to a Wizard; you're effectively locked into the Improved Familiar Attunement Arcane Thesis, you lose the extra spell slot per level from your school, and you get Phase Familiar instead of a spell school focus spell. Are Discern Secrets and an extra starting skill really worth all that? With a primal or divine Witch the comparison is less direct, but you're still clearly worse than a Cleric or Druid. In particular, you still have to learn spells individually like a Wizard instead of knowing all the common divine or primal spells automatically, and Intelligence is less useful than Wisdom in PF2. If you're a occult Witch...well, the Bard gets better class-specific cantrips than you, more HP, better (though still not very good) weapons and armor, and doesn't have to predict which spells he'll need in advance. He normally has to learn heightened versions of spells separately, but this is partially mitigated by signature spells.
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Jul 13, 2023 17:28
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As a Witch player, yes, they're definitely weaker than most other caster classes, but in PF2e that still means you get to hold you own to be fair. Looking forward to the way they're reworked with the Remaster though.
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Jul 13, 2023 17:49
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The Slack Lagoon posted:So far a Druid, Rogue, Barbarian, Witch, and possibly 1 TBD Hopefully the TBD doesn't choose Bard because those two classes can overlap hard and the Bard comes out superior. The problem with Witch is they balanced the class as if the familiar abilities are worth the power nerf of the other aspects when familiars suck actually so it's just a nerf for no reason. Hopefully they fix that in the remaster, preferably by moving away from familiar garbage(they won't they're going to tweak familiars to make them "better" but I just don't think that's possible).
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Jul 13, 2023 18:01
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Epi Lepi posted:Hopefully the TBD doesn't choose Bard because those two classes can overlap hard and the Bard comes out superior. The familiar is a big part of the flavor though. They aren't going to get rid of that. Some players really really like having a pet.
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Jul 13, 2023 18:08
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Facebook Aunt posted:The familiar is a big part of the flavor though. They aren't going to get rid of that. Some players really really like having a pet. This is why the player wants Witch over Wizard.
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Jul 13, 2023 18:18
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Facebook Aunt posted:The familiar is a big part of the flavor though. They aren't going to get rid of that. Some players really really like having a pet. my witch player is greatly amused by how the class lets them recover their familiar every day so they use it as a trapfinding device in the abomination vaults. "this is the source of your power? what do you do with it?" "Get it blown up once every 24h"
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Jul 13, 2023 18:23
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They seem to be moving towards more emphasis on familiars in the Remaster, though some people on the Paizo forums don't like that very much and feel they should make hexes more powerful instead.
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Jul 13, 2023 18:24
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Hexes are definitely more flavorful, yeah.
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Jul 13, 2023 18:32
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Facebook Aunt posted:The familiar is a big part of the flavor though. They aren't going to get rid of that. Some players really really like having a pet. Yeah sure but the familiars don't really do a whole lot. Paizo needs to either really bump up the usefulness of familiars or acknowledge that Hexes should be more effective.
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Jul 13, 2023 18:50
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Honestly, the upcoming "recover all focus points as one downtime action" change should make hexes a lot better by itself, and opens up feat choices you'd otherwise spend on recovering more focus points on more interesting things. Focusing on making familiars good as more than a flavor thing is definitely what they should focus on, because that's the part that needs the help getting to a good baseline after the upcoming system changes.
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Jul 13, 2023 19:11
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You still won't be able to recover all your focus points with a single 10 minute refocus without a feat, you'll just be able to recover more than one in between encounters without those feats.
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Jul 13, 2023 19:32
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Hellioning posted:You still won't be able to recover all your focus points with a single 10 minute refocus without a feat, you'll just be able to recover more than one in between encounters without those feats. Oh, misremembered the proposed change. Still, I think my point stands. Hexes need some buffs for the worst options and some system-level changes, and familiars need some actual dev attention to be a part of the class that's worth mentioning.
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Jul 13, 2023 19:51
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Alright, so stupid question, but is a character supposed to get all of their class features as they level up? I've been assuming they do but I'm seeing some things that are worded like they don't. Like Oracles have Light Armor Expertise, Lightning Reflexes, and Weapon Specialization all at level 13; is the idea that the player has to choose one of these things? Because one of the Oracle's curse specializations has the phrase "At 13th level, if you gain the lightning reflexes class feature...", unless that's a clause meant for characters who pick up a curse via Oracle Dedication.
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Jul 14, 2023 05:57
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Scrap Dragon posted:Alright, so stupid question, but is a character supposed to get all of their class features as they level up? I've been assuming they do but I'm seeing some things that are worded like they don't. Like Oracles have Light Armor Expertise, Lightning Reflexes, and Weapon Specialization all at level 13; is the idea that the player has to choose one of these things? Because one of the Oracle's curse specializations has the phrase "At 13th level, if you gain the lightning reflexes class feature...", unless that's a clause meant for characters who pick up a curse via Oracle Dedication. You automatically gain anything that's a class feature. However you only get a certain amount of class feats.
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Jul 14, 2023 06:16
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Scrap Dragon posted:Alright, so stupid question, but is a character supposed to get all of their class features as they level up? I've been assuming they do but I'm seeing some things that are worded like they don't. Like Oracles have Light Armor Expertise, Lightning Reflexes, and Weapon Specialization all at level 13; is the idea that the player has to choose one of these things? Because one of the Oracle's curse specializations has the phrase "At 13th level, if you gain the lightning reflexes class feature...", unless that's a clause meant for characters who pick up a curse via Oracle Dedication. It's always going to happen, but it's leaving room for if a future class archetype trades it away.
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Jul 14, 2023 08:01
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Scrap Dragon posted:unless that's a clause meant for characters who pick up a curse via Oracle Dedication. looking at this again, I think this is exactly it. If you pick Oracle as an archetype you get to pick a Mystery, and the Mystery of Flames contains this wording: quote:At 13th level, if you gain the lightning reflexes class feature, your proficiency rank for Reflex saves increases to master, and when you roll a success on a Reflex save, you get a critical success instead. That's quite a lot to just give away on an archetype so they want to make sure you have the actual class.
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Jul 14, 2023 08:13
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Or lightning reflexes from another class.
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Jul 14, 2023 13:14
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It’s a roundabout way of giving Evasion only to people who didn’t already have Evasion. If you gain Lightning Reflexes, that means your Reflex saves started at Trained, and you aren’t going to gain Evasion/Master Reflex saves. Basically what the mystery is saying is “if you wouldn’t normally get this, you can get it,” and, perhaps just as importantly, “if you would normally get this at a later level, you can’t use this archetype to get it early” (for example, Alchemists don’t pick up Evasion until level 15. But since they start at Expert, they never have lightning reflexes. So an Oracle archetype isn’t helpful here.) Chevy Slyme fucked around with this message at 14:16 on Jul 14, 2023 |
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Jul 14, 2023 14:11
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Lamuella posted:looking at this again, I think this is exactly it. If you pick Oracle as an archetype you get to pick a Mystery, and the Mystery of Flames contains this wording: You cannot get the Mystery Benefit from the archetype. For good reason - imagine if you could get the Cosmos benefit via archetyping, for instance.
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Jul 14, 2023 15:48
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Cyouni posted:It's always going to happen, but it's leaving room for if a future class archetype trades it away. That's not how archetypes work in this edition though. It could be future proofing in case they introduce subclasses or a feat that gives up your class feature, or it could be a remnant from early in design where they were considering keeping the 1e version of archetypes. I thought it might be related to the dual-classed characters variant rule, but my reading of how they explain overlapping features suggests that the an Oracle would still gain Lightning Reflexes at level 13 even if they had that level of reflex save from an earlier level from another class, it just wouldn't do anything. They reference gaining Alertness as a Cleric/Ranger, for example. My best guess is that they just wanted to leave open the design space for sacrificing class features without it breaking progression on skills, or in case they open some way for you to get mystery benefits through other sources.
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Jul 14, 2023 19:15
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Taciturn Tactician posted:That's not how archetypes work in this edition though. It could be future proofing in case they introduce subclasses or a feat that gives up your class feature, or it could be a remnant from early in design where they were considering keeping the 1e version of archetypes. Note that I specified class archetype, aka the 1e version. quote:Archetypes with the class trait are a fundamental divergence from your class's specialties, but one that exists within the context of your class. You can select a class archetype only if your class meets the criteria listed in the archetype's prerequisites. Class archetypes always alter or replace some of a class's static class features, in addition to any new feats they offer. It may be possible to take a class archetype at 1st level if it alters or replaces some of the class's initial class features. In that case, you must take that archetype's dedication feat at 2nd level, and after that you proceed normally. You can never have more than one class archetype. Note that it has the potential to alter/replace static class features, like say...Lightning Reflexes.
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Jul 14, 2023 19:17
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Cyouni posted:Note that I specified class archetype, aka the 1e version. Huh, I didn't actually know that was in the description for class archtypes, since the existing ones are more about altering than actually just removing features as a cost. My bad!
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Jul 14, 2023 19:22
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Taciturn Tactician posted:Huh, I didn't actually know that was in the description for class archtypes, since the existing ones are more about altering than actually just removing features as a cost. My bad! Not really your bad. 1e rules are rarely relevant to discussions about 2e, especially in this case where archetypes are already their own thing in 2e.
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Jul 14, 2023 19:49
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How do people like the Battlezoo Bestiary monster crafting? And more importantly does the Foundry module work reasonably well?
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Jul 14, 2023 22:04
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Taciturn Tactician posted:Huh, I didn't actually know that was in the description for class archtypes, since the existing ones are more about altering than actually just removing features as a cost. My bad! It's hard to blame someone for not knowing all of class archetype details when after four years, we have five of them. Four of which are really just casting alterations, and one of which is Spellshot. (The one where it's sole distinguishing factor from another Way is that it changes class DC to Int and makes you take the Dedication.)
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Jul 14, 2023 23:16
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So it looks like Nonat1's put out a short, for him, video on the Kineticist. This time it was on the first level Impulse feats for Wood and Metal as those two elements weren't in the Kineticist playtest. Still probably most of a week or so until he does the full deep dive on the class, but at that point Subscribers should probably have their PDFs. Here is the video if anyone wants to check it out. While I was looking forward to a Fire Kineticist based off usually liking pyro builds and what I had heard about their junctions I am also really curious about a Conrasu Wood Element Kineticist. Have a feat to create a tree. A feat to create an apple or nut that provides some healing that scales 1d4+5 every other level, would have expected 1d4+1 as that is the base amount. A feat to create medium armor and shield, metal has something similar but their shield is hardier but also shatters on a crit, that scales off your best armor proficiency. A 2 action overflow feat, so potentially usable every round, to deal 1d4 piercing and bleed damage in a cone, that scales both damage types by 1d4 every other level. So 10d4 piercing and 10d4 bleed at 19th level. With a Basic Reflex save. It sounds like a crit fail would probably also double the bleed damage. EDIT: Oh. Uh I thought PDFs were going out on the 17th for Rage of Elements. But uh saw people on Reddit mentioning already having it, and I just checked my digital downloads and I guess I know what I am doing for the rest of the night. Ryuujin fucked around with this message at 06:40 on Jul 15, 2023 |
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Jul 15, 2023 06:38
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I recall they fire off your PDF when it ships, if you have that going. For anyone who doesn't have a subscription, it's the 17th.
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Jul 15, 2023 07:12
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Yeah I thought the 17th was when it was going to ship for the Subscription, and that the waves of PDFs would start then, but I may have been mistaken. Not going to complain about having it now instead of the 17th or later. Might complain about not being able to immediately build one in Pathbuilder.
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Jul 15, 2023 07:54
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Ryuujin posted:Yeah I thought the 17th was when it was going to ship for the Subscription, and that the waves of PDFs would start then, but I may have been mistaken. Not going to complain about having it now instead of the 17th or later. They fired off shipments for Rage a few days early because Gencon is Coming etc etc
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Jul 15, 2023 11:40
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Mine isn't in my download yet 
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Jul 15, 2023 11:45
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