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I got an ancient 113 a few years back, you can't quite get a riving knife on those, you can get a splitter that attaches to the back near the rear trunion and tilts with the blade, but it won't move up and down with it. You can also get some microjig splitters and attach them to a zero clearance insert if you don't mind being limited to 90 degree cuts, that's what I did. I actually ended up buying an insert from leecraft rather than making one because the shape of the throatplate is a little fiddly, you may have more talent or time than I and not need to do that. Otherwise sounds reasonable, idk about fences because mine is tolerable. Edit: the start capacitor on mine died. You could buy one and keep a spare around so you don't have to put a project on hold waiting for shipping, but you're just as likely to never need it.
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Jul 10, 2023 07:40
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That might be one of 113 models that uses 8” blade. I think Frued still makes a couple 8” blades but they kinda hard to find. I gave up restoring one, it tilt had issues as well. The rack and pinon fence tends to have slop on far end. Link belts are a nice cheap upgrade you can do.
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Jul 10, 2023 18:38
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Putting some Natural Danish Oil on a chair I made for the shop out of construction lumber. Really confirming my fear that I just really do not like the look of naked pine. There's basically no color in this, but it's darkening the grain enough still that it's just screaming at me "HELLO I AM PINE"
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Jul 10, 2023 23:35
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It will darken further as it ages but it will still be pretty light. Personally I don't mind the lightness of pine but I get it, I think a lot of people associate the color with the exposed studs in their basement or something and it just seems to exude a feeling of "cheapness." Don't stain it walnut dark it will look even worse  To me, it helps a lot to work the wood to make it no longer look like it was made from 2x4s. The roundness of the edges is pretty specific to the eye and if you just square off some stuff or chamfer it differently the piece you make will look much improved.
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Jul 10, 2023 23:49
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Shou sugi ban is the best way to make pine not look like pine... It's also a great way to make it twist like a pretzel.
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Jul 11, 2023 03:32
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I went down the rabbithole a few years ago trying to figure out how to turn new but high grade/tight grained yellow pine into old heart pine and failed miserably, lol. I tried all the things that *should* change the color consistently to look more like old heart pine and nothing really worked. I had high hopes for the chemical oxidizers-potassium bichromate, lye, potassium permanganate-and while they all did something, none of them got that really nice warm pumpkin brown earlywood with the dark reddish latewood. I could either get the right color in the earlywood or the latewood, but never both at the same time. And then my lumberyard quit carrying rough sawn 8/4 C grade SYP 2x12’s so I quit caring. The thing I have had the best luck with was alchohol-soluble dyes. They seem to take a bit better on the hard part of the growth rings better than water-soluble. A tinted film-forming topcoat also helps. It sits on top of the wood and avoids the different stain penetration in the early/latewood. Those will get you new pine that looks old, but it won’t get you new pine that looks like old pine.
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Jul 11, 2023 04:09
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deimos posted:Shou sugi ban is the best way to make pine not look like pine... It's also a great way to make it twist like a pretzel. If woodworking Facebook is to be believed, it's how you get away with charging $200 for a thin blue line flag made out of 2x4.
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Jul 11, 2023 04:28
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more falafel please posted:If woodworking Facebook is to be believed, it's how you get away with charging $200 for a thin blue line flag made out of 2x4. BRB gonna go pay for a new bandsaw by ripping off bootlickers.
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Jul 11, 2023 06:22
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I have a Dewalt 10" 7491 jobsite saw. I'm kind of long term wish-list planning on a dado set and there seems to be a big price difference between the diablo 8" stack and the Freud 10" stack. The max depth of cut on that saw is 3 1/8" with a 10" blade, so I'm figuring the max depth of cut with an 8" blade should be 2 1/8" which is a lot deeper dado or rabbet than I ever plan to cut. That being said, is there any reason I couldn't use an 8" dado stack or even just an 8" blade on a 10" saw?
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Jul 12, 2023 02:59
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Skunkduster posted:I have a Dewalt 10" 7491 jobsite saw. I'm kind of long term wish-list planning on a dado set and there seems to be a big price difference between the diablo 8" stack and the Freud 10" stack. The max depth of cut on that saw is 3 1/8" with a 10" blade, so I'm figuring the max depth of cut with an 8" blade should be 2 1/8" which is a lot deeper dado or rabbet than I ever plan to cut. That being said, is there any reason I couldn't use an 8" dado stack or even just an 8" blade on a 10" saw? Nope. I use an 8" dado on my 10" saw, like you I don't think I'd ever cut a dado 2 1/8" deep. You can also use a smaller blade on your saw, it has a thinner kerf, but likely won't be as stiff and clean cutting as a larger blade. I see people use smaller blade when cutting inlay banding or other strips where you don't want to lose too much wood to the kerf. You would need to put in a thinner splitter or riving knife, or remove it if you were using a smaller blade, so that's a good reason not to use one all the time if you had to remove your riving knife.
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Jul 12, 2023 03:04
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Skunkduster posted:I have a Dewalt 10" 7491 jobsite saw. I'm kind of long term wish-list planning on a dado set and there seems to be a big price difference between the diablo 8" stack and the Freud 10" stack. The max depth of cut on that saw is 3 1/8" with a 10" blade, so I'm figuring the max depth of cut with an 8" blade should be 2 1/8" which is a lot deeper dado or rabbet than I ever plan to cut. That being said, is there any reason I couldn't use an 8" dado stack or even just an 8" blade on a 10" saw? If/when I get another set to cover me while one is being sharpened, I'll probably spend some money and get a 10" set. Literally in 14 years of doing this full time I have never needed anything but an 8" and have always used the diablo ones from HD. It does tend to blow out the back of the cut slightly if you crosscut with it, but a better zero clearance setup on my crosscut sled would probably fix that. I imagine a 10" 32T one would be better in that fairly minor regard.
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Jul 12, 2023 03:18
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Kaiser Schnitzel posted:I have the Diablo 8" one from Home Depot that I use in my 10" saw and its good. After 5 years and alot of tenoning, it probably finally needs sharpening. Tbf, I've never heard of 10" dado pack until today, but that would have to be serious. But, if you go that route and the outer blades are "just blades", you could even upgrade them for less tearout to 40, 60, heck who knows.
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Jul 12, 2023 03:24
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Mr. Mambold posted:Tbf, I've never heard of 10" dado pack until today, but that would have to be serious. But, if you go that route and the outer blades are "just blades", you could even upgrade them for less tearout to 40, 60, heck who knows. I wanna see a 60" dado stack
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Jul 12, 2023 04:08
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I'm thinking about the mechanics and if I'm not badly mistaken, a smaller diameter blade has a lower effective cutting speed (the speed of the blade's teeth as they meet the wood is a function of the RPMs times the distance from the center), but also there is less leverage/mechanical advantage applied by the work piece which means it is less likely to bog down or stop when pinched, or to put it another way I think you have more cutting power or torque. I think for a dado pack both a slower cutting speed and a higher amount of power to cut through the wood is good because you're cutting a lot more wood at once.
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Jul 12, 2023 04:44
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I have a 6" dado stack I bought for my 7491 and used twice before upgrading to a Sawstop if you want to buy it off me 
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Jul 12, 2023 05:17
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Leperflesh posted:I'm thinking about the mechanics and if I'm not badly mistaken, a smaller diameter blade has a lower effective cutting speed (the speed of the blade's teeth as they meet the wood is a function of the RPMs times the distance from the center), but also there is less leverage/mechanical advantage applied by the work piece which means it is less likely to bog down or stop when pinched, or to put it another way I think you have more cutting power or torque. I think for a dado pack both a slower cutting speed and a higher amount of power to cut through the wood is good because you're cutting a lot more wood at once. I found with regular blades, that the smaller the blade; i.e. radius, the more torque and efficient cutting power. So ripping 8/4 hardwood for example, the smaller blade with fewer teeth was always easier; less work on the motor. A 24 tooth 8" diablo blade all day vs. a 10" 40 or 60 tooth any brand. Especially with an underpowered saw. RPM's is constant, obviously. So, I think your last sentence is right, but for the wrong reason. You have more teeth cutting, but with less power and less wood at once, therefore a cleaner cut. Which is what you want with a dado, but not straight ripping.
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Jul 12, 2023 17:12
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Leperflesh posted:I'm thinking about the mechanics and if I'm not badly mistaken, a smaller diameter blade has a lower effective cutting speed (the speed of the blade's teeth as they meet the wood is a function of the RPMs times the distance from the center), but also there is less leverage/mechanical advantage applied by the work piece which means it is less likely to bog down or stop when pinched, or to put it another way I think you have more cutting power or torque. I think for a dado pack both a slower cutting speed and a higher amount of power to cut through the wood is good because you're cutting a lot more wood at once. OTOH, the 8” blade only has 12 teeth with ~2” between teeth and the 10” has 32teeth with ~.9” between teeth, plus the larger blade has a faster rim speed so it is going to have more tooth strikes per inch and a much smaller chip load. BUT the chippers still only have 2 teeth on each, which makes things more complicated! So if we do the math, assuming the arbor spins at 5000rpm, the rim speed of the 8” (25.12” circumference) is 125,600 inches per minute or 174 feet per second. That’s a good speed-generally between 160-230fps is fine. Now we figure out the number of tooth strikes per minute-12 teethx6000 rpm-72,000 strikes per minute. The 10” (31.4” circumference) has a rim speed of 157,000 ipm, 218 Ft/s, also good. 160,000 tooth strikes per second. For both, the chipper teeth are striking 10,000 times per second. Okay so what does that mean? Well, when we assume a feed rate we can figure out the chip load per tooth. Let’s assume a 25’ feet per minute feed rate (300 inches per minute) so we divide that feed rate in inches by the number of tooth/knife strikes per minute, to get the chip load per tooth. For the 8”-.004” for the 10”-.0018”-less than half the chip load, but the chip load for the chippers is the same for each-.03” So what does that mean? The 10” is going to make a much cleaner cut with its 32t blade than the 12t blade of the 8”, but the chipper cut quality is probably going to be about the same, slightly better on the 10” because a larger diameter cutter has a shallower angle of attack on the wood and makes a nicer cut. But most of the load is being generated by the chippers and the 10” blade theoretically has ??? (25%? Maybe this isn’t a direct relationship but rather exponential? I’m not a math guy) less torque at the rim than the 8” blade. That should only matter if your saw is underpowered for the cut, and you should be able to compensate with a slower feed rate. If you have a 5hp saw you can probably feed at the same speed with either size dado, with a 1.5hp saw I’d imagine you’d need to take it a hair slower with the 10” dado stack on a deep/wide cut. That same math is also how you figure out appropriate spindle and feed speeds for a shaper or router or jointer or whatever. For spindle speeds: we know we want around ~160-230ish FPS (115,200-165,000inches per minute) rim speed, so divide that by the circumference of the cutter (pi x diameter). A 5” diameter cutter has a circumference of 15.7”, so the spindle speed should be between ~7300 and 10,500rpm. Router bits have a bit wider range of rim speeds and it’s easiest to just look at a chart. I don’t exactly understand why X rim speed is good for X diameter, but IIRC it’s because larger diameter cutterheads have a shallower angle of attack on the wood and therefore don’t need to be moving as fast. For feed speed: Usually you want around 20-40 knife marks per inch for a nice finish, so find the number of cuts per minute (rpm X number of flutes or teeth) and divide that by knife marks per inch to get feed speed in inches per minute. So a 4 knife jointer cutterhead at 5k rpm is 20K knife strikes per minute and we want 25 per inch so that’s 800 inches per minute or 13 inches per second or 7 seconds for an 8’ board. Seem really fast? That’s because it is. With things with multiple knives/cutter heads like jointers, planers, shapers, and even larger diameter router bits, it’s best to assume that the knives are not all exactly the same height and that only 1 knife is leaving a mark (but still count all the knives when considering chip load). So then we get a pretty simple feed speed in inches per minute is rpm/desired knife marks per inch, or 200 inches per minute (5000rpm/25 knife marks per inch). Which means run an 8’ board in 30 seconds. Which seems a little slow to me. These are guidelines  Basically adjust your feed speed until you get a good finish that isn’t rough or glazed or burned. Tl;dr: I don’t even know, 8” dado stacks are fine?!
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Jul 12, 2023 17:14
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Mr. Mambold posted:I found with regular blades, that the smaller the blade; i.e. radius, the more torque and efficient cutting power. So ripping 8/4 hardwood for example, the smaller blade with fewer teeth was always easier; less work on the motor. A 24 tooth 8" diablo blade all day vs. a 10" 40 or 60 tooth any brand. Especially with an underpowered saw. RPM's is constant, obviously. So, I think your last sentence is right, but for the wrong reason. You have more teeth cutting, but with less power and less wood at once, therefore a cleaner cut. Which is what you want with a dado, but not straight ripping.
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Jul 12, 2023 17:20
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I am getting into turning a bit, what's a decent set of hss and/or carbide tools? I want at least my own rough and spindle gouge.
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Jul 12, 2023 18:04
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The surface speed discussion got me curious, so I did a quick comparison of a few 10" and 12" saws on Grizzly as well as some 8 1/4" saws from Home Depot. Looks like the 8 1/4 saws run at 5800rpm, the 10" saws at 4000-4200rpm, and the 12s at 3600-4000rpm, so it does seem that the manufacturers compensate for surface speed by using slower RPM for larger blades.
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Jul 12, 2023 18:59
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That makes a lot of sense. If you feed a board through the saw too slowly you can get scorching, and "too slowly" would be a pretty ridiculously fast feed rate if you had a 12 inch saw running at 5800 rpm.
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Jul 12, 2023 19:12
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Kaiser Schnitzel posted:But most of the load is being generated by the chippers and the 10” blade theoretically has ??? (25%? Maybe this isn’t a direct relationship but rather exponential? I’m not a math guy) less torque at the rim than the 8” blade. That should only matter if your saw is underpowered for the cut, and you should be able to compensate with a slower feed rate. If you have a 5hp saw you can probably feed at the same speed with either size dado, with a 1.5hp saw I’d imagine you’d need to take it a hair slower with the 10” dado stack on a deep/wide cut. Strictly speaking the 10" blade experiences more torque than the 8" but in the sense that the force is against the spin of the blade, ie the wood's advantage against the motor. Much like trying to pull on a stuck nut with a bigger wrench, the bigger the radius of the blade, the more the wood fights back against the motor.
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Jul 12, 2023 21:28
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Kaiser Schnitzel posted:The grind of the teeth has a ton to do with this too. 24 tooth blades are usually ground for ripping, while 60 tooth are usually ground for cross-cutting. Fewer teeth also means a larger gullet to clear the larger chip and and the attack angle is usually much more raked on a coarser rip blade. Crosscut teeth are usually almost perpindicular to the circumference of the blade whereas rip teeth are usually angled forward. Smaller diameter blades are also usually thinner and so make a smaller cut and remove less wood, therefore requiring less power. The set, yes, absolutely. Kaiser Schnitzel posted:OTOH, the 8” blade only has 12 teeth with ~2” between teeth and the 10” has 32teeth with ~.9” between teeth, plus the larger blade has a faster rim speed so it is going to have more tooth strikes per inch and a much smaller chip load. BUT the chippers still only have 2 teeth on each, which makes things more complicated! lol 
Mr. Mambold fucked around with this message at 22:30 on Jul 12, 2023 |
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Jul 12, 2023 22:28
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Kaiser Schnitzel posted:OTOH, the 8” blade only has 12 teeth with ~2” between teeth and the 10” has 32teeth with ~.9” between teeth, plus the larger blade has a faster rim speed so it is going to have more tooth strikes per inch and a much smaller chip load. BUT the chippers still only have 2 teeth on each, which makes things more complicated! Is this too long for the thread title?
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Jul 12, 2023 23:30
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Meow Meow Meow posted:Is this too long for the thread title? I had an extra shot in my iced coffee this morning 
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Jul 12, 2023 23:35
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Kaiser Schnitzel posted:Lol. I sure hope you never discover the coffee thread if it’s that easy to get you going. It’s good coffee math at least.
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Jul 13, 2023 02:14
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deimos posted:I am getting into turning a bit, what's a decent set of hss and/or carbide tools? I want at least my own rough and spindle gouge. Do you already have a bench grinder/good way to sharpen quickly? If yes, I would get real HSS tools. If no, carbide may be a better option. I have no personal experience with carbide inserts so I can’t speak to them, but most any of the English brands make good tools. Robert Sorby stuff is nice, the Crown Tools PM line is great too and sharpens really quickly. Cheap stuff on Amazon is probably fine if it’s HSS-good steel is pretty cheap these days. My buddy has some ‘Benjamin’s Best’ tools that were fairly expensive from somewhere and they are fine. It’s much more about how you use and sharpen them than about the tool itself, at least in my experience with spindle turning. Bowl turning may be more demanding on tools, but I’ve never really done it.
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Jul 13, 2023 02:23
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I don't know that I've seen it posted here, but this is great: https://www.opticutter.com/cut-list-optimizer Doing a few shop cabinets and it saved me a full sheet of plywood vs. my guestimating.
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Jul 15, 2023 19:43
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Does anyone have a recommendation for a good-quality budget table saw fence? The original fence that came with this 1950s craftsman 113 is toast. I see a number of aftermarket replacements starting at $250 for the delta T3. Is that the floor price I can expect for something of reasonable quality?
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Jul 16, 2023 04:53
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That's lower price than the cheaper shop fox fence I think.
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Jul 16, 2023 06:20
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HolHorsejob posted:Does anyone have a recommendation for a good-quality budget table saw fence? The original fence that came with this 1950s craftsman 113 is toast. You might find something cheaper used on eBay. Any kind of Biesemeyer style fence is pretty universal and there isn’t too much that can go wrong with them.
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Jul 16, 2023 15:17
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Quick question. We got an old piece of wooden furniture. It's got drawers, but the drawers aren't on modern metal sliders or rollers - just wooden boxes that are held in place by and slide out over wooden rails. They're a little bit sticky. I want to lube them so they slide more easily. I have beeswax and mineral oil. I have read that wax works but I'm a little bit reluctant and hope that it doesn't gunk up over time. Should I just put wax under the drawers or is there a better way?
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Jul 17, 2023 19:34
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Rub a candle on the runners, repeat as necessary
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Jul 17, 2023 22:11
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Rapulum_Dei posted:Rub a candle on the runners, repeat as necessary Or the chunk of beeswax which he said he has.
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Jul 17, 2023 22:24
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Sometimes, I will find pieces of manufactured wood used as packing material. It is extremely flat and dense like MDF, but uses a much finer sawdust for a very smooth surface. Anybody know what the name of this "wood" is?
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Jul 17, 2023 23:31
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Masonite/hardboard?
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Jul 17, 2023 23:37
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Lord Stimperor posted:Quick question. The beeswax is completely fine to use yeah
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Jul 17, 2023 23:39
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Beeswax worked! Unfortunately I woke my wife rattling all the drawers. What's the fix for that?
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Jul 18, 2023 00:02
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Lord Stimperor posted:Beeswax worked! Unfortunately I woke my wife rattling all the drawers. What's the fix for that? Whisky.
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Jul 18, 2023 00:02
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Lord Stimperor posted:Beeswax worked! Unfortunately I woke my wife rattling all the drawers. What's the fix for that? Hire a poltergeist to deflect blame.
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Jul 18, 2023 00:43
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