|
In Ascension, Sleepers need to be propagandized because they passively make you win or lose with their thoughts alone. In Awakening, Sleepers need to be educated and moved to action.
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 02:41
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 21:00 |
|
|
neonchameleon posted:So in your reading not cops but community based vigilantes and violent Citizen's Councils? More of a Freelance Police, if you will.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 13:16
|
|
|
Lord_Hambrose posted:More of a Freelance Police, if you will. Basically squadrismo.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 14:29
|
|
|
Was it Ascension or Awakened that had "technology was actually magic and the technomages are the baddies"? That's all I remember from the core book I found for $5 at a used book store.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:12
|
|
|
Randalor posted:Was it Ascension or Awakened that had "technology was actually magic and the technomages are the baddies"? That's all I remember from the core book I found for $5 at a used book store. That's ascension. Though technomages can be good if they're into discredited science, ether and perpetual motion and so on.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:15
|
|
|
Ascension is the reality war version where technology is just the dominant magick of the setting. In the more "innocent" times of the 90s playing the guy saying "Vaccines are full of mind control nanites, I can heal you with these crystals" was ok. Its when that opinion went mainstream it starts to look dodgy.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:18
|
|
|
technocracy did nothing wrong
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:23
|
|
|
The Technocracy is an evil, anti-science organization and people really need to lay off siding with fascists in 2023 just because they're wearing a label that says "Science."
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:29
|
|
|
Maybe games shouldn't equate "science" and "fascism."
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:33
|
|
|
Maybe people should be able to separate a group's aesthetic from its ideology.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:34
|
|
|
Oh gently caress it's every M:tA flamewar since Usenet was a thing. Are we finally going to solve it here?
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:36
|
|
|
I'm sorry I started... whatever this is because I asked which version had the technomages in it.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:39
|
|
|
I'm surprised there isn't already an emoji for infectious mage chat.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:43
|
|
|
Wearing a “I loving love science” T-shirt while they repeat whatever convenient lies will makes things go smoother.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:44
|
|
|
Randalor posted:I'm sorry I started... whatever this is because I asked which version had the technomages in it. Ain't your fault, friend. This is just what the oMage fandom does.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 15:44
|
|
|
moths posted:I'm surprised there isn't already an emoji for infectious mage chat.  This was in the running for the WoD Gangtag but Thai Cuisine won instead.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 16:16
|
|
|
Magnetic North posted:Like, we all know there was tons of appropriative stuff that happened in the 90s, and in recent days we're realizing it's really not okay even if it was not based in bad intentions or even misguided good intentions. I just don't understand the resistance to things being changed. It's not part of your loving trade dress or something that puts your intellectual property in jeopardy. We know they can retcon poo poo. But you're not asking about online randos, you're asking about the people running maybe the second-most visible IP in the history of tabletop games. As for how a leading game company can be run by grognards who seem determined to piss everyone off, well, ask Mike Mearls I guess. Berkshire Hunts posted:I’ve never really been sure what the draw of owod over nwod is anyway so I have no trouble believing it’s the racism DalaranJ posted:I wonder if OWoD provided some of the inspiration for the factions in D&D's Planescape.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 16:20
|
|
|
Halloween Jack posted:And while they will never, ever, ever, ever admit this, I think a lot of WoD fans missed the superheroes-with-fangs power creep and wackiness of the later WoD. i'm the weirdo who thinks the oWoD is almost* universally garbage, but still recognizes that this is a redeeming quality and a niche that the nWoD doesn't really fill, at least not in the same way it'd rule to have something comparably gonzo and exaggerated but not, you know, half load-bearing slurs by volume * Wraith is good
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 16:24
|
|
|
Nightlife is very playable with a few easy house rules. There's even a much simpler, Black Hack inspired homage called Nightcrawlers, it's five dollars. Of course, it doesn't have as much of this...
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 16:47
|
|
|
neonchameleon posted:They've very different tones. oWoD is "The World Is Dark. We're Princes of the Universe, fighting for survival in a world with the darkest power. We've come to be the rulers of you all". nWoD is "The world is dark and we're supernatural people fighting for survival." Of the major lines: You forgot Hunter!
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 17:01
|
|
|
Werewolf: The Forsaken 1st edition was actively hostile towards a lot of things that made people like W:TA and seemed to have a lot of built in hooks to give the Storyteller an excuse to just loving murder the party for any reason if anything went awry. The tribes are actively hostile to each other almost to the point of open conflict yet it's expected that you will join a multi-tribal pack with little explanation of how that will happen. Once you have territory you're expected to defend it to the death but if you leave it for any reason you'll probably get killed by another pack for abandoning it, now here's a list of a bunch of lodges that you'll need to travel to join and also here's a bunch of setting books full of people who will murder you if you visit. If two Uratha gently caress they will have a demon death baby that exists to kill werewolves and nothing up to and including murdering the pregnant mother will stop it. 2nd Edition was a lot more hands off and let you do whatever you wanted so long as you were fulfilling your sacred hunt.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 17:01
|
|
|
Tuxedo Catfish posted:i'm the weirdo who thinks the oWoD is almost* universally garbage, but still recognizes that this is a redeeming quality and a niche that the nWoD doesn't really fill, at least not in the same way That's just the late-era and especially 2E nWoD, which has setting lore much weirder and more expansive than the oWoD ever managed and such hard-hitting, rhetorically-explosive superpowers that it's kind of a problem. Ferrinus fucked around with this message at 17:16 on Jul 24, 2023 |
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 17:05
|
|
|
Halloween Jack posted:People who grew up with the Lore are just nostalgic for it and sad that they junked it in nWoD. And while they will never, ever, ever, ever admit this, I think a lot of WoD fans missed the superheroes-with-fangs power creep and wackiness of the later WoD. I will admit this. Blade(s) vs Vampire Breakfast Club was great fun. Although I think it really helps that latter era corresponds with an uptick in writing quality
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 17:15
|
|
|
Tuxedo Catfish posted:i'm the weirdo who thinks the oWoD is almost* universally garbage, but still recognizes that this is a redeeming quality and a niche that the nWoD doesn't really fill, at least not in the same way This might just be how Gatto Grigio is running it, but Deviant definitely has that vibe to it.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 19:02
|
|
|
Halloween Jack posted:Nightlife is very playable with a few easy house rules. There's even a much simpler, Black Hack inspired homage called Nightcrawlers, it's five dollars. Of course, it doesn't have as much of this...  As someone who has run a fuckton of Nightlife, I have to agree.
|
|
#
?
Jul 24, 2023 19:33
|
|
|
King of Solomon posted:This might just be how Gatto Grigio is running it, but Deviant definitely has that vibe to it. I gotta do right by Kamen Rider!  Admittedly, I may be biased in that we designed the target Conspiracy in our game as a global biotech megacorp, so comparisons to stuff like Pentex will be more direct. You can make your Conspiracy a corporation, but it can also be a government, a cult, a criminal syndicate, etc. But the core facet that unites all the Conspiracies in Deviant is that they are all willing to exploit and permanently damage human beings in order to achieve their goals (otherwise they wouldn't be creating or seeking out Deviants). The game presents the same degree of exigency seen in Werewolf and its conflict with The Wyrm, or Mage with its Ascension War, but provides what is - at least to me - a much more nuanced and relatable portrayal of those conflicts. The Web of Pain presents corporations that do as much active harm in the name of greed as Pentex, but without the excuse of being commanded by a cosmic force of entropy. It presents shadowy Deep-State organizations that wield oppression in the name of hegemony as much as the Technocracy, but without the excuse of providing the advances of modernity. The Web of Pain represents the hierarchies that are oppressing all of us and destroying the world in the name of profit and ideology, but they are stripped of the essentialist excuses, revealing the exact same naked greed that motivates the hierarchies of today. Then it gives you the tools to destroy them. 
Gatto Grigio fucked around with this message at 17:32 on Jul 26, 2023 |
|
#
?
Jul 25, 2023 00:20
|
|
|
Halloween Jack posted:Undoubtedly. There were so many games, many of them very far afield from what White Wolf was doing in terms of genre, that aped their conventions. And they weren't wrong to do so; splats were a great idea in a game that didn't have character classes. Even games that didn't exactly have splats would have things like "a sidebar where this faction tells you what they think of the other factions, mostly pithy put-downs." It's one of those things that's easy to mock, but it really gives the games flavour to not just have categories and affiliations that define and give flavour to your character but actual factionalism, interpersonal dynamics and in-setting assumptions and stereotypes that make it feel like part of a world, not just a name for a particular array of numbers. It can get a bit high school clique but it's one of those things that makes a fantasy setting feel real, and there's a reason so many fantasy stories have it. Look at D&D even and how much storytelling they get out of tension between wizards and sorcerers, divine and arcane casters, or Avatar TLA and different Bending styles also tied in with the nations and cultures they originate from. That splats tend to be based on different cultural stereotypes, archetypes and creatures makes it even more interesting. What happens when you have a bunch of fairies including the boogeyman, the big bad wolf, the moon princess and the shoemaker elf all trying to make rent? When the Orlock vampires, the nightclub goth vampires and the wealthy nobleman vampires are negotiating territorial boundaries? Superheroes with fangs is a thing because superheroes are fun no matter the tone when done right. Heh, that whole tone can even work if you lean into the totally Venture Bros angle of trying to wrangle a functional society out of a bunch of mentally unstable weirdos with superpowers, ancient grudges, cliques and incredibly powerful enemies lurking in the shadows.
|
|
#
?
Jul 26, 2023 11:00
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/Kickstarter/status/1686409335730053120
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 07:21
|
|
|
AI essentially does GMS's Far West "art direction" efficiently, so of course Kickstarter is going to allow it. The alternative is to whack-a-mole down projects that are too obvious about AI use. What would be a problem for Kickstarter is that you could prompt an AI to mimic exclusively $1M+ USD projects. So within a year, every game could be a soulless nostalgia-based licenced FOMO box with too many miniatures. But more efficiently than how humans are already trending it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 08:12
|
|
|
moths posted:AI essentially does GMS's Far West "art direction" efficiently, so of course Kickstarter is going to allow it. 12 years of work and the only way we get an actual game out of it is because he had the chatbot make it for him.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 08:58
|
|
|
yeah yeah oka- moths posted:GMS's Far West "art direction" Wait... Did that actually get released?
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 09:29
|
|
|
How much you want to bet when they say "shaped by feedback" we're going to hear tons of creators who are like, "gently caress you, you didn't listen to poo poo." Unless all those conscientious creators bailed after their were unable to elaborate on their crypto plans to demonstrate why it would be a value add to them. FWIW, I could not find a policy regarding AI on Gamefound or Backerkit.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 13:10
|
|
|
Megazver posted:Wait... Did that actually get released? No, but the preview art was cut and pasted from other sources and filtered. He'd basically done a composite art theft before AI did. In a way, GMS actually pioneered something. But in his way, it was lovely.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 14:20
|
|
|
moths posted:. Composite tracing is called the Scythe method.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 14:32
|
|
|
This is a steam style no but actually yes AI ban because there's no really performant widely used base model compliant with the latter for text and images, it allows poo poo like the Doom 2016 music.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 15:25
|
|
|
Megazver posted:yeah yeah oka- The manuscript went out. Of course it’s been in layout for over a year since then.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 15:48
|
|
|
moths posted:No, but the preview art was cut and pasted from other sources and filtered. AI composite art is worlds better than that ancient Far West stuff. Composite art shouldn't be considered automatically illegitimate, anyway. But of course that's as long as it isn't obviously Matt Damon with his legs replaced by erector set spider machine, both of which were immediately recognizable from simple Google image searches, then run through a Photoshop filter.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 16:38
|
|
|
StratGoatCom posted:This is a steam style no but actually yes AI ban because there's no really performant widely used base model compliant with the latter for text and images, it allows poo poo like the Doom 2016 music. The Doom 2016 music had nothing to do with AI?
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 17:23
|
|
|
Yeah I was going to say, dooms whole thing was that Mick Gordon said he wasn't allowed full review of masters etc and theres been a bunch of back and forth over it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 17:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 21:00 |
|
|
also it wasn't Doom 2016 it was Doom Eternal and it was some other guy taking his work and chopping it up to make the CD Tracks because they were refusing to pay him to do it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2023 17:43
|
|