|
Dawgstar posted:Surprisingly not, but it's still very fetishy. She's described as, basically, a street kid but makes it look good. And she wears a utilikilt which shouldn't make me laugh but does. I ran a LARP years ago that we wove stuff from the ticker into the newspaper as Gehenna came on. People unsurprisingly decided to use their downtimes to try to investigate some of it. It was a pretty good time.
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 01:53
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 1, 2024 04:07 |
|
|
MoonKnight posted:I ran a LARP years ago that we wove stuff from the ticker into the newspaper as Gehenna came on. People unsurprisingly decided to use their downtimes to try to investigate some of it. It was a pretty good time. I was going over it and nearly overcome with a wage of nostalgia. In our game we specifically used the fomori going feral because they didn't have Harold Zettler's Domination/Dementation combo juicing their brains any more, the announcement of no new Garou births and Zhyzhak taking over an entire town in Maine to call out Albrecht in the run up to our little Apocalypse. There's still some I have no idea which line they refer to (and some are pretty general, I think). Radio Telescopes Pick up Growls in the Sky ARECIBO, PUERTO RICO—Scientists at the world-famous Arecibo radio observatory were today unable to explain the strange electromagnetic interference that is causing strange displays in the night sky and blanketing the airwaves with waves of sound that one official describes as “a chorus of bestial growls and moans.” Scientists at a recent conference concurred that, whatever the source of the strange noises is, the strength of the interference is steadily increasing. One official who did not wish to be named insisted that he had been able to discern distinct voices and patterns of speech among the cacophony of noise. ‘Sea Monster’ Seen in New York’s East River NEW YORK CITY, NEW YORK—Police dispatchers last night responded to over 300 calls reporting a “monster” by the Manhattan side of the East River. Various reports describe the “monster” as having tentacles and being of indiscernible size.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 03:03
|
|
|
Yon tentacular beastie is [Tzimisce] itself.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 03:12
|
|
|
Loomer posted:Yon tentacular beastie is [Tzimisce] itself. Yeah, I guess I can see that. There's at least one other 'bit' that talks about a weird fungus mixed with bio-matter they can't identity so I figured the Eldest already got its mention.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 03:35
|
|
|
There's a reason one of the Masquerade rules is keep your goddamn bookkeeping in order.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 06:04
|
|
|
The Arecibo incident sounds like it could be Nephandi breaking something out in the Umbra, letting something through. (Or any of the other Wyrm-aligned factions, take your pick--it might not be anything gameline specific.)
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 06:37
|
|
|
I always figured the growling on radio telescopes was the Umbra breaking through a little, and people picking up Garou moots.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 11:49
|
|
|
Given that it comes from space and the blurb explicitly says the "strength of the interference is increasing," (i.e. getting closer), isn't it probably the evil red star/comet that heralds the end of days coming toward Earth?
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 12:04
|
|
|
That and/or the alteration in the speed of light being a sign of Hell breaking open.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 12:19
|
|
|
My favorite one is the Imbued reporting about the giant black cathedral appearing in LA that's like 100 meters tall or whatever crazy thing. I would lay money it's Demon-related but I would have to re-read City of Angels, the LA book for Demon, to confirm and I do not want to do that because it is not very good, forcing this weird court system on everything and making it feel like warmed-over Vampire.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 13:39
|
|
|
Oh, Lucifer just in there chillin'
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 13:50
|
|
|
GimpInBlack posted:Given that it comes from space and the blurb explicitly says the "strength of the interference is increasing," (i.e. getting closer), isn't it probably the evil red star/comet that heralds the end of days coming toward Earth? That was how we reacted to it on New Bremen. Which, as I mentioned before, used each scenario from each of the game lines. My thinblood ended up trapped in the church, passed the "test", and turned human. Which meant he Awoke and finally got the dot in Prime I would constantly tease ChrisR about getting. (They also hauled the poor people handling IT out of bed when the epologue scenes ran past the shut off time.) Some of these I remember, like Czar Vargo showing up yet again. Some I never could figure out, like - Prince Charles causing England to go all Wicker Man; Verbena or Fae? - Egyptian SIDS; Mummy...? - Japanese buildings growing; - Mount Etna erupting and egyptian earthquakes; i assume various Andeluvians waking up Most of them, I assume, are references to game lines I was less than familiar with (changeling, demon, mummy) or with the novels. citybeatnik fucked around with this message at 15:07 on Jul 27, 2023 |
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 15:04
|
|
|
Japan's buildings are the work of Mikaboshi.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 15:13
|
|
|
I think some of it just general apocalyptic imagery. Why is Hawaii destroyed in a massive volcanic eruption? Because it would set the mood properly.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 15:48
|
|
|
Loomer posted:Japan's buildings are the work of Mikaboshi. There was a surprising amount of Kindred of the East referenced on that ticker; then again, the “broken mirrors” (where Hell overlays and replaces Earth) are fun and very demonstrative of the end times, and the Wan Kuei are useful tools if you want to fortune cookie stereotypically hint at something without spelling it out directly
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 16:03
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:- Prince Charles causing England to go all Wicker Man; Verbena or Fae? The Egyptian thing was probably Demon. A little repeat of an Old Testament greatest hit. Like Loomer said, Japanese buildings were the work of Mikaboshi, specifically him bring his hell of the Wicked City to Tokyo. You're close on the Prince Charles thing, it IS Mage, but the Harbingers of Avalon are a sub-faction of the Technocracy who believe in King Arthur as a sort of Technocratic ideal and Queen Victoria was supposed to be the big push at drawing the (figurative maybe, or not) Excalibur but died before she could. As one might imagine the Technocracy takes a dim view of Arthurian LARPer goofs running around so they've been toying with the idea of going Disparate but they'd have to tone down being nationalistic and chauvinistic weirdos. 'Sleepytown' does not personally ring a bell if somebody could fill me in there. AmiYumi posted:There was a surprising amount of Kindred of the East referenced on that ticker; then again, the “broken mirrors” (where Hell overlays and replaces Earth) are fun and very demonstrative of the end times, and the Wan Kuei are useful tools if you want to fortune cookie stereotypically hint at something without spelling it out directly We can pause to be really irritated at how lackluster the last Time of Judgement book was and just threw the rest of the game lines together (barring Wraith, of course) and they were all kind of sandbox-y and not very interesting. Dawgstar fucked around with this message at 16:25 on Jul 27, 2023 |
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 16:22
|
|
|
I’m back with another recap from our New York game. This time the digital dice were wild and like half of all successful tests were Messy Crits, to the point where towards the end of the session I just had to go “I’m letting you off the hook for this messy crit, I can’t come up with more stuff to mess up your night.” As usual, our coterie consists of Augustus the Amish Banu Haqim and Thomas the Triad Tremere. The nights in our games usually start with a round of hunting rolls, where Augustus rolls his first messy crit of the session. He prefers to eat rats for nourishment and has recently started to expand his diet to include raccoons and possums. I let him take off an extra point of hunger for finding some very juicy animals, but unfortunately someone sees him covered in rat guts and pieces of fur. And Augustus realizes he has been seen when the camera flash goes off. The random passer-by with a film camera runs off and Augustus chases after them to prevent a Masquerade breach. The chase ends suddenly as the passer-by runs onto a busy street and is immediately hit by a car. The camera is broken but the film is most likely still intact. As for the passer-by, it’s impossible to tell how they're doing without getting closer. Augustus manages to convince on-lookers that he is a medical professional and approaches without anyone noticing that he is wearing a bloody hoodie (from the rats). I tell Augustus that the passer-by is seriously wounded and will not survive without his help. The player takes a moment to ponder this ethical dilemma I’ve sprung up on him. He decides to share his vitae with the wounded person and manages to do so without anyone noticing. He also steals the camera in the process to protect the Masquerade. All of this went better than expected, except Augustus had rolled another Messy Crit and gained a compulsion to do harm. As the coterie regroups (they prefer hunting solo) they start brainstorming how to manage Augustus’ need to destroy something or someone. Naturally they start getting wild ideas and I politely remind them that Augustus can just punch the first random pedestrian he sees. I am then informed that Augustus would not find it ethically acceptable to do random violence to someone who doesn’t deserve it, so I let them keep brainstorming. They decide to find some Fight Club type of establishment to do consensual violence. Thomas rolls to find it and gets a Messy Crit, so he finds it but he too will participate. They find a street fighting circle in Off-Off-Coney Island, on a tiny island in Jamaica Bay, where a crowd has gathered in the middle of a January night to watch and participate in physical combat. The event is a multi-man brawl-for-all. The only rule is that you’re not allowed to strike someone in the head if they’re lying on the ground. Neither of the characters are especially good at fisticuffs, but they are undead creatures and punches do very little to them. Thomas focuses on using dexterity to avoid strikes, while Augustus is forced by his compulsion to use strength to damage others. Which he whiffs for a while and gets beaten up quite severely until he gets yet another Messy Crit and absolutely demolishes someone with his bare hands. Soon enough the two vampires are the only fighters standing. Augustus has gotten the need for violence out of his system and takes a dive, allowing Thomas to win the grand prize of 200$. And all of the session so far has been the result of some wild dice rolls and me having like three sentences worth of notes about someone taking dangerous pictures and getting hit by a car. The players had previously asked for some random encounters and I think I delivered. After that rollercoaster it was time to return to the previously scheduled plot. Augustus is attempting to contact the local Banu Haqim to get them to espouse pacifism. Next on the list is a private investigator named Kowalski. The players hope that knowing an investigator, especially one well-connected with local police, would help them against the Second Inquisition breathing down their necks. Unfortunately, Kowalski is a very young vampire, not well connected, and absolutely refuses to take any actions against fellow policemen when inquired about it. Most Banu Haqim follow a strict moral code and for Kowalski that code is based on the U.S. Constitution. They also learn that Kowalski’s sire is a former USMC sniper who eliminates the enemies of Camarilla and the United States (Kowalski doesn’t see these two contradicting each other). While Kowalski won’t help them against the SI, he is willing to listen to Augustus’ moral sermon if they are willing to do a favor for him. A gang of thugs is terrorizing the area and Kowalski wants the coterie to get rid of them. They can be found at a local community center and when the players go there it turns out the gang is just some black teens playing board games. To no one’s surprise the vampire cop is a racist piece of poo poo. Kowalski’s mortal daughter is also part of this group and she figures out immediately that her dad had sent the coterie to harass them. She wants nothing to do with Kowalski and the players agree with her, unfortunately it would be politically more convenient for them to make up. A successful persuasion test gets the daughter to come with them to meet Kowalski and another very successful persuasion test gets them to make up and/or resolve the situation. I realized in the middle of the scene that I really don’t want to roleplay an abusive family relationship and called it just a dice roll so we can move on. Kowalski was now ready to listen to Augustus’ sermon about pacifism. The coterie had helped Kowalski and he is a fledgling just looking for guidance, so the difficulty was not too high. Not too low either, since pacifism doesn’t fit with his career as a police officer and his love of the constitution. Augustus did let it slip that using violence in self-defense is acceptable, which he took to mean “You can shoot people if you feel threatened” which muddied the message he was trying to preach. Augustus got some average rolls and arguments and in the end Kowalski doesn’t feel comfortable accepting Augustus’ morals, but if he got more Kindred on board he’d come along then. And that’s it for this session. Off-screen the characters are still trying to find a new haven and I gave them the idea of having some sort of public front. If the players need to contact someone specific, they have a pretty good idea where to go, whereas if some NPC needs to contact the players, I as a GM have no idea how they would do that and it makes it hard for me to write plot hooks. The players started thinking about a butcher shop to suit all their feeding needs, and I’m excited about the idea. The players haven’t succeeded in any rolls to acquire this new haven yet so I nipped the conversation short, since there’s a high risk of everyone forgetting the details by the time they’re relevant.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 16:24
|
|
|
Stumbled into the TV Tropes page for the WoD while trying to see if there was an annotated collection of those tickets anywhere. On a quick scan, it’s pretty matter-of-fact, just an excited recounting of the basics without the usual troper-ish sex weirdness I’ve come to expe-quote:Everyone Is Bi: While not outright stated or heavily enforced, it was implied that most of the Fae were bisexual in Changeling: The Dreaming. Especially since a husband and wife could reincarnate as two men or two women, among other reasons.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 16:27
|
|
|
Dawgstar posted:We can pause to be really irritated at how lackluster the last Time of Judgement book was and just threw the rest of the game lines together (barring Wraith, of course) and they were all kind of sandbox-y and not very interesting. I know I was in a KotE game at the time and wondered if the writers had been given any notes beyond World of Darkness: Hong Kong (published 1998), because not only did all the referenced NPCs come from there, so did the book’s outdated approach to plotting and crossover. Seem to recall Changeling players being “meh” about their section, then upset about how much had been left on the editing room floor (a whole new sidhe house!) The Mummy section was neat in a “wait, really?” sort of way, and in spending most of its wordcount on the nonstandard mummies (and, continuing the tradition, giving them a third set of mechanics in three books total; what was up with M:tR on that, honestly) The others I know were present, but I honestly can’t even bring up a single thing about them from memory, which is a sign all its own. I think there was stuff on the existing WoD angels in the Hunter or Demon section? Tempted to crack that book back open, but every time I start a reread I end up back at Apocalypse because that one was way more fun.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 16:42
|
|
|
Sort of related, had anyone run Orpheus? I know it’s got a great reputation, but I’m curious how it was as an actual set of modules.
Berkshire Hunts fucked around with this message at 17:06 on Jul 27, 2023 |
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 17:01
|
|
|
LatwPIAT posted:I think some of it just general apocalyptic imagery. Why is Hawaii destroyed in a massive volcanic eruption? Because it would set the mood properly. The elder gods standing around the smouldering crater, sipping mai tais as water rushes into the gaping wound in the earth. "I do really enjoy the ambiance."
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 17:47
|
|
|
Dawgstar posted:The Egyptian thing was probably Demon. A little repeat of an Old Testament greatest hit. Sleepytown is a mage thing, the technocracy builds a very Leave it to Beaver sort of town to do something with disbelief, I think.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 18:30
|
|
|
AmiYumi posted:The disconnect between the lead-up prose sections and the scenarios themselves got so much worse in Time of Judgement; from what I remember, Changeling and Kindred of the East got some pretty good “build up” followed by insultingly bad scenarios I remember reading a chunk of the ToJ book at some point and thinking one of the Changeling scenarios was sort of neat from a "Wait...but what about humanity?" perspective. Long Winter I think? Whichever one has the Kithain all gently caress off back to Arcadia, leaving the earth essentially devoid of imagination. Also I think there was a full on apocalypse style scenario for Hunter that was basically "You're all hosed, everything is hosed, enjoy your remaining existence among the wastelands". I think I also read through some of the Gehenna scenarios and boy I sure love the "Cool poo poo is happening off screen while you just sit here and listen to all the cool stuff happening off screen. No you may not look at what is happening off screen. gently caress you"
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 18:33
|
|
|
Everything Counts posted:The Arecibo incident sounds like it could be Nephandi breaking something out in the Umbra, letting something through. (Or any of the other Wyrm-aligned factions, take your pick--it might not be anything gameline specific.) I think it's this because one of the Ascension scenarios is that the Nephandi are the final obstacle/adversary and destroy the world. Dawgstar posted:My favorite one is the Imbued reporting about the giant black cathedral appearing in LA that's like 100 meters tall or whatever crazy thing. I would lay money it's Demon-related but I would have to re-read City of Angels, the LA book for Demon, to confirm and I do not want to do that because it is not very good, forcing this weird court system on everything and making it feel like warmed-over Vampire. It might be Genhinnom but most the Lucifer scenarios is him out and about, stirring up poo poo. Could be related to Hunter too since the whole endcap thing is that the Imbued are a project of the possibly two remaining angels. Explodingdice posted:Sleepytown is a mage thing, the technocracy builds a very Leave it to Beaver sort of town to do something with disbelief, I think. Yeah, they're a town in the middle of nowhere in middle America that has been socially engineered to have no conception of anything related to the Traditions. They also are a Leave it to Beaver, Mayberry type place because the Technocrats make sure their version of history doesn't have things like the Kennedy assassination, Watergate, and/or anything else negative from history and their media has no references to occult or magic in it. I believe it's in the one Storyteller's Guide, could be wrong, and paradox against the supernatural is so strong there that it might affect vampires or werewolves.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 20:37
|
|
|
Berkshire Hunts posted:Sort of related, had anyone run Orpheus? I know it’s got a great reputation, but I’m curious how it was as an actual set of modules. Genuinely very good. While the storyline does set up the organization Orpheus to eventually explode and your PC circle to go on the run, that happens as soon or as late as you want (and you needn't do it at all) and there's a lot of fun hooks put out there to follow or not like running down the source of the ghost-seeing (and ghost-making) drug pigment, Radio Free Dead, what the deal with Project Flatline was, just a lot of stuff. They're honestly that combo of setting book/module, with the modules themselves being fine. I expanded on stuff and adjusted it for the shenanigans my players pulled but I used most everything and the stuff I didn't wasn't because of quality.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 20:40
|
|
|
Orpheus is legit my favourite oWOD title. Hell, favourite WoD, new or old. It has a smaller scope than other settings and suffers from the base system being terrible, but what's in there is really tight. I remember commentary at the time is that it was a trial run for other limited series and I feel it's a shame we didn't have other games with a steadily advancing metaplot paired with mechanical expansions coming to an effective conclusion. I guess 1E Promethean and Changeling had limited scopes on release (and they were great, loved them, Changeling: The Lost remains my favourite nWOD thingie), but the hands off setting for nWOD kept it from going into some of the wild directions Orpheus goes.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 20:50
|
|
|
I do find it funny how often Oliver Thrace shows up the in the KotE Judgment scenarios.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 20:54
|
|
|
MonsieurChoc posted:I do find it funny how often Oliver Thrace shows up the in the KotE Judgment scenarios. How can you NOT put the White Savior front and center? Speaking as an Asian person, as I've said before, I kinda liked the broad theory of KotE solely for the fact that it was nice to have SOME representation, even if it was racist hackneyed trash. The primary issue was always, "why the gently caress am I playing some not-Vampire?" Kindred of the Ebony Kingdom, with it's hilariously racist name, strangely actually did it better... Why not just make regular loving kindred, but out them in Asia and incorporate new cultural stuff to them? I had hoped maybe V5 would go that route, but they already said they're not touching KotE at all, and I doubt we get some Eastern focused book at all, so I guess it's just erasure rather than poor representation. Progress!
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 21:32
|
|
|
J.F. Sambrano, who posted their dealings with Paradox on W5, posted a follow up in the RPG.net thread:quote:I've been debating getting into the discussion here, although I have been reading what everyone has had to say. My original thought was that it would be best to present my story and evidence and let the community come to their own conclusions.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 22:27
|
|
|
Yes, you normalize white supremacy by... *checks notes*... vilifying the white supremacists! Makes total sense.  The stuff about erasure and minimizing and dismissing minority viewpoints was not surprising at all and 100% believable given the brand, but considering so much of the other WoD Team stuff has been actively combating the thick, fat, white supremacist streak in their community because they know it's a loving cancer that will kill the franchise, I really don't buy that retaining the Nazi stuff for the Get, who are now villains was an attempt at normalizing fascism. It seems more like going out of their way to make "Nazis = BAD" a subtext of the franchise, with the Get being an easy scapegoat to throw to the wolves (pun not intended, but it works) to overly aggressively bludgeon that stance home. Fuzz fucked around with this message at 23:32 on Jul 27, 2023 |
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 23:22
|
|
|
It's not really about praising vs. villifying so much as positioning something as an inherent and incessant property rather than a political contingency. The choice of what to keep as a bedrock element of the setting as opposed to what to jettison as superfluous or distracting is more important than the choice of who to give a white hat or a black hat, especially in a series of games that's broadly about playing the villains and monsters in the first place. Like, take your own idea of "fixing" KotE. Asian mythology? Fake. Nah, all those guys come from the Bible, just like real vampires.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 23:31
|
|
|
Ferrinus posted:It's not really about praising vs. villifying so much as positioning something as an inherent and incessant property rather than a political contingency. The choice of what to keep as a bedrock element of the setting as opposed to what to jettison as superfluous or distracting is more important than the choice of who to give a white hat or a black hat, especially in a series of games that's broadly about playing the villains and monsters in the first place. And while that may be true I genuinely doubt that was their intent, is my point. It's kneejerk and poorly planned damage control to minimize the angles from which they can be attacked for appropriation or racism, as they have so many times in the past, while being overly virtue signally about not liking Nazis. It very much feels like a, "we suck at reading the room and getting how to do this tactfully, but our franchise is cool and okay now, right guys? Guys??" Ferrinus posted:Like, take your own idea of "fixing" KotE. Asian mythology? Fake. Nah, all those guys come from the Bible, just like real vampires. I mean part of V5 is a specific push to say that the whole Caine mythos and Noddism as a whole are just a religion and not necessarily true at all. By that metric, introducing kindred from other, non-Abrahamic cultures who have dramatically different explanations for what ends up being the same or similar distribution of clans/legacies/families/whatevers is actually exactly what you want to do.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 23:41
|
|
|
Can't exactly blame them for jettisoning the Black Fury brand of radical feminism at a time where that branch of feminism is increasingly associated with some of the biggest freaks in politics.
|
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 23:50
|
|
|
Fuzz posted:And while that may be true I genuinely doubt that was their intent, is my point. It's kneejerk and poorly planned damage control to minimize the angles from which they can be attacked for appropriation or racism, as they have so many times in the past, while being overly virtue signally about not liking Nazis. It very much feels like a, "we suck at reading the room and getting how to do this tactfully, but our franchise is cool and okay now, right guys? Guys??" I don't disagree, but I also don't think you disagree with Sambrano. There's a reason that the writers' idea of damage control involves jettisoning all the indigineity and feminism but keeping and writing copious amounts of rules and setting detail for the white supremacy. Their ideological limitations mean that they couldn't get rid of the white supremacy if they tried -- even though I'm willing to believe that they are, on some level, trying. quote:I mean part of V5 is a specific push to say that the whole Caine mythos and Noddism as a whole are just a religion and not necessarily true at all. By that metric, introducing kindred from other, non-Abrahamic cultures who have dramatically different explanations for what ends up being the same or similar distribution of clans/legacies/families/whatevers is actually exactly what you want to do. First, we all know that's bunkum, and that Caine and the Antedeluvians and so on are as real as ever. You notice how all the elders are being mysteriously summoned to the middle east and not to China or Africa? Second, what about the various hells? What about the yin vs. the yang principle? What about drinking breath or following dharmas? If Jiang-Shi still all drink blood and shapeshift into vermin it's obvious where real vampires come from and whose legends are just mistakes or accidents. There's rules somewhere for making KotE the actual default, universal kind of vampire and Cainites amusingly off-base, where like Humanity is just a particularly lovely Dharma, but it still involves people touched by evil clawing their way back to their bodies from the netherworld and starting out as powerless zombies and not generations of fledgelings and elders sharing bloodlines. Ferrinus fucked around with this message at 23:54 on Jul 27, 2023 |
|
#
?
Jul 27, 2023 23:51
|
|
|
Ferrinus posted:First, we all know that's bunkum, and that Caine and the Antedeluvians and so on are as real as ever. You notice how all the elders are being mysteriously summoned to the middle east and not to China or Africa? This is specifically addressed in the Cults of the Blood Gods books, as a bunch of Elders are being summoned to South America, Africa, Australia, the Antarctic, etc. The Beckoning is not just to the Middle East, now, it's just "they're gone. Somewhere not here." Ferrinus posted:Second, what about the various hells? What about the yin vs. the yang principle? What about drinking breath or following dharmas? If Jiang-Shi still all drink blood and shapeshift into vermin it's obvious where real vampires come from and whose legends are just mistakes or accidents. There's rules somewhere for making KotE the actual default, universal kind of vampire and Cainites amusingly off-base, where like Humanity is just a particularly lovely Dharma, but it still involves people touched by evil clawing their way back to their bodies from the netherworld and starting out as powerless zombies and not generations of fledgelings and elders sharing bloodlines. Again, you're missing my point... all the stuff you listed is a really bad read of Taoist principles and would just be tossed out because it wouldn't be relevant to kindred mythology in the east, when there are plenty of other options to work with. Dharma as it is intended to actually be in Vedic religions would actually be closest to Convictions in terms of how mechanics work, but even so it doesn't even need to be brought up as any sort of mechanical anything, because it's not actually relevant. I'm saying you literally throw out the existing KotE but rebuild it from the ground up saying, "they were regular Kindred all along, and all these myth and stories of nonsense were either bad translations, bad Western racism when observing the "inscrutable" Asians, or active misinformation from early culture wars thousands of years ago that just sort of hanged around and gained traction and just turned into racist tropes." You don't need to "explain" a Second Breath when one doesn't actually exist because they're just regular rear end kindred vampires who get Embraced. There actually ARE multiple myths from various Asian cultures specifically dealing with drinking tainted blood and it poisoning people. It would just require them to do the research and hire culturally competent people and give them free reign to actually do what they need to to make the game mesh. We all know they would never do that, obviously, based on Sambrano's lived experiences, but that's my point - it's what they should have done rather than just say, "well KotE is dead and we're not going to touch it this edition at all," and then proceed to not actually talk about what's going on in Asia at all, so it's just a black hole of erasure.
|
|
#
?
Jul 28, 2023 00:08
|
|
|
Fuzz posted:This is specifically addressed in the Cults of the Blood Gods books, as a bunch of Elders are being summoned to South America, Africa, Australia, the Antarctic, etc. The Beckoning is not just to the Middle East, now, it's just "they're gone. Somewhere not here." Mmm, but strangely they didn't say that to start, did they? No doubt the really-existing Antedeluvians have plots that range across the entire world, which is why the elders, who are sooo important (as reified by the mechanics, since Generation remains in the game) are being sent hither and yon. quote:Again, you're missing my point... all the stuff you listed is a really bad read of Taoist principles and would just be tossed out because it wouldn't be relevant to kindred mythology in the east, when there are plenty of other options to work with. Dharma as it is intended to actually be in Vedic religions would actually be closest to Convictions in terms of how mechanics work, but even so it doesn't even need to be brought up as any sort of mechanical anything, because it's not actually relevant. I'm saying you literally throw out the existing KotE but rebuild it from the ground up saying, "they were regular Kindred all along, and all these myth and stories of nonsense were either bad translations, bad Western racism when observing the "inscrutable" Asians, or active misinformation from early culture wars thousands of years ago that just sort of hanged around and gained traction and just turned into racist tropes. You don't need to "explain" a Second Breath when one doesn't actually exist because they're just regular rear end kindred vampires who get Embraced. There actually ARE multiple myths from various Asian cultures specifically dealing with drinking tainted blood and it poisoning people. No, look. Your basic proposition, "they were regular Kindred all along", constitutues a western-chauvinist cultural erasure. Why aren't we learning that the Cainites were regular wan kuei all along? Why aren't we hearing apologism about how Convictions are actually just poorly-understood Dharmas? How come vampires aren't all spawned by the Second Breath, and all these legends about "the embrace" are just people confused by the fact that one way to die while touched by corruption is to be eaten or drained to death by a vampire? We all know why!
|
|
#
?
Jul 28, 2023 00:18
|
|
|
In order to fix this divide in lore, we must hybridize Cainism with the ideology of King Hong Xiuquan and the Taiping Heavenly Kingdom
|
|
#
?
Jul 28, 2023 00:45
|
|
|
joylessdivision posted:I think I also read through some of the Gehenna scenarios and boy I sure love the "Cool poo poo is happening off screen while you just sit here and listen to all the cool stuff happening off screen. No you may not look at what is happening off screen. gently caress you" Steamed Hams: The Apcolypse
|
|
#
?
Jul 28, 2023 00:51
|
|
|
Whirling posted:In order to fix this divide in lore, we must hybridize Cainism with the ideology of King Hong Xiuquan and the Taiping Heavenly Kingdom This is Vampire: the Requiem, in which a nocturnal cannibal of some description is broadly what you get when you corrupt and disfigure someone's humanity, but modern-day vampires are more a result of convergent evolution than unbroken descent from some singular founder to the point that not even, like, Mekhet and Nosferatu are strictly speaking exactly the same sort of creature.
|
|
#
?
Jul 28, 2023 00:54
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 1, 2024 04:07 |
|
|
CAPT. Rainbowbeard posted:Steamed Hams: The Apcolypse Are you telling me that God himself is outside this church, laying waste to every Cainite in sight? At this time of year, localized in this city?! Yes. .....may I see it? ...No.
|
|
#
?
Jul 28, 2023 00:58
|
|