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To be honest I'm playing a Rogue in AV and if the fool bard just wants to cast Warp Step, zoom in and eat any AoOs, sing a song to buff my attack, and provide flanking for me then I'd be alright with that.
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Aug 11, 2023 00:16
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Lurks With Wolves posted:But the strength requirement is just "you don't get penalties and lose five less speed while wearing it", and losing that 5' of speed is the part they thought their friend would object to. I don't think, I know that one cold, just from the things they've said and the obsession they have with Warp Step. I appreciate everyone's advice, and I think this is a salvageable character. I'm trying to support them in their choice to play a sort of weird support character but I think we need to talk about the taking of Psychic, because that seems really out of line with their trying to heal the party with Medicine.
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Aug 11, 2023 00:17
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Kyrosiris posted:Honestly it seems like he's trying to do thirty seven different things at once and sucking at all of them. There's a bunch of stuff he could do to fix it. Off the top of my head, switching from melee to ranged and switching from an actual shield to cantrip Shield would both bump up his AC and allow for smoother turns (Shoot + Move + Shield is almost always a solid turn, regardless of the situation). If he's an Ancestry with an unarmed attack (Ifrit has a feat that gives one if he doesn't wanna switch to being a Lizardfolk or whatever), then he can still Warp Step in to threaten flanking while not dropping his bow. That's just system talk, though. If he's stuck in his ways, then he's stuck in his ways and it's a player problem. Froghammer fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Aug 11, 2023 |
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Aug 11, 2023 00:17
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Lurks With Wolves posted:But the strength requirement is just "you don't get penalties and lose five less speed while wearing it", and losing that 5' of speed is the part they thought their friend would object to. 5 less speed in exchange for quartering your chance to be critically hit is a good trade. He already has the amped warp step for emergncies, why does he need to go fast the rest of the time? It isn't like he's doing anything valuable with that movement.
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Aug 11, 2023 00:18
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Honestly, I think if he's spamming Warp Step, he can get away without 5 ft speed. If he's just using it to get flanking, then assuming 25ft base, he still moves 50ft with it. That's more than enough.Froghammer posted:If he's an Ancestry with an unarmed attack (Ifrit has a feat that gives one if he doesn't wanna switch to being a Lizardfolk or whatever), then he can still Warp Step in to threaten flanking while not dropping his bow. That's just system talk, though. If he's stuck in his ways, then he's stuck in his ways and it's a player problem.
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Aug 11, 2023 00:38
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appropriatemetaphor posted:To be honest I'm playing a Rogue in AV and if the fool bard just wants to cast Warp Step, zoom in and eat any AoOs, sing a song to buff my attack, and provide flanking for me then I'd be alright with that. He's contributing far less to the fight than the game expects a player to, so the math on XP budgets for combats is going to be off.
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Aug 11, 2023 01:11
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if the dude's a big grog he probably figures what he's doing is fine and effective enough since he isn't dying (which surprises me, as somebody playing through the vaults right now i'd expect anybody aggressively flanking without even being defense capped to be getting bounced off the floor all the time)
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Aug 11, 2023 01:33
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Bards are casters. Ask him if he thinks a caster without good dex should be in melee. If not, politely inform him they shouldn't be. Probably via murder.
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Aug 11, 2023 01:47
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atelier morgan posted:if the dude's a big grog he probably figures what he's doing is fine and effective enough since he isn't dying (which surprises me, as somebody playing through the vaults right now i'd expect anybody aggressively flanking without even being defense capped to be getting bounced off the floor all the time) Yeah, I was gonna say, as a fighter in half plate I'm taking some lumps when I try to set up for our swashbuckler; a low AC bard in the tussle sounds like they'd get turned into a stain.
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Aug 11, 2023 02:39
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Kyrosiris posted:Yeah, I was gonna say, as a fighter in half plate I'm taking some lumps when I try to set up for our swashbuckler; a low AC bard in the tussle sounds like they'd get turned into a stain. yeah i only get away with doing it sometimes by virtue of drakeheart mutagen and a shield
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Aug 11, 2023 03:26
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That was my experience as a shield champion as well.
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Aug 11, 2023 03:31
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Summon Fey is a 1st level spell. If he wants to provide flanking bonuses so badly, that's what he should be doing
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Aug 11, 2023 04:06
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Seems like that bard player would be better served playing a thaumaturge or investigator with bard multiclass. Mirror implement would be basically perfect for what he wants to do. Thaum with bard multiclass actually sounds really fuckin good now that I think about it Summoners are also great support characters since their action economy and breadth are crazy
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Aug 11, 2023 05:23
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:My groggy D&D loving Bard continues to give me The Sads, literally spending every round after the first (where he casts Inspire Courage) blowing his entire turn to Raise A Shield and do a Warp Step to some weird-rear end place on the map to "help with flanking". how can this guy love D&D and have no idea how to play a bard, which more or less works exactly like it does in D&D?
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Aug 11, 2023 06:56
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The aid rules kinda confuse me, and I think I've been fudging them. Like, recently - I was running beginner's box and the party got to the final barracks room of kobolds before the bosses by going around through the xulguths, one of which 1-shot crit someone unconcious. Anyway, they're aware of the encounter ahead of time, notice and bypass the mermaid trap, and wind up getting set up to come at the unaware kobolds from two sides. As they burst in the front one of the players yodels to the one behind the blocked alternative entrance, and I A. insist they actually do this, and then give them a hero point. B. have them roll a performance check to notify the person doing this and also inspire / aid them. They pass. I give the person a +1 circumstance modifier. That +1 modifier (and a +2 from the altars to the str check) winds up making the difference, and he then burst into the room, kool-aid man style. This of course trivialized the encounter, but hey, it was fun.
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Aug 12, 2023 15:35
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Buffer posted:The aid rules kinda confuse me, and I think I've been fudging them. My amateur understanding of RAW is that the player has to spend 1 action to notify that they want to Aid, and then use their reaction to roll the relevant skill/attack check to see if they succeed. The way I run that as a GM is that if they're spending their reaction on an Aid they can do the relevant roll on their turn and I may/may not withhold the results to add some suspense, and then proceed as normal. Sometimes the player wants to use another reaction that round and I have to remind them that they spent it on Aid, and so far no one has had an issue with that.
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Aug 12, 2023 16:14
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Buffer posted:The aid rules kinda confuse me, and I think I've been fudging them. Honestly, this is fine enough that I wouldn't raise an eyebrow at it in practice. I don't quite recall if the altar gives a status or circumstance bonus. Usually, I'd probably say that it'd have to help in a more direct fashion, though (barring One for All or similar). In this particular case, I'd probably have them roll Athletics for initiative and to determine if they bust through immediately or need to take actions on their turn. In terms of actual actions, basically it's a specific type of Ready, except instead of readying an action (and costing two actions), you ready help for your ally.
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Aug 12, 2023 16:25
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Because the DC is fixed, Aid is very bad at lower levels, and you should just fudge it. Pure opinion here but: much like Recall Knowledge, getting a failure on Aid at low levels sort of breaks the game's action economy. One Action + Reaction for a +1 on another player's roll is perfectly balanced and fine, maybe a skitch overpowered at low levels when a lot of classes just don't have Reactions anyways and so it's functionally costing one Action. However, having to roll against DC 20 at level 1 - where there's a very decent chance you're going to do absolutely nothing, or even get a critical fail and apply a penalty - completely busts it open and makes it feel like a garbage choice. It takes it from cool and good to "don't use this until you have Expert proficiency and can hand out +2s like they're nothing". I suspect it will get changed in the Remaster.
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Aug 12, 2023 18:33
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I will say Aid becomes amazing at higher levels, my Magus often gets an Aid for +3 from a Swashbuckler, which significantly ups the crit rate.
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Aug 12, 2023 18:41
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Just make Aid a standard DC for you level IMO
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Aug 12, 2023 18:57
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How does Aid work with helping with Strikes? Do you have to be adjacent to the ally? To the enemy? etc?
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Aug 12, 2023 19:05
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appropriatemetaphor posted:How does Aid work with helping with Strikes? Archives of Nethys posted:Similarly, a character usually needs to be next to their ally or a foe to Aid the ally in attacking the foe. "Usually", so GM fiat if they want to allow ranged aid.
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Aug 12, 2023 19:22
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I don't require a roll and just give +1/2/3/4 based on proficiency because the aid check isn't interesting for 80% of your career and definitely isn't as cool as whatever check you were actually aiding. Rolling slows down play at all levels and shuts down teamwork at low levels for zero benefit.
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Aug 12, 2023 20:02
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Burning a reaction makes it pretty bad for a fighter to aid someone anyway. Fighter, Rogue, Champion, and a lot of martial classes as well.
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Aug 12, 2023 20:32
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xK1 posted:https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=842 we have an investigator with a gun our GM allows to do covering fire via aid when their strategic analysis shows they'd miss (and they don't have anything better to do) and it hasn't been unbalanced or op so i'd recommend it
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Aug 13, 2023 00:34
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How do you guys normally handle abitrating interact actions for things like pulling out wands or scrolls, or shuffling items around to free up hands? The RAW honestly seem excessively fiddly unless I'm misunderstanding something. According to this table (https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=194), let's imagine a character holding a Greataxe who wants to pull out a potion and drink it. From what I can tell, they need to: -Drop their weapon entirely or release one hand from the grip (free action) -Remove their backpack (interact) -Pull the potion out of the pack (interact) -Drink the potion (interact) Their turn is over -Next turn, pick up their weapon or change their grip to be holding it in 2 hands again (interact, maybe two interacts??) -Their backpack is still on the floor in that space and I refuse to believe any GM has ever actually tracked this in a real game Scoss fucked around with this message at 02:40 on Aug 13, 2023 |
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Aug 13, 2023 02:35
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I think the fiddly extra action thing is supposed to just make it matter whether you're wearing something or have it in your pack. I think you should be able to wear the potion instead of having it in your pack? But otherwise yeah it takes a decent number of actions to use an item if you don't have some feature to improve it.
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Aug 13, 2023 02:45
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Okay, I see now that there is a kind of intermediate storage category of "worn" items in your pockets and such. If I wanted to simplify things just a bit, would these houserules invite abuse, compete with existing features players might be expected to aim for, or otherwise get me in trouble? Is there a good reason to strictly monitor free hands? -Stow a held item with the same interact action you use to pull out a worn item (I always hate the idea of dropping weapons or wands or something on the ground in the middle of a fight) -Allow hands holding shields or the second hand holding a 2hander to count as a free hand, at the cost of not being able to use the shield/weapon on the same turn
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Aug 13, 2023 03:02
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Scoss posted:Okay, I see now that there is a kind of intermediate storage category of "worn" items in your pockets and such. The first is pretty standard, the second is actually a possible problem because that takes away a balance aspect of 2H vs 1H. See the Nimble Shield Hand feat for instance.
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Aug 13, 2023 03:53
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Always played fine in my experience. Players appreciate the hands rules when their enemy spends an action putting their hand back on their great sword and ends their turn. Never really felt complicated and I like that there’s a cost to accessing stowed items. Consumables can be really strong and picking out the thing from the sack should come at an action cost. sugar free jazz fucked around with this message at 03:58 on Aug 13, 2023 |
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Aug 13, 2023 03:56
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Just assume they've got the potion on their belt or whatever. Backpack is for stuff you won't need in combat ever. So Release Grip (free action), Grab Potion (interact), Drink Potion (interact), Regrip to Two Hands (interact). Another reason that I think my favorite type of Fighter is one-handed, you get all the athletic maneuvers and you can easily roll into battle with a potion in your hand already.
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Aug 13, 2023 04:17
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appropriatemetaphor posted:Just assume they've got the potion on their belt or whatever. Backpack is for stuff you won't need in combat ever. it seems comically bizarre to walk into battle with a potion in one hand and have that be optimal
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Aug 13, 2023 04:28
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Taciturn Tactician posted:it seems comically bizarre to walk into battle with a potion in one hand and have that be optimal That's not optimal if you're playing the grabby type of Fighter.
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Aug 13, 2023 04:32
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Taciturn Tactician posted:it seems comically bizarre to walk into battle with a potion in one hand and have that be optimal It's...not really that optimal? You're making some hard tradeoffs there - can't use maneuvers until you use/stash the pot, can't use shields, can't use parry skills (because that requires a free hand), you're stuck with a 1h weapon, and you really better need that potion and not another one. Still, has its uses.
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Aug 13, 2023 04:50
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True optimum is Gnoll with Crunch or a Lizardfolk with Sharp Fangs for a 1d8 Bite attack, one free hand, one hand holding a potion (or shield), getting the free hand benefits, standard damage for a 1-handed weapon, and then holding a useful item in your other hand
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Aug 13, 2023 13:03
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Instructions unclear, continuing to use a greatsword on my pixie.
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Aug 13, 2023 13:25
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Can you cast Magic Weapon on your bite attack to give yourself magic +1 striking teeth? More importantly would that make you chew food faster?
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Aug 13, 2023 18:18
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Clerical Terrors posted:Can you cast Magic Weapon on your bite attack to give yourself magic +1 striking teeth? No but you can cast magic fang. (Also Handwraps of mighty blows work just fine.)
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Aug 13, 2023 18:21
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Chevy Slyme posted:No but you can cast magic fang. They really thought of everything
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Aug 13, 2023 18:28
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Piell posted:True optimum is Gnoll with Crunch or a Lizardfolk with Sharp Fangs for a 1d8 Bite attack, one free hand, one hand holding a potion (or shield), getting the free hand benefits, standard damage for a 1-handed weapon, and then holding a useful item in your other hand I actually did this, making a Lizardfolk Champion/Oracle with a shield in our dual-class game. It was very entertaining.
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Aug 14, 2023 05:16
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