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One has only to watch any given hour of 1960s television to understand why the women's lib movement happened.
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Aug 19, 2023 01:58
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Fighting Trousers posted:One has only to watch any given hour of 1960s television to understand why the women's lib movement happened. I mean, the closing message of TOS is literally "Bitches be crazy, am I right fellas?"
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Aug 19, 2023 02:01
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nine-gear crow posted:I mean, the closing message of TOS is literally "Bitches be crazy, am I right fellas?"  Closing credits, cue end credits theme.
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Aug 19, 2023 02:05
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I've been wondering as I watched the first half of season one why no one talks about Yeoman Rand the way they talk about other TOS characters. She's been in way more scenes than Uhura at this point and might even give the impression that she's a central member of the cast and Uhura is the guest star or featured actress of the episode. Charlie X very nearly starred Rand as its central TOS character as well. I'm guessing she is either written off at some point, or the actress died, or she just wasn't interested in doing the films or conventions and so fell off the radar.
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Aug 19, 2023 02:10
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Atlas Hugged posted:I've been wondering as I watched the first half of season one why no one talks about Yeoman Rand the way they talk about other TOS characters. She's been in way more scenes than Uhura at this point and might even give the impression that she's a central member of the cast and Uhura is the guest star or featured actress of the episode.
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Aug 19, 2023 02:12
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FlamingLiberal posted:The actress was being sexually harassed by a producer. She never named who it was, but she left the show pretty early on. They brought the actress back a few times later when they did the movies, and she appears once on Voyager. Ah well there it is. I'll keep my eyes open for her when I get to the films (which I've seen already, but not in the context of the show). Miri felt like a bad Twilight Zone episode, but I didn't outright hate it. Mudd's Women is the episode that has most leaned into the "wagon train to the stars" premise, but it's also just real bad. That loving accent on Mudd. Little Girls I actually kind of like. It's very Forbidden Planet.
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Aug 19, 2023 02:17
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Miri definitely feels like they just took a Twilight Zone script and put the crew in it, yes. It's a weird one for TOS.
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Aug 19, 2023 02:18
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Atlas Hugged posted:I've been wondering as I watched the first half of season one why no one talks about Yeoman Rand the way they talk about other TOS characters. She's been in way more scenes than Uhura at this point and might even give the impression that she's a central member of the cast and Uhura is the guest star or featured actress of the episode. She was sexually assaulted by a producer and fired from the show three days later because they 'wanted to go in a different direction with Kirk' and totally not as a result of that incident at all.
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Aug 19, 2023 02:19
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Atlas Hugged posted:Mudd's Women is the episode that has most leaned into the "wagon train to the stars" premise, but it's also just real bad. That loving accent on Mudd. Mudd owns actually
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Aug 19, 2023 02:22
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Apart from everything else, Mudd's Women is fairly incoherent. It's trying to make a point about self confidence but the ending doesn't make sense - Eve needed the Venus drug to be beautiful, but not really because they switched the drug with colored gelatin so she was actually beautiful all along? It's also still in the context of marrying the gruff bald miner who reminds me of one of my uncles (you'll see this actor again in TOS if you keep watching, those who are working their way through the series).
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Aug 19, 2023 02:25
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skasion posted:“What Are Little Girls Made Of” is so bad its good 
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Aug 19, 2023 02:29
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Atlas Hugged posted:Little Girls I actually kind of like. It's very Forbidden Planet. Yeah, both in tone and in the central concept of the mad scientist squatting in the alien ruins with their weird machines. Also just a fun looking production, full of character overall. The ridiculous outfit on Andrea. Ruk. The dick stalactite. the unforgettable racist Kirk robot
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Aug 19, 2023 02:32
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FlamingLiberal posted:Miri definitely feels like they just took a Twilight Zone script and put the crew in it, yes. It's a weird one for TOS. A lot of the episodes I've seen so far have felt like Twilight Zone episodes. The Man Trap and Charlie X for sure have the anthology show "what if" vibe to them. The Enemy Within could also be one if you subbed out the transporter accident or just set it in a whacky professor's lab like The Fly. To Boldly Go could also be a Twilight Zone episode if you drop crossing the galactic barrier as the cause for the psychic powers growing in strength. Again, just set it on Earth and have a different trigger and bam Twilight Zone. It's not like the The Twilight Zone ever shied away from including little green men. Really, Mudd's Women is the episode that feels the most like Trek because it's genuinely about the crew, the ship, surviving in the extremes of space and the frontier, and dealing with nefarious characters at the edge of the reach of the law. The Enemy Within gets close with the Sulu subplot, but that's just a metaphor for Kirk's failing command. The episode is really about exploring the duality of man. Speaking of, it really bothered me during the episode how they kept pointing out that the soft Kirk needed the evil Kirk to be fit for command, but no one ever pointed out that the evil Kirk was also not fit and needed the soft Kirk to be fit for command as well. I guess that's the difference between toxic and positive masculinity.
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Aug 19, 2023 02:35
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The germ of a good idea in "The Enemy Within" was eventually fully realized in TNG's "Tapestry". It's a better way of using sci-fi magic to see what the captain would be like if he wasn't willing to take risks, which is a much better and less problematic way of framing it than "evil side and good side"
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Aug 19, 2023 03:17
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Boxturret posted:Helvetica, tragic Lucky Medibot was invented and they can clear that right up. Even give you a daring conversation tusk.
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Aug 19, 2023 04:35
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If anyone had actually paid attention to "The Enemy Within" it's not "good side/evil side". It's more like ego and id.
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Aug 19, 2023 05:03
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McSpanky posted:If anyone had actually paid attention to "The Enemy Within" it's not "good side/evil side". It's more like ego and id. Yeah, "Evil" Kirk isn't evil, he's just Kirk's worst impulses, his drive to leap without looking and take whatever he thinks is his, so he comes across like a domineering rear end in a top hat. "Good" Kirk meanwhile was all of Kirk's tempering qualities, the part that made him a brilliant tactician, but without the drive to take the initiative and see things through, resulting in an absolute wuss of a man. Neither man can be a complete person without the other half.
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Aug 19, 2023 05:11
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Well, Suddenly Human does not make a good first impression, what with the howling sullen teenager and Picard and Co just making the situation worse at every turn. Stewart acts the hell out of every scene though. He's pretty much holding this one together, but it's funny how Picard's aversion to children has come back only a couple of episodes after his easygoing rapport with his nephew. Yet another convoluted super duper future space game, this time some sort of tennis thing. Wesley takes a load of goo to the face and everybody laughs. And then a resolution that basically tells you what you already know; "Whoops, we hosed up this all up, sorry." I don't know if I feel vindicated or annoyed by that. Remember Me is real good! A weirdo Beverly focused mystery where she's the only one noticing that the crew is disappearing after Wesley does MAD SCIENCE. It's eerie as hell, members of the crew constantly vanishing, Spielbergian light shows and a real frightening finale as she has to make her escape from a collapsing universe. I can pick holes. She does look a bit of a dimwit taking so long to figure out that she needs to be in engineering. Wil Wheaton's complexion in this episode is not nice, I guess that goo did nothing for his skin. There, holes picked. Otherwise, really enjoyed that.
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Aug 19, 2023 08:39
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"If there's nothing wrong with me, maybe there's something wrong with the universe!" is one of my favorite lines ever.
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Aug 19, 2023 08:50
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so on enterprise is archer just being captain (badly) without a dedicated XO/first officer? role seems to switch between tpol, boarding school boy and trip but they are science/security/engineering didn't hate "the andorrian incident" this morning but how could I hate some combs action, fairly well put together compared with what I watched so far
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Aug 19, 2023 11:03
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Another thing I should have pointed out; the ample Gates McFadden screen time gave me a chance to finally register just how oddly she moves about the place. Forearms up, elbows at her side, hips shimmying and swaying about like she's about to break into a tap dance number. I know she's got a background in dance, but I never really thought about it before. It reminds me of Christopher Walken when he's not blatantly dancing, just generally moving around in scenes.
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Aug 19, 2023 11:05
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"The natural walk of a striptease queen", was it?McSpanky posted:If anyone had actually paid attention to "The Enemy Within" it's not "good side/evil side". It's more like ego and id. You're not wrong, but they do explicitly frame it that way -- "evil", "negative", "dark" -- in the episode itself. quote:SPOCK: We have here an unusual opportunity to appraise the human mind, or to examine, in Earth terms, the roles of good and evil in a man. His negative side, which you call hostility, lust, violence, and his positive side, which Earth people express as compassion, love, tenderness. quote:MCCOY: Jim, you're no different than anyone else. We all have our darker side. We need it! It's half of what we are. It's not really ugly, it's human. Spock is somewhat playing with "your human terms" here and he relates it to his own struggle with his 2 halves, which is all good stuff. But usually when an alien says "your human terms" we're not supposed to assume he's wrong, just that he's talking to the audience. It's not hard to get the wrong lesson from this, i.e. "we can't be too good, too compassionate, or else we won't be able to get anything accomplished". Like I was saying, "Tapestry" is a much healthier version of this same idea. It characterized the missing ingredient as a willingness to take initiative and take risks, which are qualities that can be abused, but are not inherently abusive. Whereas the former episode seemed to be saying "just don't be too abusive." Sir Lemming fucked around with this message at 12:27 on Aug 19, 2023 |
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Aug 19, 2023 12:24
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cenotaph posted:"If there's nothing wrong with me, maybe there's something wrong with the universe!" is one of my favorite lines ever. This is how I choose to live my life
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Aug 19, 2023 14:34
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DesperateDan posted:so on enterprise is archer just being captain (badly) without a dedicated XO/first officer? T'Pol was the first officer as well as science officer, which was a direct reference to the roles Spock filled on TOS. But yeah, ENT's command structure could be...squishy. quote:didn't hate "the andorrian incident" this morning but how could I hate some combs action, fairly well put together compared with what I watched so far Any ENT episode with Jeffery Combs in the guest credits is going to be a good time. (except for the finale, but we don't discuss that)
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Aug 19, 2023 15:11
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In theory Trip was the first officer. But he was in engineering 99% of the time so T'Pol was the actual first officer.
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Aug 19, 2023 17:09
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I love the bit at the end where Picard acts all confused at her saying that this giant ship was made for more than two people. The Enterprise was just for the two of them to explore the galaxy together, how romantic.
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Aug 19, 2023 17:22
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Boxturret posted:I love the bit at the end where Picard acts all confused at her saying that this giant ship was made for more than two people. The Enterprise was just for the two of them to explore the galaxy together, how romantic. And yet, as zoux pointed out earlier in the thread, he trusts her despite the absurdity of the idea. Because even in a weird fake reality where Crusher's not sure what to believe, the possibility of a Starfleet officer not trusting his crew, and not earnestly engaging their concerns, would be too weird.
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Aug 19, 2023 17:35
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MuddyFunster posted:Another thing I should have pointed out; the ample Gates McFadden screen time gave me a chance to finally register just how oddly she moves about the place. Forearms up, elbows at her side, hips shimmying and swaying about like she's about to break into a tap dance number. I know she's got a background in dance, but I never really thought about it before. It reminds me of Christopher Walken when he's not blatantly dancing, just generally moving around in scenes. Do remember the casting notes were for the doctor to have the shimmy of "a striptease artist," so maybe McFadden was just sticking to the original intent of the character. I like "Remember Me" a lot, but feel they gave away the mystery too early in the episode with the scenes in the "normal" universe. Tension could've been heightened further, I think. Plus it's the return of pedo-van Traveler.
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Aug 19, 2023 17:36
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Watching TNG and there's a child actress in Dark Page who I think "huh, she kind of looks like Kirsten Dunst." It's Kirsten Dunst. 
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Aug 19, 2023 23:01
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My sister and I used to intentionally misquote one of her character's lines as "Who is hetero?"
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Aug 19, 2023 23:12
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Legacy, bit more Tasha Yar lore, the Enterprise finally visiting Rape Gang Planet, which was... Barely explained before, other than just "Oh no, look out, the rape gangs". The situation is that much further clarified, beyond the usual two sided conflict between the interchangeable Hoopty Doos and the Rumpty Tums. But it's not really about that, it's more about Tasha's sister and Data getting his heart broke. It was FINE, nothing more. Reunion; Hooray, yet more Klingons! All the stuff coming back, lots more continuity bumf, more conspiracy stuff. We got Duras returning, we got *hits google to copy paste the spelling* K'Ehleyr returning, that big fat one is there, then he carks it, that's sad. And then we get the immortal line "That's Gowron" and it cuts to the man himself, DOING THE FACE, boggling his eyes out like a pro-wrestler and looking menacing. Not even a fanboy with all the knowledge of the show, as you may know, but I know Gowron and his boggly eyes. And then there's the first (?) appearance of a bat'leth, that's... Certainly a thing. Oh and Worf's got a little baby Worf now! Yes, still love all the Klingon nonsense, it is good fun. And yet more dangling loose ends (what's with the bomb? who poisoned fatkins?) mean there's probably more to come, I guess! Six episodes down and apart from Remember Me (which still has traces) they're all heavily family themed, huh.
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Aug 20, 2023 01:14
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Yes there is a whole running thread of Klingon political intrigue that goes on most of the show
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Aug 20, 2023 01:29
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That's good as long as there's more of Gowron and his face.
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Aug 20, 2023 01:48
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MuddyFunster posted:That's good as long as there's more of Gowron and his face. He also shows up on DS9
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Aug 20, 2023 02:01
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Dagger of the Mind - Not much to say about this one. I liked seeing that the escaped doctor was actually totally sound of mind and I could absolutely see a prison warden descending into madness like that. The security guard getting zapped is the highlight. B+ all around. The Corbomite Maneuver - This feels like a proto-submarine episode. It's entirely on the Enterprise and they're in a desperate situation to save the ship. There are genuinely great scenes on the bridge where we learn just how and why the bridge crew have to keep their cools. Bailey freaking out with 8 minutes on the clock and being relieved of duty was pitch perfect. I also really got the sense of what the Starfleet Captain is in this episode. He has experts across a variety of fields to give him advice, but ultimately it's his call how far he pushes the crew and the ship itself. He gets to decide how far they're tested, not his advisors, but he'd also be a fool to ignore them entirely. Goofy ending, but great episode overall. The Menagerie - The brownies had really kicked in by the time I got here. I got through about half of part 2 before deciding I needed to regroup for the night. I'll finish that in a bit. Do I really need to see The Cage? Outside of the framing device, is it substantially different?
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Aug 20, 2023 03:20
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Atlas Hugged posted:Dagger of the Mind - Not much to say about this one. I liked seeing that the escaped doctor was actually totally sound of mind and I could absolutely see a prison warden descending into madness like that. The security guard getting zapped is the highlight. B+ all around. The Cage is worth it as a curiosity piece. A peek into an alternate universe of what Star Trek could have been at one point, but otherwise no, what's there in The Menagerie is what's canon to TOS, SNW and beyond and that's all that matters story-wise.
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Aug 20, 2023 03:26
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MuddyFunster posted:That's good as long as there's more of Gowron and his face. Robert O'Reilly's Gowron faces were the perfect blend of sadistic creep and weaselly politician.
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Aug 20, 2023 03:38
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Atlas Hugged posted:The Menagerie - The brownies had really kicked in by the time I got here. I got through about half of part 2 before deciding I needed to regroup for the night. I'll finish that in a bit. Do I really need to see The Cage? Outside of the framing device, is it substantially different? Once you've seen The Menagerie, you've seen everything you really need to of The Cage. There are a few scenes that were cut for time but none of them really matter. Check it out if you're in a 100%-completionist mood; otherwise, skip it.
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Aug 20, 2023 04:04
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AlternateNu posted:Robert O'Reilly's Gowron faces were the perfect blend of sadistic creep and weaselly politician. Gowron's eyes could have shot out of his face like rocket fists and killed a man and I'd have taken it completely in stride
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Aug 20, 2023 04:07
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cenotaph posted:"If there's nothing wrong with me, maybe there's something wrong with the universe!" is one of my favorite lines ever. It is loving astonishing how consistently Beverly will tell anyone in the crew "Something's wrong" and they immediately believe her, every goddamn time and she's right every goddamn time. She is the most confident woman in Trek, even Janeway's like "Am I doing the right thing, Chakotay??" once in a while and Bev's like "Fly this ship into the sun, we've a heat shield that Ferengi told me would work once"
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Aug 20, 2023 05:26
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