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The Dave
Sep 9, 2003

Check with your energy provider, they're often heavily discounted there.

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100 HOGS AGREE
Oct 13, 2007
Grimey Drawer

Eeyo posted:

I asked a bit ago about house energy audits, what should I expect to pay for a good one? One place quoted me $1800 for door blower, infrared cameras, hvac equipment tests, and duct testing.

Consumers Energy did a basic one at my new house for free, then sent me a check for fifteen dollars. The guy gave me some tips and places I could call that he knew on what you can do for more intensive checks like you're asking, but I think that was just the dude I had and not like, official from the power company.

Hed
Mar 31, 2004

Fun Shoe
If it's $1800 for a check, I wish I could just move straight to mitigation--suck out my attic, seal up light fixtures and any other penetrations, then pile the insulation on.

Douche4Sale
May 8, 2003

...and then God said, "Let there be douche!"

I just had a 2-year old hot water heater fail in the house we moved into 1 year ago. Multiple large holes rusted through along the base. We've got hard water, but uh, that level of deterioration that fast is wild.

This is the 2nd warranty service on this unit after having the ignition system replaced earlier this year. The plumber for that rolled his eyes and said he was shocked that it lasted this long, because that batch of Rheems was notorious for this particular failure.

After getting off the phone with Rheem, they are saying to have the unit drained, disconnected, and return it to Menards for a replacement. I obviously don't have the original receipt, so I'm super excited to fight with Menards about that. It was clear that I would have to pay a price difference between units and all the costs associated with disconnecting it and then installing the new one.

So, I guess I have a couple of questions:
1. We live in WI and the unit is going into our basement, where the temperature is usually low 60s to upper 70s at the extremes. Current one is gas, but I'm unclear if a hybrid makes sense? Temp swings aren't that extreme down there, so the bigger upfront costs make sense in the long-term, right? And there are federal energy credits I can get too. Anything I am overlooking vs just getting another gas system?
2. I've ruled out tankless because we have 2 kids and a whirlpool bath - going 55 gallon tank+ to make everyone happy. That makes sense too, right?
3. How involved is removing a water heater? I've done toilet installs, routed electrical and installed ceiling fans from scratch, etc. for a sense of my skill level. In my mind, half the work is done from when I shut off the water and gas to the unit - now I just need to disconnect it. Or am I oversimplifying stuff and it is best left to a plumber?
4. Related, what about the installation? Similarly straightforward or should I get that installed too? Does having a hybrid complicate the install (separate breaker line maybe? Probably adding a GFCI outlet at minimum, right?)?

I hate having to deal with all this stuff that I would normally take time to research and decide on in the context of trying to make things happen quickly so I can get back to having hot water.

Tezer
Jul 9, 2001

Douche4Sale posted:

1. We live in WI and the unit is going into our basement, where the temperature is usually low 60s to upper 70s at the extremes. Current one is gas, but I'm unclear if a hybrid makes sense? Temp swings aren't that extreme down there, so the bigger upfront costs make sense in the long-term, right? And there are federal energy credits I can get too. Anything I am overlooking vs just getting another gas system?

Talk to your tax advisor about tax credits, there may be local ones that I wouldn't be aware of. Here is one of the federal credit programs for 2023 that would apply to a heat pump water heater:
https://www.energystar.gov/about/federal_tax_credits/water_heaters_non_solar

The design mistakes I see with unit-mounted heat pump water heaters: not properly reading the install details on supply air/minimum square footage of the utility room, not appreciating the recovery time and buying a tank that is too small, and noise (really only an issue if it's installed in a room that is being used for other purposes).

quote:

2. I've ruled out tankless because we have 2 kids and a whirlpool bath - going 55 gallon tank+ to make everyone happy. That makes sense too, right?

The calculation is different.

Tank storage units pose the question: 'can I complete my concurrent water use activities before the stored hot water is used up (total gallons used in a discrete time period)'
Instantaneous units pose the question: 'is the draw (gallons per minute) of my anticipated concurrent uses less than the advertised supply rate'

Typically with unit-mounted heat pump water heaters I would recommend installing the largest tank you can fit as recovery times can be longer than you are used to. So if you currently have a 55 gallon tank, maybe go for an 80 gallon tank. You can find the recovery data in the system specifications and draw your own conclusions.

quote:

3. How involved is removing a water heater? I've done toilet installs, routed electrical and installed ceiling fans from scratch, etc. for a sense of my skill level. In my mind, half the work is done from when I shut off the water and gas to the unit - now I just need to disconnect it. Or am I oversimplifying stuff and it is best left to a plumber?
4. Related, what about the installation? Similarly straightforward or should I get that installed too? Does having a hybrid complicate the install (separate breaker line maybe? Probably adding a GFCI outlet at minimum, right?)?

I don't do a lot of my own plumbing these days, a water leak can ruin your home faster than you would imagine. I stick to DIY activities that have less catastrophic potential. A good installer will know the tax credits/rebates as well.

PainterofCrap
Oct 17, 2002

hey bebe



Douche4Sale posted:

...
3. How involved is removing a water heater? I've done toilet installs, routed electrical and installed ceiling fans from scratch, etc. for a sense of my skill level. In my mind, half the work is done from when I shut off the water and gas to the unit - now I just need to disconnect it. Or am I oversimplifying stuff and it is best left to a plumber?

4. Related, what about the installation? Similarly straightforward or should I get that installed too? Does having a hybrid complicate the install (separate breaker line maybe? Probably adding a GFCI outlet at minimum, right?)?

I hate having to deal with all this stuff that I would normally take time to research and decide on in the context of trying to make things happen quickly so I can get back to having hot water.

Sounds like you are comfortable disconnecting the gas, water, and electric (if it's a power-vented unit) - it is that simple.

Drain it down; the unit will be bulky, and has some mass but it's a large bottle/can wrapped in a can. You need to plan getting it out & the new one in. Unboxing the replacement will make it easier to manipulate.

I have not installed a GFCI for the power vent.

I would plan to replace the hoses/piping to the unit. Be sure you are installing similar metals, or use the proper pipe dope if not (copper/brass ---> steel). Good time to make sure your gas piping is in good nick as well. Don't forget the drip leg & pressure relief downpipe if it doesn't already have them.

I've done four over the thirty years I've had our house, and by myself. I'd never done it before I did the first in 1992. It would be easier with two people, especially if you have to maneuver through tight spaces. I was able to yeet the first 3 (40-gal) out through the basement window, but my current Rheem PV unit* had to come down the stairs.

(*mine didn't rust out, but I did replace it under warranty due to, evidently, a bad power vent unit. It kept shutting itself off. Took 2-years to get to the point you are now at)

Ham Equity
Apr 16, 2013

The first thing we do, let's kill all the cars.
Grimey Drawer
As far as babby's first home improvement project, how difficult is running UTP to faceplates I would need to install? I've got an expired Network+ certificate, so I suppose I ostensibly know what I'm doing (I've literally never crimped a cable before in my life, and in fact wound up just skipping the "what is the proper pin color order for a crossover cable" questions)? It's the upstairs, so we'll just be running it through the crawlspace.

Kaiser Schnitzel
Mar 29, 2006

Schnitzel mit uns


Ham Equity posted:

As far as babby's first home improvement project, how difficult is running UTP to faceplates I would need to install? I've got an expired Network+ certificate, so I suppose I ostensibly know what I'm doing (I've literally never crimped a cable before in my life, and in fact wound up just skipping the "what is the proper pin color order for a crossover cable" questions)? It's the upstairs, so we'll just be running it through the crawlspace.

I am literally a moron at anything networking and was able to do it myself. I can't remember how, but I definitely did it. I think the AT&T might have done a splice somewhere, I know I didn't do it, but I had no problem running wire to faceplates.

Sirotan
Oct 17, 2006

Sirotan is a seal.


Ham Equity posted:

As far as babby's first home improvement project, how difficult is running UTP to faceplates I would need to install? I've got an expired Network+ certificate, so I suppose I ostensibly know what I'm doing (I've literally never crimped a cable before in my life, and in fact wound up just skipping the "what is the proper pin color order for a crossover cable" questions)? It's the upstairs, so we'll just be running it through the crawlspace.

Crimping cables sucks rear end, just buy premade patch cables instead imho. Have you ever used a punchdown tool before? That's gonna be the more necessary skill here. How easy or hard the cable runs will be depends entirely on how easy the space is to access. Buying some fish tape and fish rods (I recommend the fiberglass glow in the dark ones) will make pulling the cable a lot easier. You can get keystones and a punchdown tool set, boxes of cable (get two so you can pull two cables at the same time for every drop), patch panel, patch cables, etc all from Monoprice for a pretty good price. Just pick A or B for the punchdown config and follow the color guides on the keystones when punching down, it's pretty easy.

Muir
Sep 27, 2005

that's Doctor Brain to you
It was super easy, I did it a few months ago. Got a big spool of cable and a bunch of keystone jacks. Make sure you get a line tester and test everything as you go so you can redo the jack on the spot if needed. I was pretty proud that all my jacks worked the first time and I ended up finding a broken 5 wire in one of the jacks my contractor put in. Annoyed too, but proud.

Ham Equity
Apr 16, 2013

The first thing we do, let's kill all the cars.
Grimey Drawer

Kaiser Schnitzel posted:

I am literally a moron at anything networking and was able to do it myself. I can't remember how, but I definitely did it. I think the AT&T might have done a splice somewhere, I know I didn't do it, but I had no problem running wire to faceplates.


Sirotan posted:

Crimping cables sucks rear end, just buy premade patch cables instead imho. Have you ever used a punchdown tool before? That's gonna be the more necessary skill here. How easy or hard the cable runs will be depends entirely on how easy the space is to access. Buying some fish tape and fish rods (I recommend the fiberglass glow in the dark ones) will make pulling the cable a lot easier. You can get keystones and a punchdown tool set, boxes of cable (get two so you can pull two cables at the same time for every drop), patch panel, patch cables, etc all from Monoprice for a pretty good price. Just pick A or B for the punchdown config and follow the color guides on the keystones when punching down, it's pretty easy.

Muir posted:

It was super easy, I did it a few months ago. Got a big spool of cable and a bunch of keystone jacks. Make sure you get a line tester and test everything as you go so you can redo the jack on the spot if needed. I was pretty proud that all my jacks worked the first time and I ended up finding a broken 5 wire in one of the jacks my contractor put in. Annoyed too, but proud.

Good to know, thank you all. I can borrow punch/crimping tools from a coworker. The part I'm most scared of is punching holes in the walls for the faceplates. :ohdear:

Incoming connection will be gigabit fiber, what did everyone do as far as cable quality? Cat6? Cat6A? UTP or FTP?

H110Hawk
Dec 28, 2006

Ham Equity posted:

Good to know, thank you all. I can borrow punch/crimping tools from a coworker. The part I'm most scared of is punching holes in the walls for the faceplates. :ohdear:

Incoming connection will be gigabit fiber, what did everyone do as far as cable quality? Cat6? Cat6A? UTP or FTP?

Nothing matters, UTP though. The hardest part is always going to be the parts in the walls.

Sirotan
Oct 17, 2006

Sirotan is a seal.


I went 6 iirc, unshielded. My house is only 1200sqft so 6 was plenty for me and slightly cheaper than 6a.

Muir
Sep 27, 2005

that's Doctor Brain to you
Cat 6, unshielded. Cutting holes in the wall was fine. If you’re nervous, start small and then enlarge the hole. My only snafu was drilling a hole through the exterior wall with one of those really long drill bits for sliding down through the face plate cut out to drill down through the sill plate into the crawl space. Pulled it out and saw sunlight 😱

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg
:colbert:

My builder pre-wired my rooms (5e unfortunately) but left them all loose and not terminated in the utility room. As someone who never did anything with network cables before, punching them down was pretty easy but as mentioned get a kit that includes a tester. it did catch a couple of mistakes.

I think snaking the cable would probably be the hardest part, especially if you have to go to a different level.

H110Hawk
Dec 28, 2006
5e is fine don't worry about it. 6/6a/7 is only for stupidly fast things normal people don't need.

Harminoff
Oct 24, 2005

👽

Douche4Sale posted:

I just had a 2-year old hot water heater fail in the house we moved into 1 year ago. Multiple large holes rusted through along the base. We've got hard water, but uh, that level of deterioration that fast is wild.

This is the 2nd warranty service on this unit after having the ignition system replaced earlier this year. The plumber for that rolled his eyes and said he was shocked that it lasted this long, because that batch of Rheems was notorious for this particular failure.

After getting off the phone with Rheem, they are saying to have the unit drained, disconnected, and return it to Menards for a replacement. I obviously don't have the original receipt, so I'm super excited to fight with Menards about that. It was clear that I would have to pay a price difference between units and all the costs associated with disconnecting it and then installing the new one.

So, I guess I have a couple of questions:
1. We live in WI and the unit is going into our basement, where the temperature is usually low 60s to upper 70s at the extremes. Current one is gas, but I'm unclear if a hybrid makes sense? Temp swings aren't that extreme down there, so the bigger upfront costs make sense in the long-term, right? And there are federal energy credits I can get too. Anything I am overlooking vs just getting another gas system?
2. I've ruled out tankless because we have 2 kids and a whirlpool bath - going 55 gallon tank+ to make everyone happy. That makes sense too, right?
3. How involved is removing a water heater? I've done toilet installs, routed electrical and installed ceiling fans from scratch, etc. for a sense of my skill level. In my mind, half the work is done from when I shut off the water and gas to the unit - now I just need to disconnect it. Or am I oversimplifying stuff and it is best left to a plumber?
4. Related, what about the installation? Similarly straightforward or should I get that installed too? Does having a hybrid complicate the install (separate breaker line maybe? Probably adding a GFCI outlet at minimum, right?)?

I hate having to deal with all this stuff that I would normally take time to research and decide on in the context of trying to make things happen quickly so I can get back to having hot water.


Just a heads up but you don't need a receipt if you remember what card you used. Menards gas a receipt lookup/printer that you use before doing the return. It's super simple.

KoRMaK
Jul 31, 2012



I'm trying to figure out which arborvitae I have here so I can order a replacement. is this an emerald green or one of the other arborvates? how can I tell?


Tunicate
May 15, 2012

update on joists situation, so here's the original cut in half joist from before



it appears what actually happened is they cut out that big notch for Toilet A, and later on renovated to replace it with Toilet B, doing further joist damage in the process



note that the piping hole for Toilet B goes nicely across the edges of two pieces of plywood.

Anyway it's sistered now with a couple of kickers added but the two questions the contractor had are
A) how did this pass inspection during construction
B) how did this pass inspection during purchase

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009

Tunicate posted:

Anyway it's sistered now with a couple of kickers added but the two questions the contractor had are
A) how did this pass inspection during construction
B) how did this pass inspection during purchase

The answer to both questions is "nobody looked".

StormDrain
May 22, 2003

Thirteen Letter

H110Hawk posted:

5e is fine don't worry about it. 6/6a/7 is only for stupidly fast things normal people don't need.

Counterpoint, the faster cable isn't much more expensive ($10/1000ft) and if you're doing the job you may as well put something in that will stave off being depreciated a bit longer.

If we're talking patch cables or stringing something along the basement or crawlspace, go for what's cheap. If it's going to require fishing cable and pulling through the walls, I'm a buy once cry once kinda guy.

I just applied Enduro shield on my glass shower enclosure. I got the small kit which meant I had enough to do the shower and the tub glass in my other bathroom. And the mirror. And the mirrors of two of my cars. And I still have some left and I just kinda looked around thinking I needed to use it because I paid for it.... But I don't actually! I'll do my wife's mirrors and toss the rest. I'm sure this stuff works, but I do hope it works well enough to be worth the effort. Ideally it sheds water enough that my glass doesn't look dirty in a few showers.

H110Hawk
Dec 28, 2006

StormDrain posted:

Counterpoint, the faster cable isn't much more expensive ($10/1000ft) and if you're doing the job you may as well put something in that will stave off being depreciated a bit longer.

Counter counter point it's already in the wall and it's perfectly fine. :v: Just don't worry about it, you can easily shoot gig down it, 2.5/5 I assume would work fine as well but I have limited experience with it.

brugroffil
Nov 30, 2015


Garbage disposal: air switch, or regular switch?

Mustache Ride
Sep 11, 2001



Regular

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009

brugroffil posted:

Garbage disposal: air switch, or regular switch?

It's supposed to be an air switch. If you're putting the switch on your sink/in the counter by the sink it should absolutely be air.

If you're switching it from the wall you'll probably be fine to use a regular switch.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg
:colbert:

Ours disposal was an afterthought when we bought our house so we put our switch (electric) in the cupboard below the sink.

At first I didn't think I'd like it there and really wanted to route the power to the backsplash area, but in reality it's been perfectly fine, super easy to get at (open the cupboard door and its on the top edge) and heck of a lot easier to install.

VelociBacon
Dec 8, 2009

slidebite posted:

Ours disposal was an afterthought when we bought our house so we put our switch (electric) in the cupboard below the sink.

At first I didn't think I'd like it there and really wanted to route the power to the backsplash area, but in reality it's been perfectly fine, super easy to get at (open the cupboard door and its on the top edge) and heck of a lot easier to install.

I too have grown used to my I'll-fix-this-later-for-sure shortcuts as the years have gone on.

Kaiser Schnitzel
Mar 29, 2006

Schnitzel mit uns


Anyone have experience with slate countertops? Everything about them sounds great and I like the look and they are supposedly a bit cheaper than granite, but I'm wondering if they aren't more popular for a reason.

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009

slidebite posted:

Ours disposal was an afterthought when we bought our house so we put our switch (electric) in the cupboard below the sink.

At first I didn't think I'd like it there and really wanted to route the power to the backsplash area, but in reality it's been perfectly fine, super easy to get at (open the cupboard door and its on the top edge) and heck of a lot easier to install.

That's what I had when I bought this place and absolutely hated it. When I switched faucets we put in a pull down type, so I had an extra hole from the sprayer. I used that for an air switch and replaced the light switch under the counter with an outlet to power the air switch, swapped the hard wire cord on the disposal to a plug (like all the new stuff comes these days) to plug into the air switch controller.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg
:colbert:

We probably only use our disposal once a week (if not less) so it's really not an issue for us and after doing it a couple times its super intuitive.

Would I have preferred it on the topside all things being equal? Sure. But it really hasn't been an issue for us.

PainterofCrap
Oct 17, 2002

hey bebe



Mine was on the panel between the sink base cabinet door and the countertop when we bought our house in 1992. I grew up with it there in my mom’s house, so there it stays.

SpartanIvy
May 18, 2007
Hair Elf
Finally got my washer/dryer unit into the tiny little closet corner I built for it. Moving a 300 pound machine when you can't even get your fingers around the sides because there's so little clearance is insanely difficult. I'm glad I haven't installed the door yet because that much less clearance would have made it even worse.

Making things more awful is that I had to move it in and out three different times to get it level. There's so little clearance that there's no margin for error in the level because it'll rock back and forth too much and bang the wall.

If I didn't have an Appliance Buddy(which I had to cut a few inches off the side to get to fit) and lots of Windex, I wouldn't have been able to do it at all.



I told my partner that when it breaks we're just going to move, but more realistically I'll probably buy one of those $700 appliance air lifters.

e: I know there was a lot of interest in my combo unit and its performance when I got it a month ago. I'm happy to say it's been working very well for us. You have to keep on top of the lint filter more than you would a typical dryer, but it washes and dries just as good as the forced air units we had before. We're really happy with it, but the longevity of it is still the big question.

SpartanIvy fucked around with this message at 22:25 on Aug 27, 2023

Democratic Pirate
Feb 17, 2010

Anyone have YouTube recs for gutter redos? The fascia in a corner opposite the drain side warped and now the water collects there and spills down the wall. Thinking I need to replace and reinforce the corner and might as well refresh the gutter if I can.

Probably an easy morning job for a company but I need to up my DIY skills and save some money*

Tool purchases TBD.

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009

SpartanIvy posted:

e: I know there was a lot of interest in my combo unit and its performance when I got it a month ago. I'm happy to say it's been working very well for us. You have to keep on top of the lint filter more than you would a typical dryer, but it washes and dries just as good as the forced air units we had before. We're really happy with it, but the longevity of it is still the big question.

I saw a teardown and test video of this since you got it. They came to the same conclusions: works great, but you must maintain that big lint filter.

The part the blew me away is the heat pump. Since your average washer dryer person is not an HVAC person they made the entire sealed system a field replaceable unit. It's just a big box in the middle of the top with some wires going to it. In fact, the right hand side of that big filter lays against it. Just really, really good engineering for service work. Which is something I rarely see manufacturers spending much time or money on anymore.

I'm sorely temped to get one of them for my walk in closet when I redo it. It shares a wall with the master bath so all the plumbing is right there.

Kylaer
Aug 4, 2007
I'm SURE walking around in a respirator at all times in an (even more) OPEN BIDENing society is definitely not a recipe for disaster and anyone that's not cool with getting harassed by CHUDs are cave dwellers. I've got good brain!
I have a nearly-new basic washer and dryer pair but the heat pump type is really fascinating to me, since it means the dryer won't spend an hour or two hemorrhaging air-conditioned air out of the house every time I run it. If I'd found out about this prior to buying my current set I'd probably have given it a shot. Don't think it makes sense to replace my current set since they're working fine, but it's something I'll file away for the future.

That Works
Jul 22, 2006

Every revolution evaporates and leaves behind only the slime of a new bureaucracy


Kaiser Schnitzel posted:

Anyone have experience with slate countertops? Everything about them sounds great and I like the look and they are supposedly a bit cheaper than granite, but I'm wondering if they aren't more popular for a reason.

Curious about this as well

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009

That Works posted:

Curious about this as well

Same. We pretty much hate out "leathered granite" countertops. Not enough to do something about it right now, but like....we know we don't want that poo poo if and when we re-do the kitchen.

The soapstone ones in a different part of the kitchen are much nicer but also very much more high maintenance to keep looking nice.

Kaiser Schnitzel
Mar 29, 2006

Schnitzel mit uns


Motronic posted:

The soapstone ones in a different part of the kitchen are much nicer but also very much more high maintenance to keep looking nice.
Is there more to it than just oiling them? Also interested in learning more about soapstone. My only experience with them was staying in an airBnB house with black soapstone countertops and the owner leaving very particular instructions about them. IIRC they looked nice but also it didn't take much to make them not look nice in terms of water or soap or vinegar or grease spatters or anything like that, but mineral oil made them look nice again?

It was otherwise a fantastic and practical but not super fancy kitchen owned by a person who clearly actually cooked and had all the pots and pans and implements that people who actually cook use and none of the gadgets that people put in their kitchen to pretend they cook. We even had like a 75% overlap in our 'reliable but not trendy' cookbook collections.

EPICAC
Mar 23, 2001

SpartanIvy posted:


e: I know there was a lot of interest in my combo unit and its performance when I got it a month ago. I'm happy to say it's been working very well for us. You have to keep on top of the lint filter more than you would a typical dryer, but it washes and dries just as good as the forced air units we had before. We're really happy with it, but the longevity of it is still the big question.

What’s a typical wash/dry cycle time?

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SpartanIvy
May 18, 2007
Hair Elf

EPICAC posted:

What’s a typical wash/dry cycle time?

True to the advertisements, two hours is typical. Some are longer, some shorter.

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