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wet_goods
Jun 21, 2004

I'M BAAD!
I’m really enjoying this Spore chat

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Mederlock
Jun 23, 2012

You won't recognize Canada when I'm through with it
Grimey Drawer

shame on an IGA posted:

Very strong "god is real and a prankster" vibes from the way we all go noseblind to H2S as soon it reaches truly dangerous concentrations

When the concentration is that high, all of your mucus membranes will be burning as the H2S dissolves into your snot and eye goop and becomes sulfuric acid(iirc) , so you'll definitely still know something's hosed up

A.o.D.
Jan 15, 2006

Lovely Joe Stalin posted:

I imagine there would be survival benefits to detecting rain or snowfall, back down the evolutionary chain.

We spent a million or two years walking in semi-arid grasslands before we started using tools. Being able to detect rainfall from dozens of miles away was absolutely a survival trait.

McGavin
Sep 18, 2012

Humans can detect rainfall 1,000 times better than a shark can detect blood.

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?
But can they do it underwater?

windshipper
Jun 19, 2006

Dr. Whet Faartz would like to know if this smells funny to you?
Ukrainian forces have made significant gains in the past 72 hours.

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/0...?smid=url-share

cr0y
Mar 24, 2005



Us only being able to detect CO2 and not specifically the lack of oxygen always made me feel like evolution was like "ehh close enough, should generally work the way it's intended"

AlternateNu
May 5, 2005

ドーナツダメ!

Aces High posted:

this reads like one of those real life examples you get told in workplace safety courses "x person was driving their truck, they hit a big pothole and it broke containment, the driver didn't think to put on any PPE before checking and passed out while checking. Their partner went to check on them and passed out, they both died"

complacency (and severe lack of situational awareness) kills

They show a video during high voltage training (e.g.; working on power lines) of an Indian village in the middle of a monsoon. People trudging through waste deep water with the wind blowing in their face. One dude leans again a power pole to steady himself and immediately drops. Someone wades over to him to help him up, puts his hand on the pole for stability, immediately drops. Two other people suffer the same fate over the next 60 seconds. None of them noticed the ceramic insulators at the top all broke off and the primaries were just laying on the pole, energizing it with 12,000+ volts.

Comrade Blyatlov
Aug 4, 2007


should have picked four fingers





cr0y posted:

Us only being able to detect CO2 and not specifically the lack of oxygen always made me feel like evolution was like "ehh close enough, should generally work the way it's intended"

This is exactly how evolution works.

Tunicate
May 15, 2012

windshipper posted:

Ukrainian forces have made significant gains in the past 72 hours.

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/0...?smid=url-share

Not what the article is showing for me.

A.o.D.
Jan 15, 2006

Tunicate posted:

Not what the article is showing for me.

Once you get done blocking all of the necessary elements, you scroll down a few articles to eventually get to a blurb about a Pentagon official vaguely referring to progress on the offensive.

Kazinsal
Dec 13, 2011

Tunicate posted:

Not what the article is showing for me.

god dammit russia why you gotta drop the bomb on a long weekend can you not wait until tuesday

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull

Comrade Blyatlov posted:

This is exactly how evolution works.

Yep. Evolution has no intent or direction.

Sickle-cell is a horrifying example. It's a harmful genetic mutation that causes all kinds of medical issues, but also makes you less likely to die of malaria. In areas of the world where malaria is endemic, this positive effect outweighs the negative effects enough that the mutation is conserved by evolution instead of getting filtered out.

Stultus Maximus
Dec 21, 2009

USPOL May

cr0y posted:

Us only being able to detect CO2 and not specifically the lack of oxygen always made me feel like evolution was like "ehh close enough, should generally work the way it's intended"

In the tens of millions of years of mammalian evolution, a negligible fraction involved any reasonable probability of encountering a concentrated CO2 atmosphere. It works fine.

Tiny Timbs
Sep 6, 2008

cr0y posted:

Us only being able to detect CO2 and not specifically the lack of oxygen always made me feel like evolution was like "ehh close enough, should generally work the way it's intended"

Well yeah. Why should humanity have evolved the capability to detect noxious air when it only ever killed a few curious cave dwellers?

spankmeister
Jun 15, 2008






The Eyes Have It posted:

Humans have really not (as in not all) evolved any ability whatsoever to detect or deal with a situation of "maybe the air here is not actually air as we know it"

There was a dude years ago who bought an old missile silo or something, and in exploring it belatedly realized how close he and his whole crew came to being a snuff film when their voices got higher and everyone actually managed to get out. Dude beat the odds there. But at no point did anyone feel funny or the air tasted weird, or anything. We're just not built that way.

I remember that. Dude seemed like a bit of an idiot tbhq. I remember him wanting to live there and there was a LOT of work to be done and he was always talking about his constrained budget. Then one of the very first things he did was install a super expensive home theater set lol

The Door Frame
Dec 5, 2011

I don't know man everytime I go to the gym here there are like two huge dudes with raging high and tights snorting Nitro-tech off of each other's rock hard abs.

spankmeister posted:

I remember that. Dude seemed like a bit of an idiot tbhq. I remember him wanting to live there and there was a LOT of work to be done and he was always talking about his constrained budget. Then one of the very first things he did was install a super expensive home theater set lol

someone who is good at the economy please help me budget this. my family is dying

Murgos
Oct 21, 2010

A.o.D. posted:

Once you get done blocking all of the necessary elements, you scroll down a few articles to eventually get to a blurb about a Pentagon official vaguely referring to progress on the offensive.

I’ve been upping my intake of ISW the last few days because there is a definite momentum shift happening.

Ukraine seems to be at a point where the slow grinding offense seems to be well, still slowly grinding, but a little more smoothly and deliberately.

The Russian forces in front of the offensive appear to be getting reinforcements from the rest of the line and and those units are being replaced by a new combined arms army made up mostly of units that ground themselves to nothing last winter. Which have been rearming and getting replacements but were not supposed to be deployed for a while yet.

goatsestretchgoals
Jun 4, 2011

The Door Frame posted:

someone who is good at the economy please help me budget this. my family is dying

more candles

Soul Dentist
Mar 17, 2009

Rinkles posted:

But can they do it underwater?

I can definitely detect water at that concentration almost anywhere

canyoneer
Sep 13, 2005


I only have canyoneyes for you

The Door Frame posted:

someone who is good at the economy please help me budget this. my family is dying

spend more on toxic gas mitigation

Cugel the Clever
Apr 5, 2009
I LOVE AMERICA AND CAPITALISM DESPITE BEING POOR AS FUCK. I WILL NEVER RETIRE BUT HERE'S ANOTHER 200$ FOR UKRAINE, SLAVA
The existence of the uncanny valley effect suggests that our ancestors evolved in a context in which quickly identifying and being repulsed by a not quite human entity was essential for survival.

Kei Technical
Sep 20, 2011

Cugel the Clever posted:

The existence of the uncanny valley effect suggests that our ancestors evolved in a context in which quickly identifying and being repulsed by a not quite human entity was essential for survival.

Corpses

Akratic Method
Mar 9, 2013

It's going to pay off eventually--I'm sure of it.

Any day now.

Gotta learn not to gently caress the monkeys somehow.

(…he said, as a probable descendent of people who hosed the non-human hominids)

goatsestretchgoals
Jun 4, 2011

-a habsburg

Lemniscate Blue
Apr 21, 2006

Here we go again.

Cugel the Clever posted:

The existence of the uncanny valley effect suggests that our ancestors evolved in a context in which quickly identifying and being repulsed by a not quite human entity was essential for survival.

Clicky for hugey (read the whole thing, it's good):

goatsestretchgoals
Jun 4, 2011

0/10 didn’t have the it’s aliens guy

e: and for the record I did not read all that because you posted a PNG

goatsestretchgoals fucked around with this message at 05:03 on Sep 2, 2023

B33rChiller
Aug 18, 2011




Arc Light posted:

My most lingering memory of Afghanistan was watching an Afghan soldier exit the Black Hawk on the uphill side of a mountain and promptly lose his head. This was a thing we'd been repeatedly briefed not to do, but it didn't really sink in until that moment.
This is what happens when you grow up without constant MASH reruns.
"Why are they ducking like that, Dad?"
"It's so the helicopter blades don't hit them, son."
Foundational memories.

Mederlock
Jun 23, 2012

You won't recognize Canada when I'm through with it
Grimey Drawer

goatsestretchgoals posted:

0/10 didn’t have the it’s aliens guy

e: and for the record I did not read all that because you posted a PNG

It's a dumb tumblr screed, you didn't miss out on anything.

Lovely Joe Stalin
Jun 12, 2007

Our Lovely Wang

There are different theories, disease/death aversion is one. Iirc the neurological theory based on recorded brain activity is, basically, that the uncanny valley effect is what happens when the most ingrained pattern that our pattern seeking brain looks for is recognised (other humans), but the partner function to that which simultaneously assesses the emotion/intent/threat in expression cannot find a pattern match and so you get a response varying from unease up to fear.
The further you get from short circuiting that fundamental process the less pronounced the effect. Which is why less humanlike = less immediately unsettling, because it's not throwing up your deep brain equivalent of the windows bong noise.

That theory makes more sense to me than the illness/deformity/Other type explanations.

Lovely Joe Stalin fucked around with this message at 05:33 on Sep 2, 2023

kalel
Jun 19, 2012

Mederlock posted:

It's a dumb tumblr screed, you didn't miss out on anything.

I read it all and it makes sense to me. as a fellow tumblr avoider I understand the impulse to ignore it but it's a convincing argument that's presumably well-sourced

Cugel the Clever
Apr 5, 2009
I LOVE AMERICA AND CAPITALISM DESPITE BEING POOR AS FUCK. I WILL NEVER RETIRE BUT HERE'S ANOTHER 200$ FOR UKRAINE, SLAVA

Lemniscate Blue posted:

Clicky for hugey (read the whole thing, it's good):
lol, I was about to respond to "corpses" with "the walking dead?!" but this bringing it to rabies actually makes a lot of sense.

On the other hand, I'm pretty skeptical of the "racism is a modern European invention" tangent... Sure, those fuckers took things to a whole new pseudoscientific extreme, but the human tendency to otherize on the pettiest criteria without the right socialization to the contrary seems pretty obvious to me. Would be curious about their citations, but it's hard not to read as anything but a noble savage myth which undermines our ability to fight the pervasive realities of racism across all cultural boundaries.

poo poo, what thread was this again? Uhh... Слава Україні!

Arc Light
Sep 26, 2013



From a couple of days ago, but I didn't see it here, Ukraine's first batch of Abrams tankers are through training, and their tanks should arrive in country mid-month.

https://www.politico.com/news/2023/08/31/ukrainian-soldiers-complete-training-abrams-tanks-00113668

Tunicate posted:

Not what the article is showing for me.

Weird, might be the link just takes you to the latest update in the feed.

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/0...?smid=url-share

quote:

NY Times: Ukraine’s counteroffensive has made ‘notable progress’ in the last 72 hours, the White House says.

Ukrainian forces have made “notable progress” in their counteroffensive over the last 72 hours, notching wins against the second line of Russian defenders, a White House spokesman, John F. Kirby, said at a news conference on Friday.

The United States, Mr. Kirby said, will not discuss Ukraine’s war plans, or how its forces would exploit their gains. But, he added, the U.S. expects Ukraine to continue to push further south, requiring “tough fighting ahead.”

Ukraine’s military celebrated a tactical victory earlier this week when its forces retook the southern village of Robotyne. Days later, Ukrainian assault units moved east toward Verbove, where several lines of defense converge.

On Friday, Andriy Kovalev, a spokesman for the general staff of Ukraine’s armed forces, said that Ukrainian troops had successfully pushed about three and a half miles farther south of Robotyne toward Melitopol, a primary target of the counteroffensive. Ukrainian troops struck Russian targets with artillery, Mr. Kovalev added.

Mr. Kirby, who is the chief spokesman for the White House’s National Security Agency, said that while the roughly 2-month-old counteroffensive had been slow in some areas, slower than Ukrainian commanders had hoped for, Kyiv’s military had made progress. And any criticism of Ukrainian strategy or operations by anonymous U.S. officials, he said, was not helpful.

Mr. Kirby’s comments came a day after a Ukrainian official made sharp comments deriding criticism of the counteroffensive as slow.

At a meeting of European Union foreign ministers in Spain on Thursday, Ukraine’s foreign minister, Dmytro Kuleba, likened such assessments to “spitting into the face” of Ukrainian soldiers giving their all on the front line, Reuters reported.

“I would recommend all critics to shut up, come to Ukraine and try to liberate one square centimeter by themselves,” he said.

Neither Mr. Kuleba nor Mr. Kirby specified what criticism they were referring to, but two weeks ago, The Washington Post reported on a U.S. intelligence assessment saying that Ukraine would fail to reach the key southeastern city of Melitopol, a key to the counteroffensive’s goal of cutting off Russian supply lines in southern Ukraine. And last week, The New York Times published an article on assessments by U.S. and Western officials that the slow pace of the counteroffensive stemmed from its decision to deploy roughly equal numbers of troops to the fronts in the south and east, rather than focusing on the south.

In July, President Volodymyr Zelensky of Ukraine attributed the counteroffensive’s delayed start partly to the slow arrival of Western weapons. With more than a year to prepare for a Ukrainian offensive in the south, Russian forces had ample time to construct a dense network of fortifications.

On Friday, Mr. Kirby reaffirmed U.S. support for Ukraine, praising its soldiers for fighting “bravely and courageously” and emphasizing that the United States had been “trying to get them what they need.”

The United States wants to help Ukraine capitalize on its recent progress by making sure it has tools, techniques, training and capability to “continue that progress at a pace that they decide is appropriate,” Mr. Kirby said.

Continued U.S. assistance, he said, would include helping Ukraine react “positively and effectively” to any Russian countermoves.

— Julian E. Barnes and Gaya Gupta

LtCol J. Krusinski posted:

:lol:

Have you ever pulled a me and gone “WHO THE gently caress THOUGHT I WAS A FORCE MULTIPLIER IN THIS SITUATION?!” When thinking about your time in the forever wars?

Like, I’m 90% sure you were USAF cyber troop right? Why were you on a Blackhawk with ANA infil’ing on the side of steep terrain? I’m almost certain almost nobody ever joined the goddamn Air Force to work on computers and live with that life experience.

I can’t help but laugh though, because goddamn is that ever on brand for the ANA.

Back in 2012, the Army was hurting for bodies, so the Air Force filled a bunch of Army deployment billets. I got a month of Army training at Ft Dix and then spent the next seven months running comms for an SF team at CJSOTF in Afghanistan. It was... a change of pace, yes. Our guys almost never went out on their own. It was typically a small element from an ODA accompanying larger units of the ANA, either their regulars (terrible) or their commandos (generally competent when they weren't high).

I wasn't on the helicopter; I was at camp running ISR for the TOC chief, which included feeds from some proto-bodycam systems used by the US ODA guys, so I just watched it live on camera. Was one of many many unnecessary ANA deaths that tour, surpassed only by the 3 of them lost while trying to recover a dropped rifle in the middle of a firefight while their US advisors yelled at them to stop running out in front of an RPK.

Alan Smithee
Jan 4, 2005


A man becomes preeminent, he's expected to have enthusiasms.

Enthusiasms, enthusiasms...

Lemniscate Blue posted:

Clicky for hugey (read the whole thing, it's good):







Tunicate posted:

Not what the article is showing for me.

the yield is so small you can't even detect it you might be dead already and not even know it

That Works
Jul 22, 2006

Every revolution evaporates and leaves behind only the slime of a new bureaucracy



Lol

LtCol J. Krusinski
May 7, 2013

by Fluffdaddy
Is the uncanny valley phenomenon culturally independent? I.E. do Asians experience it the same as say Europeans or Africans etc.

Stultus Maximus
Dec 21, 2009

USPOL May

kalel posted:

I read it all and it makes sense to me. as a fellow tumblr avoider I understand the impulse to ignore it but it's a convincing argument that's presumably well-sourced

I assumed it was a parody given the misspelled words and stream of consciousness writing, with part of the joke being that people will assume you know what you are talking about if you write a whole lot with big words and lots of links that nobody will actually bother to check the validity of.

kalel
Jun 19, 2012

Stultus Maximus posted:

I assumed it was a parody given the misspelled words and stream of consciousness writing, with part of the joke being that people will assume you know what you are talking about if you write a whole lot with big words and lots of links that nobody will actually bother to check the validity of.

that's a few irony levels above my pay grade, sorry

Tuna-Fish
Sep 13, 2017

kalel posted:

I read it all and it makes sense to me. as a fellow tumblr avoider I understand the impulse to ignore it but it's a convincing argument that's presumably well-sourced

The part I didn't like was that the writer limited themselves to fairly recent human subspecies (Neanderthals), while Homo Erectus remained at the top of the food chain for about a half a million years after the lineage that lead to modern humans split off, and there is some proof of them hunting and eating other hominids.

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Murgos
Oct 21, 2010

Tuna-Fish posted:

The part I didn't like was that the writer limited themselves to fairly recent human subspecies (Neanderthals), while Homo Erectus remained at the top of the food chain for about a half a million years after the lineage that lead to modern humans split off, and there is some proof of them hunting and eating other hominids.

There’s plenty of evidence of homo-sapiens sapiens hunting and eating other hominids too. Probably don’t need to single out poor misunderstood erectus here.

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