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Spaceship building is lots of fun. I have only two complaints about it: 1. As mentioned earlier in the thread, placement of internal ladders and doors is automatic, with no ability for the player to influence where they go. It's frustrating when the ship you conceived in your head turns into a nonsensical maze once you build it. 2. The rule that every time you modify a ship, every item in it goes in the cargo hold is ridiculous. I understand why it might be technically necessary to reset things when adding new hab blocks, but why do all the guns in my armory and cheese on my desk go into cargo when I upgrade my missile launchers? As someone who upgrades their ship constantly, it turns me off on decorating.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:32
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Basic Chunnel posted:The big red flag on the character build system was starting as an explorer, getting to the Lodge, and they say “guess what we’ve got for you? A jetpack. Now you can double jump.” boostpacks proper functioning being behind three skill challenges is pretty hosed, the game is unplayable for me without 4 levels of the skill now because there's no car and boostpacking is the only way to cover long distances on the ground without burning stamina.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:32
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also the combat slide sucks rear end and i want my perk back
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Sep 7, 2023 20:33
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Is there a point to redoing the main quest on NG+? For the additional XP?
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Sep 7, 2023 20:34
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For me I’m fine with like, lockpick progression being locked (helps that every locked container I come across contains the same stuff you’d find in an unlocked one, maybe with a little cash thrown in). But it’s things like double jump, or the stealth indicator, which feel like I’m being conned out of a level. There’s also the fact that the real fun stuff for tinkerers like me is locked into high level play. Especially when it comes to ships. You hit the ceiling on what you can do very quickly and you either cheat or sit with that ceiling for a very long time. It’s worse than FO4’s attribute gating, tbh. I didn’t have to spend literally 9 levels of FO4 progression before I could build a merchant stall (can you have outpost stores in Starfield?)
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Sep 7, 2023 20:34
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Lexorin posted:I wish the skill upgrade challenges took more effort and didn't cost a skill point. ya, i think this would be the quickest fix for the system imo. There are what, 80ish skills in the game? Each one has four levels so a character would need to be level 320+ to max out everything in this game. Considering that a player will get to level 35-50 when they beat the main quest means that there are a TON of skills and mechanics that will be ignored by each player. Who is taking the cooking or surveying skills when combat is so pervasive in the game? its weird cause what is the design goal of the current system? does bethesda want every character to be highly specialized, necessitating many playthroughs in order to see all the game mechanics, or do they want every character to be able to take on all the content in a single playthrough? If they want to have multiple playthroughs with new characters, then why are there so many NG+ mechanics and why can a player join every faction? It all feels at ends with itself now that i type this all out, i think im gonna just give myself the additional ranks of skills for free to see how that feels, cause like hell am i gonna play through this game 6+ times to see if extra persuasion or better surveying is worth a whole playthrough
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Sep 7, 2023 20:35
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The Oldest Man posted:boostpacks proper functioning being behind three skill challenges is pretty hosed, the game is unplayable for me without 4 levels of the skill now because there's no car and boostpacking is the only way to cover long distances on the ground without burning stamina. *e [i] is not [spoiler], as it happens
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Sep 7, 2023 20:37
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tbf, 9 levels in starfield takes like no time at all to get. I got my important t1 skills maxed out asap and by the time I did that, I had the ability to put points into any tier I wanted. Started getting points for ship building what, 15 hours in or so? definitely gotta plan out what you want to do early though if you want to do stuff like that in loop 1. another big part of what I like about the NG+ system is each playthrough for me can let me focus on a different style and progression. obvs not for everyone to say 'yeah just play for 60 hours youll get everything you want!' but im just glad its there for my sake!
trizzNPH fucked around with this message at 20:46 on Sep 7, 2023 |
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Sep 7, 2023 20:37
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Combat Pretzel posted:Is there a point to redoing the main quest on NG+? For the additional XP? There are different starting sequences every NG+ you hit. Your suit and ship are upgraded and re-roll bonuses every NG+
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Sep 7, 2023 20:39
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CLAM DOWN posted:10700k/3070 and it runs great 3080 and some ryzen xx00 technically a tier under what it should be. I play at 1440 though because that's what all my monitors are so I don't have to worry about performance issues.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:40
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The Oldest Man posted:also the combat slide sucks rear end and i want my perk back Reperkolating would be nice. Can't believe I wasted so many points on some of this stuff and now I'm stuck for 5 levels upgrading some other things I don't really want because I want to make my jetpack better
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Sep 7, 2023 20:41
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Basic Chunnel posted:If you grind thru the main quest there’s a certain point where you get a unlimited O2 biotic power you can spam You know what sounds like fun? Doing all the ship-to-temple ground traversal runs to get those powers without a boostpack
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Sep 7, 2023 20:42
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Bethesda is bad at coming up with skills and has been since Fallout 3. Not just because they lock basic gameplay concepts behind skills and cram in a ton of "+10%" dreck. Take a look at something like Rapid Reloading. At the first tier ballistic weapons reload 30% faster. At the second tier energy weapons reload 30% faster. If you think about it for half a second (which no one did) you'll realize how stupid this is. A player focusing on energy weapons has to spend twice as many points to get the same benefit as a ballistics-focused player. They could have made each tier decrease all reload times by a smaller amount. That would have been boring, but at least it would have made sense.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:45
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trizzNPH posted:tbf, 9 levels in starfield takes like no time at all to get. I got my important t1 skills maxed out asap and by the time I did that, I had the ability to put points into any tier I wanted. Started getting points for ship building what, 15 hours in or so? To be able to put skills into any tier you want it would be a minimum of 12 levels per tree. Assuming a reasonable 'cap' of 45 that means you would either have to do a cartoonish amount of grinding or having completed almost everything non-procgen in the game to reach that point, and that's not even counting the points you need to invest in the skill itself. It also doesn't help some skills are one-hit wonders while others require 4 skills to be worth the cost.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:45
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ScootsMcSkirt posted:ya, i think this would be the quickest fix for the system imo. There are what, 80ish skills in the game? Each one has four levels so a character would need to be level 320+ to max out everything in this game. Considering that a player will get to level 35-50 when they beat the main quest means that there are a TON of skills and mechanics that will be ignored by each player. Who is taking the cooking or surveying skills when combat is so pervasive in the game? Would love to see a non-promo behind the scenes or some dev conference breakdown debriefing. Very curious how they arrived at many of these design choices and limitations. Like was the planet thing a design choice or tech issue, on the surface it seems like they could stitch as many procgen planes together to make a planet just like NMS does. They don't even have to worry about in-world caves like NMS does. It would not make the game better itself, but does feel somewhat arbitrary of a half measure either way, I would just be curious how they went about all these choices when trying to make this and why.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:46
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ImpAtom posted:To be able to put skills into any tier you want it would be a minimum of 12 levels per tree. Assuming a reasonable 'cap' of 45 that means you would either have to do a cartoonish amount of grinding or having completed almost everything non-procgen in the game to reach that point, and that's not even counting the points you need to invest in the skill itself. whatever tier i wanted within the branches I was interested in, should've clarified my apologies. For example, I have like... 2 points in persuasion and 2 in scavenging on NG+, I worried about physical and tech primarily first loop, w/ points in combat perks just to buff up my shotties and pistols.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:48
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I don't know if it's just me but it took me like 20 minutes across multiple visits to a space ship vendor to figure out how to just add a gun to my ship. Between this, my first attempt to build a small outpost, and the fact that they are still binding medkit to the 0 key on the numbar by default, I think Bethesda might have the worst UI talent in the entire AAA games space.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:50
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Scoss posted:I don't know if it's just me but it took me like 20 minutes across multiple visits to a space ship vendor to figure out how to just add a gun to my ship. It took me a few minutes to realize the super importance of my R and F keys in ship building. Moreso when you build double deck ships.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:51
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Khanstant posted:Would love to see a non-promo behind the scenes or some dev conference breakdown debriefing. Very curious how they arrived at many of these design choices and limitations. Like was the planet thing a design choice or tech issue, on the surface it seems like they could stitch as many procgen planes together to make a planet just like NMS does. They don't even have to worry about in-world caves like NMS does. It would not make the game better itself, but does feel somewhat arbitrary of a half measure either way, I would just be curious how they went about all these choices when trying to make this and why. So for the skill trees I am pretty convinced that it being awkward is intentional because they wanted the game to be designed around you building up crews and bases and stuff. However that entire system is so poorly explained and unclear that I think a lot of people are mostly ignoring it or not entirely clear on what can and can't be shuffled off to a crew member. Like it'd make perfect sense for crafting to be a pain to do solo if the intent is for you to build up a team of scientists at your own personal base to do it for you, but people have said that doing that doesn't necessarily let you do high level crafting without having the skill yourself so who knows. And to be honest if that had a better interface or clearer mechanics that'd be awesome. Making your own Enterprise crew or your own research base to discover new technologies and bringing people from across the systems to do so? That's a fuckin' great idea and it is kinda-sorta in the game but the implementation is so fucky that nobody really naturally gravitates towards it.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:52
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DarkDobe posted:I'm not sure how you're going to react to the base building. ymgve posted:I haven’t gone in depth with the settlement system, but I noticed you can build turrets. Is this a Fallout 4 situation where you have to constantly babysit your settlements under constant fauna and spacer attacks? Oh god nooooooo! I will definitely skip base building if this happens. In FO4 I remember carefully plotting each places defences and arming each settler with insane weapons and outfits and then.... in the middle of a quest getting an alert. My choices are stop what I'm doing to gun down like 5 raiders or (3 outta 4 times) I have to go back as those 5 raiders damaged half the town with their t1 weapons and now people are starving. Think that was what got to me the most. That and Preston Garvey forever radiant missions. George Sex - REAL posted:I liked outpost building a lot in FO4. It was intuitive and easy and it felt fun to watch a little settlement come to life, after laying out some amenities for your trash people.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:52
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ImpAtom posted:To be able to put skills into any tier you want it would be a minimum of 12 levels per tree. Assuming a reasonable 'cap' of 45 that means you would either have to do a cartoonish amount of grinding or having completed almost everything non-procgen in the game to reach that point, and that's not even counting the points you need to invest in the skill itself. I appreciate that they gave long-term players a goal to hit, filling out the full skill tree is probably going to take years. There are 81 skills, 4 ranks each, you start with 3 and can get various ones free. Roughly level 320 to open them all. Powershift fucked around with this message at 20:55 on Sep 7, 2023 |
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Sep 7, 2023 20:53
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Scoss posted:Between this, my first attempt to build a small outpost, and the fact that they are still binding medkit to the 0 key on the numbar by default, I think Bethesda might have the worst UI talent in the entire AAA games space. Hold my beer and let me boot up modern CoD for you.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:54
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As it stand now it feels like bases are there for you to store all your poo poo, most of your energy should be put on ship building. Can't wait for mods that let you actually decorate the interiors of your ships. Maybe NG+ will be a good way to play this in a year or two when the creation kit is out.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:55
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Powershift posted:I appreciate that they gave long-term players a goal to hit, filling out the full skill tree is probably going to take years. Nobody who plays Starfield is ever going to max out the skill tree naturally. It isn't a goal. Even if it is your absolute favorite game of all time and you can thrive within it you're still going to eventually want to reroll your character to try different traits or just because you'll have maxed out everything remotely fun and the only thing left to do is grind levels so you can ignore cooking.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:56
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Khanstant posted:Would love to see a non-promo behind the scenes or some dev conference breakdown debriefing. Very curious how they arrived at many of these design choices and limitations. Like was the planet thing a design choice or tech issue, on the surface it seems like they could stitch as many procgen planes together to make a planet just like NMS does. They don't even have to worry about in-world caves like NMS does. It would not make the game better itself, but does feel somewhat arbitrary of a half measure either way, I would just be curious how they went about all these choices when trying to make this and why. my guess is that they learned very early that the engine could not handle in-atmosphere flight for an entire planet. Once they cut that feature, everything else kinda makes sense. no need to have the entire surface available at any moment since the player can only run on foot and theyd be tethered to their ship anyways. No need to have detailed space flight, since they would need a menu to land on a planet etc
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Sep 7, 2023 20:56
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Like seriously, it is an act of genuine insanity for a human to conclude that the emergency heal button should default to the 0 key-- perfectly equidistant between both hands in a standard WASD and mouse configuration and requiring the user to remove their hand from either movement or aiming and peck the key in the middle of a fight while looking down to find this virtually never-used key.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:57
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edit: nm I'm dumb i got it
DeadFatDuckFat fucked around with this message at 21:01 on Sep 7, 2023 |
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Sep 7, 2023 20:57
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ImpAtom posted:Nobody who plays Starfield is ever going to max out the skill tree naturally. It isn't a goal. Even if it is your absolute favorite game of all time and you can thrive within it you're still going to eventually want to reroll your character to try different traits or just because you'll have maxed out everything remotely fun and the only thing left to do is grind levels so you can ignore cooking. I'm going to and you can't stop me 
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Sep 7, 2023 20:57
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ImpAtom posted:So for the skill trees I am pretty convinced that it being awkward is intentional because they wanted the game to be designed around you building up crews and bases and stuff. However that entire system is so poorly explained and unclear that I think a lot of people are mostly ignoring it or not entirely clear on what can and can't be shuffled off to a crew member. My favourite part of NMS are the big capital cruisers you get. You can have your own star destroyer and see all your ships inside it waiting to take off if you hop in, you can build a massive base inside, and you have all your crew and their workstations and stuff around. The game starts you off with quests to unlock and upgrade your team and those quests end up sending you into other systems and game loops. You also get to recruit other ships and frigates for your fleet to send on their own missions. Plus you can warp it to the planet you visit and get to see it looming in the sky and easily warp down resources and vehicles on the fly.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:58
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Combat Pretzel posted:Is there a point to redoing the main quest on NG+? For the additional XP? Doesn't seem like it. I checked and you can still get Barrett his +1 Barrett upgrade while doing the abbreviated route and I think that would be the only potential mechanical benefit.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:58
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BULBASAUR posted:As it stand now it feels like bases are there for you to store all your poo poo, most of your energy should be put on ship building. Speaking of storing poo poo, is the safe in my Constellation bedroom a safe location, or does it reset?
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Sep 7, 2023 20:58
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Scoss posted:Like seriously, it is an act of genuine insanity for a human to conclude that the emergency heal button should default to the 0 key-- perfectly equidistant between both hands in a standard WASD and mouse configuration and requiring the user to remove their hand from either movement or aiming and peck the key in the middle of a fight while looking down to find this virtually never-used key. They probably didn't even think about it. Using the quick weapon select pauses the game so you have all the time in the world to select the healing item.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:59
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ScootsMcSkirt posted:my guess is that they learned very early that the engine could not handle in-atmosphere flight for an entire planet. Once they cut that feature, everything else kinda makes sense. no need to have the entire surface available at any moment since the player can only run on foot and theyd be tethered to their ship anyways. No need to have detailed space flight, since they would need a menu to land on a planet etc That makes sense, they can generate the landscape at fast-travel speed, but when you're cruising in a ship you might need to be having half the planet surface generated and rendered to some extent.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:59
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i wish they'd let you re-allocate skill points. i put points in lasers and ballistics but they were wasted because melee is just better than guns when you have the right skills.
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Sep 7, 2023 21:00
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gnoma posted:Doesn't seem like it. I checked and you can still get Barrett his +1 Barrett upgrade while doing the abbreviated route and I think that would be the only potential mechanical benefit. I'm pretty sure there are story beats and decisions you can make that are directly impacted by you being in NG+, cant confirm entirely but ive heard people get new dialogue and such for it
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Sep 7, 2023 21:00
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Khanstant posted:My favourite part of NMS are the big capital cruisers you get. You can have your own star destroyer and see all your ships inside it waiting to take off if you hop in, you can build a massive base inside, and you have all your crew and their workstations and stuff around. The game starts you off with quests to unlock and upgrade your team and those quests end up sending you into other systems and game loops. You also get to recruit other ships and frigates for your fleet to send on their own missions. Plus you can warp it to the planet you visit and get to see it looming in the sky and easily warp down resources and vehicles on the fly. NMS has a lot of cool ideas and looks pretty good on paper. Unfortunately all of the systems are skin deep and the gameplay that branches off from those many many systems is, similarly, unconscionably shallow. George Sex - REAL fucked around with this message at 21:03 on Sep 7, 2023 |
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Sep 7, 2023 21:01
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Conversely, I think NMS is an incredible game at this point with tons of interesting stuff to check out every time I jump back in, but they've had seven years of constant updates and feedback to get there, and they woved to make up for the lackluster launch early on and actually stuck to it.
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Sep 7, 2023 21:04
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DogsInSpace! posted:Sounds like a mix of old school Dawn of War 1/Starcraft and Skyrim (??) where I need to build the furniture for the rooms? Do you have to actually fill out the furniture for people to be assigned to the post? Kinda sad sticking Lin and her sidekick in an empty room but I've got planets to explore! You can put down extractors, power sources, light posts, ship landing points/cargo pads, storage crates, and HABITAT modules using fps view or a RTS type camera - I suggest the latter. The only things you 'need' are power sources and extractors. The various cargo stations just make things more convenient. Then you can also put down turrets, up to 3 NPC robots that do various things. The robots all provide a benefit to some aspect of your outpost, or provide physical security (the dog robots are best for this). Someone earlier asked 'do turrets mean you need to defend your outpost' the answer is loosely yes: if you are ACTIVELY at the outpost, every hour or so a ship of Ecplipe or Pirates will show up and you get to shoot them - otherwise they might blow up one of your robots, or your power generators. So far as I have seen those are the only 2 things that can be damaged. Again: your outposts can only be attacked while you are there. There is an exception if the planet you are on has hostile wildlife, they tend to wander in and get blown up by turrets/defense robots at random. If robots or other buildings are destroyed, you need to walk up to them and press E to magically fix them - I don't know if this uses any resources. The HABITAT modules come in like 6 flavours with a few variants each, and you can also press E while pointing at highlighted walls/doors to make them turn into windows/wider doors, etc. It's very minor - and honestly the most undercooked part of the building. Inside the habs themsleves, you can throw down all sorts of furniture that has ZERO effect on the usability of the habitat, but make it look nice. There are also the various crafting benches: these are only useful to you, the player. You can also put down a bounty station, and a generic mission kiosk. Lastly, there is one - only one - item that affects NPCs and that is the 'crew station' - it is literally a desk, a chair, and a computer monitor as one package. Putting this inside your hab (or outside? I haven't tried putting one outdoors) lets you assign your crew to permanently man the outpost - and based on their stats - maybe give it some passive benefits. You can have a single empty room with a crew station in it, and you'll be able to assign as many NPC crew to that outpost as you like. They don't need beds or anything else. Beds and other furniture are purely set dressing, although NPCs will make use of them if they are available. DarkDobe fucked around with this message at 21:14 on Sep 7, 2023 |
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Sep 7, 2023 21:07
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DEEP STATE PLOT posted:i wish they'd let you re-allocate skill points. i put points in lasers and ballistics but they were wasted because melee is just better than guns when you have the right skills. Seems like they may be didn't expect people to go all-in on melee. Seems like introvert and melee are the two main ones, unless upgraded bare knuckle is as strong as a varuun painblade. They have some AI types who charge in melee and sometimes they will shove you with their own melee gun attacks but the blocking is too slow to really be useful and you only have the one set of chop attacks plus your own power chop which I assume is the melee button for guns. Then again I don't remember if Skyrim had swordplay any more complex than this either, but I think I did sneakyboi poo poo for that.
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Sep 7, 2023 21:12
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ymgve posted:Speaking of storing poo poo, is the safe in my Constellation bedroom a safe location, or does it reset? Just plop down an outpost for storing stuff, you can build one on Jemison or whatever. No need for any skills and putting down a couple boxes takes very little resources. That's like the primary point of having outposts in the first place. No need for any building either, you can just put them on the ground next to the main beacon and you're done.
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Sep 7, 2023 21:14
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