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Vintersorg posted:People are allowed to not like things without resorting to putting them down. Sure but I'm referring to the people being performatively negative. And I really mean the comment about maybe it's just not for them. If you watch more than half a show, hating it, and keep watching anyway, I'm not sure you're really going to add anything enjoyable to a discussion at that point I'm not claiming they can't post or anything though
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Sep 13, 2023 04:48
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Vintersorg posted:Oh yo I didn’t like it??! This really is your human interaction highlight of the week, isn’t? Your criticisms would appear much less performative if you weren’t watching this show you profess to hate the moment it is released. You can’t wait. If you really hate this show, then it shouldn’t hurt you to wait a few hours to let us kibitz about it. A person who isn’t desperate for negative attention should be able to do that.
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Sep 13, 2023 04:53
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thrawn527 posted:I agree. It looked fantastic. And starting by showing her raised in war to be a soldier, but now using the Force to communicate with space whales because she is more than that, was great. Plus the best on screen depiction of Anakin I’ve ever seen. His good, and his darkness. This one episode pretty much covered Ahsoka's entire character arc from child soldier, to disillusioned Jedi, to outsider loner, to re-embracing life and rejecting and overcoming the trauma of the past. As you said, drat good Star Wars. Also, baby Ahsoka was the same actress who played baby Gamora in Infinity War 5 years ago. That kid's got a bright future.
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Sep 13, 2023 04:54
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Positivepost Loved seeing Anakin do stuff Loved looking at costumes: mid-young Ahsoka, New Ahsoka, Clones, Battle Anakin, Rex The Ghost/Phantom2 is a cool hero ship like the Falcon or Enterprise and I enjoy seeing it on screen Love looking at Huyang doing anything at all Kid Ahsoka was good All the different era lightsabers in context were cool Seeing a bit of the Siege of Mandalore and the Deathwatch Maul helmet was great Huyang's banter with Jacen was fun purgil wowing the fleet was amusing especially when the big one turned up
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Sep 13, 2023 04:56
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I think you guys have been abusing the word performative a bit here. Having a stronger negative opinion about the show than you consider reasonable can still be perfectly sincere
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Sep 13, 2023 04:57
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Also, I think the kid who plays Jacen is cool. I bet he knows a lot about Nintendos.
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Sep 13, 2023 04:58
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I don't care about people disliking things, it's just old for the same people to constantly contrarian in every thread to purposefully put attention on themselves and keep conversation about them for whatever reason. I don't see it as much here now, but this site used to pretty much be everyone trying to do that and you see it elsewhere on the Internet which makes people wary. Most people grow past that after a while and don't find it interesting to down things like that. I personally am still unpacking this episode because so much was shown that might not even be picked up on first watch. For instance, did Ahsoka beat Anakin the same way he did Dooku and choose non-violence? Not sure, but it did look similar (and wasn't as obvious as Baylan trolling her to use Anakins stance in the last episode). Edit also reborn Ahsoka in the belly of a whale. Darko fucked around with this message at 05:03 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 04:59
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No Mods No Masters posted:I think you guys have been abusing the word performative a bit here. Having a stronger negative opinion about the show than you consider reasonable can still be perfectly sincere Don’t jump over part about being eager to complain. The show will still be lovely for you tomorrow, do it then. Learn to share a public space.
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Sep 13, 2023 04:59
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I don’t think that was the “real” world between worlds. Instead everything in it played out more like the inside of a Jedi Temple where you go in only with what you take with you. Hence Ahsoka and Anakin jumping from one time/location from her past to the next. I was half expecting them to reveal there was some kind of Jedi temple entrance beneath the waves. But if you’re a Rebels watcher, it definitely played out a lot like Ezra’s experience when he went inside a temple. Anyways the episode ruled, I am totally digging this show but apparently based on most everyone else’s reactions i am a bad TV watcher.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:01
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No Mods No Masters posted:I think you guys have been abusing the word performative a bit here. Having a stronger negative opinion about the show than you consider reasonable can still be perfectly sincere I'm going to try to positivepost more from now on but I think this deserves a response Yeah, it can be sincere to not like something but why put yourself though the effort of watching something you already have a strong negative opinion about and then posting about it, apparently owning yourself for watching something you already knew you wouldn't like? I guess for a reaction, which I provided (mea culpa). I genuinely wish everyone enjoyed it because enjoying things is good Edit: also some of the negative language is worded strongly enough to basically be insulting to people enjoying the show and wanting to geek out about it with pals online and that's what really provoked a response maybeadracula fucked around with this message at 05:05 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 05:02
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Marsupial Ape posted:This really is your human interaction highlight of the week, isn’t? Who says I am performative? I am just as loving excited as you are for new poo poo. I’ve been following along for a long time as I am sure you have too. And many others of course. So if I don’t like what I saw - I have to wait for you to “kibitz”? Who set that law? You’re again saying people who had some issues are seeking negative attention? We’re just posting stuff. We’re having discussions of things that work and don’t work. I’d rather read about stuff like that than some of the same old, “10/10 - Star Wars is back. I saw a lightsaber and Ahsoka smirked.” E: like if I have to PROVE I like Star Wars for some of you: I consider Rebels and its entire cast perfect Star Wars. I wanted the secret Jedi in Mando to be Ezra (or maybe Cal Kestis…). I was super hyped for Ahsoka - it couldnt be any worse than Obi Wan or Boba or Mando S3. So far it isn’t but it’s more so disappointment we’re getting a disjointed series that has/had potential to be as good as Rebels. Vintersorg fucked around with this message at 05:09 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 05:04
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maybealabia posted:I'm going to try to positivepost more from now on but I think this deserves a response Because watching something in a critical way to try to understand why it doesn't work can also be interesting, and perhaps interesting to have a conversation about? I think that's just as valid as hugboxing and until I hear otherwise I think it's allowed here. I assure you I am not getting erect reading riveting complaints about complaints No Mods No Masters fucked around with this message at 05:15 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 05:06
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I think my only real criticism was no one acknowledging that two x-wing pilots literally died in the previous episode. Not Hera, not the New Republic, nope nothing. Sorry guys it was like you never existed.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:08
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Vintersorg posted:Who says I am performative? I am just as loving excited as you are for new poo poo. I’ve been following along for a long time as I am sure you have too. And many others of course. Too Fussy, Didn’t Read
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Sep 13, 2023 05:11
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Filoni, stop wiretapping my social media accounts I beg of you I was loving joking about riding in the whale's mouths Honestly my biggest gripe with the episode was that the map sphere was cut cleanly in half despite being impaled with a plasma blade Where's the cylindrical hole bored into the cut halves, like a cored apple, or a bagel
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Sep 13, 2023 05:12
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I zipped through the series over the last 2 nights and while I thought eps 1 and 2 were a bit dull, the rest has been fabulous. Ray Stevenson is just such a force and I'm so, so sad that he's gone but so glad he got to do this fun and awesome role. As a person who pretty much hated the prequels start to finish, ep 5 showed what could have been. The Clone War flashback scenes were incredible, and incredibly well directed. Hayden proved once and for all that he can do well with good material, and if you'd have told me that Ahsoka would make me reevaluate the prequels as an object lesson of the dangers of militarizing police, I wouldn't have believed you. But that's what I took from this episode. Holy poo poo at what can be accomplished in such a short screen time, with everyone and everything firing on all cylinders. The show isn't as "prestige" as Andor, but this story is also far more Star Wars than Andor was/is, and it's far superior to any other SW media with Andor as the exception. The saber choreography is perfect, and it makes the fight scenes a joy to watch. I can't wait for the next episode, though I think there's nowhere to go but down from the height of episode 5.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:15
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Vinylshadow posted:Filoni, stop wiretapping my social media accounts I beg of you He changed it to fine slice setting, duh.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:16
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It is a bit hard to put my finger on why, when Anakin switched back to being Anakin from Vader, there was something very Mark Hamill about him. It was the first place that I ever really saw Anakin as Luke's dad.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:22
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No Mods No Masters posted:Because watching something in a critical way to try to understand why it doesn't work can also be interesting, and perhaps interesting to have a conversation about? I that that's just as valid as hugboxing and until I hear otherwise I think it's allowed here. "Doesn't work" with no qualifiers makes you sound pompous fyi But yes it can be, if you aren't mistakenly judging things by the wrong criteria. For example, complaining that you don't know who the characters are is a bit like watching Infinity War as your first marvel movie or Return of the King as your first LotR movie. Neither implies in the title that they are a direct sequel to other things but you'd have to willfuly ignore the marketing material not to think so. Who are these people? This movie is bad and slow lol I don't think this is a movie split into parts, it's a serialized, patient adventure with some of our well known space friends. Wondering when you'll get to the fireworks factory is perhaps missing the point.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:22
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Marsupial Ape posted:Also, I think the kid who plays Jacen is cool. I bet he knows a lot about Nintendos. I’d bet he’s got an uncle who works at Nintendo. Also, i’m jealous because he gets to hang out with everyone’s favorite war criminal. *I* want to hang out with Chopper and witness various war crimes!
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Sep 13, 2023 05:23
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I didn't like the idea of Jacen back in Rebels, and it's not getting any better the more I see. That aside, trippy flashback CW with all the costume and hairstyle changes was extremely my poo poo. I'm not sure what the lesson was Ahsoka was supposed to have learned, but... ineffable Jedi stuff, I guess? A little of that goes a long way, and I'm glad they didn't try to spell it out.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:28
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maybealabia posted:"Doesn't work" with no qualifiers makes you sound pompous fyi
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Sep 13, 2023 05:29
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Yeah, I generally can see how most people come to the more like execution based complaints(the Jacen complaints are still very stupid), as despite enjoying it I don't think this is like Good™ like Andor was. But it is still an enjoyable watch to me, despite having some flaws, in a way that stuff like Obi-Wan, Mando S3 and Boba Fett(outside of a handful of scenes) were not. But also yeah, we are more than halfway through this show, it is kinda doing the thing it's doing, and it either works or it doesn't for you. Ballz posted:I think my only real criticism was no one acknowledging that two x-wing pilots literally died in the previous episode. Not Hera, not the New Republic, nope nothing. Sorry guys it was like you never existed. When Hera is court martialed next episode it legitimately wouldn't shock me if it gets brought up. They didn't have any real conversation with the NR fleet, just they show, up they stall for a bit, and then holy poo poo space whales. Dexo fucked around with this message at 05:34 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 05:31
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Marsupial Ape posted:Also, people who unironically say ‘hugboxing’ need to be put outside the city walls after dark. If that’s your reaction to a group of human beings enjoying themselves…oof. This why you make little kids where helmets during exercise. I think "implication you should be killed" and "implication you are mentally handicapped" are some incredibly assholish attacks over the subject matter of not liking the star wars show, that others have not been remotely leveling at you. But please tell me more about how public spaces ought to be shared
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Sep 13, 2023 05:35
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Madurai posted:I didn't like the idea of Jacen back in Rebels, and it's not getting any better the more I see. She was being extremely blocked off and cold to apparently not go the same route as her Master, which caused her to make some of the same mistakes due to blocking too much off and being old Jedi. That was exemplified where she went into his stance in the last episode once challenged on that and did a Dooku/Obi Wan episode 3 on Ray's apprentice (since legacy kept being brought up and Dooku is ALSO part of her legacy). Her choice when first meeting Anakin is not to live and keep doing what she's doing, and he's telling her, no, she actually needs to get out of the past and actually live and she finally embraces it and starts acting non stoic and such when she comes out of it. That's just my first watch impressions.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:37
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Dexo posted:Gonna be wild when David Tennant gets another emmy for this performance as Huyang He is good, isn't he? Although I don't know who decided he should deliver his initial lines in this last episode by doing one at a time with a long pause between them. Maybe replicating one of the worst things in Lucas Star Wars isn't the greatest idea? None of the acting in this show is wooden, but the point of a pause in a conversation is to register emotion or tension of some sort, and that's only happening some of the time. Maybe they were going for grief, but if so, it didn't quite land for me. Darko posted:I liked this episode a lot, but thats because so much of it was pretty and probably literally stretched the volume as far as it could go. Yes, it was amazing and I can see why they wanted these images available on a movie screen. But I'm not an especially visual person and I found Ahsoka's lesson to be essentially unintelligible, though I loved the change in her afterward (more smiles than in all her other appearances put together). Star Wars has never been good with registering or handling trauma, which is weird for a series that started with trauma as a basis for multiple characters. But I honestly thought Ahsoka was supposed to learn the lesson that she needed to move beyond Anakin, and that would be represented by her refusing to fight him and NOT DYING ANYWAY. But no, I guess "git good" was her lesson and she was able to beat him because she learned a thing that I didn't personally witness her learning at all? Like, don't be defined by fighting and prove that by fighting? Or get past all this trauma by reliving it and then just notionally being over it, like telling someone with severe depression to just cheer up and expecting that to work? Seriously, if someone can break down how the "Ahsoka learns" portion of the story works, I'd appreciate it. My patience is rapidly eroding with what I'm starting to see as Filoni-isms. OK, you want a moment of tension early in the episode, so Huyang is standing by a cliff, with a helmet, hidden behind a rock, and when he hears the ship he's expecting landing behind him and multiple people conversing he just keeps standing there, says nothing, and waits so he can be discovered in a moment of broken tension? I'm not expecting the richness of Andor messaging from this show, but "character behaves in character and doesn't simply do things to enable a moment in the script" would be nice. Huyang is not the strong, silent type, and I don't believe for a moment he'd have just been standing there, especially as he has no reason to suspect Ahsoka went over the cliff. Yes, it's a visual metaphor and the sea represents death/the next world, and he's looking out to sea because he thinks Ahsoka and Sabine are both dead and he's mourning, but this isn't Bergman and the visual/physical indicators of emotion don't carry over into dialogue and behavior. Huyang says things that indicate he's upset, but he doesn't sound especially upset, and the things he goes on to say sound pretty calm, as is the ensuing conversation. Hera isn't tearing up because she fears she's lost family. And these performers have the chops to carry subtle emotion; it's like they've been told not to. The show really does feel like it's doubling down on the Kurasawa influences and going for a differing expression of character and emotion shown in a far more staged and formal way. And some of the base-level decisions on cuts and pacing are just inexplicable. Just consider this sequence of events near the end of the episode (and I guess I should spoiler this?): Ahsoka is going to commune with a whale to see if they can hitch a ride. Hera sends the X-wings to stall the approaching fleet, which is apparently important because disturbing the mind-meld could be dangerous. She says that as we see a shot of Ahsoka standing outside her ship by the whale. The X-wings fly out of the atmosphere. Cut to their fleet jumping in, and the X-wings arriving, and a substantial fraction of the stall. Then cut back to the planet, where, after all this time, we see... Hera explaining what Ahsoka is going to do, as she lifts her hand and closes her eyes. But either Ahsoka was just standing there doing nothing through the X-wing flight and the whole conversation/stall in the previous scene, or we've cut BACK IN TIME, which entirely removes whatever tension might have been created by the "any disturbance is dangerous" line that's the only reason for the stall in the first place. If they'd cut back to Ahsoka, already with her hand up and her eyes closed, then the cut is intelligible and the stakes remain. If they really wanted to show Ahsoka starting the communication, then instead of cutting away from her at that moment to follow events with the X-wings and the fleet and then cutting back to her in that same moment, show her start the communication and THEN cut to the fleet. And sure, call this a Cinemasins nitpick. But this kind of cross-editing to show simultaneous events is a Star Wars trademark, Lucas was great at it, and it involves a far clearler sense of how people perceive time cinematically than Filoni shows here. This felt careless and made the supposed stakes meaningless, because obviously if we cut back and she's not started yet, we aren't supposed to care that she'll run out of time, because the visual language is completely unhurried and the temporal logic shows this scene isn't operating in sync with the previous scene. I had similar feelings about earlier episodes that showed ships approaching a planet and landing. These scenes were very Star Wars, establishing a visual sense of place. OTOH, they also felt like B-movie parking scenes, where a film that needs running time shows the characters arrive at a place, park the car, get out, close the door, and walk into a building without cutting away. I think the Mandalorian handled this sort of scene well in that you usually were thinking about some challenge or problem associated with the planetary arrival, or in some cases were concerned his drat ship wasn't going to be able to land safely. There's no tension-building associated with the early episode landings in Ahsoka, and the music wasn't quite enough for me to see these moments as doing only the one thing, instead of several. I suppose if Filoni is going for a particular filmic style, there's a justification, but Kurasawa (or even Bergman) is a high bar to reach and I don't think the story or themes have managed to bridge the gap yet.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:40
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Parkingtigers posted:This one episode pretty much covered Ahsoka's entire character arc from child soldier, to disillusioned Jedi, to outsider loner, to re-embracing life and rejecting and overcoming the trauma of the past. Yeah, that was really solid. This is the good stuff. A big part of the appeal of Star Wars is that it takes you somewhere very different to have adventures. The world between the worlds looked fantastic, that's an unreal environment that just works. The Clone Wars flashbacks were eerie, foreboding, and a lot sinister. A very good creative choice for flashbacks to a time of bloody ar and the trauma of a child soldier. X-Wings on SAR duty was amazing. That shows that they're thinking about the setting as a real thing, and it makes it all work just that much better. I love that Hera trusted Jacen. Gotta respect that kind of parenting. He was great with both Huyang and Chopper. I may end up with a lot of criticisms of the show's pacing and episodic structure. For what they were going for (that's a load-bearing phrase if I've ever used one) this was exactly the episode that they needed to make. Or at least it looks like it so far. There's been an awfully deliberate pacing to this show. I'll decide if it works when they finish. And  at anyone who thought that Ahsoka was in the water the whole time.e. This was also a pretty heavy episode for philosophizing, and showing-not-telling what they meant. You're supposed to pick it up from Anakin, and the Clone Wars flashbacks. Then the sequence at the end with the whales confirms it. It's already been said that this shows Ahsoka's journey all in one episode. Child soldier to a mature woman able to laugh as she trusts her faith in the Force. There's honestly tons of character development for both Ahsoka and Anakinin this episode. That last point should remind people that this show is about characters, not the plot. The plot serves to define the outer aspects of their journey. Ahsoka and Sabine's story is about them changing, not them achieving. Learning, not winning. Growing, not triumphing. I think it works so far. mllaneza fucked around with this message at 05:48 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 05:40
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Love that they brought in the "Anakin switching between himself and Vader" idea 
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Sep 13, 2023 05:41
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I loved Anakin's "Is that what this is about?" "Get over it, solider"
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Sep 13, 2023 05:42
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No Mods No Masters posted:I think "implication you should be killed" and "implication you are mentally handicapped" are some incredibly assholish attacks over the subject matter of not liking the star wars show, that others have not been remotely leveling at you. "Not liking the star wars show" =/= "coming into the Star Wars thread and accusing people who like the show of creating a 'hug box' ".
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Sep 13, 2023 05:43
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Just because Star Wars poured blue milk on your cereal doesn't mean all cereal is ruined forever, Syril
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Sep 13, 2023 05:49
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FLIPADELPHIA posted:"Not liking the star wars show" =/= "coming into the Star Wars thread and accusing people who like the show of creating a 'hug box' ". I still think it's a little extreme to pull the "wish you were dead" and "you are mentally disabled" cards out over that but maybe it's a more loaded term than I realized. Happy to follow the OP's lead and call it kibitzing instead
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Sep 13, 2023 05:52
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Jehde posted:I think most want a recount of the clone wars, but I think it will be more about the master teaching the padawan how to be a master, something he had to get to grips with himself for her. thrawn527 posted:That was some drat good Star Wars.  Dexo posted:God Hayden is loving killing this poo poo. TheBigBudgetSequel posted:That was a fantastic Star Wars show, and seeing Hayden get to act opposite Ahsoka both young and old is really something special. GarudaPrime posted:I guess we aren't going to get to stop talking about child soldiers in Star Wars for another week. Vintersorg posted:I’m just busting. They nailed Yiung Ahsoka too btw! Lobok posted:Man, I was hoping a pod of Godzilla-sized whales going faster than faster than light was going to have a new cool effect and not just the usual zip aways. Marsupial Ape posted:Also, I think the kid who plays Jacen is cool. I bet he knows a lot about Nintendos. FLIPADELPHIA posted:The show isn't as "prestige" as Andor, but this story is also far more Star Wars than Andor was/is, and it's far superior to any other SW media with Andor as the exception. The saber choreography is perfect, and it makes the fight scenes a joy to watch. Other things I noticed: Loved Carson's "Jedi poo poo? gently caress okay let's get going", and his "Respectfully disagree" Love what Paul Sun-Hyung Lee brings to that side character. I was honestly impressed with the prosthetics when Ahsoka is waking up in her ship. Those New Republic ships that come after Hera looked kind of dope. A very nice blend of both imperial and rebel aesthetics. I enjoyed the whole hitchhiking in the whale's mouth, it's a nice callback to ESB, just more consensual force stuff instead of wacky escape chaos.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:55
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Jacen’s costume is pretty great. He’s got the jacket with his dad’s shoulder paldron and the fingerless gloves. He’s ready to kidnapped by Dark Jedi every year until he’s old enough YA novels.
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Sep 13, 2023 06:02
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No Mods No Masters posted:I still think it's a little extreme to pull the "wish you were dead" and "you are mentally disabled" cards out over that but maybe it's a more loaded term than I realized. Happy to follow the OP's lead and call it kibitzing instead Take it like the 19 year veteran you are.
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Sep 13, 2023 06:05
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Larryb posted:That was some of the best acting I’ve ever seen from Hayden and whoever played Young Ahsoka was pretty good too (also it was cool to see Rex again though Ahsoka The White was a bit weird) Young Ahsoka was played by Ariana Greenblatt, who was also recently seen in Barbie as America Ferrera’s daughter.
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Sep 13, 2023 06:07
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Ariana Greenblatt (Young Ahsoka) honestly sounded/acted more like the cartoon VA than Rosario does, almost a pity she was just a oneshot That aside, the exchange between Ahsoka and Huyang at the end was funny at least Larryb fucked around with this message at 06:30 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 06:09
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Sep 13, 2023 06:10
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Jesus Christ, you can’t even intimate a person doesn’t deserve the comforts of civilization if they refuse to cohabitate correctly with other humans, anymore. I don’t want you dead, I just want you to not know hearth or roof ever again. Marsupial Ape fucked around with this message at 06:15 on Sep 13, 2023 |
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Sep 13, 2023 06:13
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Marsupial Ape posted:Jesus Christ, you can’t even intimate a person doesn’t deserve the comforts of civilization if they refuse to cohabitate correctly with other humans, anymore. weird thoughts.
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