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Pilfered Pallbearers posted:Outside of some stupid, out of my control factor like money or climate change or whatever, I will never ever ever not live in or directly adjacent to a top 15 US major metro. Even with that, I probably wouldn’t accept living in half of the ones in that category. code:
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Sep 15, 2023 19:33
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Pham Nuwen posted:I grew up in a small town (grocery store, library, gas station, and a burger joint that was perpetually going in and out of business). School was pretty drat good, probably because the richest people in the area were Mormon farmers and at least out there they cared about education (I'm told Idaho Mormons disdain it). The nearest town with a Walmart or a Chinese restaurant was 40 minutes away. I did a lot of farm work and spent a ridiculous amount of time in front of a 486, dreaming about escaping the farm life so I could go touch computers professionally amongst other dedicated computer touchers. Now I'm in a big city dreaming about becoming a gentleman farmer (read: bad at farming) who doesn't have to touch computers so goddamn much. Yeah, and I will absolutely admit that there are a bunch of downsides to living in the city: it's noisy (this is a very big deal, and as we study it, are finding it's way worse for people's mental health than we previously thought), your neighbors are right next to you, there's a lot of visible homelessness (though, visiting my hometown again, rural areas aren't really getting you that much away from that, and just because you're not seeing it doesn't mean it's not there)... but to me, those downsides are so far outweighed by just the access to stuff and not having to spend time in a car you get from a city. And for the car thing, I don't even mean just if you live in a very transit-accessible area; sure, in a city, maybe you have that half-hour drive to work, but where I grew up, in addition to that half-hour drive to work or school, if I wanted to go to a decent-sized grocery store, it was forty minutes of driving. Get food not from one of the three places in the valley that are only open until, like, 8:00? Forty minutes of driving. Pick up a prescription? Forty minutes of driving. Need a tool/specific screw/particular light bulb? Forty minutes of driving. Go to a movie? Forty minutes of driving. Go to the library? Forty minutes of driving. Go hang out somewhere near where most of my friends live or at one of their homes? Forty minutes of driving. Fly somewhere? 90 minutes of driving there, assuming you want to fly to where the single-terminal local airport goes, otherwise you're going three hours one-way and paying a shitload for parking. Go to a mall? Three hours of driving. Go to Costco? Three hours of driving (it's forty minutes now, but they just put that Costco in a couple of years ago). Go to a C-tier or higher concert or play? Two hours of driving, minimum; frequently six hours for in-demand stuff. Go to a professional sporting event? Six hours of driving. You don't live in your house, you live in your loving car, you just sleep and watch TV in your house. And all that driving isn't counting time looking for parking. Until I got older, I never really grokked the "location, location, location" thing, but it's so loving true. For me, my quality of life is way more based around where I live than the quality of my living space (though, I'm about to compromise and move significantly farther out for a waaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyy better living space, presuming I can ever get keys to the place). I don't have a car, so my time spent driving approaches zero; I can go watch a professional soccer, football, or baseball game or a stadium show with a fifteen-minute walk (actually more like five minutes for football/soccer). There are probably more restaurants within half a mile of my apartment than there were within half an hour of the home I grew up in. And yeah, it takes me forty minutes to get to the airport... by light rail. I don't have to deal with parking at all. Due to a ticketing fuckup, I had gotten bumped to a flight like three hours later one time before I went through security, so I just went home, then came back to the airport later, it was great.
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Sep 15, 2023 19:40
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spwrozek posted:What? you don't want to work for CAT? hey, you can also work at the Komatsu EDT plant!!!!! I have spent a fair amount of time in Peoria and I never want to go back. I got on I-74 in Indianapolis earlier this year and got triggered by the "Peoria" signs.
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Sep 15, 2023 19:44
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Lockback posted:Although honestly I don't think there is much to talk about until the sellers actually say what they're going to do. It's this. I know the thread craves content, but we're not heading out there until 5:00pm Pacific Time. Lawyer looked over what we had, said yeah, you can pay them if you want/need to. I have nothing else for you. Ham Equity fucked around with this message at 19:54 on Sep 15, 2023 |
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Sep 15, 2023 19:46
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Ham Equity posted:It's this. I know the thread craves content, but we're not heading out there until 5:00pm Pacific Time. Lawyer looked over what we had, said yeah, you can pay them if you want/need to. I have nothing else for you. lmao that the lawyer's supposed advice is basically "yeah whatever, i guess"
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Sep 15, 2023 19:58
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pmchem posted:lmao that the lawyer's supposed advice is basically "yeah whatever, i guess" That doesn't seem that weird to me. I give legal advice all the time that's along the lines of "yes, there's nothing legally problematic about that decision, and whether you do it or not is up to you as a business/economic choice."
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Sep 15, 2023 20:06
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pmchem posted:lmao that the lawyer's supposed advice is basically "yeah whatever, i guess"
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Sep 15, 2023 20:07
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It's almost like there was no lawyer and this is made up.
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Sep 15, 2023 20:11
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Silly, completely hypothetical home-buying question, as long as we're talking about crazy scenarios: 1) You go try to buy a house. 2) Seller discloses a safety issue, but you're OK with hiring someone to fix it, so whatever. 3) Current owner contracts a rentback with you before you take possession. You agree, close the sale, they start rentback. You have not fixed the safety issue because you haven't moved in / they haven't moved out. 4) The [now renter, former owner] injures themselves on the safety issue. 5) [Now renter, former owner] sues you for not fixing a known safety issue. Does this ever happen?
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Sep 15, 2023 20:13
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Not in a world where you have competent legal representation and don't blindly fill out templates for sales contracts and rental agreements.
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Sep 15, 2023 20:15
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Ham Equity posted:She told us that paying them out would not amount to tax evasion since we haven't been contacted by the DoR, it is unlikely that the DoR would come after us for the money, and that we should reach out to them to make sure they're aware that by breaking the terms of the sale agreement they would be getting the money released to us (which we did). I'm not sure what more you were expecting...? Like, if the lawyer didn't say "this is the worst thing ever, I can't believe you did that," I'm lying...? What's the plan? Are you bringing cash, money order, check?
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Sep 15, 2023 20:32
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Leperflesh posted:There are reasons beyond just "that's where my job is" for why 70+% of americans live in cities. It's where all the other goods and services are concentrated too. And you know what? Goods and services are great, they loving rock. Looove me some services in particular. I love trees and solitude and ecosystems and peace and quiet and clear air and independence but also I looove having four choices within five miles for my vietnamese food, a fire station six blocks away with 24/7 paid professional firefighters inside and a fire hydrant outside my house they can hook up to, a dozen+ mechanics competing with each other to fix my car, and a municipal sewer system.
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Sep 15, 2023 20:33
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Baddog posted:What's the plan? Are you bringing cash, money order, check?
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Sep 15, 2023 20:38
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I admit I haven't read every last post in this ham story, but what are you expecting to get out of today's 5pm PST meeting? keys? what paperwork is being signed?
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Sep 15, 2023 20:41
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Sundae posted:You have not fixed the safety issue because you haven't moved in / they haven't moved out. That part wouldn't be a solid argument. You are the owner of the property, you hold the deed, there's no reason why you can't fix something while you have someone else living there. Every state has conditions of how to fix a safety issue while someone is residing in your house. Now, how liable would you be? Depends on the situation. At the very least they couldn't claim the tenant didn't know about the issue, but how it breaks down would depend on the situation.
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Sep 15, 2023 20:43
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pmchem posted:I admit I haven't read every last post in this ham story, but what are you expecting to get out of today's 5pm PST meeting?
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Sep 15, 2023 20:45
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Ham Equity posted:I'm expecting to get a better idea of what the sellers' play is. We're hoping to get keys, but I'm not optimistic. No paperwork, other than maybe an email from escrow letting us know what their deal is. I'm gonna have the attorney draft a release before we put a check in their hands, in any case. so there's no actual action items on the agenda. this is all so ridiculous someone just report posts if things get too stupid in this thread please
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Sep 15, 2023 20:50
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Ham Equity posted:I'm expecting to get a better idea of what the sellers' play is. We're hoping to get keys, but I'm not optimistic. No paperwork, other than maybe an email from escrow letting us know what their deal is. I'm gonna have the attorney draft a release before we put a check in their hands, in any case. Per your earlier posts, havent they already overstayed? Are you planning on just gifting them $25k if they ask for it to avoid an uncomfortable situation?
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Sep 15, 2023 20:54
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drk posted:Per your earlier posts, havent they already overstayed? Yes. Please answer these questions. And if they have not overstayed it's escrow's job to return the money to them, not to you.
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Sep 15, 2023 20:56
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drk posted:Per your earlier posts, havent they already overstayed? Motronic posted:Yes. Please answer these questions. Per escrow, the DoR very specifically told escrow not to give them the money.
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Sep 15, 2023 20:59
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Have you talked to your lawyer about what to do if they don't hand over the keys? Better still, is your lawyer coming to this meeting?
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Sep 15, 2023 21:02
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Reminder that even if they have overstayed, if they move out in the first month they are at least owed the deposit and second month's rent. Someone is owed that, anyway. I believe this to be their play, to get that cash, and perhaps even if they "lose" the first month's rent for overstaying by one day, they're still happy with that because that was money they weren't going to have anyway, it's coming out of the IRS's pocket somehow. What is unclear to me and I hope is clear to Ham Equity's lawyer is whether this manipulation constitutes some sort of fraud, to which Ham Equity could be an accessory. Especially if he also refunds the first month's rent, at which point it sorta sounds like he's effectively declining to invoke the contractural obligation of the former owners to pay rent for overstaying, but still accepting the payout from escrow for exactly that thing, seems extra shady to me. I hope this has all been made crystal clear to this lawyer and that the lawyer has provided her advice in writing.
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Sep 15, 2023 21:04
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Ham Equity posted:Per escrow, the DoR very specifically told escrow not to give them the money. And how is DoR going to feel if you turn around and give it to them anyways? Are you sure they aren't going to come after you for it?
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Sep 15, 2023 21:06
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Leperflesh posted:
Lawyer said it was "unlikely", heh. Ham, did you pay this lawyer, or was this the free advice you get prior to an actual engagement?
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Sep 15, 2023 21:06
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Have you talked to your lawyer about what to do if they don't hand over the keys? Better still, is your lawyer coming to this meeting? Lawyer is not coming to the meeting. We didn't talk to the lawyer much about that, I'm not in love with the idea of racking up billables on "what-ifs," even if they're somewhat likely what-ifs. I'm not saying we don't want our keys as soon as possible, but the flip side is we weren't planning on moving until the 23rd anyway, so if it's a few extra days on the keys to save $600, that's probably worthwhile for us.
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Sep 15, 2023 21:09
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I've never heard of the DoR going after a landlord because someone who owed money for taxes paid their rent. Maybe it could happen but it does strike me as extremely unlikely.Arsenic Lupin posted:Have you talked to your lawyer about what to do if they don't hand over the keys? Better still, is your lawyer coming to this meeting? They have 2 months in which they can live there before its a problem. They paid a deposit that was "We get 2 months rent or we get the money back". They didn't leave so as of now they have 2 months to live there. They want to meet anyway and its almost certainly going to be to try to negotiate a cash for keys situation, but HE doesn't know what the request is going to be yet.
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Sep 15, 2023 21:11
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Ham Equity posted:Lawyer is not coming to the meeting. We didn't talk to the lawyer much about that, I'm not in love with the idea of racking up billables on "what-ifs," even if they're somewhat likely what-ifs. I'm not saying we don't want our keys as soon as possible, but the flip side is we weren't planning on moving until the 23rd anyway, so if it's a few extra days on the keys to save $600, that's probably worthwhile for us. Lol. Lmao. Pilfered Pallbearers posted:My dude, your unwillingness to spend a fraction of a percent (~0.25%, being generous with how high a fee an attorney would have charged initially for this clusterfuck) of your 3/4 of a million dollar purchase is going to cause you months of pain and significantly more in costs than that attorney would have cost you.
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Sep 15, 2023 21:14
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Baddog posted:Lawyer said it was "unlikely", heh. Ham, did you pay this lawyer, or was this the free advice you get prior to an actual engagement? Leperflesh posted:Reminder that even if they have overstayed, if they move out in the first month they are at least owed the deposit and second month's rent. Someone is owed that, anyway. I believe this to be their play, to get that cash, and perhaps even if they "lose" the first month's rent for overstaying by one day, they're still happy with that because that was money they weren't going to have anyway, it's coming out of the IRS's pocket somehow. Lockback posted:I've never heard of the DoR going after a landlord because someone who owed money for taxes paid their rent. Maybe it could happen but it does strike me as extremely unlikely. Apparently, I was wrong about not having content for you all, my apologies. EDIT: Just heard from escrow, they're going to cut us the check today. Ham Equity fucked around with this message at 21:23 on Sep 15, 2023 |
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Sep 15, 2023 21:20
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yeah I didn't say tax fraud as in you not paying tax, you've already clarified that part, I'm talking about the sellers using this mechanism to get cash that should have gone to the IRS. It's shady. I'm glad you talked about it with the lawyer though. I really do think the most likely outcome is that it'll work out and be OK, but like... the risk seems very very high. Good luck to you. Genuinely I hope it works out. We all think you were crazy to take this risk, regardless.
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Sep 15, 2023 21:29
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Leperflesh posted:yeah I didn't say tax fraud as in you not paying tax, you've already clarified that part, I'm talking about the sellers using this mechanism to get cash that should have gone to the IRS. It's shady. I'm glad you talked about it with the lawyer though. Leperflesh posted:I really do think the most likely outcome is that it'll work out and be OK, but like... the risk seems very very high. Good luck to you. Genuinely I hope it works out. We all think you were crazy to take this risk, regardless.
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Sep 15, 2023 21:32
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Ham Equity posted:We didn't talk to the lawyer much about that, I'm not in love with the idea of racking up billables on "what-ifs," even if they're somewhat likely what-ifs. 
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Sep 15, 2023 21:46
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Ham Equity posted:Lawyer is not coming to the meeting. We didn't talk to the lawyer much about that, I'm not in love with the idea of racking up billables on "what-ifs," even if they're somewhat likely what-ifs. I might just be a simple country lawyer *snaps suspenders* but it sure sounds like you cheaped out by asking the lawyer to take a free 30 minute look at some paperwork and some non sequiturs about tax fraud instead of your actual problem of likely deadbeat tenants you're an accidental landord over and got the non-answer you wanted to hear about how it probably maybe will be fine. Ham Equity posted:We haven't signed a representational agreement yet, but she's reviewed the sale agreement and closing documents before advising us. I'm expecting an agreement today.  I too march straight into a buzzsaw with the confidence that I have a doctor all lined up who maybe just might have time to patch me up, maybe, if nothing else important from one of their other paying patients comes up first.
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Sep 15, 2023 21:47
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Do lawyers go to meetings like this? I'm sure that it would be useful to have one there, like if the sellers want to make a deal and sign it off then and there. Where do I hire the Lincoln lawyer
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Sep 15, 2023 21:56
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Ham Equity posted:Lawyer is not coming to the meeting. We didn't talk to the lawyer much about that, I'm not in love with the idea of racking up billables on "what-ifs," even if they're somewhat likely what-ifs. I'm not saying we don't want our keys as soon as possible, but the flip side is we weren't planning on moving until the 23rd anyway, so if it's a few extra days on the keys to save $600, that's probably worthwhile for us. What The gently caress
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Sep 15, 2023 21:57
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Epitope posted:Do lawyers go to meetings like this? I'm sure that it would be useful to have one there, like if the sellers want to make a deal and sign it off then and there. Where do I hire the Lincoln lawyer
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Sep 15, 2023 22:00
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pmchem posted:so there's no actual action items on the agenda. this is all so ridiculous This meeting could've been an email! Oh wait this isn't the corporate thread??
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Sep 15, 2023 22:04
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Epitope posted:Do lawyers go to meetings like this? I'm sure that it would be useful to have one there, like if the sellers want to make a deal and sign it off then and there. Where do I hire the Lincoln lawyer We found a lawyer, we laid out the situation for her, she agreed to advise us, we provided her with our documents, and we are listening to what she is telling us to do. She didn't tell us not to go to the meeting, and she didn't say there were any specific steps we should take in regards to landlord/tenant concerns, and everyone is acting as if I'm totally off the reservation, here. This was not a five-minute conversation, it was a forty-five minute call plus document review. She is not telling me things like "I am not your lawyer and this is not legal advice." EDIT: To be clear, the "action item" for this meeting is that they are handing over the keys, I'm just not 100% confident that is going to happen for... *gestures in the direction of my other posts*... Reasons.
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Sep 15, 2023 22:04
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Vice President posted:I might just be a simple country lawyer *snaps suspenders* but it sure sounds like you cheaped out by asking the lawyer to take a free 30 minute look at some paperwork and some non sequiturs about tax fraud instead of your actual problem of likely deadbeat tenants you're an accidental landord over and got the non-answer you wanted to hear about how it probably maybe will be fine. I'm just a simple suburban lawyer, but this sounds fine. An engagement letter/representation agreement with a lawyer, like any other contract, isn't done on the spot. Ham said that the lawyer is sending them the engagement agreement shortly. Plenty of lawyers will take a couple of hours to dig into the issue before the agreement is actually signed, especially if it's time sensitive. Arsenic Lupin posted:It's routine (and required in some states) for a lawyer to come to a closing. You pay them by the hour to do this, of course. And in many other states, it's not routine at all. It is not routine in California, for example. Epitope posted:Do lawyers go to meetings like this? I'm sure that it would be useful to have one there, like if the sellers want to make a deal and sign it off then and there. Where do I hire the Lincoln lawyer Right, well, Ham's not talking about making a handshake deal on the spot. Any request from the sellers would have adequate time to be run by the lawyer after the conversation.
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Sep 15, 2023 22:06
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Muir posted:I'm just a simple suburban lawyer, but this sounds fine. An engagement letter/representation agreement with a lawyer, like any other contract, isn't done on the spot. Ham said that the lawyer is sending them the engagement agreement shortly. Plenty of lawyers will take a couple of hours to dig into the issue before the agreement is actually signed, especially if it's time sensitive. Thank you for this sanity check, Muir. I feel like the thread is gaslighting me. Also, you responded to a post responding to me, I'm pretty sure that means that you're my lawyer, now.
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Sep 15, 2023 22:07
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Muir posted:Right, well, Ham's not talking about making a handshake deal on the spot. Any request from the sellers would have adequate time to be run by the lawyer after the conversation. Sure, it seems the speculation is the sellers are going to try a hard sell on the spot. But I suppose goon speculation is not helping much, even if it can be amusing.
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Sep 15, 2023 22:12
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