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kastein posted:I personally hate Eaton as a company, but mostly for AI reasons rather than thread-relevant reasons.  but yeah. (Re: Tripp-Lite acquisition.)According to the description it comes with the main breaker. Everything else would be just feeding from that breaker into another panel. Not sure what else I could need? Lugs tend to be pretty widely available if I need anything like that. This is the breaker: https://www.platt.com/p/0271643/eaton/breaker-200a-2p-120-240v-25-kaic-type-csr/782113098463/cutcsr2200n Pricing on some of this stuff is completely wild. This same sku is listed at $2500-3500 on other websites, $299 at home depot (out of stock at all stores). I don't know if they're selling a 10-pack or if it's just gently caress you pricing until you setup a trade account with them then magically it's all correct or what.
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Sep 15, 2023 23:41
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Ooh, wasn't sure how you were planning on running this. In my case I ran a 100A dual pole that feeds one indoor sub panel and left room for another 100A to feed a second sub (the service itself is 200A) so I needed to add a breaker. If you're just going from lugs on the main breaker direct to your panel inside, yeah, you will probably be fine. The crazy prices are probably one of the reasons you listed or possibly COVID era gouging - meter mains and similar service equipment were extremely hard to come by for a few years including people getting delivery estimates well into the 1-2 year range, and every electrician and scummy distributor sitting on a pile of stock started jacking their prices on things as a result.
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Sep 16, 2023 00:13
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Is it ever allowable to wire two switches in parallel? I don’t mean a 3-way, I mean actually parallel. The use case: I have a motion sensor switch in my garage, love the way it works, it pops on when we come in or out, stays on for 5 minutes, shuts off. 99% of the time that’s just what I want. It’s a single momentary button you can slap to trigger on state as if by motion. That other 1% of the time, I want it to stay on indefinitely, and I’ve not found a way to force that. I could replace the switch with something that behaves a little differently, but alternatively, I could wire a standard switch in parallel right next to it. If that switch is on, the lights are on, period. If that switch is off, I get the mode I very much like. Is it me? Am I considering willfully being the oft-lamented Previous Owner?
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Sep 17, 2023 22:46
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I um.......wow. I'd need to do code review on that. It sounds reasonable but I feel like it would go against some things in regards to deenergizing conductors maybe? Maybe not? This is the kind of thing I used to love getting when I was in code enforcement. Especially if the answer ended up being "YES! But you need to put a tag on it that says xxx" or whatever.
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Sep 17, 2023 22:54
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Yeah, they’d be in the same box, even, and if one opened it, it’d just be a couple 6” wires from one to the other. I know deep down that just using a different switch is probably the right answer but 1) the existing one is otherwise perfect, does what I need, not complicated, and 2) I have all the needed parts on hand as a matter of course, so I wouldn’t need to go drop $30 or whatever on a switch.
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Sep 17, 2023 23:10
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I'm gonna go with parallel wiring being an acceptable solution here based on basic NEC knowledge now that I think about it more. I think you're talking about a switch with a sensor inside, but if not you could put in a dumb but still smarter motion sensor that has a mode thing in it like "on-off-on-off-on" means stay on. Those are definitely a thing and may be even easier for you to wire up (and then replace the switch with a standard one?). I don't feel like I've got the full picture, just giving options around this general area.
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Sep 17, 2023 23:19
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Just for kicks, this is all it is currently: That sensor kicks the light on, and eventually it shuts off again. You can press the button to turn it on (or off) manually, but it still sticks to the timer when you turn it on.  It’s all a bit silly because the thing meets its purpose so well I can go an entire year without having to even touch it. But once in a blue moon, I want to work in the garage after hours, just out of view of the sensor, and then all of a sudden CURFEW IS NOW IN EFFECT, LIGHTS OUT. Bad Munki fucked around with this message at 23:27 on Sep 17, 2023 |
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Sep 17, 2023 23:24
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Bad Munki posted:Just for kicks, this is all it is currently: Looks like you live in California and that's a title 24 switch. You may want to pop that out enough to find a manufacture and model number a look up a cut sheet. It MIGHT have a mode to stay on based on some keypress dance/just hold it in for 5 seconds/etc. And if not you should probably find an "occupancy switch" that does that rather than parallel wiring.
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Sep 17, 2023 23:32
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Iowa, but I’ll have a look inside to try to find a manual.
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Sep 17, 2023 23:34
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Bad Munki posted:Iowa, but I’ll have a look inside to try to find a manual. Then you have a better chance of that switch having an always on mode depending on when it was made.
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Sep 18, 2023 00:38
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Double-tap is "stay on" on a few models I've seen.
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Sep 18, 2023 00:48
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It’s a Lutron 9d10, and based on the manuals I can find, it doesn’t have a “just stay on” option. See page 3, Sensor Mode: https://assets.lutron.com/a/documents/048461.pdf
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Sep 18, 2023 01:49
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I see no reason why switches in parallel wouldn't be legal. Especially in the same box. It's essentially equivalent to an ON/AUTO control (like ON/OFF/AUTO with no full OFF).
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Sep 18, 2023 02:38
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Motronic posted:Looks like you live in California and that's a title 24 switch.
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Sep 18, 2023 03:12
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Looked it up. Goddrat do I hate automatic vacancy sensors. Spent too much time waving an arm above my head because the sensors didn't detect me because I was sitting still typing. Stop using public restrooms as your office?
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Sep 18, 2023 03:13
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Bad Munki posted:Stop using public restrooms as your office? Gotta get the ones with accoustic sensors so you can fart the lights back on
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Sep 18, 2023 05:11
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I don't see any code reason against this either. I would probably put a switch with a pilot light (not a night light) in as the force-on switch so that it's obvious it's been left in the wrong position when you're leaving. Something like a leviton 5638-2w. This may require you to use a relay driven by the override switch so that the pilot light can't be backfed from the occupancy sensor, or find a DPST with pilot light switch and use one set of contacts just for the pilot light.
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Sep 18, 2023 05:18
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I have something similar in my house with some Lutron Maestros. My solution was a HA-controlled relay that does the exact thing you’re talking about in a nearby jbox — I can toggle a “maintenance mode” from my browser and temporarily suspend all convenience automations. Never really thought about code I guess, it’s all buttoned up + you’ll de-energize the circuit before working on it anyways… right!?
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Sep 18, 2023 13:19
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Bad Munki posted:Stop using public restrooms as your office? I swear I heard someone say that they worked somewhere with those sensors in the toilets but they weren't in the cubicles so you'd just get stuck in the dark if nobody had come into the main bathroom area.
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Sep 18, 2023 13:36
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Looked it up. Goddrat do I hate automatic vacancy sensors. Spent too much time waving an arm above my head because the sensors didn't detect me because I was sitting still typing. FYI, there's a revolution quietly happening in this field with millimeter wave radar sensors. Not only do they detect presence without motion as opposed to the PIR kind (which has been around for half a century and is most well known for creating the issue you're describing), but depending on how complex they are, they can detect multiple presences, height of said presences, and things like if one presence goes from standing to on the floor very quickly (i.e. fall detection). At the moment most of the available models are noname stuff off Aliexpress, but there are some actual companies in the home automation field releasing branded sensors and they may finally allow the holy grail of home automation, properly tracking where someone is and automating things literally around them.
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Sep 18, 2023 21:50
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SyNack Sassimov posted:At the moment most of the available models are noname stuff off Aliexpress, but there are some actual companies in the home automation field releasing branded sensors and they may finally allow the holy grail of home automation, properly tracking where someone is and automating things literally around them. I have heard nothing but disappoint and "but"s about these. Yeah, it's coming, but it's not here.
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Sep 18, 2023 22:02
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Can't wait for my Amazon Sense to suggest that I order a pizza from their partner because it detected I flopped onto the couch harder than usual and the algorithms determined there was an advertising opportunity to be exploited.
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Sep 18, 2023 22:05
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SyNack Sassimov posted:millimeter wave radar...stuff off Aliexpress Speaking of things we definitely won't discover cause brain cancer: https://guru.inc/ . Someone I know works there which is how I learned it exists at all.
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Sep 19, 2023 00:12
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H110Hawk posted:Speaking of things we definitely won't discover cause brain cancer: https://guru.inc/ . Someone I know works there which is how I learned it exists at all. quote:A fundamental departure from previous power transfer methods, GuRu employs proprietary “Smart Lensing” technology that enables the use of focused energy beams for highly efficient power transfer. Our Smart Lensing pinpoints specific targets for power delivery rather than flooding an entire room with wireless energy.  And uh.....what happens when a big sack of meat and water happens to get in the way of this, as they put it, "focused energy beam"? (huh where have I heard that nomenclature before oh well I can't remember surely it'll come to me) I'm not one for OM 5 GEEZ CAUSES CANCER but uh, that doesn't mean I want radio beams in my house to be anything that could be called high power.
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Sep 19, 2023 04:06
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So, I have a 12 year old Hunter ceiling fan (first mistake, I know - but I've gotten my money's worth) with a remote control that started having just one of the bulbs flicker. The bulbs were these tiny little 40W Krypton bulbs with E12 sockets because they were the only thing that fit in the globe 12 years with an E12 base and put out decent light. I figured the bulb was going bad or something funky, but for kicks I grabbed a newish candleabra LED bulb from another fixture to see if they would fit and I could reduce my power usage. 1 basic LED bulb + 1 Krypton bulb works fine. Grabbed a second LED bulb from the donor fixture and put it in place of the remaining Krypton bulb, nothing. Think that is weird, but don't have time to troubleshoot, so put back in the one Krypton bulb and leave it. Do a little more dicking around, and realize Philips now makes Hue E12 base bulbs (we have a lot of Hue stuff already), so order one up to see if they will fit. It, along with a single Krypton bulb also works fine, and hey, it fits inside the globe! Fabulous. Order another Hue bulb, and with two in the fixture, they strobe on and off at probably 5 Hz or so. If I swap one Hue for a basic LED bulb, they both still strobe. Well this is loving bizarre. So my behaviors so far are below, although they aren't always consistent: 2 Krypton bulbs -> just one bulb blinks on and off at very long (tens of seconds), erratic intervals 1 Krypton bulb + 1 basic LED or hue bulb -> works great, no issues, even for extended time 2 basic LED bulbs -> no light 2 Hue bulbs or 1 Hue + 1 basic -> seizure mode The only discrete thing accessible in the lower part of the fan that is inline with the lights is a 120C thermal fuse, which doesn't seem like a credible source of this behavior, although it is easy enough to bypass to see I suppose. Anything else silly I should be checking before I start dismounting the whole fan to find the remote module and see if I can find a replacement? Could this just be some weird intermittent connection that has a weird thermal behavior or something? If so I would think it would be more consistent and linked to higher wattage bulbs causing more issues. I'm at a loss beyond electronic fuckery between however the remote control module switches power to the bulbs and the electronics in the LED bulbs - but then why the issue with two Krypton bulbs? Maybe that was truly a weird bulb failure and separate from the problem with the LED bulbs? None of this makes sense to me; I'm just a dumb mechanical engineer, although that is normally sufficient for home wiring. The thermal fuse in question: 
ROJO fucked around with this message at 05:33 on Sep 19, 2023 |
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Sep 19, 2023 04:53
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ROJO posted:So, I have a 12 year old Hunter ceiling fan (first mistake, I know - but I've gotten my money's worth) with a remote control The canopy remote control receiver isn't compatible with LED bulbs. Since you want to use hue stuff anyway, just bypass the module for the lighting circuit. Rather than use the lighting output of the module to feed the sockets, just connect directly to the hot lead in the ceiling box. The remote will still control the fan, but the lighting will be controlled via whatever runs your hue.
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Sep 19, 2023 05:50
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A pretty good rule of thumb is that if a dimmer is more than about ten years old it is going to have trouble with LEDs. A wall-mounted fan control would also likely work just fine. Something like this: But if you are using Hue bulbs anyway I agree it is best to just bypass the remote entirely and use Phillips' wall control. There's a home automation thread here, that might be a good place to ask about setups if you want to build out a Hue system.
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Sep 19, 2023 11:22
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All of the Lutron fan/light switches now require separate hots to the fan, which if they exist are great but if not you have limited options. Lutron's own canopy module which didn't support LEDs was discontinued years ago and they never released a new version with LED support.
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Sep 19, 2023 13:51
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H110Hawk posted:Yields this, which Platt claims to have 6 of, even if they're pretty expensive compared to the 200A meter main load center combos at Home Depot: I just got off the phone with a very nice person over at the local SCE planning office who confirmed that what I bought is in fact compatible with SCE service. He said the EUSERC stamp is what I want, and that the ESR I found in fact where I should be looking. I was driving and he told me yeah it's "in there somewhere, normally towards the end..." and then looked it up himself. Page a zillion appendix something oh yeah here we go. He was very happy to chat with me as my 4 year old chattered away from the back seat.
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Sep 19, 2023 17:51
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Qwijib0 posted:The canopy remote control receiver isn't compatible with LED bulbs. Since you want to use hue stuff anyway, just bypass the module for the lighting circuit. Rather than use the lighting output of the module to feed the sockets, just connect directly to the hot lead in the ceiling box. The remote will still control the fan, but the lighting will be controlled via whatever runs your hue. Shifty Pony posted:A pretty good rule of thumb is that if a dimmer is more than about ten years old it is going to have trouble with LEDs. A wall-mounted fan control would also likely work just fine. Something like [url=https://www.lutron.com/en-US/Products/Pages/StandAloneControls/FanControls/Maestro/Overview.aspx]this: Yup, that was totally it. Since the fan remote had a dipswitch for dimmable/non-dimmable lights, I assumed that wouldn't have been an issue, then you all made me realize it is just restricting the commands the remote sends, not changing how the controller actually drives the lights  Bypassing the module for just the lights worked great. Thanks guys!
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Sep 19, 2023 18:26
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Qwijib0 posted:All of the Lutron fan/light switches now require separate hots to the fan, which if they exist are great but if not you have limited options. Lutron's own canopy module which didn't support LEDs was discontinued years ago and they never released a new version with LED support. There is a very limited range of led bulbs that work with it but it took a lot of trial and error to get ones that won't flicker.
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Sep 19, 2023 19:51
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Platt shipped my meter main in the "retail" packaging plus label, as is frequently riffed on in this hilarious PMF thread from captian invictus which led to some damage. Basically the razor sharp (lol ask me how I know) unpainted bracket/flangy parts got bent at the tops and bottom, I assume the whole bits are out of true. The painted parts all look fine. I don't have anything level enough to test if the whole box is twisted somehow. At least not that I can access while my back is spasmed. I emailed all of this to my electrician as well. Should I complain to platt about this? It looks like a pair of lineman pliers would make it straight enough, followed by the fasteners screwing it to the wall. Not sure if there is something I'm missing. Crappy extremely cropped to remove shipping labels nighttime pictures of the delivery before I touched it:   Bent stuff:    Contents look good:  
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Sep 24, 2023 01:52
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I thought this was that thread for a second. It'll be fine. That stuff is designed specifically to be flimsy in a couple of directions and strong in another so that you can screw it into an existing structure made with the orange toilet store's worst twisted beaver bribe wall studs and still have the main can remain square and true. If any of the plastic or metal bits inside the enclosure are cracked, bent, or damaged in any way, make a claim.
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Sep 24, 2023 04:45
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That's what I sort of assumed but didn't know how to verify - thank you. Wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something.
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Sep 24, 2023 15:22
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I was installing a dimmer today and noticed that whoever redid this box to add fan controls cut the entire back of the old work box out instead of trying to feed the existing wires in.  How much should I care? Said person also consistently hosed up the ground connections in every single box they did. They tied together the grounds of the new wiring but then didn't bother to connect the ground of the existing incoming cable to it because they cut it too short when removing the old box. You can see the stub of the actual ground peeking out at the right rear of the box, above the Wago I was in the middle of installing when I took the picture. They also didn't use proper old work boxes when putting in 3-gang boxes, instead using some drywall screws to screw the end wall of a new work box to the stud.
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Sep 29, 2023 01:10
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That isn't to code. It will need to be replaced. Did they do that to fit the depth of the wall cavity? There are other choices for old work boxes. You have more choices for depth with steel boxes with plaster ears and those bendy side brackets.
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Sep 29, 2023 01:51
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I'm pretty sure they did it because it was a pain in the rear end to feed the stub of the existing cable through the cable clamps of the old work box. Which I totally get is extremely annoying, but that's no excuse for poo poo work. Especially because the wall backs up to a closet where it would be pretty trivial to cut a hole and feed the wires in from the back (or even use a new work box). If they really couldn't get the existing cable through the clamps the proper solution would have been to stick a junction box in the attic to splice in a new run of cable and abandon the old cable. After all they were already fishing the new 14/3 fan cable down as well as a new 14/2 cable to feed the closet light (the red tape in the box is the abandoned old closet light feed, which has a black wire broken off at a uselessly short length), but nope Gary gonna Gary.
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Sep 29, 2023 02:28
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The box provides fire protection for the wire connections. Cutting it out negates that. They went to a lot of effort to make that box pointless.
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Sep 29, 2023 02:57
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I think my outlets have failed and I am replacing them all. High wattage appliances would turn off (toaster, dishwasher) after running for a bit. I traced it down to the outlet. This outlet had an absolute crapload of ants in it, the copper turned green?  I cut back the insulated wires and stripped them to clean copper. I sanded the grounds with emery cloth. They looked like this:  Some questions: Is sanding the grounds to shiny copper ok? There is not enough clean copper in the box to cut back. The original outlets have two ground wires jammed under the screw, this doesn't seem right? I put a pigtail thing and wago'd the three together, is this correct? The boxes are metal, but are not bonded to ground directly, the frame of the outlet smooshing against the box seems to be the thing grounding the box. Should I do something different? I did a 7 outlets this way, did 21 minutes per outlet on average. Multiplying out, going to take NINE HOURS to do the first floor. Holy smokes I hope I get faster at this. I have 3 more buildings with the same crappy outlets. If I spend a bunch of time doing this, I want it to be as correct as possible without opening up the walls.
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Oct 1, 2023 00:27
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Looks good to me but I am not an electrician. You will get faster as you get calloused and the hang of stripping wire. Do you have an auto-stripper? That makes it much faster. That green is corrosion, probably from water, hopefully not from overloading/poor connections. What's your main panel look like? If it's one of the cursed brands then you might be in for a shock.
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Oct 1, 2023 00:43
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