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There's also the really cringey Riot versus Blizzard angle to the Tencent discussion that doesn't warrant a detailed dismantling in this thread.
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Sep 19, 2023 03:25
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Endorph posted:tbh there are cases of the cn government censoring, like, gay content I'm not bringing it up to make fun of the position, I'm bringing it up because it is legitimately what you'll hear in quite a lot of gaming spaces. This isn't a dichotomy, it stems from the same issue of 'people are not bringing forward legitimate, actionable criticism of Tencent and the Chinese government' and I don't think the solution is 'well, you'll just have to put up with the racism because even if people are mad for inaccurate reasons, at least they're mad'.
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Sep 19, 2023 03:32
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im not saying you have to ignore the racism but im saying i dont see the value in bringing it up here apropos of nothing when nobody here's acting like that
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Sep 19, 2023 03:36
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Inadequately posted:Yeah, to be clear, that stuff is indefensible, and I'll acknowledge there is probably something to the idea that Tencent would roll over in an instant if the Chinese government commanded it. The vast majority of people that I interact with anyway use 'Tencent Bad' as shorthand for two things: "Super Conglomerates using their child companies as investment vehicles are frequently bad on a short timeline, and are always bad on a longer one" and "The Chinese Government can suck a fat chode". Less frequently, I see it in the context of 'China, the businesses' when it comes to issues of copyright, Aggressive P2W stuff, etc. Less then that still, I see it in the context of 'China, the people' where it comes up as ' we don't want cheaters here' which I'm not convinced is particularly defensible, but there is some evidence that it has some truth in it. I think it would be very reasonable though to say that the majority of people who don't like Tencent are not motivated by a racial aspect.
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Sep 19, 2023 03:39
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My first real exposure to Tencent being bad was the Blitzchung thing where they wagged the dog and forced US Blizzard to basically act as an arm of the chinese government with regard to censorship. It hasn't gotten better since then. Though that whole ordeal is made even funnier since China kicked Blizzard out anyways this year.
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Sep 19, 2023 03:52
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Kurieg posted:My first real exposure to Tencent being bad was the Blitzchung thing where they wagged the dog and forced US Blizzard to basically act as an arm of the chinese government with regard to censorship. It hasn't gotten better since then. In Tencent's defense, that was Netease (although it probably doesn't matter at all in this case - defying the Chinese government is high on the list of things you shouldn't do as a business there if you want to continue to exist). And Netease and Blizz couldn't agree on contract terms to operate in China, so that's why Blizzard is out of China. A very annoying piece of China Trivia - if you are a game company and want to operate there, you cannot do so by yourself. You have to operate through someone else, which is why Netease or Tencent is a required entry point for titles that want to operate there.
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Sep 19, 2023 04:25
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Kurieg posted:My first real exposure to Tencent being bad was the Blitzchung thing where they wagged the dog and forced US Blizzard to basically act as an arm of the chinese government with regard to censorship. It hasn't gotten better since then. This is by no means a defense of Tencent, but I don't believe they had anything to do with the Blitzchung thing. IIRC Tencent only owns a ~5% stake which is far too small to force things out of Acti-Blizz. Blizzard preemptively banned Blitzchung themselves because they anticipated a warning/backlash from the CCP, but said warning never (publicly) happened. So as far as we know, they just shot themselves in the foot for no reason. Also, Blizzard was always partnered with Netease to distribute their games in China, not Tencent. Sources claim that the ABK execs was the ones who pulled out of that contract, not the Netease side.
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Sep 19, 2023 04:26
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Ahh yeah, whoops. Still makes me leery of any chinese game company, really.IncendiaC posted:Also, Blizzard was always partnered with Netease to distribute their games in China, not Tencent. Sources claim that the ABK execs was the ones who pulled out of that contract, not the Netease side. I seem to remember the Netease press release around that time being something to the effect of "Bobby Kotick tried to play hard ball thinking he could get a better deal with another company and that we'd agree to anything to keep him but that's not how it works here." Also Blizzard China made their press release condemning Blitzchung and Blizz US's response was basically "oh uh we can't actually tell them not to do that."
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Sep 19, 2023 05:21
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Canine Blues Arooo posted:In Tencent's defense, that was Netease (although it probably doesn't matter at all in this case - defying the Chinese government is high on the list of things you shouldn't do as a business there if you want to continue to exist). And Netease and Blizz couldn't agree on contract terms to operate in China, so that's why Blizzard is out of China. This is business in China generally. Foreign companies cannot directly do business in China. You can actually register a foreign owned Chinese business to operate through instead, but that company has to operate under Chinese business law with all the financial restrictions and whatnot associated with that so it's not a great option for most.
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Sep 19, 2023 05:33
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mycot posted:I definitely remember a very racist bent to the conversation where Tencent, the Chinese government, and Chinese people were all conflated with each other, but I suppose those are just people who would always be racist. The CCP would very much love this because - and surely this would never happen - their opponents would self censor because any criticism of them is automatically a racist attack on Chinese people
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Sep 19, 2023 05:48
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https://twitter.com/Terraria_Logic/status/1704227519027651016?t=BXS39axJyyBpIOUg4nlmQA&s=19
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Sep 19, 2023 23:09
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Do American CEOs ever resign to try and save face for the company? Cause now seems like a pretty good time to do that even if it's ultimately a symbolic gesture.
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Sep 19, 2023 23:23
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Mercury_Storm posted:Do American CEOs ever resign to try and save face for the company? Cause now seems like a pretty good time to do that even if it's ultimately a symbolic gesture. Not typically? Sometimes CEOs get forced out or opt to bail before the jenga tower collapses, but it's basically never framed as a public admission of fault or contrition and is almost always framed as "seeking new opportunities".
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Sep 19, 2023 23:44
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Kanos posted:Not typically? Sometimes CEOs get forced out or opt to bail before the jenga tower collapses, but it's basically never framed as a public admission of fault or contrition and is almost always framed as "seeking new opportunities". And a lot of CEO positions pay you more when you leave them, even if you’re leaving under bad auspices unless they can really prove you hosed up.
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Sep 19, 2023 23:50
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Mercury_Storm posted:Do American CEOs ever resign to try and save face for the company? Cause now seems like a pretty good time to do that even if it's ultimately a symbolic gesture. he's gonna get a raise
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Sep 20, 2023 00:01
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Mercury_Storm posted:Do American CEOs ever resign to try and save face for the company? Cause now seems like a pretty good time to do that even if it's ultimately a symbolic gesture. Dude resigned from EA so 
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Sep 20, 2023 00:30
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Mercury_Storm posted:Do American CEOs ever resign to try and save face for the company? Cause now seems like a pretty good time to do that even if it's ultimately a symbolic gesture. They ran Brian Krzanich out of Intel for sleeping with one of his employees, but everyone knows its actually because he was doing a terrible job as CEO. While the stock price is going up they never care if CEOs are loving the employees, weird.
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Sep 20, 2023 00:37
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Twerk from Home posted:They ran Brian Krzanich out of Intel for sleeping with one of his employees, but everyone knows its actually because he was doing a terrible job as CEO. Allegedly sexually assaulting the head of HR didn't get rid of JR, so I doubt the Intel plan will work.
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Sep 20, 2023 00:56
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MarcusSA posted:Dude resigned from EA so Ten years from now he'll be hailed as a pioneer Published on March 19, 2013
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Sep 20, 2023 01:14
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Kanos posted:Not typically? Sometimes CEOs get forced out or opt to bail before the jenga tower collapses, but it's basically never framed as a public admission of fault or contrition and is almost always framed as "seeking new opportunities". "Spending time with their family."
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Sep 20, 2023 13:13
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leper khan posted:Allegedly sexually assaulting the head of HR didn't get rid of JR, so I doubt the Intel plan will work. He married the head of HR and sexually assaulted others. Who found it difficult to get assistance from HR because, well. https://techcrunch.com/2019/06/08/former-unity-technology-vp-files-lawsuit-alleging-ceo-sexually-harassed-her/?guccounter=1 quote:“Throughout Evans’ tenure at Unity, Riccitiello regularly made comments about all of the women he slept with, their ages, and what sexual acts they liked to perform with him,” the lawsuit states. “Brown [Unity’s chief people officer], often would laugh approvingly about Riccitiello’s tales of sexual conquest and later when they started a relationship (as described below) would talk in explicit detail at work about her and Riccitiello’s sex life.”
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Sep 20, 2023 16:41
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Well, poo poo, the Embracer fallout keeps going and now it's Beamdog taking a hit: https://www.gamedeveloper.com/business/embracer-cuts-jobs-at-i-baldur-s-gate-enhanced-edition-i-developer-beamdogquote:Former Beamdog associate producer Misia Bloniarz noted that "on Friday, 26 people were laid off at Beamdog and I unfortunately am one of them." The news was corroborated by those affected including the studio's former QA manager Erin McIntyre and associate graphic artist Jill Hollet.
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Sep 20, 2023 16:57
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Ah, so I guess no more BG updates
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Sep 20, 2023 17:01
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Beginning to think that a company being able to buy every other game company with no real regulation is bad or something.
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Sep 20, 2023 17:04
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FishMcCool posted:Well, poo poo, the Embracer fallout keeps going and now it's Beamdog taking a hit: https://www.gamedeveloper.com/business/embracer-cuts-jobs-at-i-baldur-s-gate-enhanced-edition-i-developer-beamdog https://store.steampowered.com/app/363860/MythForce/ (be honest, how many of you are hearing about it for the first time)
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Sep 20, 2023 17:26
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kliras posted:they just released mythforce which, despite its cool art style, bombed pretty hard I don't think I even saw it on the New Releases page on steam. 
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Sep 20, 2023 17:45
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I only knew about it because I follow the publisher on Steam which sends you emails when a game of theirs launches. It’s handy. The game isn’t really my kind of thing though so I didn’t buy it.
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Sep 20, 2023 17:50
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kliras posted:they just released mythforce which, despite its cool art style, bombed pretty hard lol never heard of it and I guess it looks ok?
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Sep 20, 2023 17:51
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kliras posted:they just released mythforce which, despite its cool art style, bombed pretty hard I'd seen it before because I was looking up Beamdog last month. The game gave me big Agents of Mayhem vibes... and not just because of the throwback cartoon style.
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Sep 20, 2023 17:52
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Not that studios shouldn’t be allowed to branch out and do other stuff but if you’ve made your name doing well-regarded remasters and expansions, I think you’d at least want to advertise a fully new game at least a little bit? I definitely didn’t hear a thing about it.
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Sep 20, 2023 17:54
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Velocity Raptor posted:I don't think I even saw it on the New Releases page on steam. yeah, never heard of or seen that before in my life
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Sep 20, 2023 17:54
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If you had told me that Beamdog had made a new game, cartoon FPS wouldn't exactly have been my first genre guess.
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Sep 20, 2023 17:58
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i was actually looking forward to it, but it got slammed for its dull mechanics as soon as it launched, and i guess everyone's going to be reading the same reviews. surprised they didn't even throw money at streamers with all the people playing dark & darker, but guess they knew they had a lemon on their hands?
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Sep 20, 2023 18:00
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It's utterly unaccessable solo, doesn't have any real way in either map design or character build to meaningfully change up runs, and asked $30 per player for the privilege of dealing with A and B because it has production values that far outstrip the game they're dumped into. It can be a fun time for a little while as a group (Humble was/is running a bundle at like 60% off that might be worth a look if your group is willing to buy in) but as a solo or long-term experience it just kinda thought having very basic, banal metaprogression would cover both, and it does not.
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Sep 20, 2023 18:06
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So they pivoted from turn-based RPGs directly into Left 4 Dead: He-Man Edition with what sounds like a brutal early access period. And development started before Embracer bought them. Yeah, they were dead no matter what, there was ever any way for that to end with the studio solvent.  Like, “cartoon graphics faithful to the 80s”, “procedural generation that’s fun” and “netcode that works” are all huge technical asks on their own, and it sounds like they tried to combine them in a couple of years’ development time with no real previous experience. pumpinglemma fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Sep 20, 2023 |
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Sep 20, 2023 18:11
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That game was going to be a disaster because it had no pre-existing fans and the studio had no track record. Yakuza finally hit big in the west with the ninth game (0) which helped having eight previous games to iterate on. Baldurs Gate 3 was a sequel in all but name to the Original Sin series, the second of which put Larian on the map. Beamdog's only prior efforts were remastering old IE games and producing that rather rubbish BG1 expansion. There was no goodwill to be had.
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Sep 20, 2023 18:20
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kliras posted:they just released mythforce which, despite its cool art style, bombed pretty hard
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Sep 20, 2023 18:23
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Galak-Z was pretty solid. But I don’t think it’s all that widely used?
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Sep 20, 2023 18:26
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Orv posted:Not that studios shouldn’t be allowed to branch out and do other stuff but if you’ve made your name doing well-regarded remasters and expansions, I think you’d at least want to advertise a fully new game at least a little bit? I definitely didn’t hear a thing about it. I recall it being shown on a Nintendo Direct so that's something. Not enough, clearly, but something.
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Sep 20, 2023 18:28
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I remember seeing trailers for Mythforce on at least one of Geoff Keighley's showcases, and those aren't cheap to get your game in on.
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Sep 20, 2023 18:31
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